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13 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

That's amazing

Thank you Uncle Joe and all the Dems who voted for it. And a pox on those of you, including my useless Congresscreature and even more useless Senator Ron Johnson.

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13 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

Really??  I can't even get into the DMV faster than that happened.  I'm blown away by this.

Dayum...  Did you get a check last time or DD??  

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3 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

I got DD, haven't gotten this one yet though like those lucky bastards above.

Some things depend on when your bank chooses to post things.  My credit union posts things as soon as they arrive even though the funds might not be available for a few days.  Thus this stimulus payment is posted under a “pending” category with the caveat that the actual amount may differ from the pending amount.  My SS check usually gets posted 3 or 4 days before the money becomes real.  YMMV 

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3 hours ago, Mike G said:

Bingo.

Chevy doesn't make more 2020 cars (creating jobs) than people buy in 2020, no matter how much cash they get in the form of tax cuts.

The way to sell more cars is if the people that actually BUY cars have more money in their pocket.

That's called Demand Side Economics.

Reagan exposed the fallacy of that economic theory when he introduced Trickle Down or Supply Side Economics. We've all seen how effective it has been.

 

 

reaganomics-pic.jpg

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7 hours ago, quod umbra said:
23 hours ago, Bristol-Cruiser said:

It is being sold as being good for ordinary people, but deep down in economist world they realize this all about economic stimulus. This kind of spending will have a high domestic multiplier.....

So basically all sugar with no long lasting redeeming value.   ...

Did you understand ANY of B-C's post that you replied to?

- DSK

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On 3/10/2021 at 1:21 PM, roundthebuoys said:

2 confirmations, including a stellar AG, and a historic bill passed.  Nice to see shit quietly getting done.

Update #1: Stim checks hitting bank accounts 1 day after the bill is signed. 400 insurrectionists getting charged.

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16 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

Update #1: Stim checks hitting bank accounts 1 day after the bill is signed. 400 insurrectionists getting charged.

Insurrectionists is such a tough word. These are people who have been treated very badly. Unfairly. SO Unfairly. 
 

The preferred nomenclature would be “performance free speech advocates.”

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On 3/12/2021 at 6:45 PM, SloopJonB said:

That's called Demand Side Economics.

Reagan exposed the fallacy of that economic theory when he introduced Trickle Down or Supply Side Economics. We've all seen how effective it has been.

 

 

reaganomics-pic.jpg

 

“The money was all appropriated for the top in the hopes that it would trickle down to the needy. Mr. Hoover didn’t know that money trickled up. Give it to the people at the bottom and the people at the top will have it before night, anyhow. But it will at least have passed through the poor fellow's hands”.

WILL ROGERS, St. Petersburg Times, Nov. 26, 1932


 

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On 3/12/2021 at 7:38 PM, Steam Flyer said:

Did you understand ANY of B-C's post that you replied to?

- DSK

Absolutely. But I am not a Keynesian.
Did you understand my response? (rhetorical)

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17 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

Absolutely. But I am not a Keynesian.
Did you understand my response? (rhetorical)

Your response was nonsense, and  in no way pertains to being "not a Keynesian" unless the only thing you know about Keynes is that conservatives hate him

- DSK

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On 3/10/2021 at 6:21 PM, quod umbra said:

Never left the fiscal express.
CARES Act meant nothing to us.

40% of this bill is borrowed money.

Debt service is closing in on 15% of the budget.

Cut the military by 90%.  Easy peasy.

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3 hours ago, hasher said:

Cut the military by 90%.  Easy peasy.

First off it is only 20% of the budget. For some odd reason leftists always think it is far larger.......

Secondly it is one of the few expenditures in the federal budget called for in The US Constitution.

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3 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Your response was nonsense, and  in no way pertains to being "not a Keynesian" unless the only thing you know about Keynes is that conservatives hate him

- DSK

One of us is full of shit.....and it isn't me.

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Just now, quod umbra said:

First off it is only 20% of the budget. For some odd reason leftists always think it is far larger.......

Secondly it is one of the few expenditures in the federal budget called for in The US Constitution.

First of all, we spend too much.

Second of all, we don't need too.

Come back again when you find your brain.

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13 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

First off it is only 20% of the budget. For some odd reason leftists always think it is far larger.......

Secondly it is one of the few expenditures in the federal budget called for in The US Constitution.

 
15 percent
 
The United States spent $686 billion on national defense during fiscal year (FY) 2019 according to the Office of Management and Budget, which amounts to 15 percent of the federal budget.Jan 11, 2021

 

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59 minutes ago, quod umbra said:
4 hours ago, hasher said:

Cut the military by 90%.  Easy peasy.

First off it is only 20% of the budget. For some odd reason leftists always think it is far larger.......

Secondly it is one of the few expenditures in the federal budget called for in The US Constitution.

??

Math is not your strong point, is it? He didn't say "cut the budget 90% by cutting the military"

The military is considerably less than 20% of Federal spending, here's a 2019 graph... "defense + Homeland Security = 16.2%"

Rv5UHrNsvcucvflDwwz_pqEjjHnbQeE_HoAgEM44mGOwutlLCyMopUBTlKW_j1krJ775qI5DGZLYlEB8z7I3mD5BllP27Iq4URRWPE-vV3hfqv4wYgLtmDm3D_Z_hAlEMc-s1yA

 

And dragging the Constitution into this? WTF?

 

 

1 hour ago, quod umbra said:

One of us is full of shit.....and it isn't me.

Umm, yeah right. Let's have discussion of Keynesian policies, vice what -you- think "Keynesian" means. Go ahead, any time you're ready

- DSK

 

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2 hours ago, badlatitude said:
2 hours ago, quod umbra said:

First off it is only 20% of the budget. For some odd reason leftists always think it is far larger.......

Secondly it is one of the few expenditures in the federal budget called for in The US Constitution.

 
15 percent
 
The United States spent $686 billion on national defense during fiscal year (FY) 2019 according to the Office of Management and Budget, which amounts to 15 percent of the federal budget.Jan 11, 2021

Might as well cut the hell out of it.

 

revolting.JPG

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6 hours ago, quod umbra said:

First off it is only 20% of the budget. For some odd reason leftists always think it is far larger.......with veterans benefits, DOE caring for nuclear ships and weapons, CIA opps, and other military related expenses.  Or half of discretionary spending.

Secondly it is one of the few expenditures in the federal budget called for in The US Constitution.

Actually the Constitution signers were so afraid of a military coup they only allow Congress to authorize an army for two years at a time, with the expectation it would be go away after the need evaporated.   They thought state militias would be enough in time of peace.  All states had an ocean coast to defend from invasion at that time, so they never realized Kansas could slack off and let others defend it.   Notably they don’t restrict the navy in this manner, after disappointing revolutionary war results with state militia fleets, privateers, and the realization that warship building and cannon casting requires a long lead time.    The Constitution failed to authorize an air force or space force.  Apparently Congressional literalists believe these are the responsibility of the states?   

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19 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

??

Math is not your strong point, is it? He didn't say "cut the budget 90% by cutting the military"

The military is considerably less than 20% of Federal spending, here's a 2019 graph... "defense + Homeland Security = 16.2%"

Rv5UHrNsvcucvflDwwz_pqEjjHnbQeE_HoAgEM44mGOwutlLCyMopUBTlKW_j1krJ775qI5DGZLYlEB8z7I3mD5BllP27Iq4URRWPE-vV3hfqv4wYgLtmDm3D_Z_hAlEMc-s1yA

 

And dragging the Constitution into this? WTF?

 

 

Umm, yeah right. Let's have discussion of Keynesian policies, vice what -you- think "Keynesian" means. Go ahead, any time you're ready

- DSK

 

DOD, DHS + Veterans = 20%
Sorry for your confusion.
Actually I understand Keynesian policy fine. I just do not agree with government spending to stimulate a weak economy.
Secondly, our version of Keynesian policy avoids the  paying back the debt incurred during boom times.
That gives two solid reasons for why Keynesian policy is flawed.
The government does not know how to spend the people's money better than the people.
Again, sorry for your confusion.

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14 hours ago, Lark said:

Actually the Constitution signers were so afraid of a military coup they only allow Congress to authorize an army for two years at a time, with the expectation it would be go away after the need evaporated.   They thought state militias would be enough in time of peace.  All states had an ocean coast to defend from invasion at that time, so they never realized Kansas could slack off and let others defend it.   Notably they don’t restrict the navy in this manner, after disappointing revolutionary war results with state militia fleets, privateers, and the realization that warship building and cannon casting requires a long lead time.    The Constitution failed to authorize an air force or space force.  Apparently Congressional literalists believe these are the responsibility of the states?   

Actually I was more referring to a constitutional obligation to protect our borders.
I do agree that we are not the world's police force. And I do agree there is wasteful spending at The Pentagon.... or more aptly, that Congress buys shit The Pentagon does not want or need.

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Social Security and Medicare are not part of the federal budget - they are funded separately. 

The Reich always tries to include them because that makes military spending seen less outrageous. 

Vets For Peace 

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23 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

DOD, DHS + Veterans = 20%
Sorry for your confusion.
Actually I understand Keynesian policy fine. I just do not agree with government spending to stimulate a weak economy.
Secondly, our version of Keynesian policy avoids the  paying back the debt incurred during boom times.
That gives two solid reasons for why Keynesian policy is flawed.
The government does not know how to spend the people's money better than the people.  That old fallacious trope again.
Again, sorry for your confusion.

By the "people" do you mean the insurance companies running health care, corporations running defence spending, and investment banks running pension funds?

Or do you mean "hiring" a bankrupt property developer to build a beautiful border "wall". 

Clearly you have not looked at the comparative overhead of Medicare versus private medical insurance.  

Nor do you recognise the miserable failure of republican policies directed at economic growth through "trickle-down" fantasies versus Democratic policies of direct stimulus (e.g. money to those who will spend it) and infrastructure construction.  

Sorry for your confusion.  But you do NOT understand Keynesian policy "fine".

 

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3 hours ago, quod umbra said:

Actually I understand Keynesian policy fine. I just do not agree with government spending to stimulate a weak economy.

You would have done real well in 1930 - could have hired on with Hoover.

Study some economic history dummy.

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3 hours ago, quod umbra said:

DOD, DHS + Veterans = 20%
Sorry for your confusion.
Actually I understand Keynesian policy fine. I just do not agree with government spending to stimulate a weak economy.
Secondly, our version of Keynesian policy avoids the  paying back the debt incurred during boom times.
That gives two solid reasons for why Keynesian policy is flawed.
The government does not know how to spend the people's money better than the people.
Again, sorry for your confusion.

So the flaws you believe are in Keynesian economics are about how it is  practiced rather than the theory?

 

I'm guessing you're surprised we think you're an idiot?

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4 hours ago, Left Shift said:
4 hours ago, quod umbra said:

.... Actually I understand Keynesian policy fine. I just do not agree with government spending to stimulate a weak economy.
Secondly, our version of Keynesian policy avoids the  paying back the debt incurred during boom times.
...

By the "people" do you mean the insurance companies running health care, corporations running defence spending, and investment banks running pension funds?

Or do you mean "hiring" a bankrupt property developer to build a beautiful border "wall". 

Clearly you have not looked at the comparative overhead of Medicare versus private medical insurance.  

Nor do you recognise the miserable failure of republican policies directed at economic growth through "trickle-down" fantasies versus Democratic policies of direct stimulus (e.g. money to those who will spend it) and infrastructure construction.  

Sorry for your confusion.  But you do NOT understand Keynesian policy "fine".

 

He doesn't understand shit, he's just heard the right-wing talking heads insulting Keynes and thinks that is all there is to know. And apparently thinks Trump is going to release his beautiful health care plan any day now.

"I just do not agree with government spending to stimulate a weak economy" is great for countries that you want to suffer economic collapse. It's been done over and over... actually refined quite a bit since Keynes and is not really Keynesian except in the caveman sense.

"Secondly, our version of Keynesian policy avoids the paying back the debt incurred during boom times" sounds like the writing of somebody that flunked high school English, but it's still blaming Keynes for not following Keynesian policy.... huh?

When I first joined Sailing Anarchy, I would have thought that semi-literate dumb fucks would not participate in sailing. But it looks like i was wrong.

- DSK

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You're funny.
I studied economics in school way back when, so I do actually understand it to "some" degree.
As for economic collapse, the problem with such a mindset is that for starters it is based on fear as the motivating factor. If you actually look at the science of this pandemic, we would be far better off opening up the economy than passing a 1.9 trillion dollars stimulus plan.
Do yourself a favor and look up "The Everything Bubble" and how this stimulus plan pushes us closer to that economic event.
I would be glad to discuss either sailing or education in private with you if you like.
I doubt you will, so carry on with the usual over the top PA nonsense. It is, in moderation, amusing.

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19 hours ago, Lark said:

Actually the Constitution signers were so afraid of a military coup they only allow Congress to authorize an army for two years at a time, with the expectation it would be go away after the need evaporated.   They thought state militias would be enough in time of peace.  All states had an ocean coast to defend from invasion at that time, so they never realized Kansas could slack off and let others defend it.   Notably they don’t restrict the navy in this manner, after disappointing revolutionary war results with state militia fleets, privateers, and the realization that warship building and cannon casting requires a long lead time.    The Constitution failed to authorize an air force or space force.  Apparently Congressional literalists believe these are the responsibility of the states?   

I would have thought that after US troops reclaimed the airports from the British during the Revolution the FF would have seen the value of having an Air Force.  

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1 hour ago, Ease the sheet. said:

So the flaws you believe are in Keynesian economics are about how it is  practiced rather than the theory?

 

I'm guessing you're surprised we think you're an idiot?

Oh boy.
This place, and you and Steam at the moment, are the poster children of Dunning Kruger.
The flaw of Keynesian is believing that once the genie is out of the bottle that it will return. It will not when politicians buy votes with our monies.
The second problem is, as I mentioned previously, it is all sugar. It is not based on anything other than pumping money into a system when the participants are already fearful of an economic downturn, real or imagined. In essence what you are doing is taking money from the population and spending it on their behalf because they have decided to cut back on their spending due to economic uncertainty. If you are incapable of wrapping your heads around that I truly feel pity for you.

Now enjoy the rest of your Saint Patrick's Day.

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2 minutes ago, Fakenews said:

I would have thought that after US troops reclaimed the airports from the British during the Revolution the FF would have seen the value of having an Air Force.  

Says the person who coined, albeit inadvertently, the term "Elk".
Yeah, that's right, some of us remember.........

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21 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

You're funny.
I studied economics in school way back when, so I do actually understand it to "some" degree.
As for economic collapse, the problem with such a mindset is that for starters it is based on fear as the motivating factor. If you actually look at the science of this pandemic, we would be far better off opening up the economy than passing a 1.9 trillion dollars stimulus plan.
Do yourself a favor and look up "The Everything Bubble" and how this stimulus plan pushes us closer to that economic event.
I would be glad to discuss either sailing or education in private with you if you like.
I doubt you will, so carry on with the usual over the top PA nonsense. It is, in moderation, amusing.

530,000+ dead people would disagree with you, if they still could.

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17 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

Oh boy.
This place, and you and Steam at the moment, are the poster children of Dunning Kruger.
The flaw of Keynesian is believing that once the genie is out of the bottle that it will return. It will not when politicians buy votes with our monies.
The second problem is, as I mentioned previously, it is all sugar. It is not based on anything other than pumping money into a system when the participants are already fearful of an economic downturn, real or imagined. In essence what you are doing is taking money from the population and spending it on their behalf because they have decided to cut back on their spending due to economic uncertainty. If you are incapable of wrapping your heads around that I truly feel pity for you.

Now enjoy the rest of your Saint Patrick's Day.

The flaw of not actually knowing shit... what exactly is "Dunning Kruger"?

The flaw of Keynesian economics is that you don't understand it and you're sure that the dadgum gubbermint isn't applying it correctly

In essence what you are doing is spouting a lot of bullshit, partly out of ignorance and partly out of stubborn spite.

And thanks, I had a great St. Patricks Day sail earlier today and now enjoying an evening with my family.

- DSK

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1 hour ago, quod umbra said:

You're funny.
I studied economics in school way back when, so I do actually understand it to "some" degree.
As for economic collapse, the problem with such a mindset is that for starters it is based on fear as the motivating factor. If you actually look at the science of this pandemic, we would be far better off opening up the economy than passing a 1.9 trillion dollars stimulus plan.
Do yourself a favor and look up "The Everything Bubble" and how this stimulus plan pushes us closer to that economic event.
I would be glad to discuss either sailing or education in private with you if you like.
I doubt you will, so carry on with the usual over the top PA nonsense. It is, in moderation, amusing.

This statement is best categorised under the theme heading of:  "Let 'er R.I.P."

As long as it's somebody else's Grandma.

 

And for some light reading for our Special Ed Economist:  Let 'er R.I.P.!

Screen Shot 2021-03-17 at 5.37.27 PM.png

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1 hour ago, quod umbra said:

Oh boy.
This place, and you and Steam at the moment, are the poster children of Dunning Kruger.
The flaw of Keynesian is believing that once the genie is out of the bottle that it will return. It will not when politicians buy votes with our monies.
The second problem is, as I mentioned previously, it is all sugar. It is not based on anything other than pumping money into a system when the participants are already fearful of an economic downturn, real or imagined. In essence what you are doing is taking money from the population and spending it on their behalf because they have decided to cut back on their spending due to economic uncertainty. If you are incapable of wrapping your heads around that I truly feel pity for you.

Now enjoy the rest of your Saint Patrick's Day.

Politicians buying votes and genie's out of bottles have nothing to do with Keynesian economics, or economics in general.

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7 hours ago, quod umbra said:

You're funny.
I studied economics in school way back when, so I do actually understand it to "some" degree.

You're a liar.

No-one could study economics past elementary school and spout the moronic shit you do.

You have the typical zero level of right wing understanding

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19 hours ago, quod umbra said:

You're funny.
I studied economics in school way back when, so I do actually understand it to "some" degree.
As for economic collapse, the problem with such a mindset is that for starters it is based on fear as the motivating factor. If you actually look at the science of this pandemic, we would be far better off opening up the economy than passing a 1.9 trillion dollars stimulus plan.
Do yourself a favor and look up "The Everything Bubble" and how this stimulus plan pushes us closer to that economic event.
I would be glad to discuss either sailing or education in private with you if you like.
I doubt you will, so carry on with the usual over the top PA nonsense. It is, in moderation, amusing.

We would not have had to pass this plan if the other guy had put even the minimum actions into place when this started.  Even you can see that...  

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3 hours ago, d'ranger said:

So q u was The Shadow? Then that means he was also No.2 (or No.6), J_T, Jack Tar and a host of other socks/IDs?  Same shit, different name.

To be honest, I can't keep straight half the name changes in this place.  But, he certainly posted as The Shadow.

Screen Shot 2021-03-18 at 5.49.49 PM.png

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4 hours ago, shaggy said:

We would not have had to pass this plan if the other guy had put even the minimum actions into place when this started.  Even you can see that...  

Oh boy.
Might I suggest you consider other sources for your "news" then the ones you currently enjoy?
So didn't vote for Trump, either time. Just to get that part of the name calling out of the way.
Trump imposed a travel ban from China very early on. He then extended that to Europe. He then shut down the country to try and flatten the curve.
Do none of these actions a year ago rise to the level of taking action early on in your book?
I don't know why you guys run on about things that clearly are not true nor accurate.

And I must say, aside from my 3 years taking economics.... books I have read and countless hours as a teen watching PBS shows about J.M.K., Adam Smith and Milton Friedman have really let me down here in this forum. I mean clearly the arguments you all have made, the provocative thought, the citations and graphs have clearly demonstrated the errors of my ways. Oh wait, aside from hurling insults like monkeys flinging feces at the zoo, you haven't laid out one good reason why we just spent 1.9 trillion dollars on what is 90% pork barrel and paybacks. And all the while you are dislocating your shoulders patting yourselves on the back and grinning about how very smart and learned you all are. Methinks you all haven't a fukin clue of that which you speak.

Best you can all do is try and out others who time and again use variations on the same name. This is the work product of your lives and I applaud you all for the efforts.

Now you all enjoy your evening.... and D'ranger, enjoy the long email you will no doubt write to Tempesta to try and get me banned...... as you are so fond of doing. How very pathetic.

 

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1 hour ago, Bus Driver said:

To be honest, I can't keep straight half the name changes in this place.  But, he certainly posted as The Shadow.

Screen Shot 2021-03-18 at 5.49.49 PM.png

Why is it that the most clueless right wingers keep changing their ID's?

As a practice it seems to be restricted to only the dumbest and most fanatical of them.

Do they think it hides them from Big Brother or something?

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16 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

Why is it that the most clueless right wingers keep changing their ID's?

As a practice it seems to be restricted to only the dumbest and most fanatical of them.

Do they think it hides them from Big Brother or something?

That is what parlor is for...

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16 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

Why is it that the most clueless right wingers keep changing their ID's?

As a practice it seems to be restricted to only the dumbest and most fanatical of them.

Do they think it hides them from Big Brother or something?

Happens every winter, especially when there is a party change in the WH coming up. As soon as the boats come out of the water the nuts fall off of the trees. 

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20 hours ago, Sol Rosenberg said:

Happens every winter, especially when there is a party change in the WH coming up. As soon as the boats come out of the water the nuts fall off of the trees. 

Spit coffee allover my keyboard.
How many screen names have you used since 2000 CW? How many? Half dozen? Dozen?? You sir are this places biggest hypocrite. Display it with pride.

I was wondering if any of you bothered to have Quod Umbra translated? Any one?
Since you can't defend the 1.9 trillion boondoggle or Keynesianism, you all fall back to what you are best at..... which amounts to nothing. The cumulative body of work, 1.4 million posts in PA is the sum total of your lives. Your Mothers must be so very proud.

Time to get shit done. Enjoy the day all!

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16 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

I was wondering if any of you bothered to have Quod Umbra translated? Any one?

the first day ;-) no need to google it...I know a tad bit of Latin...

Umbrage is to cast a shade or shadow .........

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4 hours ago, dacapo said:
4 hours ago, quod umbra said:

I was wondering if any of you bothered to have Quod Umbra translated? Any one?

the first day ;-) no need to google it...I know a tad bit of Latin...

Umbrage is to cast a shade or shadow .........

He was just desperate to have someone look it up after he spent all those days finding it himself.

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4 hours ago, dacapo said:

the first day ;-) no need to google it...I know a tad bit of Latin...

Umbrage is to cast a shade or shadow .........

I’m guessing it’ll be the next sock name something we should all take umbrage with.

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On 3/18/2021 at 3:57 PM, quod umbra said:

Oh boy.
bla bla bla a whole bunch of bullshit

 

Covid deaths per million population:

  • USA: 1637
  • Canada: 600

Tell me again how Trump's Covid actions were anything but an unmitigated disaster?

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1 minute ago, Nice! said:

Covid deaths per million population:

  • USA: 1637
  • Canada: 600

Tell me again how Trump's Covid actions were anything but an unmitigated disaster?

Well, there were a lot of people trying to make it a mitigated disaster, but Turnip went with Scott Atlas instead.

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On 3/10/2021 at 3:05 PM, quod umbra said:

And it costs $5932 for every man, woman, child and other.
Some will get $1,400 cheques
And you all seem to think this is such a deal.
Ain't government math grande?

Sure, why not? Shut down the economy to benefit the elderly, give the bill to the children. $2 trillion in stimulus, give the bill to the children. Build up another trillion in debt for a military that is useless in the emerging Economic War? Hand that bill to the children too. Fund institutional racism with tax dollars and steal the futures of millions of children of color and immigrants? Meh, they're just a bunch of kids, put them in cages and tell them not to come here.

The math works just as well as our pollution policies worked for the last few decades; create manufacturing profits, dump the toxins on poor people ... and children. But as long as we keep worshiping at the alter of left and of right, of red and of blue, we won't notice the debris in our wakes.

Debt is only something that "stupid" lefties and righties  like you and I concern ourselves. The intelligent lefties and righties, they don't worry about debt, it's a tool for success, after all. Our debt creeps up to $100.000 per citizen? Why worry, we'll be dead, it's the kids' problem. We never promised them a better world than we inherited, did we? Boomers never claimed to be the Greatest Generation with those antiquated ideas of leaving the world better than they found it, they're Boomers, and Boomers gotta Boom, Boom, Boom.

https://usdebtclock.org/

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On 3/18/2021 at 2:28 PM, d'ranger said:

So q u was The Shadow? Then that means he was also No.2 (or No.6), J_T, Jack Tar and a host of other socks/IDs?  Same shit, different name.

 

Many say he is also Snaggletooth....

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On 3/17/2021 at 6:59 PM, quod umbra said:

 we would be far better off opening up the economy than passing a 1.9 trillion dollars stimulus plan.

 

You disapprove of the stimulus plan helping millions of people in dire straits, we get that. 

But, how do you feel about Trumps 1.9 Trillion gift to the wealthy and Corporations?  I guess you are okay with that?

 

https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/economy/news/2019/06/20/471209/1-9-trillion/

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On 3/20/2021 at 8:44 AM, dacapo said:
On 3/20/2021 at 8:25 AM, quod umbra said:

I was wondering if any of you bothered to have Quod Umbra translated? Any one?

the first day ;-) no need to google it...I know a tad bit of Latin...

Umbrage is to cast a shade or shadow .........

Ever noticed how the true dumbfucks always assume they're smarter than others? "Oo-o I'll pick a screen name in Latin, that's like an unbreakable code" because nobody ever studies Latin in high school.

Then there is the issue of why anybody would give a half a rat shit about Mr Dumbfuck's name. But he's really smart, he knows Keynesian economics is bad!

- DSK

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1 minute ago, Steam Flyer said:

Ever noticed how the true dumbfucks always assume they're smarter than others? "Oo-o I'll pick a screen name in Latin, that's like an unbreakable code" because nobody ever studies Latin in high school.

Then there is the issue of why anybody would give a half a rat shit about Mr Dumbfuck's name. But he's really smart, he knows Keynesian economics is bad!

- DSK

 

Dunning-Krueger

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2 hours ago, billy backstay said:

 

You disapprove of the stimulus plan helping millions of people in dire straits, we get that. 

But, how do you feel about Trumps 1.9 Trillion gift to the wealthy and Corporations?  I guess you are okay with that?

 

https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/economy/news/2019/06/20/471209/1-9-trillion/

 

Sent a PM to Quod Shadow, awaiting his response here???

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3 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Ever noticed how the true dumbfucks always assume they're smarter than others?

It's the fundamental fact behind Dunning & Krugers research. The true dumbfucks reside at the peak of Mount Stupid.

Dunning Kruger-Effect: Why Unintelligent People Don't Learn? - SlideModel

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1 hour ago, SloopJonB said:

It's the fundamental fact behind Dunning & Krugers research. The true dumbfucks reside at the peak of Mount Stupid.

Dunning Kruger-Effect: Why Unintelligent People Don't Learn? - SlideModel

Too bad they spelled "Plateau" wrong. :blink:

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On 3/20/2021 at 1:08 PM, SloopJonB said:

He was just desperate to have someone look it up after he spent all those days finding it himself.

Actually, I took 5 years of Latin and 7 of French........

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8 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Ever noticed how the true dumbfucks always assume they're smarter than others?

This is precisely what I have thought of you lot for many, many years.

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8 hours ago, billy backstay said:

 

You disapprove of the stimulus plan helping millions of people in dire straits, we get that. 

But, how do you feel about Trumps 1.9 Trillion gift to the wealthy and Corporations?  I guess you are okay with that?

 

https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/economy/news/2019/06/20/471209/1-9-trillion/

Oh Billie, Billie, Billie..... As you know, I did answer your PM.
And I do not have issue with helping those in dire straits. What I take issue with is causing those dire straits then pretending to come to the rescue.
The Border Crisis is a great example. First create the crisis, then solve the problem...... in a way favorable not to those at the heart of the crisis, but to those who manufactured the crisis in the first place.

Billie, we have three choices. Follow the science, follow the money, or swallow the malarkey but pretend we have the intellectual capacity to understand just how  enlightened our leaders are. 

Toodles.
S.T.
 

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1 minute ago, Navig8tor said:

Just confirming he's a slow learner. 

He spent two terms in 9th grade; Bush and Clinton.

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14 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

Actually, I took 5 years of Latin and 7 of French........

And look where it got you.

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13 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

This is precisely what I have thought of you lot for many, many years.

And once again you were wrong.

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Ninth grade.... who was President? Ummm, Nixon's The One!
Fuk I'm so old I remember being dismissed from Grammar School and walking home when JFK was assassinated. They brought us all into the auditorium and told us The President has been shot and killed and to go home. No buses, no teachers escorting us.....little kids and we all just walked home. Vaguely remember asking my Mom what it all meant. I was in Kindergarten!

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31 minutes ago, quod umbra said:
9 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Ever noticed how the true dumbfucks always assume they're smarter than others?

This is precisely what I have thought of you lot for many, many years.

As the late Flip Wilson used to say, "You don't know me -THAT- well." And you may consider me a dumbfuck but I am here to learn. You?

- DSK

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3 hours ago, Ishmael said:
5 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

It's the fundamental fact behind Dunning & Krugers research. The true dumbfucks reside at the peak of Mount Stupid.

Dunning Kruger-Effect: Why Unintelligent People Don't Learn? - SlideModel

Expand   Expand  

Too bad they spelled "Plateau" wrong.

IMHO, the more one learns, the more one is aware of the limits of all current knowledge on the given subject as well as ones' own limits. Nobody ever reaches the heights of confidence of the truly ignorant.

- DSK

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27 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

....... I am here to learn. You?

- DSK

To mock all of you enlightened folks. :D
I know the leftists always think they are the smartest in the room. I find that comical frankly.
My take is, or has long been that the guy living under the underpass in a cardboard box knows a shit-ton more about life than I will ever know.

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1 hour ago, quod umbra said:

Oh Billie, Billie, Billie..... As you know, I did answer your PM.
And I do not have issue with helping those in dire straits. What I take issue with is causing those dire straits then pretending to come to the rescue.
The Border Crisis is a great example. First create the crisis, then solve the problem...... in a way favorable not to those at the heart of the crisis, but to those who manufactured the crisis in the first place.

Billie, we have three choices. Follow the science, follow the money, or swallow the malarkey but pretend we have the intellectual capacity to understand just how  enlightened our leaders are. 

Toodles.
S.T.
 

 

Yes, thank you!  You did answer my PM.   But you are still dodging me, when I specifically requested that you opine publicly here, on the 1.9 trillion Trump giveaway to one-percenters, in the same fashion that you publicly decried here, the same 1.9 T stimulus to the middle income and zero-percenters....

So, we are still waiting, S.T.....  TTFN

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2 hours ago, quod umbra said:

Oh Billie, Billie, Billie..... As you know, I did answer your PM.
And I do not have issue with helping those in dire straits. What I take issue with is causing those dire straits then pretending to come to the rescue.
The Border Crisis is a great example. First create the crisis, then solve the problem...... in a way favorable not to those at the heart of the crisis, but to those who manufactured the crisis in the first place.

Billie, we have three choices. Follow the science, follow the money, or swallow the malarkey but pretend we have the intellectual capacity to understand just how  enlightened our leaders are. 

Toodles.
S.T.
 

Since this line of reasoning stems from your objection to the COVID relief bill, perhaps you'd share with the class precisely how President Biden, or anyone remotely associated with him, caused the dire straits for which the $1.9 package is intended to address.

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1 hour ago, Bus Driver said:

Since this line of reasoning stems from your objection to the COVID relief bill, perhaps you'd share with the class precisely how President Biden, or anyone remotely associated with him, caused the dire straits for which the $1.9 package is intended to address.

 

Thanks Bus!  Exactly what I am trying to get our friend "quod umbra" to respond directly to here. Unfortunately he keeps bobbing and weaving and dodging, hoping to tire us with Ali's "rope-a-dope" tactic from boxing.  And, while he has decried the stimulus as horrific economics, he will not answer my direct question about the 1.9 trillion Trump giveaway, to the one percenters and Corporations, as I have asked him to.  This is NOT "what about-ism".  One is a nearly 2 trillion handout to the richest of the rich, versus helping the lowest of the low, in a once in a century pandemic, which has financially slaughtered millions of hard working poor and middle class working Americans....

 

Still waiting quod umbra?  Nice chatting and catching up via PM's, thanks for that....

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6 hours ago, quod umbra said:

My take is, or has long been that the guy living under the underpass in a cardboard box knows a shit-ton more about life than I will ever know.

I suspect many, or most here will agree with you about that.

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9 hours ago, billy backstay said:

 

Thanks Bus!  Exactly what I am trying to get our friend "quod umbra" to respond directly to here. Unfortunately he keeps bobbing and weaving and dodging, hoping to tire us with Ali's "rope-a-dope" tactic from boxing.  And, while he has decried the stimulus as horrific economics, he will not answer my direct question about the 1.9 trillion Trump giveaway, to the one percenters and Corporations, as I have asked him to.  This is NOT "what about-ism".  One is a nearly 2 trillion handout to the richest of the rich, versus helping the lowest of the low, in a once in a century pandemic, which has financially slaughtered millions of hard working poor and middle class working Americans....

 

Still waiting quod umbra?  Nice chatting and catching up via PM's, thanks for that....

 

 

 

11 hours ago, Bus Driver said:

Since this line of reasoning stems from your objection to the COVID relief bill, perhaps you'd share with the class precisely how President Biden, or anyone remotely associated with him, caused the dire straits for which the $1.9 package is intended to address.

Egads. A very loaded question.  Allow me to turn it around on you for a second. How is it that this isn't laid at the feet of those who came in a time before Trump? The Wuhan Lab has an interesting history and the US has supplied funds for some of the research done there. Since Congress appropriates funding, seems that culpability has a long and varied reach. That squarely includes Mr. Biden.
I think it child like to try and lay blame on Trump's doorstep..... but clearly he will be your boogieman for years to come. Which is sad and is designed to get you to look the other way.
President Biden, signing or asking for such mind boggling amounts of "stimulus"..... because Billy and BD, "it's Trump's fault" is about as weak a justification as you could possibly put forth. If you kids bothered to actually try and understand that less than 10% of this spending bill helps "those in dire straits", perhaps then you may be able to understand my objections to it. "BUT WE MUST HELP THOSE IN NEED!" Sure, so then that lowers the cost of this bill into a couple of hundred billion, not 1.9 trillion.

We do not follow the science. That is a plain and simple fact. Look at the numbers. Look at the brackets of those most vulnerable, age groups, co-morbidities, even evidence of blood types. But no, cannot do that in America. All must suffer equally. Fact is 78% of those that died from Covid 19 were obese. Fact is the vast majority of those that died were over 55 years of age. Fact is those that died had two or more underlying health conditions.
But man you better shut it all down. Show them who is boss. Scare and spend baby, scare and spend.

As for tax cuts. Always a popular subject. Blame the rich. Divide and conquer.... class warfare is about as ugly as it gets. The left always rolls out how tax relief favors the wealthy. STORM THE BASTILLE! Hmmmm, think about that for a second. Do you think that may well have to do with the fact that the wealthy pay the vast majority of taxes? "String up those sons of bitches!"
As a follow up to that, what happens to those monies if "the government" didn't confiscate it in the form of excessive taxation? Does it disappear? Is in no longer in circulation being spent or invested? So what you all preach is rather than allow it to be left to the free market, let's just take it away from those mean and greedy people and spend it on the people! Utter nonsense. But ya'll fall for it every damn time.

Have fun kids. There is your answer Billie...... and no I am not Snaggletooth!

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40 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

 Do you think that may well have to do with the fact that the wealthy pay the vast majority of taxes? "String up those sons of bitches!"

 

Much of the 1.9 Trillion giveaway was in the form of tax breaks for the rich and Corps.  You're okay with that, but not with helping millions of restaurant workers?  You think instead we should open back up the restaurants.  Have you noticed the steep increase in Covid cases in just the past few days?   Like you said, "follow the science", which tells us to wear masks stay 6 feet apart and don't congregate in large numbers close together.  Watch the video coverage of the spring break rioters in Miami Beach, the past few nights.  If you don't think this will be a super spreader event, I have a bridge in Brooklyn, I can get you a real good deal on!!

Cheers, Happy Monday!

 

EDIT -  Most of the Corporate Free Money was NOT plowed back into the economy, as promised.  Instead they bought back their stock shares to bolster their prices, and buried the money rather than spend it.  Same with the one-percenters, for the most part.  What was promised to be a tax break for the Middle Class, became a HUGE GIFT to those that need it the least. 

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17 minutes ago, billy backstay said:
46 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

 Do you think that may well have to do with the fact that the wealthy pay the vast majority of taxes? "String up those sons of bitches!"

 

Much of the 1.9 Trillion giveaway was in the form of tax breaks for the rich and Corps.  You're okay with that, but not with helping millions of restaurant workers?  You think instead we should open back up the restaurants.  Have you noticed the steep increase in Covid cases in just the past few days?   Like you said, "follow the science", which tells us to wear masks stay 6 feet apart and don't congregate in large numbers close together.  Watch the video coverage of the spring break rioters in Miami Beach, the past few nights.  If you don't think this will be a super spreader event, I have a bridge in Brooklyn, I can get you a real good deal on!!

Cheers, Happy Monday!

One thing that completely escapes the "Those poor rich guys pay the vast majority of taxes!!" brigade is that the wealthy gain the vast majority of benefit from the organization, structure, and enforcement, of our socioeconomic system.

Rich people don't just have more stuff, they live longer, get more sleep, better health care, etc etc.

And of course, the "poor rich guys pay blah blah" brigade ALSO say "the rich EARNED that money!!"

Which is why they so vigorously oppose inheritance taxes, too.

- DSK

 

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2 hours ago, billy backstay said:

EDIT -  Most of the Corporate Free Money was NOT plowed back into the economy, as promised.  Instead they bought back their stock shares to bolster their prices, and buried the money rather than spend it.  Same with the one-percenters, for the most part.  What was promised to be a tax break for the Middle Class, became a HUGE GIFT to those that need it the least. 

Just wait - it'll trickle down soon.

Real soon.

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1 hour ago, Steam Flyer said:

One thing that completely escapes the "Those poor rich guys pay the vast majority of taxes!!" brigade is that the wealthy gain the vast majority of benefit from the organization, structure, and enforcement, of our socioeconomic system.

Rich people don't just have more stuff, they live longer, get more sleep, better health care, etc etc.

And of course, the "poor rich guys pay blah blah" brigade ALSO say "the rich EARNED that money!!"

Which is why they so vigorously oppose inheritance taxes, too.

- DSK

 

Well that is a bit myopic IMHO. The rich, in many cases, became rich because they had the skillset to compete.
The poor, remain the poor, because we as a society pay them to remain poor, rather then helping them to succeed.
Back to what I mentioned earlier in the thread IIRC, you cannot have, allow, tolerate, less than 40% of inner-city kids to make it through graduation. It is a national disgrace.
 

Inheritance taxes are a whole other issue. The threshold for tax free inheritance is currently around 11 million...over that threshold there is a 40% tax. It has steadily increased from just over 5 million a couple of years ago. Now the fallacy in wanting to see that lowered is that family businesses and family farms generally have to be sold off to pay steep inheritance taxes. If you owned a farm, or built a business over the course of your lifetime, would you not wish your kids to be able to keep that farm or that business? 

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4 minutes ago, quod umbra said:

Well that is a bit myopic IMHO. The rich, in many cases, became rich because they had the skillset to compete.
The poor, remain the poor, because we as a society pay them to remain poor, rather then helping them to succeed.
Back to what I mentioned earlier in the thread IIRC, you cannot have, allow, tolerate, less than 40% of inner-city kids to make it through graduation. It is a national disgrace.
 

Inheritance taxes are a whole other issue. The threshold for tax free inheritance is currently around 11 million...over that threshold there is a 40% tax. It has steadily increased from just over 5 million a couple of years ago. Now the fallacy in wanting to see that lowered is that family businesses and family farms generally have to be sold off to pay steep inheritance taxes. If you owned a farm, or built a business over the course of your lifetime, would you not wish your kids to be able to keep that farm or that business? 

Yes, the seperation of business from the inheritance tax is an issue... mostly for people who do not study their state's accounting regs, and refuse to hire a decent accountant. But it is a problem.

I also agree about education. The opportunity for an education should be universal and not dependent on your families wealth or lack of it.

In the greater majority of cases in the USA, wealthy households are in that category because they started out in the upper wealth brackets. Kids go to "good" schools (which is as much about networking as it is about education), business connections already established, etc etc. It's a hell of a lot easier to make your 2nd million than your 1st. I do not know this of my own knowledge, but I am friends with several people who do, that your 60th, 70th, 100th, etc, million makes itself. All you have to do is not piss it away faster than it accumulates.

Which brings a whole new level of respect for The Donald, who in ~30 years has pissed away a fortune richer than most countries.

- DSK

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2 hours ago, billy backstay said:

 

Much of the 1.9 Trillion giveaway was in the form of tax breaks for the rich and Corps.  You're okay with that, but not with helping millions of restaurant workers?  You think instead we should open back up the restaurants.  Have you noticed the steep increase in Covid cas