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1) It's not up to us to prove your claim is false. You made the claim, so you can either back it up or you can't.  2) Rand Paul is a fucking liar and you shouldn't believe any of the vile spew th

“The money was all appropriated for the top in the hopes that it would trickle down to the needy. Mr. Hoover didn’t know that money trickled up. Give it to the people at the bottom and the people at t

IMHO, the more one learns, the more one is aware of the limits of all current knowledge on the given subject as well as ones' own limits. Nobody ever reaches the heights of confidence of the truly ign

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Wait.......................... Wait....................... Wait..................... Here it comes..... Hold on..................

 Idiots are about to start telling us that Garland is a commie, and the stimulus package is only for black welfare queens...... Wait.....

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I just hope the folks who need the help, and favor the GOP, are paying attention.

158621000_1475409672846084_1361577047004921011_o.jpg

But, they sure as shit supported the Tax Cut that went to the top 0.1%

One day, that money will trickle down.  So we've been assured, for decades.  But, this time it'll happen.  Trust me.

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And it costs $5932 for every man, woman, child and other.
Some will get $1,400 cheques
And you all seem to think this is such a deal.
Ain't government math grande?

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31 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

And it costs $5932 for every man, woman, child and other.
Some will get $1,400 cheques
And you all seem to think this is such a deal.
Ain't government math grande?

There's a shitload more to the bill than that and I suspect you were perfectly fine with the CARES act and supplemental bill logging in a $3T since the last guy was in office then.  But welcome back aboard the fiscal express. 

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It's completely inconceivable to me that congressmen/women and senators from places where their constituents would benefit greatly from the stimulus bill,would vote against it just to make some sort of brainless political point.

It just boggles the mind that people would purposefully hurt other people just because of politics.... Just astounding.

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36 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

And it costs $5932 for every man, woman, child and other.
Some will get $1,400 cheques
And you all seem to think this is such a deal.
Ain't government math grande?

You don't seem to understand that spending on programs that affect everyone, affects everyone, not just the programs getting the money. If the highway dept. in Madison Co. doesn't get money to fix bridges..... Guess what?

 

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4 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

There's a shitload more to the bill than that and I suspect you were perfectly fine with the CARES act and supplemental bill logging in a $3T since the last guy was in office then.  But welcome back aboard the fiscal express. 

B2 just couldn't stay away, could he...?

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A bit of hypocrisy.  He, of course, voted no

Independent restaurant operators have won $28.6 billion worth of targeted relief. This funding will ensure small businesses can survive the pandemic by helping to adapt their operations and keep their employees on the payroll.
 
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2 hours ago, roundthebuoys said:

2 confirmations, including a stellar AG, and a historic bill passed.  Nice to see shit quietly getting done.

So much winning.  I’m not going to get tired of it.

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34 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

There's a shitload more to the bill than that and I suspect you were perfectly fine with the CARES act and supplemental bill logging in a $3T since the last guy was in office then.  But welcome back aboard the fiscal express. 

There needs to be a push to recoup the costs of this by repealing the Relief for Downtrodden Oppressed Billionaires Act of 2017. We can’t afford to keep doing this without paying for it. 

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37 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

There's a shitload more to the bill than that and I suspect you were perfectly fine with the CARES act and supplemental bill logging in a $3T since the last guy was in office then.  But welcome back aboard the fiscal express. 

Never left the fiscal express.
CARES Act meant nothing to us.

40% of this bill is borrowed money.

Debt service is closing in on 15% of the budget.

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1 minute ago, quod umbra said:

Never left the fiscal express.
CARES Act meant nothing to us.

40% of this bill is borrowed money.

Debt service is closing in on 15% of the budget.

If the Repugnicans hadn't given all that relief to the billionaires, things would be a fuck of a lot better off. 

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7 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

Never left the fiscal express.
CARES Act meant nothing to us.

40% of this bill is borrowed money.

Debt service is closing in on 15% of the budget.

Who is us?

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1 hour ago, Mrleft8 said:

It's completely inconceivable to me that congressmen/women and senators from places where their constituents would benefit greatly from the stimulus bill,would vote against it just to make some sort of brainless political point.

It just boggles the mind that people would purposefully hurt other people just because of politics.... Just astounding.

And, some of their tactics are becoming tiresome to their own team.

Marjorie Taylor Greene delays COVID stimulus vote, annoys Republicans

Forty Republicans sided with Democrats by voting against her motion to adjourn.

  • The number of Republican members opposing Greene's stall tactics have increased since February, and doubled in size since last week when the Georgia representative made a motion to adjourn.

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42 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

There needs to be a push to recoup the costs of this by repealing the Relief for Downtrodden Oppressed Billionaires Act of 2017. We can’t afford to keep doing this without paying for it. 

Agreed and we could probably take a couple $100B from Defense.

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2 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

And, some of their tactics are becoming tiresome to their own team.

Marjorie Taylor Greene delays COVID stimulus vote, annoys Republicans

Forty Republicans sided with Democrats by voting against her motion to adjourn.

  • The number of Republican members opposing Greene's stall tactics have increased since February, and doubled in size since last week when the Georgia representative made a motion to adjourn.

Yeah but 150+ of them didn’t.....

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2 minutes ago, Fakenews said:
2 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

And, some of their tactics are becoming tiresome to their own team.

Marjorie Taylor Greene delays COVID stimulus vote, annoys Republicans

Forty Republicans sided with Democrats by voting against her motion to adjourn.

  • The number of Republican members opposing Greene's stall tactics have increased since February, and doubled in size since last week when the Georgia representative made a motion to adjourn.

Expand  

Yeah but 150+ of them didn’t.....

I like the trend.  Her first 2 motions, no GOP opposition.  Her 3rd garnered 18 GOP votes in opposition.  This one was 40 votes in opposition.  They see that her motions are not doing anything but garnering her attention and forcing them to jump when she says jump (they have to report to the floor to vote on her motion).  She is quickly becoming a pariah.  Hopefully, she is as dumb as we think and will continue to pull this shit.  No Committee assignments and regularly ignored by teammates.  She'll be ripe to be voted out in 2022.

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5 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

I just hope the folks who need the help, and favor the GOP, are paying attention.

158621000_1475409672846084_1361577047004921011_o.jpg

But, they sure as shit supported the Tax Cut that went to the top 0.1%

One day, that money will trickle down.  So we've been assured, for decades.  But, this time it'll happen.  Trust me.

$1400???  But he promised $2000! You must be a proud dupe 

Yup, and not a single Republican supported a $15 dollar minimum wage either.

Oh, that's right, it's not even in the bill!

Funny how that works.  :D

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4 hours ago, quod umbra said:

Never left the fiscal express.
CARES Act meant nothing to us.

40% of this bill is borrowed money.

Debt service is closing in on 15% of the budget.

If you don't have big acts of complete fucking stupidity, you don't have clean up costs to pay for.

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5 hours ago, quod umbra said:

Never left the fiscal express.
CARES Act meant nothing to us.

40% of this bill is borrowed money.

Debt service is closing in on 15% of the budget.

You missed the part in the bill where Mexico pays for it. 

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5 hours ago, quod umbra said:

Never left the fiscal express.
CARES Act meant nothing to us.

40% of this bill is borrowed money.

Debt service is closing in on 15% of the budget.

Nope, 100% of our defense budget and tax cuts for the .01% are now all borrowed money and this bill is 0% borrowed, in fact it earns interest, because math changed on Jan 20th.

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8 hours ago, roundthebuoys said:

Nope, 100% of our defense budget and tax cuts for the .01% are now all borrowed money and this bill is 0% borrowed, in fact it earns interest, because math changed on Jan 20th.

Yes the math did change. I heard Senator Schumer say when asked how we would pay for this bill that "we don't have to think about that in the world of MMT."
So I have a question for Mr. Schumer, if MMT is our monetary policy, and it is sound policy, then why am I still being asked to pay taxes?

My preference would be to open up the economy rather then a huge spending bill in the name of Covid Relief that only 10% has squat to do with coronavirus.

 

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41 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

Yes the math did change. I heard Senator Schumer say when asked how we would pay for this bill that "we don't have to think about that in the world of MMT."
So I have a question for Mr. Schumer, if MMT is our monetary policy, and it is sound policy, then why am I still being asked to pay taxes?

My preference would be to open up the economy rather then a huge spending bill in the name of Covid Relief that only 10% has squat to do with coronavirus.

 

The fact that you need to ask that question shows you don't understand mmt or the role of taxes.

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5 hours ago, quod umbra said:

My preference would be to open up the economy

Move to Texas and take your chances.

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7 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Move to Texas and take your chances.

Don’t forget to breathe deep and if you’re older don’t forget the Gov. expects you to take one for the, um I mean his team.

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14 hours ago, Venom said:

not a single Republican supported a $15 dollar minimum wage either.

Oh, that's right, it's not even in the bill!

You seem just flat-out over joyed at your fellow countrymen (and women) being ground down into the dirt. 

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18 hours ago, roundthebuoys said:

Agreed and we could probably take a couple $100B from Defense.

Good Op-ed in the Gray Lady today  . . 

The government could recover over $ 7 TRILLION over the next ten years .  

by going after the big tax cheats. 

The Reich, as you know, has defunded and hamstrung the IRS to the point where it cannot do its job. 

Hundreds of thousands of people don't bother to file at all anymore. 

Yet the Reich wants you to think they care about fiscal responsibility. 

No, they don't. 

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1 hour ago, SloopJonB said:

Move to Texas and take your chances.

What is the chances of dying from covid if you contract it?
At this point in time 95,000,000 people have been vaccinated and what, 25,000,000 have had covid. It is thought that millions more likely had  covid but it was not terribly severe thus never got tested. 
So the US population is around 336,000,000 thus around 1/3 are no longer susceptible. There is also a good deal of discussion about two factors that lead to severe. 78% of thus that werein danger of death or died were obese. The other factor, which they are looking at very hard lately, is blood type.....specifically type A as higher rate of infection.
We are extremely close to herd immunity and survival rate has gone up exponentially.

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2 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

Or you could support your own claim, not that elk ever do.

Or you could offer up some proof that 9% directly attributed to Covid relief is false.... which you will not fair well in trying to do.

BTW, Rand Paul was talking about this for quite a while. I think he probably has a good handle on how those monies will be spent.

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7 hours ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Can you give us a cite for that? 

It was someone I was watching on a financial show. I watch a couple of them through the day. My recollection was Steve Moore or Rand Paul.

In the spirit of debate, feel free to repute the umber with your own cite..... which I doubt you will bother doing.

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1 minute ago, quod umbra said:

Or you could offer up some proof that 9% directly attributed to Covid relief is false.... which you will not fair well in trying to do.

Perhaps you could offer up some proof that there isn't a Genie living in a teapot in orbit at the Lagrange point between the sun and the earth.

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6 hours ago, Ease the sheet. said:

The fact that you need to ask that question shows you don't understand mmt or the role of taxes.

I tell you what, instead of a flippant comment, why not explain MMT to the class and how it is not simply fiat.

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2 minutes ago, Danceswithoctopus said:

Perhaps you could offer up some proof that there isn't a Genie living in a teapot in orbit at the Lagrange point between the sun and the earth.

The passive aggressive runs strong with you all, surpassed only by insipidness. 
Thanks for your meaningful response that added so much to this thread. We are all better people for it.

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10 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

Or you could offer up some proof that 9% directly attributed to Covid relief is false.... which you will not fair well in trying to do.

BTW, Rand Paul was talking about this for quite a while. I think he probably has a good handle on how those monies will be spent.

1) It's not up to us to prove your claim is false. You made the claim, so you can either back it up or you can't. 

2) Rand Paul is a fucking liar and you shouldn't believe any of the vile spew that gets vomited from his mouth.

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7 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

The passive aggressive runs strong with you all, surpassed only by insipidness. 
Thanks for your meaningful response that added so much to this thread. We are all better people for it.

My pleasure. (Insipidity is in the mind of the beholder.)

Just now, Nice! said:

1) It's not up to us to prove your claim is false. You made the claim, so you can either back it up or you can't. 

2) Rand Paul is a fucking liar and you shouldn't believe any of the vile spew that gets vomited from his mouth.

Did Nice!'s response make more sense to you?

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11 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

I tell you what, instead of a flippant comment, why not explain MMT to the class and how it is not simply fiat.

What rock did you recently crawl out from under and how did you find your way to PA?
 

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14 minutes ago, Nice! said:

1) It's not up to us to prove your claim is false. You made the claim, so you can either back it up or you can't. 

2) Rand Paul is a fucking liar and you shouldn't believe any of the vile spew that gets vomited from his mouth.

BTW, @quod umbra, this is a claim, and I made it. I'm fully willing to back it up with cites, but not until you competently back up your claim first. 

(Note: I did not ask you to prove that Rand Paul *isn't* a fucking liar. See how this works?)

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20 minutes ago, Nice! said:

BTW, @quod umbra, this is a claim, and I made it. I'm fully willing to back it up with cites, but not until you competently back up your claim first. 

(Note: I did not ask you to prove that Rand Paul *isn't* a fucking liar. See how this works?)

Clod umbrage has no fucking clue. 

Too insipid, you ignorant twat?

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27 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

I don't think he knows how any of this works.

I think it does.  Just another angry sock who likely supported The Former Guy and slunk away, only to reappear with this new alias.

(edit)

Yep.  Found this in "Name History".

Screen Shot 2021-03-11 at 4.27.43 PM.png

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4 minutes ago, Bus Driver said:

I think it does.  Just another angry sock who likely supported The Former Guy and slunk away, only to reappear with this new alias.

(edit)

Yep.  Found this in "Name History".

Screen Shot 2021-03-11 at 4.27.43 PM.png

#6...?

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On 3/10/2021 at 4:04 PM, Bus Driver said:

I just hope the folks who need the help, and favor the GOP, are paying attention.

158621000_1475409672846084_1361577047004921011_o.jpg

But, they sure as shit supported the Tax Cut that went to the top 0.1%

One day, that money will trickle down.  So we've been assured, for decades.  But, this time it'll happen.  Trust me.

You're both getting it and paying for it.

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12 minutes ago, Dog said:

You're both getting it and paying for it.

I much prefer that typical Americans get the money, rather than the top 0.1%.

Either way, I know I am paying for it.  Difference is, I benefit from my own largesse.

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28 minutes ago, Bus Driver said:

I think it does.  Just another angry sock who likely supported The Former Guy and slunk away, only to reappear with this new alias.

(edit)

Yep.  Found this in "Name History".

Screen Shot 2021-03-11 at 4.27.43 PM.png

Where did you find that? Name History has not worked for ages.

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19 minutes ago, Bus Driver said:

The counterclockwise arrow, next to the name.

Screen Shot 2021-03-11 at 4.58.47 PM.png

Wow..... Why don't I get that option?

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42 minutes ago, Dog said:

You're both getting it and paying for it.

0 Republicans voted for the $1.9 trillion Covid relief bill.

278 Republicans voted for Trump’s $1.9 trillion tax cut for corporations and the rich.

You're paying for both of them. Which one do you think will help the economy?

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12 minutes ago, Mrleft8 said:

Wow..... Why don't I get that option?

Did you try with his name?  I tried a few others and saw nothing.  Of course, they may not be such chickenshits they needed to pretend to not be themselves.

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11 minutes ago, Nice! said:

0 Republicans voted for the $1.9 trillion Covid relief bill.

278 Republicans voted for Trump’s $1.9 trillion tax cut for corporations and the rich.

You're paying for both of them. Which one do you think will help the economy?

Ooh, ooh, pick me!

Of course, the previous plan, which showered those at the top with tax cuts will help the economy more.

Because, Trickle Down Economics is going to work.

 

 

One of these days.

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5 minutes ago, Bus Driver said:

Did you try with his name?  I tried a few others and saw nothing.  Of course, they may not be such chickenshits they needed to pretend to not be themselves.

Yup. Nothing. Tried with several other user names that I know for a fact are socks (All the same... guy.... If you can call him that)..... Nothing.

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1 hour ago, Dog said:

You're both getting it and paying for it.

Nope. The stimulus and other D initiatives will pay for themselves. Okay...that might not happen but it didn't happen (not even close) with the glorious Trump Tax cut either.

All the stimulus checks combined are trivial compared to my regular SS income. I just pile the stimulus with my other treasure. Maybe new sails soon.

I would welcome a tax increase fueled boom:

"In 1993 Bill Clinton passed a tax increase to reduce the deficit. Republicans insisted it would do no such thing. In fact, they said, it would cripple the economy. They were wrong. The economy boomed, and for the first time since the Roaring ’20s the deficit turned into a surplus for four consecutive years." Mother Jones

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24 minutes ago, Bus Driver said:

Didn't work for several of you.  Did work for one other.  Not going to waste any more time trying to understand it.

Screen Shot 2021-03-11 at 6.05.09 PM.png

I was “Sol No Ebola Rosenberg” for a while back when bullshitters we’re trying to pimp the Foxy News Fearbola campaign. 

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3 hours ago, quod umbra said:

....
We are extremely close to herd immunity and survival rate has gone up exponentially.

OK, now you're just fucking lying.

Even your made-up numbers do not put the USA anywhere close to herd immunity.

Please stop repeating dangerous bullshit

- DSK

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10 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

OK, now you're just fucking lying.

Even your made-up numbers do not put the USA anywhere close to herd immunity.

Please stop repeating dangerous bullshit

- DSK

To be fair we’re getting there.  Probably 125-150 infected and over 30M vaccinated as of now.  All adults will be eligible for vaccination by May 1 per CDC.  At 3M vaccinated per day and climbing (tip of the hat to Biden) we will be there by end of June.  So close.

Now that it’s proven Pfizer stops asymptomatic transmission cold (94%) we will be emancipated from masks after Memorial Day 

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On 3/10/2021 at 5:05 PM, quod umbra said:

And it costs $5932 for every man, woman, child and other.
Some will get $1,400 cheques
And you all seem to think this is such a deal.
Ain't government math grande?

It is being sold as being good for ordinary people, but deep down in economist world they realize this all about economic stimulus. This kind of spending will have a high domestic multiplier. Most recipients whether they are Joe (not rich) Taxpayer or state governments, schools, etc will spend this money in the US and spend it in the next few months. This will of course be multiplied probably 3x so you are looking at close to $6 trillion in stimulus. And a whole bunch of this money, the original spending plus the multiplier spending will end up going back to thee federal government in various forms of taxation making the actual cost much less.

And whose sock is quad umbra?

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It’s a bad day for the bad guys.  While Biden is giving his address to the Nation, Faux News hilariously has a PIP box of Tucker’s reaction to it live.  No audio but he’s moving around and grimacing.

Ooops it was too stupid for even Faux.  They just took down the box but the Chyron says Tucker will respond in less than 3 minutes.

Cant wait..:P

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1 hour ago, Fakenews said:

To be fair we’re getting there.  Probably 125-150 infected and over 30M vaccinated as of now.  All adults will be eligible for vaccination by May 1 per CDC.  At 3M vaccinated per day and climbing (tip of the hat to Biden) we will be there by end of June.  So close.

Now that it’s proven Pfizer stops asymptomatic transmission cold (94%) we will be emancipated from masks after Memorial Day 

We are not out in f the woods yet but we are making progress. It’s amazing what can happen when you stop trying to bullshit through a virus and implement policy based on reality. 

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8 minutes ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

It is being sold as being good for ordinary people, but deep down in economist world they realize this all about economic stimulus. This kind of spending will have a high domestic multiplier. Most recipients whether they are Joe (not rich) Taxpayer or state governments, schools, etc will spend this money in the US and spend it in the next few months. This will of course be multiplied probably 3x so you are looking at close to $6 trillion in stimulus. And a whole bunch of this money, the original spending plus the multiplier spending will end up going back to thee federal government in various forms of taxation making the actual cost much less.

And whose sock is quad umbra?

Exactly.  Thanks for giving me my own money back, I'll go buy a steak at a restaurant and have the local dude come over to paint my house.  Feel free to use the rest to buy vaccines and keep my kids safe in school.  My choice.  Not, here's my taxes, please buy another fucking F35.

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4 hours ago, Fakenews said:

To be fair we’re getting there.  Probably 125-150 infected and over 30M vaccinated as of now.  All adults will be eligible for vaccination by May 1 per CDC.  At 3M vaccinated per day and climbing (tip of the hat to Biden) we will be there by end of June.  So close.

Now that it’s proven Pfizer stops asymptomatic transmission cold (94%) we will be emancipated from masks after Memorial Day 

Yes, the vaccination numbers are going up quite well!

The max acceptable number, by reasonable methods supported by science, is 10~20% more than the number of known infections. Best guess, to get the total number of infection including unreported asymptomatic spreaders, is to just double the reported number of infections, which is just a tad under 30 million.

So, ~32 million vaccinated plus 60... no let's give it a big margin and call it 70 million infected... yields less than 1/3 of America has acquired immunity.

Plenty of wood to burn, if we're stupid enough to throw it on the fire.

- DSK

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14 hours ago, Nice! said:

0 Republicans voted for the $1.9 trillion Covid relief bill.

278 Republicans voted for Trump’s $1.9 trillion tax cut for corporations and the rich.

You're paying for both of them. Which one do you think will help the economy?

Given that Trump's tax cuts both eased the tax burden on businesses and resulted in record revenues to the government I'll go with the tax cuts over increased spending.

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23 minutes ago, Dog said:

Given that Trump's tax cuts both eased the tax burden on businesses and resulted in record revenues to the government I'll go with the tax cuts over increased spending.

So we are clear on where you stand...based on that, you agree with Senator Wicker’s vote against the bill, but disagree with his comments celebrating what the law will do for small businesses?

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36 minutes ago, Dog said:

Given that Trump's tax cuts both eased the tax burden on businesses and resulted in record revenues DEFICITS to the government I'll go with the tax cuts over increased spending.

^ truth added ^

- DSK

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10 minutes ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

So we are clear on where you stand...based on that, you agree with Senator Wicker’s vote against the bill, but disagree with his comments celebrating what the law will do for small businesses?

So to be clear, I was answering the question that Nice posed.

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38 minutes ago, Dog said:

So to be clear, I was answering the question that Nice posed.

That would be out of character. I’ll leave judgement on the veracity of that to Nice. 

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15 hours ago, Fakenews said:

Now that it’s proven Pfizer stops asymptomatic transmission cold (94%) we will be emancipated from masks after Memorial Day 

well then im glad i got the pfizer shot.

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11 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Plenty of wood to burn, if we're stupid enough to throw it on the fire.

mesquite wood from texas 

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3 hours ago, Dog said:

Given that Trump's tax cuts both eased the tax burden on businesses and resulted in record revenues to the government I'll go with the tax cuts over increased spending.

Ok, bullshitter.

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Why didn't you all try to buy Canada out?  I say we strike a deal.  We have a 2 trillion gdp, 25 year amortization, 10% down.  I'd be willing to sell out for 300 trillion.  That would be be about 300000/per person per year for next 25 years.  Surprised Trump didn't try it.  

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3 hours ago, Dog said:

Given that Trump's tax cuts both eased the tax burden on businesses and resulted in record revenues to the government I'll go with the tax cuts over increased spending.

If they had record revenues you would think that the money would be there to spend on those that are in need, no?

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