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"An eviction tsunami"


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2 hours ago, billy backstay said:

 

Thanks for that Mate!  We lost a lot in the 07-08 Recession, and nobody bailed us out. Unlike Corporate America, and Wall Street......

We are not complaining, at all, we sucked it up, and finally got new jobs, in different industries, when the old ones were never going to return for us.   

It's all good, we have our health, and our families, and rewarding work, when we want it.....

Health, family, rewarding work.

Same here. There's a secret to happiness somewhere in there.

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There seems to be an assumption that all landlords are veritable young Mr. Farnsworths, the fourth generation trust fund babies. The trust fund babies own the notes on the houses, and they can’t wait

In my case, the tenant had no negative records. She had just left her husband and had two young kids. Husband was an abuser and she had a restraining order against him. Shortly after moving in, she fo

Working one's own land is a gentleman's pleasure, working someone else's land isn't even the pleasure of an ox.

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33 minutes ago, AJ Oliver said:

To what extent do you think that lying helps your case ?  

Did you read the Vienna social housing article above ? How about you @Fah Kiew Tu  ???

"know it all" people who won't do the slightest homework are a big part of what got us (USAeans) into this mess. 

I've been both a tenant and landlord, and mostly agree with Meli's POV 

If you agree with Mels POV, what am I lying about. You just confirmed my point. 

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4 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

If you agree with Mels POV, what am I lying about. 

You lied about my view of home ownership and compensation for its loss.  

You made that smear up out of whole cloth. 

An apology is in order, but not anticipated. 

Your act of steadfastly refusing to look at cites and sources is getting tiresome. 

You can't even be bothered to cite sources that support your own case - maybe because it is so incoherent. 

As I wrote above, yours is a lazy and uninformed "Know it all"  - ism 

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Just now, AJ Oliver said:

You lied about my view of home ownership and compensation for its loss.  

You made that smear up out of whole cloth. 

An apology is in order, but not anticipated. 

Your act of steadfastly refusing to look at cites and sources is getting tiresome. 

You can't even be bothered to cite sources that support your own case - maybe because it is so incoherent. 

As I wrote above, yours is a lazy and uninformed "Know it all"  - ism 

Burning man is a gun nut.

Fear is part of his DNA.

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1 hour ago, AJ Oliver said:

To what extent do you think that lying helps your case ?  

Did you read the Vienna social housing article above ? How about you @Fah Kiew Tu  ???

"know it all" people who won't do the slightest homework are a big part of what got us (USAeans) into this mess. 

I've been both a tenant and landlord, and mostly agree with Meli's POV 

I've no problem at all with that social housing policy. If they want to own/manage properties on that scale, fine. I expect they have them on long leases too, which is uncommon here and one of the things I see as a problem with landlord/tenant setups in Australia. The focus from the landlord POV is short term rentals and maximising capital gain. Tenants want the flexibility to relocate which is a good thing for labour mobility but a bad thing if you want people to enter into long term leases. Can't have things both ways. I expect that tenancies in Vienna are a lot more long-term and people cannot buy a place if they want to.

You undoubtedly don't know it but there's social housing in most Australian States. Nothing like 25% of housing stock but it exists. I'm quite happy with this, in fact I think there's scope for expansion. The problem was we took some really bad examples from the UK and built cheap-ish disgusting high rise tower blocks. That maximised the value/useage of the land but caused all sorts of social problems. Turns out it's a recipe for dysfunction and crime.

Reading Meli's last post I've absolutely NFI what she's objecting to. A 690 sq m block? Give me a break. My Sydney house is on 1000 sq m of land, as was bog standard in the suburbs of Sydney back in the day; that subdivision dates back to sometime in the 1920's. What does she want, forced sales and people who've lived somewhere all their life forced out of their home and into a dog box in some faraway suburb? The buy/sell costs render a swap to a smaller place in the same suburb unaffordable, at least where my place is. And no fucking way do I EVER want to live in any sort of high rise.

FKT

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16 hours ago, mikewof said:
22 hours ago, Pedagogical Tom said:

A quaint notion, but which group has more voters?

 

Lots of "pandemic relief" seems to actually be more of a panicdemic power grab. Or, as in this case, property grab.

Could this be designed as just a big property grab? Homeowners outnumber renters 2 to 1 in the USA. But I read that the USA alone has produced more than 50 new billionaires since the COVID restrictions started.

More of a big panderama. BTW, I was asking about whether we have more landlords or tenants, not more homeowners or tenants.

But since you brought it up, you've reminded me that I really should review and sign the contract that came in yesterday. It's a contract for deed and those have an unhappy history in the USA, but my dad used them to turn lots of poor people into homeowners and I'm continuing his work. There's a good chance they will succeed and wind up owning their own place. There's also a chance we will wind up taking the property back at some point, but that has happened far less often.

Anyone else here busy turning poor people who would be laughed out of a bank into homeowners?

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1 hour ago, Pedagogical Tom said:

More of a big panderama. BTW, I was asking about whether we have more landlords or tenants, not more homeowners or tenants.

But since you brought it up, you've reminded me that I really should review and sign the contract that came in yesterday. It's a contract for deed and those have an unhappy history in the USA, but my dad used them to turn lots of poor people into homeowners and I'm continuing his work. There's a good chance they will succeed and wind up owning their own place. There's also a chance we will wind up taking the property back at some point, but that has happened far less often.

Anyone else here busy turning poor people who would be laughed out of a bank into homeowners?

don't understand. some sort of hire/purchase on a house?

i'd be taking a rough guess that there's more tenants than landlords, obvious reasons.

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13 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

Hmm, there's going to have to be some change faster than that though. Home ownership is an impossible dream for many now with property prices in Melbourne and Sydney being what they are. And the desperate renters are increasingly young and educated.

The tiny house my son rents for $400 pw,15km outside the city  sold for 1.2 Million a year ago

one of these

814-816 Glen Huntly Road, Caulfield South VIC 3162

It's a joke when wages are stagnant and the workforce is increasingly casualised.

Something has to give. 

If your son is really renting a $1.2 million property for $400/ month he should not even consider buying. His landlord is an idiot.

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11 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

don't understand. some sort of hire/purchase on a house?

No, on vacant land, sometimes including a well and septic system that we install and build into the financing.

Buyers make a small down payment and then pay monthly. After they have built up enough equity, there's a closing and the property is deeded to them, with the remaining loan becoming a recorded mortgage. After they pay that off, they own it.

They usually put a mobile home on it, making them what some elitist assholes here call "trailer trash." I don't consider them trash at all. They're good people and valued customers to me, they just can't afford anything nicer.

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6 minutes ago, Dog said:

If you son is really renting a $1.2 million property for $400/ month he should not consider buying. His landlord is an idiot.

Not at all. Houses here gain 10% per year. They buy, rent for 5 years and sell again. It sucks for potential new home buyers.

The rent is pocket money for the owners.

That was $400 per week! and he and Levi got a bargain because they're nice boys :)

(And I had to go on the lease for the first year)

 

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2 minutes ago, Pedagogical Tom said:

No, on vacant land, sometimes including a well and septic system that we install and build into the financing.

Buyers make a small down payment and then pay monthly. After they have built up enough equity, there's a closing and the property is deeded to them, with the remaining loan becoming a recorded mortgage. After they pay that off, they own it.

They usually put a mobile home on it, making them what some elitist assholes here call "trailer trash." I don't consider them trash at all. They're good people and valued customers to me, they just can't afford anything nicer.

Good on you. Tiny houses are becoming very chic :)

8 Tiny Houses that Have More Storage Than Your House - This Old House

12 of the coolest tiny houses you've ever seen

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9 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

Not at all. Houses here gain 10% per year. They buy, rent for 5 years and sell again. It sucks for potential new home buyers.

The rent is pocket money for the owners.

Even so....Your son's landlord has a Gross Rent Multiple of 250. (It would take 250 years to collect rent equal to the purchase price)  Around here you want it to be about 10 to be profitable as a rental property.

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4 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

Good on you. Tiny houses are becoming very chic :)

That one looks newer and nicer than most of the ones I'm talking about, but I guess it is another example of my dad being ahead of his time. He was using a personal computer to run this business long before most people had one. I have a pile of thank you letters from people who would have never been able to save up a proper down payment nor deal with a bank, but who he turned into homeowners. He made decent money doing it too.

 

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1 minute ago, Dog said:

Even so....Your son's landlord has a Gross Rent Multiple of 250. (It would take 250 years to collect rent equal to purchase price)  Around here you want it to be about 10 to be profitable as a rental property.

It's not intended to be profitable as a rental. It's a solid 10% PA investment. No one can rent to pay a loan here. and we have this disgusting tax dodge called negative gearing, where you can claim your mortgage loss off your tax on rental investments. It's fucked.

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4 minutes ago, Pedagogical Tom said:

That one looks newer and nicer than most of the ones I'm talking about, but I guess it is another example of my dad being ahead of his time. He was using a personal computer to run this business long before most people had one. I have a pile of thank you letters from people who would have never been able to save up a proper down payment nor deal with a bank, but who he turned into homeowners. He made decent money doing it too.

 

no no no. "Tiny houses" are a "new" thing.

I assume you have companies building these. Look into it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiny-house_movement

https://www.canstar.com.au/home-loans/tiny-houses-australia/

 

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2 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

It's not intended to be profitable as a rental. It's a solid 10% PA investment. No one can rent to pay a loan here. and we have this disgusting tax dodge called negative gearing, where you can claim your mortgage loss off your tax on rental investments. It's fucked.

Interesting, that negative gearing is contributing to the escalation of real estate prices. That kind of thing happens when you mess with market incentives. We have a mortgage interest deduction that is estimated to increase real estate costs by 15%.

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5 minutes ago, Dog said:

Interesting, that negative gearing is contributing to the escalation of real estate prices. That kind of thing happens when you mess with market incentives. We have a mortgage interest deduction that is estimated to increase real estate costs by 15%.

Yep, and we're stuck with it. No gov has the guts to remove it.

So, investors get richer and kids are left out of the market.

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4 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

Yep, and we're stuck with it. No gov has the guts to remove it.

So, investors get richer and kids are left out of the market.

 

Kids are pretty screwed here as well!

Friends are telling me I should get back into Real Estate Brokerage, which I did for 30 years.  Since Covid-19 arrived, people are fleeing Manhattan and Boston, for bucolic, idylic places, like the Lower CT River Valley, here in SE CT.  My former partner told me 6 months ago that she could sell the small riverview, Ranch house, on 2 acres, with in-law apartment, above the garage, that we bought in February 2019 for $430, for $150k more than we paid for it, but Missus BB would kill her!  LOL  No interest in moving, or selling Real Estate again, been there, done that, got many T-shirts!!  Sucks to be a young family trying to buy a home here, unless your incomes are above five figures, and that makes it a non-starter for many young couples.....

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8 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Reading Meli's last post I've absolutely NFI what she's objecting to. A 690 sq m block? Give me a break. My Sydney house is on 1000 sq m of land, as was bog standard in the suburbs of Sydney back in the day; that subdivision dates back to sometime in the 1920's. What does she want, forced sales and people who've lived somewhere all their life forced out of their home and into a dog box in some faraway suburb? The buy/sell costs render a swap to a smaller place in the same suburb unaffordable, at least where my place is. And no fucking way do I EVER want to live in any sort of high rise.

FKT

From what I gathered from Meli's post - she wants everyone to be forced to accept the homeless and the poor to live in all of your unused bedrooms.  

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16 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

It's a pretty little house in an ordinary suburb. usually 2 bedrooms one about 8x8, lounge and dining room 22x14' combined. tiny bathroom with shower over the bath on a block maybe 25 x85'.

I don't know where you get the idea that I think home ownership is evil. The point is that everyone should be able to either have a modest home of their own or a long term lease with rent increases fixed to the CPI.

Short term investment buyers make that more or less impossible.

home ownership in Oz was 70% in the late 60's. that's fallen to 65%. and dropping even with interest rates at around 3-4%

I've just been for a walk. When people insist on building these on our limited land, is it any wonder the young are being squeezed out.

8 Sunset Close Waterways VIC 3195 Sold Prices and Statistics

25km south of the CBD.

4 bedrooms and pushing 1.5 million.

sitting room, family room, rumpus room, indoor leisure area, study and kitchen/dining room.

690 square metres. for 5? people.

This is not a particularly expensive property by Melbourne standards.

obscene.

Picture of 29 Deepwater Drive, WATERWAYS VIC 3195

 

You seem to have this idea that a certain number of bedrooms and baths is wrong. It's neither wrong nor right ... the builders do this because property taxes are tightly tied to square footage and only loosely tied to the size of the lot. The counties approve projects that maximize their taxable revenue.

The truly luxury homes have relatively few bedrooms and shit-ton of bathrooms and s.f., because they can. Because those are the single-custom builds. Most inner-city townhouse is worth more than those expansive suburban homes because they're throwbacks to a time when these smaller homes were built because they were more economical to be built small. Now, it's often not possible to build small unless you go in with a single-custom.

If your home is more than 50 years old or so, it was built mostly on-site. My home -- like most contemporary homes -- was built in a factory. The foundation was poured with a pre-configured form, the walls and roof trucked on site, and the whole thing was assembled like a glorified set of Legos. The size of the house is the cheapest thing compared to getting the land, working out the development deals, putting in the streets, sewer, water, drainage, etc.. I would love to have an elegant small house in the city, no way I can afford one. I keep borrowing money just to keep my grandmother's old house from falling apart, I couldn't afford to live there even if I wanted to.

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9 hours ago, Pedagogical Tom said:

More of a big panderama. BTW, I was asking about whether we have more landlords or tenants, not more homeowners or tenants.

But since you brought it up, you've reminded me that I really should review and sign the contract that came in yesterday. It's a contract for deed and those have an unhappy history in the USA, but my dad used them to turn lots of poor people into homeowners and I'm continuing his work. There's a good chance they will succeed and wind up owning their own place. There's also a chance we will wind up taking the property back at some point, but that has happened far less often.

Anyone else here busy turning poor people who would be laughed out of a bank into homeowners?

I inherited my dad's old condo, he bought it at age 92 with his G.I. loan, 0% down. I put a lot of money into making it pretty and comfortable, haven't raised the rent on the tenant in there, her rent covers the mortgage and HOA, no profit, but it's okay, the mortgage will be paid off in another 30 years or so. The building was built really poorly, it will need to be torn down eventually, likely before the mortgage is paid off, I don't see a way out of that. I told my tenant that I'm going to be sad when she leaves, but I want her to stay there until she can buy her own place. I think she's on target to do that.

To your question, nobody is laughed out of a bank anymore, they'll help nearly anyone who is serious about it get a house. They might have to spend a couple years on their credit, they'll likely have to do a Federal Mortgage Insurance for the life of the loan to the get the 3.5% down, or even the 1% down, but they can get a house or a condo. It's one of the few bright spots of our economy.

But there is a weak spot here ... I'm fortunate that she pays her rent on time, but since there is no real profit in it, if I have to leave it vacant for even a month between tenants, it turns into a real hardship. You're doing a good job with your dad's work, I assume this is building small homes on your land and doing a rent-to-own? That's possibly in Florida, essentially impossible in my state, due to water restrictions. I have some family who owns a bunch of thousand-acre plots around the state. The way the county sets up the rules on these old claims, he can build a house on each one, maybe even a really nice garage, but just one house. To rezone them for more than one house without significant political effort, would have the likelihood of the Rockies winning a World Series.

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53 minutes ago, mikewof said:

You seem to have this idea that a certain number of bedrooms and baths is wrong. It's neither wrong nor right ... the builders do this because property taxes are tightly tied to square footage and only loosely tied to the size of the lot. The counties approve projects that maximize their taxable revenue.

The truly luxury homes have relatively few bedrooms and shit-ton of bathrooms and s.f., because they can. Because those are the single-custom builds. Most inner-city townhouse is worth more than those expansive suburban homes because they're throwbacks to a time when these smaller homes were built because they were more economical to be built small. Now, it's often not possible to build small unless you go in with a single-custom.

If your home is more than 50 years old or so, it was built mostly on-site. My home -- like most contemporary homes -- was built in a factory. The foundation was poured with a pre-configured form, the walls and roof trucked on site, and the whole thing was assembled like a glorified set of Legos. The size of the house is the cheapest thing compared to getting the land, working out the development deals, putting in the streets, sewer, water, drainage, etc.. I would love to have an elegant small house in the city, no way I can afford one. I keep borrowing money just to keep my grandmother's old house from falling apart, I couldn't afford to live there even if I wanted to.

Melbourne's median household income as a percentage of average home prices is about 8% from what I could find. That would put it among the top 10 least affordable places to buy a home in America.  Good luck to your son.

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There are many good landlords out there . . 

but they get tarred with the dirty brush of the slum lords and hedge funds that buy up dwellings and then don't maintain them . . . 

like the Kushners 

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2 hours ago, mikewof said:

You seem to have this idea that a certain number of bedrooms and baths is wrong. It's neither wrong nor right ... the builders do this because property taxes are tightly tied to square footage and only loosely tied to the size of the lot. The counties approve projects that maximize their taxable revenue.

The truly luxury homes have relatively few bedrooms and shit-ton of bathrooms and s.f., because they can. Because those are the single-custom builds. Most inner-city townhouse is worth more than those expansive suburban homes because they're throwbacks to a time when these smaller homes were built because they were more economical to be built small. Now, it's often not possible to build small unless you go in with a single-custom.

If your home is more than 50 years old or so, it was built mostly on-site. My home -- like most contemporary homes -- was built in a factory. The foundation was poured with a pre-configured form, the walls and roof trucked on site, and the whole thing was assembled like a glorified set of Legos. The size of the house is the cheapest thing compared to getting the land, working out the development deals, putting in the streets, sewer, water, drainage, etc.. I would love to have an elegant small house in the city, no way I can afford one. I keep borrowing money just to keep my grandmother's old house from falling apart, I couldn't afford to live there even if I wanted to.

hmm, and you cant build a duplex under one roof on that land? thus vastly reducing the cost for two families to own their own home? Doubling or at least increasing council rates and other revenue? and reducing the carbon footprint and other environmental impacts? like urban sprawl, transport and other infrastructure? The building technique is irrelevant to that.

What you write is self serving crap.

Mine's a duplex, built 1930 under one roof. comfortably housing 8 people without the 6 leisure areas and 6 bathrooms. each one of the pair about 190 square metres.

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1 hour ago, Dog said:

Melbourne's median household income as a percentage of average home prices is about 8% from what I could find. That would put it among the top 10 least affordable places to buy a home in America.  Good luck to your son.

It's one of the least affordable cities in the world. 

I deliberately bought my house so it can easily be divided into two spacious one bedroom apartments close to the city and public transport. One for each child. 

When I'm gone, they'll both at least always have a roof over their heads or a rental to help pay for their own rent on something larger if they need larger.

 

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14 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

 

You undoubtedly don't know it but there's social housing in most Australian States. Nothing like 25% of housing stock but it exists. I'm quite happy with this, in fact I think there's scope for expansion. The problem was we took some really bad examples from the UK and built cheap-ish disgusting high rise tower blocks. That maximised the value/useage of the land but caused all sorts of social problems. Turns out it's a recipe for dysfunction and crime.

Reading Meli's last post I've absolutely NFI what she's objecting to. A 690 sq m block? Give me a break. My Sydney house is on 1000 sq m of land, as was bog standard in the suburbs of Sydney back in the day; that subdivision dates back to sometime in the 1920's. What does she want, forced sales and people who've lived somewhere all their life forced out of their home and into a dog box in some faraway suburb? The buy/sell costs render a swap to a smaller place in the same suburb unaffordable, at least where my place is. And no fucking way do I EVER want to live in any sort of high rise.

FKT

No. that HOUSE is 690sqm. The block is probably not much bigger.

(And actually, I'm given to understand that those 60's tower blocks in the inner city are a lot safer than some of our outer suburbs. Many of my clients live in the Footscray/Collingwood blocks  I deliver to a few of our home library service patrons there and one of my colleagues lives in the one in Carlton. They are actually not bad inside. The housing commission are pretty selective now about the families housed there.)

I'm not at all suggesting we build high rises, but with available building land really limited in greater Melbourne now, it seems really stupid and wasteful to be building these McMansions on the new estates along the Bay.

That house is on The Waterways" It's pretty enough with the man made water lands lakes etc, it could have been really nice and more diverse if they'd insisted on a more Port Grimaud style mixes of houses small low rise apts. and semi detached/. As it is, it's Keysbourough with ponds.

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1 minute ago, Shortforbob said:

No. that HOUSE is 690sqm. The block is probably not much bigger

The Sydney house I co-own is 54 squares in the old measurement. It was designed for a family with frequent and long-staying overseas visitors/students. 3 bathrooms, one on each level (bottom floor is dug back into the slope so 3 storey at the back, 2 at the road side). Currently houses 3 generations and likely to be 4 for a few years. Big houses have their uses though I'd never, ever build another multi-storey house.

Point is, it'd sell for maybe $1.5 million. A single villa unit *right next door* sold for $1.5 million. Even were it just my first wife still living there, other than maintenance costs it makes zero sense to downsize to a more expensive and much worse built dwelling with a single small car off-street parking spot and little else.

My Tasmanian place is 2 BR, 1 bath, 12m x 8.2m on one level and bigger than I need really. OTOH I have nearly 5 acres of land and a ton of wildlife.

You're not going to solve the rental/lack of affordability issues by your approach. You just come across as censorious in trying to tell other people how you think they should live. Wrong country for that, Aussies don't like it. And given your cultural background, one can look at how your prejudices played out in the UK WRT council-built and run accommodation. No thank you. You'd combine all the worst features of a jerry-built gimcrack apartment tower with zero amenities.

FKT

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see my rather long edit above.

Yeah. Aussies are under the impression they live in a big country. Fine in Da Bush.Not so much in the cities and burbs.

You're smart enough to know that we can't sustain the infrastructure with a population of the netherlands and cities the size of LA.

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22 hours ago, mikewof said:

They started out fine. But then when the rent money apparently went to other -- erm, enjoyments -- things went kinda south.

I spoke to the lawyer, the chance for a landlord to recover damages from a tenant in this sate is the longest of longshots. It's a cowboy state, I've been through this before. Had a tenant who once had a yard sale and sold all of the appliances, even pulled doors off the hinges and sold those. Couldn't recover a dime, the collection agency will give up in another three years. We did use the house insurance for that one, it was pretty bad. And then they cancelled the insurance, no way I'm going to use insurance for some doors and walls.

But the "Texan burrito fart judge" is a Federal judge, I have a feeling that it ends at the end of March, with no more extensions.

Not house insurance, LANDLORDS insurance. Completely different animal. Check it out. 

That federal judge has just declared a law unconstitutional, so it's going to the Supremes, like as not. There will be a stay on his ruling, bet the farm. That said the pressure is building to end this, it shouldn't be too much longer, maybe 6 months is what my ouija board says. 

Shop for a lawyer who will garnish their paycheck. Just a thought. 

 I feel your pain though, it's just that I'm in commercial real estate. Got several tenants not paying anything, most have simply locked the doors but all their shit is still there. The hope is they re-open when this is all over and we'll work out some sort of deal. Not going to be a killer if they wind up not paying for the months they weren't open because everything we own we own out-right and it will be a hell of a write-off. What is troubling is if they don't come back, looking at about a hundred and a half large to clean them out and make them tabula rasa's which will be competitive in what is sure to be a seriously renter's market in commercial RE. Fingers crossed.  

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On 2/27/2021 at 12:58 AM, mikewof said:

No decent property owner wants to evict tenants, it's a lose-lose proposition.

But the moratorium says that the tenant needs to only file the COVID exemption and then they can stop paying rent.

In my case, I have a mortgage and lots of costs on my grandmother's old house, I rented it to a tenant who needed it, and they filed the COVID exemption days later. The exemption claims that the tenant lost their jobs due to COVID, but they still need to attempt to pay some rent. In my case they still have jobs and have paid no rent since October. They won't pay gas, electric or water, and I can't shut it off, so I have to pay that for them. They've broken doors and walls and get into raging fights that end with visits from the police. And eviction is not allowed.

We have social safety nets to prevent homelessness, it's called Section-8 and I'm happy to rent Section-8, I have in the past. But there is no compliance check on the COVID exemption, it's just a blanket permission to not pay any rent.

Yes, I'm sure that it does help some people who have been genuinely impacted, but it's also apparently abused. If you feel proactive Meli, why not rent out your home to someone who breaks down doors and walls and doesn't pay rent. Then you'll have "skin in the game" too! Whee!

It warms my heart that you are suffering greatly on account of Covid.  As someone who said masks where useless and casted doubt on vaccines and said all many of indefensible bullshit like "I'm not aware of any research showing that Covid-19 destroys lung tissue"  it really does hint at a sort of cosmic justice.  I hope those tenants are an albatross around your neck for another 3 years, at least. 

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33 minutes ago, Clove Hitch said:

It warms my heart that you are suffering greatly on account of Covid.  As someone who said masks where useless and casted doubt on vaccines and said all many of indefensible bullshit like "I'm not aware of any research showing that Covid-19 destroys lung tissue"  it really does hint at a sort of cosmic justice.  I hope those tenants are an albatross around your neck for another 3 years, at least. 

Yeesh man, someone piss in your cornflakes?

COVID has caused all kinds of problems for a lot of people, mostly the young people, babies who come of age in era where they can't see human faces, high schoolers who don't get to dance, to graduate, kids who missed out on sports, My children and my young relatives have experienced these things. But me ... the need for aerosol physics in the era of COVID has been kind of a thing, I've had a god bit of new research work. Sorry to burst your bubble.

As for these things that you disagree, none of it really makes sense, and it's far more complicated than any of us know ... places that didn't social distance or use masks did well with COVID, other places that clamped down did horribly. COVID is harmless in many populations and not in others.

I get that you're angry about COVID, and you want others to suffer, but your desire to see others in pain isn't really a heart-healthy kind of thing, imo.

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4 hours ago, Mark K said:

Not house insurance, LANDLORDS insurance. Completely different animal. Check it out. 

That federal judge has just declared a law unconstitutional, so it's going to the Supremes, like as not. There will be a stay on his ruling, bet the farm. That said the pressure is building to end this, it shouldn't be too much longer, maybe 6 months is what my ouija board says. 

Shop for a lawyer who will garnish their paycheck. Just a thought. 

 I feel your pain though, it's just that I'm in commercial real estate. Got several tenants not paying anything, most have simply locked the doors but all their shit is still there. The hope is they re-open when this is all over and we'll work out some sort of deal. Not going to be a killer if they wind up not paying for the months they weren't open because everything we own we own out-right and it will be a hell of a write-off. What is troubling is if they don't come back, looking at about a hundred and a half large to clean them out and make them tabula rasa's which will be competitive in what is sure to be a seriously renter's market in commercial RE. Fingers crossed.  

Landlord insurance ... never heard of it, I'll keep it in mind. The moratorium is supposed to expire at the end of March, the longer they drag this out, the worse the evictions are going to be. Garnishing wages, I've never heard of any judge ever granting that in my State.

I've been paying for the rent on my labs even though they're not in use, though I noticed one of the biggest tenants in the building was kicked out, presumably for nonpayment of non-active offices. In my case, I need the lab space, there is only so much that can be done from a house, especially with the medical aerosol research that I'm scheduled. But what about these "office" type activities? How much of that is going to return when companies are now cool with employees working from home? I thought there might be an opportunity to convert office-type space to light manufacturing. Any thoughts on that?

I was going to buy a 10k s.f. office building a couple years ago, but I got beat out by someone else, turns out to have been a blessing in disguise. Do you think there will be any good deals on that size office building? I would love to stop paying rent for lab space.

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6 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

hmm, and you cant build a duplex under one roof on that land? thus vastly reducing the cost for two families to own their own home? Doubling or at least increasing council rates and other revenue? and reducing the carbon footprint and other environmental impacts? like urban sprawl, transport and other infrastructure? The building technique is irrelevant to that.

What you write is self serving crap.

Mine's a duplex, built 1930 under one roof. comfortably housing 8 people without the 6 leisure areas and 6 bathrooms. each one of the pair about 190 square metres.

I lived in NYC for about a dozen years, your idea that you're somehow living minimally is kind of ridiculous ... in NYC, people raise two children in one bedroom apartments. When I lived there, we had two children in a one-bedroom in Battery Park City and we felt lucky to have that. What you have would be nothing short of a mansion in NYC or S.F..

Again, in my area, if you're a working class person who wants to buy a house, you're likely not going to be able to afford the kind of thing that you have, it's too expensive. We can afford these big homes out in the boondocks because a lot of them are built. And I keep trying to explain to you, that's pretty much ALL that's built anymore. The counties want their taxable revenue and they rarely approve of new developments that don't have houses with lots of bedrooms and baths in them. A new bigger house is cheaper than an older smaller house, unless it's in major disrepair, but then the flippers fight each other for those, and they pay cash.

I get it, you fancy yourself someone just this side of a socialist, living minimally, with just the bare necessities, or something like that. The working class people in my area -- and in a lot of areas in the USA that have some amount of economic prosperity  -- get these cookie-cutter large homes because that's pretty much their only option. My old townhouse in downtown Golden is half the size of my current house and it's worth a good bit more, because those kind of houses are hard to get these days. Do you kind of see why your theories fail when they meet real life?

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7 hours ago, Dog said:

Melbourne's median household income as a percentage of average home prices is about 8% from what I could find. That would put it among the top 10 least affordable places to buy a home in America.  Good luck to your son.

I don't live in Melbourne, and my son is 10, he's not in the home-buying mode at the moment. His attentions tend to focus on Fortnite and baseball. I believe you meant to respond to Meli with this.

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18 minutes ago, mikewof said:

Yeesh man, someone piss in your cornflakes?

COVID has caused all kinds of problems for a lot of people, mostly the young people, babies who come of age in era where they can't see human faces, high schoolers who don't get to dance, to graduate, kids who missed out on sports, My children and my young relatives have experienced these things. But me ... the need for aerosol physics in the era of COVID has been kind of a thing, I've had a god bit of new research work. Sorry to burst your bubble.

As for these things that you disagree, none of it really makes sense, and it's far more complicated than any of us know ... places that didn't social distance or use masks did well with COVID, other places that clamped down did horribly. COVID is harmless in many populations and not in others.

I get that you're angry about COVID, and you want others to suffer, but your desire to see others in pain isn't really a heart-healthy kind of thing, imo.

No.  You're being called out for being a sanctimonious asshole.  My son has covid right now, it's not going to kill him, but it's made life very difficult for him and everyone around him.  Basically the entire HS basketball team rode on the team bus and got it.  So fuck your "open' states did well bullshit.  A good friends death in March and now more people than I can count on two hands sick right now doesn't have any place in what you think is reality.

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13 minutes ago, mikewof said:

I lived in NYC for about a dozen years, your idea that you're somehow living minimally is kind of ridiculous ... in NYC, people raise two children in one bedroom apartments. When I lived there, we had two children in a one-bedroom in Battery Park City and we felt lucky to have that. What you have would be nothing short of a mansion in NYC or S.F..

Again, in my area, if you're a working class person who wants to buy a house, you're likely not going to be able to afford the kind of thing that you have, it's too expensive. We can afford these big homes out in the boondocks because a lot of them are built. And I keep trying to explain to you, that's pretty much ALL that's built anymore. The counties want their taxable revenue and they rarely approve of new developments that don't have houses with lots of bedrooms and baths in them. A new bigger house is cheaper than an older smaller house, unless it's in major disrepair, but then the flippers fight each other for those, and they pay cash.

I get it, you fancy yourself someone just this side of a socialist, living minimally, with just the bare necessities, or something like that. The working class people in my area -- and in a lot of areas in the USA that have some amount of economic prosperity  -- get these cookie-cutter large homes because that's pretty much their only option. My old townhouse in downtown Golden is half the size of my current house and it's worth a good bit more, because those kind of houses are hard to get these days. Do you kind of see why your theories fail when they meet real life?

What happens when people stop buying and demand smaller, cheaper houses?

You going on like it's a conspiracy to stop consumers getting what the need.

 

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11 minutes ago, mikewof said:

I don't live in Melbourne, and my son is 10, he's not in the home-buying mode at the moment. His attentions tend to focus on Fortnite and baseball. I believe you meant to respond to Meli with this.

So what's the age limit in the t's+c's of Fortnight?

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On 2/27/2021 at 5:43 AM, Dog said:

We own a apartment building and my wife screens the tenants. She's tough and as a result we have never had to evict anyone. I joke that I wouldn't qualify to live in my own building.

One of PA’s best threads was a series of photos like that about some very annoying poster’s boat, girlfriend, house, family, teet, car,,,, etc.

you are wrong about everything but not an annoying dumbass like that guy. Whose name I have forgotten. 

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34 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

No.  You're being called out for being a sanctimonious asshole.  My son has covid right now, it's not going to kill him, but it's made life very difficult for him and everyone around him.  Basically the entire HS basketball team rode on the team bus and got it.  So fuck your "open' states did well bullshit.  A good friends death in March and now more people than I can count on two hands sick right now doesn't have any place in what you think is reality.

You seem to have a complaint with someone else.

Aren't you at all happy that he even still has a basketball team? Are you happy that they get the experience of sharing bus?

My daughter's professional team in Long Island was shut down completely and isn't reforming until 2022, and that's her career and her life. My son's highly-loved baseball team in Colorado was shut down too. My other daughter's high school was shut down and she graduated in her bedroom over a laptop. You're angry at me, but you still have basketball, you still have a shared bus. What do I have to do with any of that? And what's this about "open state"? If you would have shut down the team as they did to my kids, you likely wouldn't have had the stress of COVID, but you chose to let your kids continue their lives. That choice wasn't available to everyone, but it was to you.

 

I don't want to be a dick to you, but right now, you're the "sanctimonious asshole."

 

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29 minutes ago, Ease the sheet. said:

What happens when people stop buying and demand smaller, cheaper houses?

You going on like it's a conspiracy to stop consumers getting what the need.

 

I'm trying to explain the economics of the situation. The "cheaper" houses ARE the bigger ones. For stand-alone houses, they're the only ones being built now, because the county wants their money and more s.f. is the way for them to get it. They're not approving projects with inexpensive smaller houses and the builders aren't building those because it's not all that much cheaper to build a smaller house. They build these houses in factories and just assemble them on site. My entire house from foundation to walk-through was done in a about a month.

It's not a conspiracy, and I didn't suggest it was, it's the nature of the market making and selling the most profitable product. A lot of Millennials very much want smaller homes, but they have to pay more for the than the big homes, because the smaller ones are in older neighborhoods, walking distance to shopping and bars, and they're expensive.  So to your question, what if they "demand" smaller homes? They're going to have to change the laws, because in my state with the TABOR act, the counties won't approve those because it cuts into their property tax revenue. Or they can buy older homes that are smaller, but they won't be cheaper, they're more expensive.

OR ... they can buy a home in an area that isn't getting an economic boom. There they can get cheaper, smaller homes. If I could move up into Wyoming now, I could get a thousand or so grazing acres, good for maybe a 70 head, and a small ranch house, and get it for about what my cookie-cutter house here would sell. But I can't move up to Wyoming yet.

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40 minutes ago, Ease the sheet. said:

So what's the age limit in the t's+c's of Fortnight?

No hard limit, but the recommended age is 12. It's kind of digital paintball. No blood, when the player is eliminated, the little avatar kind of evaporates in a puff of digital smoke and then they show up back at the hub. It's more like dodgeball than actual war.

 

Of course, there is the new game, which is solely shooting people in the face, and also Chainsaw Dawn ...

 

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4 minutes ago, solosailor said:

HAHAHAHAHA   Where can you get someone evicted in a month or so?

 

Every state is different. In Colorado it's 30 day notice, 15 days to court date, then the judge usually gives them no more than 5 days. But in some cases, the 30 day notice changes to a 10 day notice. It's 10 day notice now, even though the evictions are on hold. Now, NYC, the eviction will take 6 months, sometimes a year.

But Arizona ... different level, an eviction can happen in a single week. Arizona doesn't fuck around with letting things sit around in court, apparently.

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3 hours ago, Ease the sheet. said:

What happens when people stop buying and demand smaller, cheaper houses?

You going on like it's a conspiracy to stop consumers getting what they need.

 

thank you.

it is kind of . its called sales pitch. I'm surprised that Mike was susceptible. 

Developers build what people want, and people are told they need a bedroom per child, one for the guest. That guest must have a private ensuite and the consequences of Johnny walking into Jilly in the bathroom would be a family disaster.

All the kids need their own entertaining space and Dad needs a separate study.

These places can get very lonely.

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17 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

thank you.

it is kind of . its called sales pitch. I'm surprised that Mike was susceptible. 

Developers build what people want, and people are told they need a bedroom per child, one for the guest. That guest must have a private ensuite and the consequences of Johnny walking into Jilly in the bathroom would be a family disaster.

All the kids need their own entertaining space and Dad needs a separate study.

These places can get very lonely.

My youngest daughter decided she needed TWO bedrooms when her elder brother moved out.

As for needing a separate study, you obviously never needed (or had the ability) to do anything requiring intense focused concentration for 3-4 hours per night. Try designing/writing computer programs with a total surround of noise, see how you go.

As for lonely, you're projecting your own feelings/insecurities on others. While I very much enjoy the company of my GF (20+ years now) I also like my own company for a fair chunk of the time. She's the same, likes to commune with a good book and her cat so we have a house each. Yep, she owns a 3 bedroom house and it's all hers. First World luxury, sure. That's why we don't have ANY desire to live in the 3rd World or return to the crowded living conditions.

FKT

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Here in the USof A, builder's seek to maximize profit. Small houses don't have much, and no one is forcing them to be built. A new house in most new developments will be built out to the lot limits on each side, minimum set back in front (just enuff to park a car in front of the garage). Leave just enuff space in the "back yard" to have the BBQ unit & install the optional hot tub. Interiors seem to have a "check list" of up-market features design to impress (even if they don't work).

   When we moved to San Diego, we spent a lot of time looking at newer housing in many areas. Most house plans would get ruled out within 10 minutes as un workable. Things like walled off 'formal dining' areas that would fit a card table, laundry machines & desks jammed in  the sides of the main (narrow) hallways, tiny back yards.

No builder will put up actual "starter" homes when they can jamb in slightly fewer, but 2x larger houses

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23 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

My youngest daughter decided she needed TWO bedrooms when her elder brother moved out.

As for needing a separate study, you obviously never needed (or had the ability) to do anything requiring intense focused concentration for 3-4 hours per night. Try designing/writing computer programs with a total surround of noise, see how you go.

As for lonely, you're projecting your own feelings/insecurities on others. While I very much enjoy the company of my GF (20+ years now) I also like my own company for a fair chunk of the time. She's the same, likes to commune with a good book and her cat so we have a house each. Yep, she owns a 3 bedroom house and it's all hers. First World luxury, sure. That's why we don't have ANY desire to live in the 3rd World or return to the crowded living conditions.

FKT

sigh. have you ever needed 4 separate entertaining rooms and 3 bathrooms when your family was whole?

 

I used to visit parents in these McMansions when my kids were small.

Horror when the 6 year olds are all upstairs in the rumpus room, the 4 year old  is watching Moulin Rouge alone in the home theatre and the mums are drinking coffee by the pool. Dad's in the study and the teenagers from Dad's first go at being a parent are somewhere in their rooms. These people barely see each other for days.

 

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8 minutes ago, longy said:

Here in the USof A, builder's seek to maximize profit. Small houses don't have much, and no one is forcing them to be built. A new house in most new developments will be built out to the lot limits on each side, minimum set back in front (just enuff to park a car in front of the garage). Leave just enuff space in the "back yard" to have the BBQ unit & install the optional hot tub. Interiors seem to have a "check list" of up-market features design to impress (even if they don't work).

   When we moved to San Diego, we spent a lot of time looking at newer housing in many areas. Most house plans would get ruled out within 10 minutes as un workable. Things like walled off 'formal dining' areas that would fit a card table, laundry machines & desks jammed in  the sides of the main (narrow) hallways, tiny back yards.

No builder will put up actual "starter" homes when they can jamb in slightly fewer, but 2x larger houses

Sigh again, ever heard of two under one roof? AKA duplex, semi detached. These are actually cheaper to build.

It really is mainly about posturing.

What's going to happen to these shoddy 5 bedroom, 4 bathroom and three entertainment areas in 20 years when the kids have gone and no one is having 3 kids anymore? 

Split into even shabbier apartments? rooms to let?

Ooops, there goes what passed for a neighbourhood.

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5 hours ago, mikewof said:

I'm trying to explain the economics of the situation. The "cheaper" houses ARE the bigger ones. For stand-alone houses, they're the only ones being built now, because the county wants their money and more s.f. is the way for them to get it. They're not approving projects with inexpensive smaller houses and the builders aren't building those because it's not all that much cheaper to build a smaller house. They build these houses in factories and just assemble them on site. My entire house from foundation to walk-through was done in a about a month.

It's not a conspiracy, and I didn't suggest it was, it's the nature of the market making and selling the most profitable product. A lot of Millennials very much want smaller homes, but they have to pay more for the than the big homes, because the smaller ones are in older neighborhoods, walking distance to shopping and bars, and they're expensive.  So to your question, what if they "demand" smaller homes? They're going to have to change the laws, because in my state with the TABOR act, the counties won't approve those because it cuts into their property tax revenue. Or they can buy older homes that are smaller, but they won't be cheaper, they're more expensive.

OR ... they can buy a home in an area that isn't getting an economic boom. There they can get cheaper, smaller homes. If I could move up into Wyoming now, I could get a thousand or so grazing acres, good for maybe a 70 head, and a small ranch house, and get it for about what my cookie-cutter house here would sell. But I can't move up to Wyoming yet.

So you miss the point......

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5 hours ago, mikewof said:

No hard limit, but the recommended age is 12. It's kind of digital paintball. No blood, when the player is eliminated, the little avatar kind of evaporates in a puff of digital smoke and then they show up back at the hub. It's more like dodgeball than actual war.

 

Of course, there is the new game, which is solely shooting people in the face, and also Chainsaw Dawn ...

 

Excellent parenting.......

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1 hour ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

My youngest daughter decided she needed TWO bedrooms when her elder brother moved out.

As for needing a separate study, you obviously never needed (or had the ability) to do anything requiring intense focused concentration for 3-4 hours per night. Try designing/writing computer programs with a total surround of noise, see how you go.

As for lonely, you're projecting your own feelings/insecurities on others. While I very much enjoy the company of my GF (20+ years now) I also like my own company for a fair chunk of the time. She's the same, likes to commune with a good book and her cat so we have a house each. Yep, she owns a 3 bedroom house and it's all hers. First World luxury, sure. That's why we don't have ANY desire to live in the 3rd World or return to the crowded living conditions.

FKT

Why the fuck don't you have at least 2 3d printers in one of her bedrooms?

Seriously, make it worthwhile when you visit...  

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1 hour ago, longy said:

Here in the USof A, builder's seek to maximize profit. Small houses don't have much, and no one is forcing them to be built. A new house in most new developments will be built out to the lot limits on each side, minimum set back in front (just enuff to park a car in front of the garage). Leave just enuff space in the "back yard" to have the BBQ unit & install the optional hot tub. Interiors seem to have a "check list" of up-market features design to impress (even if they don't work).

   When we moved to San Diego, we spent a lot of time looking at newer housing in many areas. Most house plans would get ruled out within 10 minutes as un workable. Things like walled off 'formal dining' areas that would fit a card table, laundry machines & desks jammed in  the sides of the main (narrow) hallways, tiny back yards.

No builder will put up actual "starter" homes when they can jamb in slightly fewer, but 2x larger houses

Same here.

The only one winning from new houses is the developer.

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1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

sigh. have you ever needed 4 separate entertaining rooms and 3 bathrooms when your family was whole?

Nope. Didn't have 4 entertaining rooms anyway.

Top floor was master bedroom, 2 offices and a library. Bedroom had en suite. 2 professionals, lots of time on the phone or computer, tons of books, periodicals, professional journals etc etc. Don't want the kids to mess with this stuff, lots of it was confidential and/or medical. Most definitely never wanted my wife to share my work space; our habits and tolerance for mess weren't anything *like* compatible. I'm a neat freak. She isn't. One of the reasons we don't live together.

Mid floor, 4 bedrooms and one bathroom, open plan kitchen/living area, big playroom. 3 kids, often an overseas visitor/student for 6 months or more, kids' friends sleeping over, sometimes more than one. We could build wonderful Lego constructions in the playroom, still got all the Lego & Duplo stashed for the grandkids. Tons and tons of books for the kids.

Bottom level 2 car spaces a laundry with shower & WC and machine shop. Not really a 3rd bathroom but sufficient to get clean from yard work or for one of the kids to go take a dump if the bathroom was occupied. I did separate the WC from the bathroom - I grew up with 2 sisters and a brother.

Wasn't excessive IMO given the requirements. You may differ but as I've said, I don't give your opinion on how I should live my life any weighting.

I like my current place, it's still too big for one or indeed 2 really. In fact I'm designing a tiny house ATM, it might end up on those ex fish farm pontoons and I'll just tie my boat up alongside. Other than access to my machine shop it'd be all the space I need. Totally off grid and sort of relocatable within limits.

FKT

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1 hour ago, Shortforbob said:

What's going to happen to these shoddy 5 bedroom, 4 bathroom and three entertainment areas in 20 years when the kids have gone and no one is having 3 kids anymore? 

Split into even shabbier apartments? rooms to let?

You really do lack all imagination.

They'll get DEMOLISHED and clusters of smaller dwellings built there, or a number of blocks will be amalgamated and medium/high rise constructed.

Ticky-tacky houses get replaced by even more ticky-tacky poorly built apartment blocks.

Happening all over Sydney.

FKT

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2 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Nope. Didn't have 4 entertaining rooms anyway.

 

FKT

Thank you. No one needs 4 entertainment areas.

The rest is about needs and wants.

somewhere there has to be a balance.

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22 minutes ago, Ease the sheet. said:

Why the fuck don't you have at least 2 3d printers in one of her bedrooms?

Seriously, make it worthwhile when you visit...  

Usually she's here and we go sailing. In fact she's here ATM processing plums into the food dryer and freezer. Apricots already done, pears and apples next.

a 3D printer has been on my list for a while now, be a change from machining stuff from solid blocks of HDPE or acetal.

FKT

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2 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

You really do lack all imagination.

They'll get DEMOLISHED and clusters of smaller dwellings built there, or a number of blocks will be amalgamated and medium/high rise constructed.

Ticky-tacky houses get replaced by even more ticky-tacky poorly built apartment blocks.

Happening all over Sydney.

FKT

Maybe eventually, but I can't see that happening before the rot sets in in these estates.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Shortforbob said:

Thank you. No one needs 4 entertainment areas.

The rest is about needs and wants.

somewhere there has to be a balance.

Yeah I don't get the home movie theatre bit but then I don't even own a TV. Got to be at least 9 computers in this place though - there's 3 Raspberry Pi computers on the boat.

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Just now, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Yeah I don't get the home movie theatre bit but then I don't even own a TV. Got to be at least 9 computers in this place though - there's 3 Raspberry Pi computers on the boat.

yes yes, we know your a rabid consumer. But wait! No 3D printer yet?:rolleyes:

 

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1 minute ago, Shortforbob said:

Maybe eventually, but I can't see that happening before the rot sets in in these estates.

In my winters in Sydney I watched the building of a number of the 5-6 storey apartment blocks on sites that used to have light industry or pre-WW2 housing.

I can't see those places ageing at all well, in fact you can already see the cracks. Housing built to the same standards isn't going to be pretty after 20 to 30 years, nothing like how your place in Melbourne was built back in the day.

My place in Sydney was built to last, it's very overbuilt, and a total waste because when it eventually goes on the market, it'll be demolished for ticky-tacky villas.

The horror stories about Sydney apartment blocks are just the tip of a very nasty iceberg. And the tenants are going to cop it WRT maintenance problems.

FKT

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2 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

yes yes, we know your a rabid consumer. But wait! No 3D printer yet?:rolleyes:

I have 3 metal milling machines and 2 horizontal boring mills. A 3D printer is a toy for what I do. The computers are mainly tools, this Macbook is 8 years old. I spend my money buying more books.

And boat bits.

FKT

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Just now, Fah Kiew Tu said:

I have 3 metal milling machines and 2 horizontal boring mills. A 3D printer is a toy for what I do. The computers are mainly tools, this Macbook is 8 years old. I spend my money buying more books.

And boat bits.

FKT

8 or 9 computers for tools.

Yeah right. You forget my history. I know all about those "spare" computers and their "Uses"

Have you still got your micro bee? :D

 

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8 minutes ago, Shortforbob said:

8 or 9 computers for tools.

Yeah right. You forget my history. I know all about those "spare" computers and their "Uses"

Have you still got your micro bee? :D

 

Shrug.

2 database servers running Postgres.

3 laptops including my old white Macbook I use for programming Arduino microprocessors.

1 computer running LinuxCNC.

4 Raspberry Pi computers running a weather station,  data logging software and a hot spare or 2. It's handy to be able to test networking stuff over different operating systems. Funny what you find sometimes, like an Arduino Uno with Ethernet shield that plain refused to work with one Ethernet hub but had no problems with a different one.

Was looking at buying another Pi 4B earlier today for an embedded type system.

They're just tools. I buy them as I need them, get rid of them when I don't. All tax deductible.

All you need, most probably, is a kid's Chromebook loaded with a web browser. But then you can't program anything either.

I neither know nor care what you think you know about what your ex did with his computers.

Bored now.

FKT

 

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1 minute ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Shrug.

Bored now.

 

FKT

 

You always say that when I got ya :)

Daisy chains? 

Security systems?

Just dust them from time to time

I suppose it's too late to go sailing.

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8 hours ago, mikewof said:

I don't live in Melbourne, and my son is 10, he's not in the home-buying mode at the moment. His attentions tend to focus on Fortnite and baseball. I believe you meant to respond to Meli with this.

Apologies.

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2 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

I have 3 metal milling machines and 2 horizontal boring mills. A 3D printer is a toy for what I do. The computers are mainly tools, this Macbook is 8 years old. I spend my money buying more books.

And boat bits.

FKT

I don't know exactly what applications you handle.  But there are some excellent 3D printers out there that can handle continuous-string carbon fiber and make incredibley robust parts.  In fact the company I work for has issued one to each of the manufacturing locations because in many cases 3D printing spare parts for our manufacturing machines (that includes hundreds of CNC per location) is much faster and more efficient that making the same replacement with metal-removal machines.

The metal-removal machines definitely have their place and are necessary.  But a 3D printer is hardly a toy, used correctly.

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8 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

thank you.

it is kind of . its called sales pitch. I'm surprised that Mike was susceptible. 

Developers build what people want, and people are told they need a bedroom per child, one for the guest. That guest must have a private ensuite and the consequences of Johnny walking into Jilly in the bathroom would be a family disaster.

All the kids need their own entertaining space and Dad needs a separate study.

These places can get very lonely.

 

You're apparently not actually reading any of my responses that show why you're wrong about this. The county doesn't make it easy for small homes to be built, they want the tax revenue of larger homes, and larger homes are about the same price as smaller homes anyway, because most of the cost is in setting up the flood plain, putting in streets, cutting the deals for the water, and the actual plot of the land. The builder might save a few thousand bucks from using a bit less material and less labor from a smaller home, but the county doesn't set up the tax structure for these smaller homes, and it's why they're not built.

Again, your smaller urban home -- like the smaller urban homes in my area that have good walkability scores -- are worth far more than these bigger suburban homes.

We lived in a one-bedroom in NYC with two children, and I was happy with that. When I was single I lived on a 27 foot sailboat with a little aft cabin. This idea you're presenting only makes sense when you shut our reality.

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8 hours ago, longy said:

Here in the USof A, builder's seek to maximize profit. Small houses don't have much, and no one is forcing them to be built. A new house in most new developments will be built out to the lot limits on each side, minimum set back in front (just enuff to park a car in front of the garage). Leave just enuff space in the "back yard" to have the BBQ unit & install the optional hot tub. Interiors seem to have a "check list" of up-market features design to impress (even if they don't work).

   When we moved to San Diego, we spent a lot of time looking at newer housing in many areas. Most house plans would get ruled out within 10 minutes as un workable. Things like walled off 'formal dining' areas that would fit a card table, laundry machines & desks jammed in  the sides of the main (narrow) hallways, tiny back yards.

No builder will put up actual "starter" homes when they can jamb in slightly fewer, but 2x larger houses

Yeah, and when there is barely enough water to go around, the county won't approve of projects that don't maximize the amount of property tax they can pull out of a development. A lot of areas around here are capped at 0.8% growth or so, which means they only approve rezoning when it adds a good bit property tax to the ledger.

And due to the water restrictions, the lots are the lots. The minimum single-family lot size is what it is, even if someone wants a smaller home.

These big homes ARE the working class option now. I would rather have a small house and a little bit of land to build a barn, but I can't afford that. Meli is apparently trying to reframe her reality to where she's living the life of a modest urban poet, "waiting for the revolution" while the suburbanites are the detestable scum who suck up resources and trash the planet.

 

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8 hours ago, Shortforbob said:

Sigh again, ever heard of two under one roof? AKA duplex, semi detached. These are actually cheaper to build.

It really is mainly about posturing.

What's going to happen to these shoddy 5 bedroom, 4 bathroom and three entertainment areas in 20 years when the kids have gone and no one is having 3 kids anymore? 

Split into even shabbier apartments? rooms to let?

Ooops, there goes what passed for a neighbourhood.

The "sigh" is amusing.

You fancy yourself an expert on all things American, but you seem to have no clue here. Mutli-family houses can only be built or modified if the zoning allows those. And that means the street has to have sufficient access, there has to be enough water, enough sewage capacity, enough access for firetrucks, enough parking, upgrade utilities. There are some exceptions in older neighborhoods, not in the newer ones, but that's a tax-raising option for the county, when a single family home is converted to a duplex like you want to do with your house, if the county allows it, then they double the property tax.

Sure, people do it like you plan to do with your kids. and if it's family, nobody is usually the wiser. But when someone goes to sell the home, it's sold as a single family house, because it was never officially converted to a duplex, because it's often too expensive to do it correctly ... the building codes require certain walls between units, non-connecting attics, fire-breaks, separate drain lines, separate water feeds, separate metering. And in some older houses, just getting separate metering is a $30k job, because the whole house has to be rewired, especially with lower-to-upper floor wiring.

People can rent out rooms in their homes, they can break it up for families, but the they can't do it in full-compliance with the law, because the county ultimately owns and controls the infrastructure that gives that person access to that house.

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6 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Nope. Didn't have 4 entertaining rooms anyway.

Top floor was master bedroom, 2 offices and a library. Bedroom had en suite. 2 professionals, lots of time on the phone or computer, tons of books, periodicals, professional journals etc etc. Don't want the kids to mess with this stuff, lots of it was confidential and/or medical. Most definitely never wanted my wife to share my work space; our habits and tolerance for mess weren't anything *like* compatible. I'm a neat freak. She isn't. One of the reasons we don't live together.

Mid floor, 4 bedrooms and one bathroom, open plan kitchen/living area, big playroom. 3 kids, often an overseas visitor/student for 6 months or more, kids' friends sleeping over, sometimes more than one. We could build wonderful Lego constructions in the playroom, still got all the Lego & Duplo stashed for the grandkids. Tons and tons of books for the kids.

Bottom level 2 car spaces a laundry with shower & WC and machine shop. Not really a 3rd bathroom but sufficient to get clean from yard work or for one of the kids to go take a dump if the bathroom was occupied. I did separate the WC from the bathroom - I grew up with 2 sisters and a brother.

Wasn't excessive IMO given the requirements. You may differ but as I've said, I don't give your opinion on how I should live my life any weighting.

I like my current place, it's still too big for one or indeed 2 really. In fact I'm designing a tiny house ATM, it might end up on those ex fish farm pontoons and I'll just tie my boat up alongside. Other than access to my machine shop it'd be all the space I need. Totally off grid and sort of relocatable within limits.

FKT

It is amazing how small 3500sf can feel. With a 2 year old daughter, 6 year old son, 28 year old son working on his masters back home when his job evaporated a month into the pandemic, retired mother (in an apartment we attached to the main house), my wife, and myself it does feel a bit tight at times. I run my business form the house, and both sons are studying online, one with Kings College of London and one in Kindergarten. My oldest son shares my office with me, although it does present challenges when I am running a conf call and he needs to focus on an exam. The youngest son needs a space away from his sister when he is studying. Mom has her appt, we share a laundry room. Everyone except my wife and I need their own bedroom. It works for us, but we see more of each other on any given day than most folks did pre-pandemic. I will admit the house felt big for the very brief couple years that we were empty nesters, now it is just ....... cozy (that is what the RE folks call something that is a bit too small I think) 

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10 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

You really do lack all imagination.

They'll get DEMOLISHED and clusters of smaller dwellings built there, or a number of blocks will be amalgamated and medium/high rise constructed.

Ticky-tacky houses get replaced by even more ticky-tacky poorly built apartment blocks.

Happening all over Sydney.

FKT

Have to admit Mikewoof is correct. All depends on the local zoning & infrastructure. There is a LOT of resistance to letting this happen, as those who still own single fam houses see their prop values decrease once densification starts happening. Big houses never get torn down - when they get old or un-used they sell off & the new owner does a large re-model, often INCREASING the size of the house. This is AMERICA, bigger is better.

   I (& wife) currently live in a 4 bdrm/3bath house with detached garage (which has a bach pad room). IF we decide to downside, the best option for us is to build a 'granny flat" over the garage & lease out the big house. CA has big property taxes, and once you buy, increases in that tax are restricted in growth (far below market increase). Because we've owned this property for 23 yrs, we have a very low tax rate. If we buy a new house, that tax rate zooms up to current charges. So to continue at the same costs, we would have to move to a much smaller house (but still pay close to the same tax). The only way out is to move to a different state entirely (to be determined) and figure out how their tax structure works for us. Lots of things to factor in.

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On 2/27/2021 at 7:07 AM, Shortforbob said:

"we own an apartment building"

Cool your social warrior a bit Mel.   Dog autoridicules, but that doesn't seem so strange to me.    A family friend has an apartment building, down from a handful.   That was his full time job.   He was a realtor and had started collecting rental houses in the same neighborhood.   He was actually my parent's landlord when they first moved to the city.   About the time redevelopment of the blighted downtown became a thing I became aware he had traded his houses for a couple low rises strategically close to downtown.   As of December he had one building left   Only 50% of the tenants still pay rent.   Since revenue production has halved, value has dropped correspondingly.     Since he's in his 80's, he's ready to consider walking away from the job of managing a building - when revenue allows a sale.  

An uncle (first generation immigrant and autoworker) managed to buy a building as well.  Poor guy only slept at work.   

I used to rent out part of a multifamily home.   Evicting a tenant is difficult in many states even pre CoViD.   I only had one deadbeat, but ended up bluffing to avoid the many month expense of waiting 90 days, paying a cop to serve notice and taking her to court where the judge would likely give her 30 days to find new lodging.  Then I would have had to go back to court to get an order to force her out.   Presumably you have gone through the expense of flipping a unit after the nightmare tenant leaves.    When half a building stops paying there is no revenue for roofs and other essential repairs.   

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21 hours ago, mikewof said:

Landlord insurance ... never heard of it, I'll keep it in mind. The moratorium is supposed to expire at the end of March, the longer they drag this out, the worse the evictions are going to be. Garnishing wages, I've never heard of any judge ever granting that in my State.

I've been paying for the rent on my labs even though they're not in use, though I noticed one of the biggest tenants in the building was kicked out, presumably for nonpayment of non-active offices. In my case, I need the lab space, there is only so much that can be done from a house, especially with the medical aerosol research that I'm scheduled. But what about these "office" type activities? How much of that is going to return when companies are now cool with employees working from home? I thought there might be an opportunity to convert office-type space to light manufacturing. Any thoughts on that?

I was going to buy a 10k s.f. office building a couple years ago, but I got beat out by someone else, turns out to have been a blessing in disguise. Do you think there will be any good deals on that size office building? I would love to stop paying rent for lab space.

I expect commercial real estate is going to take a hit that will last. So many people have learned how to manage the office remotely during this COVID stuff. God knows how many are going to want to drag everybody back, considering they can operate cheaper with smaller office sqft-age. I know I'm only going to use one small office for accounting, which is 4 people and we only wish to have one be in-house at a time, so the current set up of each coming in one or two days a week will stay in place, and right there is 300ft of office space looking for a purpose. They like it...a LOT.  

 If these hunches correct the bottom of the market can be expected to be some ways out yet. Most are hanging on hoping things will go back the way they were at the moment. When hope dies and when the banks are sitting on a pile of buildings and desperate for buyers/tenants... 

 

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6 minutes ago, Mark K said:

I expect commercial real estate is going to take a hit that will last. So many people have learned how to manage the office remotely during this COVID stuff. God knows how many are going to want to drag everybody back, considering they can operate cheaper with smaller office sqft-age. I know I'm only going to use one small office for accounting, which is 4 people and we only wish to have one be in-house at a time, so the current set up of each coming in one or two days a week will stay in place, and right there is 300ft of office space looking for a purpose. They like it...a LOT.  

 If these hunches correct the bottom of the market can be expected to be some ways out yet. Most are hanging on hoping things will go back the way they were at the moment. When hope dies and when the banks are sitting on a pile of buildings and desperate for buyers/tenants... 

 

There must be an opportunity buried under the debris ... so no more offices filled with people sitting at desks, I'm surprised it took this long to happen. But light manufacturing, things that don't make a lot of noise and don't produce emissions, if light manufacturing can find a way to use former office space, it might be find a way to be competitive again.

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8 minutes ago, mikewof said:

There must be an opportunity buried under the debris ... so no more offices filled with people sitting at desks, I'm surprised it took this long to happen. But light manufacturing, things that don't make a lot of noise and don't produce emissions, if light manufacturing can find a way to use former office space, it might be find a way to be competitive again.

All turds have a silver lining...for someone. I recall an excellent case being made that The Plague gave us Gutenbergs printing press. Story goes there were so many dead people someone wondered what the heck to do with all these left-over clothes and rags. What made it worse was the survivors had all their cash and just threw away clothes when they got slightly worn. Someone figured out how to convert the rags into paper. Paper suddenly became cheap as shit. Before that you had to slaughter like 1000 sheep to make a book. Scribes could keep up with the available paper. 

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16 hours ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

Usually she's here and we go sailing. In fact she's here ATM processing plums into the food dryer and freezer. Apricots already done, pears and apples next.

a 3D printer has been on my list for a while now, be a change from machining stuff from solid blocks of HDPE or acetal.

FKT

It's a change, but probably not as effective......

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13 hours ago, Grrr... said:

I don't know exactly what applications you handle.  But there are some excellent 3D printers out there that can handle continuous-string carbon fiber and make incredibley robust parts.  In fact the company I work for has issued one to each of the manufacturing locations because in many cases 3D printing spare parts for our manufacturing machines (that includes hundreds of CNC per location) is much faster and more efficient that making the same replacement with metal-removal machines.

The metal-removal machines definitely have their place and are necessary.  But a 3D printer is hardly a toy, used correctly.

If anyone has any ideas on how to justify spending a considerable amount of money on such a 3d printer to the missus, I'm all ears.

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Just now, Ease the sheet. said:

It's a change, but probably not as effective......

They really have different use-cases. Lots of things a 3D printer can do that are quite difficult with subtractive machining. Anything involving complex curves, hollows, blended surfaces etc.

OTOH for the hobby end the materials still suck. Not a lot of strength really, even the fancy carbon fibre plastics.

Friend has one, I just get him to print stuff for me if I need it.

FKT

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1 minute ago, Ease the sheet. said:

If anyone has any ideas on how to justify spending a considerable amount of money on such a 3d printer to the missus, I'm all ears.

Do you own a boat? She must be used to spending a shit-ton of money on toys already. Tell her it'll save money on boat bits from the chandleries.

FKT

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Just now, Fah Kiew Tu said:

They really have different use-cases. Lots of things a 3D printer can do that are quite difficult with subtractive machining. Anything involving complex curves, hollows, blended surfaces etc.

OTOH for the hobby end the materials still suck. Not a lot of strength really, even the fancy carbon fibre plastics.

Friend has one, I just get him to print stuff for me if I need it.

FKT

My collection of racks, tool holders etc has grown quite extensively.

The difficulty at the hobby end is combining elegance and strength.......

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1 hour ago, Mark K said:

I expect commercial real estate is going to take a hit that will last. So many people have learned how to manage the office remotely during this COVID stuff. God knows how many are going to want to drag everybody back, considering they can operate cheaper with smaller office sqft-age. I know I'm only going to use one small office for accounting, which is 4 people and we only wish to have one be in-house at a time, so the current set up of each coming in one or two days a week will stay in place, and right there is 300ft of office space looking for a purpose. They like it...a LOT.  

 If these hunches correct the bottom of the market can be expected to be some ways out yet. Most are hanging on hoping things will go back the way they were at the moment. When hope dies and when the banks are sitting on a pile of buildings and desperate for buyers/tenants... 

 

Seems like a good idea but there's a few things to work through with working from home.

Workers comp insurance is a biggie. 

Social disconnect is another.

It's funny how these things turn around. 30 years ago Unions were trying to get the working from home thing going for working parents initially...you could hear employers screaming from Sydney to Melbourne.

We'll see how it pans out this time -_-

 

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7 minutes ago, Ease the sheet. said:

If anyone has any ideas on how to justify spending a considerable amount of money on such a 3d printer to the missus, I'm all ears.

Clothes pegs.

I don't think you have to spend so much. Liam got one a couple of years ago, used a lot. still fine.

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