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The AC 37 has started, news and rumours


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8 hours ago, Rennmaus said:

Maybe call them according to their LWL? :lol:

For the moment the team could practice crew work. Or LR and AM get together and practice starts and races (oh my, how I would love this!!!).

Unless some radical change on Patriot this will be a pretty boring show... :D

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I’m not calling this out for the sake of ostracizing you, nor to play PC police on a forum that is notorious for the opposite of that. I could just hit ignore, delete or whatever. I’m calling this out

Hilarious to watch Kiwis who've been around since AC35 twist themselves into intellectual pretzels to give ETNZ a pass on what they screamed bloody murder about when Oracle did it. Even Oracle di

Wow, 13 pages, a frenzy of outraged indignation over something that hasn't even been decided yet? This must set some new kind of SA record??! (... probably not )

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4 hours ago, Xlot said:

Long video interview with Max on FareVela. On the 1:1 match, he said - even if everything is possible in the AC - that his acquaintance with Kiwis in general and also with GD leads him to discount the possibility of such an unsporting move

Rather, he thinks (in so many words) that in addition to strong-arming the government, this is a way to sow uncertainty and undermine other team’s morale and fund raising

Paranoid much? Take Pirelli of the boat and it still fully funded. Why is he moaning, it’s sure as shit isn’t because he is worried about AM raising funds. 

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3 minutes ago, JALhazmat said:

Paranoid much? Take Pirelli of the boat and it still fully funded. Why is he moaning, it’s sure as shit isn’t because he is worried about AM raising funds. 

So because someone has money, it's  correct to ask them to throw away their investment and being happy?

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10 minutes ago, strider470 said:

So because someone has money, it's  correct to ask them to throw away their investment and being happy?

Aa far as I can tell, the reason riche guys are rich is exactly because they hate throwing away money. You can check my bank account for confirmation of the opposite.

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8 hours ago, Stingray~ said:

So what if the Poms win? Sounds like nothing changes, so how the hell can you try sell it as an actual Cup Match? May as well award the winner that silly trophy Rennie has a photo of, somewhere.. 

59c28641c5769_4-1-08-ThirdCup-1-Kopie.jpg.1277f652a1a4fcbe0bf86bfcc5379cf6.jpg

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14 hours ago, SimonN said:

That is provably incorrect. Ainslie started sailing foiling boats for AC34, at a time that Pete was sailing non foiling AC45's, and has been helming development foiling AC boats ever since. He has put in significantly more hours sailing AC foilers than the NZ guys. You seem to have forgotten how much time NZ didn't sail leading up to AC35 and even for AC36, they had less time on the water than the other teams. Even if you add in the time spent by the NZ boys sailing Moths and A's, I still cannot see them having done more time, never mind 1000% or 10 times. As for ability, with Oracle, Ainslie was the only helm capable of taming the first boat - everybody else who tried failed badly. Since then, every time boats have been equal, Ainslie has schooled everybody else, including Burling, Outeridge, Spithill and Slingsby. His record suggests that put him in any of the AC boats and he will get it round a course faster than anybody else could get it around a course. Let's see what happens in the SailGP.

It would seem that Ainslie's weakness is that while he can get the best out of any boat, he might not be the best at the development side of things. I think where the NZrs excel is the ability of the sailing team to contribute to the design.

 

 

Dennis didn't develop his keel boat speed chops in big boats.

Russell didn't develop his keel boat speed chops in big boats.

Nothings changed, you cant experiment enough to really learn on the giant platforms - you cant develop feel on big platforms - driving is too remote and you cant do the time when it costs a zillion$ an hour to sail.

You learn how to develop an AC75 by sailing 49ers, Moths N17's and A-Cats.

Ben is one of the best ever in slow boats, and he has done great trying to cross the chasm - but I stand by the fact that Glenn, Peter and Blair are 1000x ahead.

Pretty sure the results of the last 2 Cups suggest the same - Ben's boats didn't work.

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22 hours ago, cbulger said:

Clearly it's suboptimal to be CEO and Helm - especially for those campaigns that are the pet project of one billionaire.  The team CEO has to keep the money flowing - "no cash, no splash" as JB says.  For teams with one sugar daddy, that person has a much heavier hand on the team.  For INEOS, as soon as they crossed the line and were eliminated in the finals, 100% of Ben's attention was dedicated to entertaining the owner.   That is just one very visible example of how managing the "owner" distracts from leading the team on the water.

For the Kiwi team, GD has the challenge of putting together multiple sources of funding is less certain than one sugar daddy, but has its advantages.  GD can insulate the sailing team from the whims of the sponsors and let them focus on winning, not entertainment. 

1. Ben is not CEO of Ineos. That would be Grant Simmer

2. Ian R did not need entertaining. Not his style.  When he took over financing the team, he did it on the condition that all the other sponsors went away. He wanted the team to focu on sailing and eventually winning and not to be distracted by multiple sponsors.  So its quite the opposite, compared to AM or ETNZ, Grant Simmer and Ben have to spend far less time keeping sponsors happy.

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14 hours ago, SimonN said:

That is provably incorrect. Ainslie started sailing foiling boats for AC34, at a time that Pete was sailing non foiling AC45's, and has been helming development foiling AC boats ever since. He has put in significantly more hours sailing AC foilers than the NZ guys. You seem to have forgotten how much time NZ didn't sail leading up to AC35 and even for AC36, they had less time on the water than the other teams. Even if you add in the time spent by the NZ boys sailing Moths and A's, I still cannot see them having done more time, never mind 1000% or 10 times. As for ability, with Oracle, Ainslie was the only helm capable of taming the first boat - everybody else who tried failed badly. Since then, every time boats have been equal, Ainslie has schooled everybody else, including Burling, Outeridge, Spithill and Slingsby. His record suggests that put him in any of the AC boats and he will get it round a course faster than anybody else could get it around a course. Let's see what happens in the SailGP.

It would seem that Ainslie's weakness is that while he can get the best out of any boat, he might not be the best at the development side of things. I think where the NZrs excel is the ability of the sailing team to contribute to the design.

 

 

I think this is an apt summary. While I think Burling has put lots of time into foiling boats, especially moths and As, I think that Ben has full time transitioned to foiling and is not distracted any more by Olympic campaigns.   Ben and Peter are probably two of the most accomplished helms around currently which is why it will be exciting to see them on a more equal footing.

NZL has excelled in design and sailing ability. GBR needs to catch up in design....not sure why they lag, it is something the Brits are usually very good at  (Industrial design as IR points out, Ineos combines German reliability in production and British creativity in industrial design .  Formula one which is all bout design and aero is populated to a large extent by British designers. Aircraft design ahs lots of brits)   So I think the Brits will eventually and quite suddenly get it right and produce an amazing AC75 . 

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7 hours ago, Thewas said:

Aa far as I can tell, the reason riche guys are rich is exactly because they hate throwing away money. You can check my bank account for confirmation of the opposite.

Yeah, not really.

The idea that the rich are better at managing money or more thrifty than the poor is bunk.

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1 hour ago, EYESAILOR said:

1. Ben is not CEO of Ineos. That would be Grant Simmer

2. Ian R did not need entertaining. Not his style.  When he took over financing the team, he did it on the condition that all the other sponsors went away. He wanted the team to focu on sailing and eventually winning and not to be distracted by multiple sponsors.  So its quite the opposite, compared to AM or ETNZ, Grant Simmer and Ben have to spend far less time keeping sponsors happy.

Sorry, regardless of title, Ben wants and assumes the head of Syndicate role.  He was doing Grant Dalton's role with fund raising and Max's role in front of the camera while the Kiwi sailing team was developing their weapon.  

And I'm pretty sure that was JR climbing on Ineos as soon as the campaign was done and had 100% of Ben's attention while the crew tidied up the boat.  Not a critical moment, but evidence of Ben's priorities (fund raising).

Look, Ben is an all time great sailor and a top 10 driver of big foiling boats - i'm just pointing out why the structure of teams run by Kiwi's Peter Blake, Russell Coutts and Grant Dalton wins every time.

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26 minutes ago, cbulger said:

Sorry, regardless of title, Ben wants and assumes the head of Syndicate role.  He was doing Grant Dalton's role with fund raising and Max's role in front of the camera while the Kiwi sailing team was developing their weapon.  

And I'm pretty sure that was JR climbing on Ineos as soon as the campaign was done and had 100% of Ben's attention while the crew tidied up the boat.  Not a critical moment, but evidence of Ben's priorities (fund raising).

Look, Ben is an all time great sailor and a top 10 driver of big foiling boats - i'm just pointing out why the structure of teams run by Kiwi's Peter Blake, Russell Coutts and Grant Dalton wins every time.

I dont disagree entirely!      

I think a lead like Russell or Grant off the boat brings an objectivity to the team that is very strong.   I think AM's biggest weakness was having Terry H as simultaneously Tatctician, Skipper, Team manager and fund raiser.  There was not someone "off the boat" to point out a flawed decsion making and communication pattern

However I think Ben put himself in a better position than Terry H as follows:

1.  Ben does not have to do fund raising since he met IR.  No more multitude of sponsors, just one guy who can take a decision in 10 minutes and writes big checks.   I actually think Ratcliffe probably strengthens Team Ineos .

In contrast Terry is busy responding to 3 principal individual sponsors,  the NYYC and commodore who feel very involved and helped with fund raising and several corporate sponsors including Airbus.

2. Ben hired Grant Simmer to be day to day CEO.   

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10 hours ago, Thewas said:

Unless some radical change on Patriot this will be a pretty boring show... :D

Troublé:

People have been saying, including Grant Dalton, that a challenge between the Brits and the New Zealanders is a possible outcome...
For me, it's a bit of a joke. I had Grant on the phone again yesterday (Tuesday). He told me there were a lot of options, but that isn't the one he favours. In fact, it is all a game of poker to get the NZ government to pay up, which explains why Team New Zealand, who are losing Emirates as their sponsor, are threatening to hold the Cup abroad. The most likely outcome is a post Covid America's Cup organised quickly in November 2022, here in Auckland, with the present teams, so that they don't get taken apart. That's also why the New Zealanders spoke so soon about tightening up the nationality rule. They want to avoid a ploy like Bertarelli used and which harmed them so much (the head of Alinghi hired a lot of the New Zealand crew for the 2003 Cup – editor's note). I'm fighting hard now so that the eight existing boats can be used by the new teams, which would mean doing away with the rule concerning the place of construction for the boat, which in my opinion, serves no purpose now. If we did that, the boats could be used by new teams.

"I'm dreaming of getting it up to eight teams"

So, have you heard about any new teams popping up?
It's hard to say anything with certainty today. What is certain is that alongside the Kiwis and Brits, the Italians are going to continue, as will the Americans. I can see two or three more and I'm dreaming of getting it up to eight teams.

What about a French challenge?
I don't feel very optimistic. The secret of the America's Cup is finding a patron at the start who will pay for a third of the project and that allows you to get things moving. After that, it is much easier to find sponsors. In my opinion, you can't get a project up and running without that input from a private investor.

More here:

https://mailchi.mp/tipandshaft/116-bruno-troubl-there-will-be-no-going-back?e=7fef2e432d

 

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2 minutes ago, Rennmaus said:

Troublé:

People have been saying, including Grant Dalton, that a challenge between the Brits and the New Zealanders is a possible outcome...
For me, it's a bit of a joke. I had Grant on the phone again yesterday (Tuesday). He told me there were a lot of options, but that isn't the one he favours. In fact, it is all a game of poker to get the NZ government to pay up, which explains why Team New Zealand, who are losing Emirates as their sponsor, are threatening to hold the Cup abroad. The most likely outcome is a post Covid America's Cup organised quickly in November 2022, here in Auckland, with the present teams, so that they don't get taken apart. That's also why the New Zealanders spoke so soon about tightening up the nationality rule. They want to avoid a ploy like Bertarelli used and which harmed them so much (the head of Alinghi hired a lot of the New Zealand crew for the 2003 Cup – editor's note). I'm fighting hard now so that the eight existing boats can be used by the new teams, which would mean doing away with the rule concerning the place of construction for the boat, which in my opinion, serves no purpose now. If we did that, the boats could be used by new teams.

"I'm dreaming of getting it up to eight teams"

So, have you heard about any new teams popping up?
It's hard to say anything with certainty today. What is certain is that alongside the Kiwis and Brits, the Italians are going to continue, as will the Americans. I can see two or three more and I'm dreaming of getting it up to eight teams.

What about a French challenge?
I don't feel very optimistic. The secret of the America's Cup is finding a patron at the start who will pay for a third of the project and that allows you to get things moving. After that, it is much easier to find sponsors. In my opinion, you can't get a project up and running without that input from a private investor.

More here:

https://mailchi.mp/tipandshaft/116-bruno-troubl-there-will-be-no-going-back?e=7fef2e432d

 

Is it really so hard to find a title sponsor for a winning team that they go to such lengths just to make the government pony up?

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16 minutes ago, crashtack said:

Is it really so hard to find a title sponsor for a winning team that they go to such lengths just to make the government pony up?

Clearly. Sponsorship is about exposure. NZ doesn't have the appeal because

1/ we're very small.

2/ we're a long way from... pretty much everywhere.

3/ The Kiwi sponsors here don't have the kind of budget required to invest in the AC.

 

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1 hour ago, EYESAILOR said:

In contrast Terry is busy responding to 3 principal individual sponsors,  the NYYC and commodore who feel very involved

But TH wouldn't have it any other way.  This is his greatest fantasy come to life!  Listen to the interviews. He *only* refers to these billionaires by their first name, even in formal settings.  He loves every minute of it. He loves it more than winning the Cup.   TH is all about whatever is best for TH.  That is the #1 reason AM lost. Nobody wants to take a back seat (a la Max).  Nobody will step back and do what's best for the team. Fuck that. I'd rather go hobknob with billionaires and keep myself on the centerstage. 

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40 minutes ago, crashtack said:

Is it really so hard to find a title sponsor for a winning team that they go to such lengths just to make the government pony up?

Maybe it just points to the fact that as an event the AC doesn’t rate that well for sponsors and with the baby bombers folding up their tent and departing TNZ has few other options to realistically raise the $200m required.

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4 hours ago, dogwatch said:

Why do you keep posting these, every bloody time? Those who actually want to read his musings can sign up for his newletter.

Not that I read Magnus in particular, but i do find it handy when peeps post stuff in here I haven't seen before.

However this is Anarchy and anything shirt of doxing and pedo accusations are fair game, so have at it I guess.

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17 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

I guess it's that I find what MW writes utterly worthless. 

 

Oh I don't know. Most people like a good comedy.

My point was more about one man's trash being another's treasure. I don't find the links to Magnus particularly helpful but I do find other links very helpful and I'm sure there are peeps that find links to him helpful too.

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If Emirates are pulling out thats their biggest cash sponsor by far, its serious and why Stephen Tindall is concerned with insolvency.

had Grant on the phone again yesterday (Tuesday). He told me there were a lot of options, but that isn't the one he favours. In fact, it is all a game of poker to get the NZ government to pay up, which explains why Team New Zealand, who are losing Emirates as their sponsor, are threatening to hold the Cup abroad. The most likely outcome is a post Covid America's Cup organised quickly in November 2022, here in Auckland, with the present teams, so that they don't get taken apart."

Jim Ratcliffe is on record saying he will not be funding the Cowes event.

Stephen Tindall

"As a director, one of my main responsibilites is for us to stay solvent so that means if we have to do things that we would prefer not to do, then maybe that has to happen."

 
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59 minutes ago, jaysper said:

However this is Anarchy and anything shirt of doxing and pedo accusations are fair game, so have at it I guess.

What?!?  We're not allowed to accuse people of being pedos?...

Sounds like something a pedo would say. :) :) :)

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2 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Clearly. Sponsorship is about exposure. NZ doesn't have the appeal because

1/ we're very small.

2/ we're a long way from... pretty much everywhere.

3/ The Kiwi sponsors here don't have the kind of budget required to invest in the AC.

 

On point 3...all the more reason to get out of the current class of “boats”.  This notion of reducing costs and continuity is a joke.  Cost are high because of the design they chose.  Continuity is only about keeping pay checks going.  

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10 minutes ago, sailman said:

On point 3...all the more reason to get out of the current class of “boats”.  This notion of reducing costs and continuity is a joke.  Cost are high because of the design they chose.  Continuity is only about keeping pay checks going.  

Yup quite ironic really the first holder of the Cup that can't afford to defend it by introducing the most complex and costly design class since the magnificent J Class.

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59 minutes ago, sailman said:

On point 3...all the more reason to get out of the current class of “boats”.  This notion of reducing costs and continuity is a joke.  Cost are high because of the design they chose.  Continuity is only about keeping pay checks going.  

Costs are high because that’s the price of winning. 

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If the Cup is what's matters, why choosing as CoR the $quillionaire of the $quillionaires when you're in a  financial struggle? Isn't it a bit dangerous?
Or the assumption was that they will never be able to build a boat fast enough? :D

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1 hour ago, Priscilla said:

A picture tells a thousand words.

Lord Dalton attempting to gain an emergency social welfare payment from the keeper of the purse.

 

3D58E594-8B9A-44BB-ADD5-3D62AE4C9B18.jpeg.38451684d2c443813abcf5df1d375413.jpeg

 

 

 

Okay, am I the only one that wants to hate-bang Jacinda?

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2 hours ago, Priscilla said:

Yup quite ironic really the first holder of the Cup that can't afford to defend it by introducing the most complex and costly design class since the magnificent J Class.

Whilst I don't like the AC75, this has had no impact on their ability to fund a defence. It's the economic devastation that has caused that.

I'm sure the teams could find a way to spend $80 Million plus on a 2 person 3 footer. $20 million dollar paint job that will make the boat 3% faster? Sold!

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6 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Clearly. Sponsorship is about exposure. NZ doesn't have the appeal because

1/ we're very small.

2/ we're a long way from... pretty much everywhere.

3/ The Kiwi sponsors here don't have the kind of budget required to invest in the AC.

 

And apparently nobody knows (or has enough interest in) promoting the Cup outside New Zealand and negotiating broadcast /streaming deals that maximize exposure. Enough eyeballs and you get lucrative advertising to viewers. 

As much as I have criticized RC's season 1 business/management choices he found people who are doing a lot better in Season 2.1 promoting Russell's Regattas than EztNZ/Prada did reminding US and prob other places that there was a Cup coming, etc. (Still won't watch because R's Regattas is owned by an unrepentant seditionweasel.)

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7 minutes ago, NeedAClew said:

Enough eyeballs and you get lucrative advertising to viewers. 

Only way to get enough people to watch a boat is to put it on Mars.

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48 minutes ago, NeedAClew said:

Or get Elon as tactician. 

Just what we need, a boat that's 2 years late, twice the price and has quality statistics worse than a chinese brand.

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4 hours ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Okay, am I the only one that wants to hate-bang Jacinda?

I’m not calling this out for the sake of ostracizing you, nor to play PC police on a forum that is notorious for the opposite of that. I could just hit ignore, delete or whatever. I’m calling this out because I’ve come to learn that you are very capable of hearing the other side and recognizing when you’re wrong—which is all that anyone can ask of a conversation partner. Blitz, leave the grotesque misogyny aside. I much prefer hearing your thoughts on sailing.

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4 hours ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Okay, am I the only one that wants to hate-bang Jacinda?

Crikey Blitz my guess is you fall into the anger rapist category.

Power rapist

 

For these rapists, rape becomes a way to compensate for their underlying feelings of inadequacy and feeds their issues of mastery, control, strength, authority and capability. The intent of the power rapist is to assert their competency. The power rapist relies upon verbal threats, intimidation with a weapon, and uses only the amount of force necessary to subdue the victim.

The power rapist tends to have fantasies about rape and sexual conquests. They may believe that even though the victim initially resists them, that once they overpower their victim, the victim will eventually enjoy the rape. The rapist needs to believe that the victim enjoyed what was done to them, and they may even ask the victim to meet them for a date later.

Because this is only a fantasy, the rapist does not feel reassured for long by either their own performance or the victim's response. The rapist feels that they must find another victim, convinced that this victim will be "the right one."

Hence, their offences may become repetitive and compulsive. They may commit a series of rapes over a short period of time. This is the most common type of serial rapist of strangers in the United States

Anger rapist

The aim of this rapist is to humiliate, debase, and hurt their victim; they express their contempt for their victim through physical violence and profane language. For these rapists, sex is a weapon to defile and degrade the victim, rape constitutes the ultimate expression of their anger. This rapist considers rape the ultimate offence they can commit against the victim.

Anger rape is characterised by physical brutality, much more physical force is used during the assault than would be necessary if the intent were simply to overpower the victim and achieve penetration. This type of offender attacks their victim by grabbing, striking and knocking the victim to the ground, beating them, tearing their clothes, and raping them.

The experience for the offender is one that is of conscious anger and rage.

Sadistic rapist

For these rapists, there is a sexual association with various concepts, so that aggression and the infliction of pain is eroticised. For this rapist, sexual excitement is associated with the causing of suffering upon their victim. The offender finds the intentional maltreatment of their victim intensely gratifying and takes pleasure in the victim's torment, anguish, distress, helplessness, and suffering; the offender finds the victim's struggling an erotic experience.

Sadistic rape usually involves extensive, prolonged torture and restraint. Sometimes, it can take on ritualistic or other bizarre qualities. The rapist may use some type of instrument or a foreign object to penetrate their victim. Sexual areas of the victim's body become a specific focus of injury or abuse.

The sadistic rapist's assaults are calculated. They will often wear a disguise or will blindfold their victims.Prostitutes or other individuals whom they perceive to be "promiscuous" are often the sadistic rapist's targets. The victims of a sadistic rapist may not survive the attack. For some offenders, the ultimate satisfaction is gained from murdering the victim.

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4 hours ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Okay, am I the only one that wants to hate-bang Jacinda?

<_<<_< really???????????????

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4 minutes ago, mad said:

<_<<_< really???????????????

4 hours ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Okay, am I the only one that wants to hate-bang Jacinda?

That is some weird shit and hopefully you are the only one.

 

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On 3/25/2021 at 12:25 AM, strider470 said:

Let's be honest, Ben Ainslie wuould have easily won the America's Cup, swapping boats with the Kiwis.

I watched a lot of the racing. What I saw was the italians outsailing the brits and then the kiwis outsailing the italians. All 3 of the boats were very close in speed when one wasn't in the gas. I don't really like the Kiwis. They seem to be OK blokes, but just too cold for me. Ben is a great sailor. Jimmy is a great competitor. But it's more than just the one guy and the boat. The Kiwis just sailed better overall.

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2 hours ago, Will_Co said:

I’m not calling this out for the sake of ostracizing you, nor to play PC police on a forum that is notorious for the opposite of that. I could just hit ignore, delete or whatever. I’m calling this out because I’ve come to learn that you are very capable of hearing the other side and recognizing when you’re wrong—which is all that anyone can ask of a conversation partner. Blitz, leave the grotesque misogyny aside. I much prefer hearing your thoughts on sailing.

Wtf are you talking about?  That wasn't mysogisnistic at all. I dislike her not because she's a woman...  I dislike her because is a raving liberal communist.  In fact, I just said that I find her an attractive woman that I would like to have sexual relations with.  Put on your big boy pants (and probably a pair of diapers) and stop looking for injustice where none exists.  Then, the world will be a better place. 

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34 minutes ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Wtf are you talking about?  That wasn't mysogisnistic at all. I dislike her not because she's a woman...  I dislike her because is a raving liberal communist.  In fact, I just said that I find her an attractive woman that I would like to have sexual relations with.  Put on your big boy pants (and probably a pair of diapers) and stop looking for injustice where none exists.  Then, the world will be a better place. 

Maybe it was the hyphen, hate-bang has a set meaning, and not a nice one.

As for finding her attractive, you may be on your own there as well. But maybe it is the controlling, nasty underneath, personality that takes any possible sheen off for me. Or she is just not my type. Don't really care.

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11 minutes ago, Gissie said:

Maybe it was the hyphen, hate-bang has a set meaning, and not a nice one.

As for finding her attractive, you may be on your own there as well. But maybe it is the controlling, nasty underneath, personality that takes any possible sheen off for me. Or she is just not my type. Don't really care.

Oh, Cindy is safe from me banging her as long as there are dogs in the street.

However I'm not convinced her behaviour is driven by nastiness, but rather something far worse.

I think the following quite from C.S Lewis says it better than I ever could:

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."

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2 minutes ago, jaysper said:

Oh, Cindy is safe from me banging her as long as there are dogs in the street.

However I'm not convinced her behaviour is driven by nastiness, but rather something far worse.

I think the following quite from C.S Lewis says it better than I ever could:

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."

I see the nasty streak at times. She likes to come across as a kind, thoughtful person who wouldn't hurt a fly. Occasionally you see her heart break through when pushed or questioned in a way she doesn't like. I would think she can be vindictive and brutal when the cameras are off. They can be good traits in leaders at times, I just get suspicious when people spend so much time and effort to hide it.

As for the quote, agree completely, we are being led down the path to the slaughter. And we are going peacefully. Giving up liberties for safety. I think it was Roosevelt that made some comment on this.

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1 hour ago, nroose said:

I watched a lot of the racing. What I saw was the italians outsailing the brits and then the kiwis outsailing the italians. All 3 of the boats were very close in speed when one wasn't in the gas. I don't really like the Kiwis. They seem to be OK blokes, but just too cold for me. Ben is a great sailor. Jimmy is a great competitor. But it's more than just the one guy and the boat. The Kiwis just sailed better overall.

Being cold and not emotional in sport is part of our culture. Emotions do not bring out good sport performance. Clinical cold ruthless killing of your opponent works best. 

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35 minutes ago, Gissie said:

I see the nasty streak at times. She likes to come across as a kind, thoughtful person who wouldn't hurt a fly. Occasionally you see her heart break through when pushed or questioned in a way she doesn't like. I would think she can be vindictive and brutal when the cameras are off. They can be good traits in leaders at times, I just get suspicious when people spend so much time and effort to hide it.

As for the quote, agree completely, we are being led down the path to the slaughter. And we are going peacefully. Giving up liberties for safety. I think it was Roosevelt that made some comment on this.

Most facist regimes have needed but extend a handful of grass to lead the sheep to the slaughter.

Now the electorate will eventually vote her incompetent arse out, but not before she compounds upon the already enormous damage she has done.

At least Key and Clark were intelligent. This one is so obviously thick as two short planks.

For what its worth, a friend of mine met her at a party in the UK when she was "working" there and she was all Marxist dogma the whole time. Comrade this, comrade that. This is how I know she falls under C.S Lewis' quote.

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Sorry Mr Bruno Trouble

No way and I mean ZERO CHANCE Ineos Team UK would agree to hold a 2022 America's Cup in November 2022 with the existing boats since their B2 is considerably slower compared to Luna Rossa and Te Rehutai!

AC37 in Nov 2022 in Auckland YES but only in new Boats.

Ratcliffe would immediatedly pull the plug on his Challenge if he is forced to race in the existing boats.

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9 hours ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Okay, am I the only one that wants to hate-bang Jacinda?

Get help you misogynist sicko. With your hate speech you are a danger for yourself and others. 

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13 hours ago, Forourselves said:

Clearly. Sponsorship is about exposure. NZ doesn't have the appeal because

1/ we're very small.

2/ we're a long way from... pretty much everywhere.

3/ The Kiwi sponsors here don't have the kind of budget required to invest in the AC.

 

U.K. isn’t huge, has fucked itself with Brexit, and is up to its eyeballs in debt, has never won the cup and yet still finds a multi campaign sponsor. 
 

ETNZ don’t have any excuse for not being some fully funded multi campaign monster

emirates, Maccas, Toyota are NOT kiwi sponsors they are enormous multi nationals so maybe GD needs to up his game in negotiations as the current tactic of creeping along isn’t working or providing stability. ( yes they are winning cups) but the constant gun to the head bickering with NZ gov is getting dull and eventually he will be told to fuck off. 

either be the home team? Or go corporate and cut the ties, the fence sitting is dull to listen to each cycle. 

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4 minutes ago, JALhazmat said:

U.K. isn’t huge, has fucked itself with Brexit, and is up to its eyeballs in debt, has never won the cup and yet still finds a multi campaign sponsor. 
 

ETNZ don’t have any excuse for not being some fully funded multi campaign monster

emirates, Maccas, Toyota are NOT kiwi sponsors they are enormous multi nationals so maybe GD needs to up his game in negotiations as the current tactic of creeping along isn’t working or providing stability. ( yes they are winning cups) but the constant gun to the head bickering with NZ gov is getting dull and eventually he will be told to fuck off. 

either be the home team? Or go corporate and cut the ties, the fence sitting is dull to listen to each cycle. 

Emirates and Maccas perhaps, but its not Toyota International, its Toyota NZ and Bob Field.

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40 minutes ago, Rennmaus said:

Get help you misogynist sicko. With your hate speech you are a danger for yourself and others. 

 

3 hours ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

In fact, I just said that I find her an attractive woman that I would like to have sexual relations with. 

Ren the guy is beyond sick honestly any male that wants to hate bang a woman and then pedal it back to finding her an attractive sexual option requires urgent psychological assistance.

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27 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

Emirates and Maccas perhaps, but its not Toyota International, its Toyota NZ and Bob Field.

Perhaps he needs to elevate the discussion then? 

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13 hours ago, jaysper said:

Oh I don't know. Most people like a good comedy.

My point was more about one man's trash being another's treasure. I don't find the links to Magnus particularly helpful but I do find other links very helpful and I'm sure there are peeps that find links to him helpful too.

Sorry but it's a statement of the bleeding obvious that new and useful links are welcome on SAAC. My comment was specifically on posts linking to MW's blog, every few days, each time he updates it. If anyone wants those updates, they can subscribe. Posting every one is excessive.

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23 minutes ago, Priscilla said:

 

Ren the guy is beyond sick honestly any male that wants to hate bang a woman and then pedal it back to finding her an attractive sexual option requires urgent psychological assistance.

What did we expect from someone whose moniker is "Blitzkrieg"? That's inherent sickness.

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6 hours ago, nroose said:

I watched a lot of the racing. What I saw was the italians outsailing the brits and then the kiwis outsailing the italians. All 3 of the boats were very close in speed when one wasn't in the gas. I don't really like the Kiwis. They seem to be OK blokes, but just too cold for me. Ben is a great sailor. Jimmy is a great competitor. But it's more than just the one guy and the boat. The Kiwis just sailed better overall.

I don't agree on that. From a purely sailing performance point of view during races it is difficult to say that the Kiwis outsailed the Italians. If with outsail we mean sailing so better than your opponent as to justify the winning of the races. If you carefully analyse and compare the perfection of manouevre and the sheer number of errors in technique, tactics or strategy, and the outcome of startings, you'll maybe agree with me.

If you then consider the speed edge Te Rehutai had, we can even give more credit to Luna Rossa crew. The Kiwis had to raise their level during the series, to learn using their boat strength better to be able to win.

And regarding the Brits, I cannot say they were outsailed, the difference in performances between the two boats were too much evident, almost embarassing at times, to lead to such a conclusion

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6 hours ago, Gissie said:

Maybe it was the hyphen, hate-bang has a set meaning, and not a nice one.

Well, that's news to me.  I didn't know "hate-bang" has a rape or violent connotation.  I thought it just meant to have great sex with someone you dislike.  Kinda like this, from one of the best episodes from Curb:

 

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8 hours ago, Gissie said:

 Giving up liberties for safety. I think it was Roosevelt that made some comment on this.

Benjamin Franklin, actually -_-

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12 hours ago, jaysper said:

Just what we need, a boat that's 2 years late, twice the price and has quality statistics worse than a chinese brand.

But with an avid cult of followers 

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9 hours ago, Gissie said:

I see the nasty streak at times. She likes to come across as a kind, thoughtful person who wouldn't hurt a fly. Occasionally you see her heart break through when pushed or questioned in a way she doesn't like. I would think she can be vindictive and brutal when the cameras are off. They can be good traits in leaders at times, I just get suspicious when people spend so much time and effort to hide it.

 

If this were a man in power what different words would be used? 

 

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3 hours ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Well, that's news to me.  I didn't know "hate-bang" has a rape or violent connotation.  I thought it just meant to have great sex with someone you dislike.  Kinda like this, from one of the best episodes from Curb:

 

The touchy feely crowd gets butt hurt easily.  I thought it was funny

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23 hours ago, EYESAILOR said:

I dont disagree entirely!      

I think a lead like Russell or Grant off the boat brings an objectivity to the team that is very strong.   I think AM's biggest weakness was having Terry H as simultaneously Tatctician, Skipper, Team manager and fund raiser.  There was not someone "off the boat" to point out a flawed decsion making and communication pattern

However I think Ben put himself in a better position than Terry H as follows:

1.  Ben does not have to do fund raising since he met IR.  No more multitude of sponsors, just one guy who can take a decision in 10 minutes and writes big checks.   I actually think Ratcliffe probably strengthens Team Ineos .

In contrast Terry is busy responding to 3 principal individual sponsors,  the NYYC and commodore who feel very involved and helped with fund raising and several corporate sponsors including Airbus.

2. Ben hired Grant Simmer to be day to day CEO.   

Agree that Ben ran a better program than AM, but is that the benchmark you want to shoot for?  But a real CEO can select and change drivers. No way Simmer had that level of authority.

Ben has amazing talent and energy, but cant do it all.  To win the Cup he may have to step off and be CEO.

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32 minutes ago, cbulger said:

Agree that Ben ran a better program than AM, but is that the benchmark you want to shoot for?  But a real CEO can select and change drivers. No way Simmer had that level of authority.

Ben has amazing talent and energy, but cant do it all.  To win the Cup he may have to step off and be CEO.

Surely his sailing talent is rarer than his management talent.  He is surely one of the 0.,001% of the best sailors in the world right now .   As a manager?  I dont know where he ranks but I suspect a great manager can be found.  

Find a great CEO and let Ben focus entirely on the sailing.

I did think that Mozzy's idea of hiring Ian Percy as CEO made a lot of sense.

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19 minutes ago, EYESAILOR said:

Surely his sailing talent is rarer than his management talent.  He is surely one of the 0.,001% of the best sailors in the world right now .   As a manager?  I dont know where he ranks but I suspect a great manager can be found.  

Find a great CEO and let Ben focus entirely on the sailing.

I did think that Mozzy's idea of hiring Ian Percy as CEO made a lot of sense.

Too many alpha males on a few of these teams want to be on charge both on the boat and off the boat. Its silly.   Find a job you do well and do THAT job well (I'm looking at you, BA and TH).  Use Max Serena as a good example of stepping up by stepping back. 

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1 minute ago, Blitzkrieg9 said:

Too many alpha males on a few of these teams want to be on charge both on the boat and off the boat. Its silly.   Find a job you do well and do THAT job well (I'm looking at you, BA and TH).  Use Max Serena as a good example of stepping up by stepping back. 

With TH, it is easy to see him stepping into a management role.

With BA , that is harder. He is a prodigious sailing talent.  In the same way, that Peter Burling would not be my first choice to replace Grant Dalton if Grant retired. Ben is not an obvious choice to me as CEO of Team Ineos.  

Even if Burling was a superb people person and manager he  is a rarer talent as a sailor.

Tom Brady is known as having superb people leadership and motivation skills.....but his talent was better spent as a QB .

Ben is almost certainly still the #1 or #2 sailing talent in the UK with the most foiling experience. They should leave him on the helm and look for an equally good management talent to run the program.

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On 3/26/2021 at 4:47 PM, Blitzkrieg9 said:

I'm sure you fine folks have heard this a million times, but here goes anyway:  

What's a pirate's favorite letter?

x

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10 hours ago, JALhazmat said:

Perhaps he needs to elevate the discussion then? 

Perhaps he is, which is why we all are fretting abut something thats not even going to happen.

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13 hours ago, Gissie said:

I see the nasty streak at times. She likes to come across as a kind, thoughtful person who wouldn't hurt a fly. Occasionally you see her heart break through when pushed or questioned in a way she doesn't like. I would think she can be vindictive and brutal when the cameras are off. They can be good traits in leaders at times, I just get suspicious when people spend so much time and effort to hide it.

As for the quote, agree completely, we are being led down the path to the slaughter. And we are going peacefully. Giving up liberties for safety. I think it was Roosevelt that made some comment on this.

I like William Pitts statement.

 

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.

Speech in the House of Commons (18 November 1783).

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From https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/americas-cup/124666503/americas-cup-team-nzs-champion-boat-already-a-design-dinosaur

bold mine

The fascination now is in where the next regatta is held. The talk of a one-off challenge in Britain between Team New Zealand and Team UK, as early as next year, with a return to a full regatta in Auckland in 2024 could push things further in favour of the Kiwis and Brits.

Team UK’s billionaire backer Sir Jim Ratcliffe is adamant they would need a new boat to be competitive with Team New Zealand.

If both syndicates got into a fresh build for their two-team 37th edition of the Cup, they’d take a huge design advantage into the quick development phase for the 38th edition in 2024.

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4 minutes ago, Stingray~ said:

From https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/americas-cup/124666503/americas-cup-team-nzs-champion-boat-already-a-design-dinosaur

bold mine

The fascination now is in where the next regatta is held. The talk of a one-off challenge in Britain between Team New Zealand and Team UK, as early as next year, with a return to a full regatta in Auckland in 2024 could push things further in favour of the Kiwis and Brits.

Team UK’s billionaire backer Sir Jim Ratcliffe is adamant they would need a new boat to be competitive with Team New Zealand.

If both syndicates got into a fresh build for their two-team 37th edition of the Cup, they’d take a huge design advantage into the quick development phase for the 38th edition in 2024.

If that crap of 1 - 1 match will take place, I'm sure the other teams will do something very similar as well. Let's call it Prada Cup 2.0 without any limitation

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15 minutes ago, strider470 said:

Let's call it Prada Cup 2.0 without any limitation

RG tried to coin it ‘The Union Jack Cup’ because both countries have the UJ in their flags. I think a more accurate and fun moniker is

The JackOff Cup :D 

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15 minutes ago, Tornado-Cat said:

Guillaume Verdier is the key of kiwi success last 3 ACs, and not the sailors, the team that hires him will have a good shot at the cup.

Bernasconi is even more key..

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1 minute ago, Stingray~ said:

RG tried to coin it ‘The Union Jack Cup’ because both countries have the UJ in their flags. I think a more accurate and fun moniker is

The JackOff Cup :D 

The Commonwealth Cup :lol:

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1 minute ago, strider470 said:

The Comunell Cup (for non Italians, comunella = gang)

Nice one mate, what are they saying in the media there? Any talk of another Italian challenger? LRPP definitely going again? 

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Just now, 45Roller said:

Nice one mate, what are they saying in the media there? Any talk of another Italian challenger? LRPP definitely going again? 

The media here is very concerned about the rumours of excluding the best of the AC36 challengers from the next Cup...

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3 minutes ago, 45Roller said:

Nice one mate, what are they saying in the media there? Any talk of another Italian challenger? LRPP definitely going again? 

Sirena and Bruno have both labeled a one-on-one AC37 as ‘a joke’ and AM used the word ‘disaster’ or somesuch. They want to be in AC37, a real one.. 

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Fwiw, I scrolled through a mostly-boring vid this week, it included Ed Baird and Gary Jobson and the author Roger Vaughn (he wrote the recently-released AC33 book ‘Learning To Fly’ which I have but haven’t opened yet) and a couple other guys. One of those ‘other guys’ is from San Diego, involved in some big racing, and sounded open to the idea of a Challenge... If AC37 is open to multiple syndicates. 

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10 hours ago, strider470 said:

I don't agree on that. From a purely sailing performance point of view during races it is difficult to say that the Kiwis outsailed the Italians. If with outsail we mean sailing so better than your opponent as to justify the winning of the races. If you carefully analyse and compare the perfection of manouevre and the sheer number of errors in technique, tactics or strategy, and the outcome of startings, you'll maybe agree with me.

If you then consider the speed edge Te Rehutai had, we can even give more credit to Luna Rossa crew. The Kiwis had to raise their level during the series, to learn using their boat strength better to be able to win.

And regarding the Brits, I cannot say they were outsailed, the difference in performances between the two boats were too much evident, almost embarassing at times, to lead to such a conclusion

The only data that shows the NZ boat being faster is the data that includes when the boats were affecting each other. If you actually watched, you would have seen that the NZ boat called the shifts better, made fewer mistakes, and otherwise were just as good. That counts as outsailing to me.

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