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The AC 37 has started, news and rumours


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I’m not calling this out for the sake of ostracizing you, nor to play PC police on a forum that is notorious for the opposite of that. I could just hit ignore, delete or whatever. I’m calling this out

Hilarious to watch Kiwis who've been around since AC35 twist themselves into intellectual pretzels to give ETNZ a pass on what they screamed bloody murder about when Oracle did it. Even Oracle di

Wow, 13 pages, a frenzy of outraged indignation over something that hasn't even been decided yet? This must set some new kind of SA record??! (... probably not )

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2 hours ago, NZL4EVER said:

Rumour CSS to take place in the UK the match NZ. 

I’d be curious to know where you’d base multiple teams around Portsmouth. A lot of former marine/waterside facilities have been turned to housing. Worth more £££.

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I would be completely fine with the Challenger series being in the UK, as long as the match stays here, which I think it will. Gives the best of both worlds, the challenger teams gain more sponsorship exposure with more convenient TV coverage, and NZ still gets to cheer its home team on. I'm all for it.

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20 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

I would be completely fine with the Challenger series being in the UK, as long as the match stays here, which I think it will. Gives the best of both worlds, the challenger teams gain more sponsorship exposure with more convenient TV coverage, and NZ still gets to cheer its home team on. I'm all for it.

Would be the best outcome for sure. I am for it too!

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If Ineos, as a COR, will decide to have CSS in Europe and then going to NZ only for the Match or maybe the INEOS Cup finals .. they are shooting themselves in the foot, and shooting also in other challengers' feet. And since this is not a shooting contest, a more cost-effective strategy could be to simply leave the Cup to the Kiwis without even going there for the Match.

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44 minutes ago, strider470 said:

If Ineos, as a COR, will decide to have CSS in Europe and then going to NZ only for the Match or maybe the INEOS Cup finals .. they are shooting themselves in the foot, and shooting also in other challengers' feet. And since this is not a shooting contest, a more cost-effective strategy could be to simply leave the Cup to the Kiwis without even going there for the Match.

Yeah, seem like a mother fucking cock sucking idea to me too (just giving more help with your English).

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6 hours ago, jaysper said:

Honestly, we will have to agree to disagree on this one.

Alternatively we follow the traditional SA path of trash talking and trolling each other.

Spindio likes to make racist taunts about my wife, you could start there and move onto my funny hair cut :lol:

^^^This guy gets it! I first became aware of "the poisoned chalice" after some folks from Oz pulled the bolts out of the NYYC dock back in 1983.

It was not long after that our public TV network ran a program about the concept of winged keels (it was NOVA, science & tech show) & I became utterly enchanted with the idea of yachts built & raced with cost being the last thing considered.

Since that time I have moved heaven & earth to not miss a microsecond of the competition (for one cycle the LV was aired on this fungus channel that almost nobody carried, put a bit of a damper on the pub watch!).

The point here is that a spending cap IMHO is ANATHEMA to the whole concept of a design contest, which the cup should always be!

 

 

 

 

 

Now as to hair cuts, rocking a 14" lazy hawk that hasn't seen a trim (except for the sides obviously) for the better part of 3 years.

 

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5 minutes ago, animeproblem said:

The point here is that a spending cap IMHO is ANATHEMA to the whole concept of a design contest, which the cup should always be!

This.

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So Ben didn't win it, but he wants it anyway?

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2 hours ago, strider470 said:

If Ineos, as a COR, will decide to have CSS in Europe and then going to NZ only for the Match or maybe the INEOS Cup finals .. they are shooting themselves in the foot, and shooting also in other challengers' feet. 

Why?

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1 hour ago, animeproblem said:

The point here is that a spending cap IMHO is ANATHEMA to the whole concept of a design contest, which the cup should always be!

If that were true, then all innovation in the real world would come from the biggest companies with the deepest pockets. Mostly, the opposite is true.

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2 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

Why?

For many reasons.

1) the events would be necessarily held in different seasons from NH and SH (6 months apart), and you need to optimize the boats for the local conditions. Unless you want to race during British winter weather with AC 75... and that would be even worse.

2) challengers not getting enough local training on the Match racecourses and less knowledge of wind/waves typical of Auckland

3) Logistics. it would be necessary to build facilities and bases in two different places for the teams. More costs and less time for development/training

just to say a few

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1 minute ago, dogwatch said:

If that were true, then all innovation in the real world would come from the biggest companies with the deepest pockets. Mostly, the opposite is true.

But that's structural/cultural problems, is it not?

ETNZ spent what, north of $60 million? Where would you suggest the cap sits?

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9 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

If that were true, then all innovation in the real world would come from the biggest companies with the deepest pockets. Mostly, the opposite is true.

Spot on.

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5 hours ago, Tornado-Cat said:

I have read somewhere about a possible DoG match, if a DoG match was to happen under mutuel consent that would be a firts in the AC :)

Yeah, some people are a tad confused about how it works. 

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Changing subjetc, I think that letting the defender taking part to any competition during the challengers series is not something that as a COR, I would permit. You gave the defender an even greater advantage.

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@strider470 I don't see it as such a bad idea. If the CSS and AC are separated by a full 6 months period (or more), this allows the winner of the CSS to move to auckland straight after the CSS final and spend 5 full months where they can train in the Hauraki gulf.

The logistical issue would be solved by having the Defender to organize the construction of a base for the challenger, regardless of who this might be, and hand it over to the winner of the CSS at a pre-agreed price. Ideally all challengers would bring their input on how the official challenger base should be built. This way the challenger can just pack their things and move into their base in auckland, cutting the time needed to settle in. and maximizing training time.

The biggest issue however is the need to have a boat optimized for both the Hauraki gulf and the solent. Ideally challengers would be allowed to build three boats, one test boat, the boat for the CSS and the boat for the AC final. Problem is boat 3 must be conceived way before the beginning of the CSS, which comes with the commitment of large financial resources.

The financial disadvantage that the challengers face with building 3 boats can be offset with a 2 boat limit for the defender, as they do not need to sail in the CSS in the UK.

Finally, one thing which is often overlooked is the need to set up a supply chain in NZ for the challenger. I can think of LR second mast being built by southern spars instead of being shipped from italy. All challengers would need to prepare their supply chain in NZ before even knowing whether they will compete or not. A possible solution is for the CoR to set up a standard supply chain for any challenger which may win the CSS, following input from all the challegers.

Cost cap would be great, especially for sir jimmy who wasted so much money into Ineos' campaign. At least he will limit his losses for the next one.

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30 minutes ago, Sailbydate said:

But that's structural/cultural problems, is it not?

ETNZ spent what, north of $60 million? Where would you suggest the cap sits?

I don't think you can look at what one team spent, I think you need to do a study of what all teams have spent over the last 3 or 4 cycles.

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1 hour ago, rantro said:

So Ben didn't win it, but he wants it anyway?

Don't they all want it? A bit of a naff statement.

INEOS haven't done anything wrong that we know of yet.

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1 minute ago, The Advocate said:

I don't think you can look at what one team spent, I think you need to do a study of what all teams have spent over the last 3 or 4 cycles.

If we are to believe the spin, that would make the average spend even higher. So, for the sake of argument, should we say $90 - 100 million? So again, where would you establish a cap?

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So the frackers are trying to stay relevent?

Is that what this is about?

What the fuck has the UK got to do with anything?  Didn't they lose badly?

Has Ben tripped over his bottom lip and looking for revenge?

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7 hours ago, Will_Co said:

Totally. They also have revenue sharing to keep smaller markets afloat and have more teams than a spend-it-till-you-win-it approach would afford. I don’t know if there is any of that in the AC, but to the extent that fewer teams compete because the few billionaires who having a passing interest are worried about their return on investment, there’s a remedy for that. 

The AC isn’t other sports.  Stop trying to mold it into those models.  Monetizing the brand of the AC is what will kill it.  Look no further than the Olympics.

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9 minutes ago, Sailbydate said:

If we are to believe the spin, that would make the average spend even higher. So, for the sake of argument, should we say $90 - 100 million? So again, where would you establish a cap?

To create some interest from potential contenders how about each participating syndicate deposits say 10% of their working budget into a winner takes all purse.

 

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18 minutes ago, AeroSail1 said:

@strider470 I don't see it as such a bad idea. If the CSS and AC are separated by a full 6 months period (or more), this allows the winner of the CSS to move to auckland straight after the CSS final and spend 5 full months where they can train in the Hauraki gulf.

The logistical issue would be solved by having the Defender to organize the construction of a base for the challenger, regardless of who this might be, and hand it over to the winner of the CSS at a pre-agreed price. Ideally all challengers would bring their input on how the official challenger base should be built. This way the challenger can just pack their things and move into their base in auckland, cutting the time needed to settle in. and maximizing training time.

The biggest issue however is the need to have a boat optimized for both the Hauraki gulf and the solent. Ideally challengers would be allowed to build three boats, one test boat, the boat for the CSS and the boat for the AC final. Problem is boat 3 must be conceived way before the beginning of the CSS, which comes with the commitment of large financial resources.

The financial disadvantage that the challengers face with building 3 boats can be offset with a 2 boat limit for the defender, as they do not need to sail in the CSS in the UK.

Finally, one thing which is often overlooked is the need to set up a supply chain in NZ for the challenger. I can think of LR second mast being built by southern spars instead of being shipped from italy. All challengers would need to prepare their supply chain in NZ before even knowing whether they will compete or not. A possible solution is for the CoR to set up a standard supply chain for any challenger which may win the CSS, following input from all the challegers.

Cost cap would be great, especially for sir jimmy who wasted so much money into Ineos' campaign. At least he will limit his losses for the next one.

Sounds expensive.

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Just now, Sailbydate said:

If we are to believe the spin, that would make the average spend even higher. So, for the sake of argument, should we say $90 - 100 million? So again, where would you establish a cap?

I already answered this in my direct quote of you.

"I don't think you can look at what one team spent, I think you need to do a study of what all teams have spent over the last 3 or 4 cycles."

But, if you want me to put a fork in it and say this sausage is done, how about the following formula;

((combined CSS teams spend at last 3 Cup cycles)x(0.85 for each ACWS event attended by same teams))/number of CSS teams x(1.03x3)x0.80

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Dumbest idea ever. The teams all come to NZ for the match and challenge series, spend all their fucking money here, boost NZ industry, tourism, and the tax dollars stay here. Why the fuck would NZ ever agree to anything else. 

Take the old boat to pommy land and wherever else, good competition for the failgp.

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12 minutes ago, sailman said:

The AC isn’t other sports.  Stop trying to mold it into those models.  Monetizing the brand of the AC is what will kill it.  Look no further than the Olympics.

Afuckinmen

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28 minutes ago, Sailbydate said:

If we are to believe the spin, that would make the average spend even higher. So, for the sake of argument, should we say $90 - 100 million? So again, where would you establish a cap?

Infinity

25 minutes ago, rantro said:

So the frackers are trying to stay relevent?

Is that what this is about?

What the fuck has the UK got to do with anything?  Didn't they lose badly?

Has Ben tripped over his bottom lip and looking for revenge?

Nah, that was the boom he tripped over.

21 minutes ago, sailman said:

The AC isn’t other sports.  Stop trying to mold it into those models.  Monetizing the brand of the AC is what will kill it.  Look no further than the Olympics.

THIS!!

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6 hours ago, Tornado-Cat said:

I have read somewhere about a possible DoG match, if a DoG match was to happen under mutuel consent that would be a firts in the AC :)

Not at all. It was the norm for the first 100 years or so. 

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I've only thought about this recently that investment from China for the youth AC got sweet f all out of there money except sponsorship on ETNZ mainsail this begs the question did China get compensation? Was there money given back? Did they get Te Aihe for the next event? 

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23 hours ago, The Advocate said:

Any chance she was in it?

Asking for a friend......

And who was her friend?

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29 minutes ago, Rennmaus said:
6 hours ago, Tornado-Cat said:

I have read somewhere about a possible DoG match, if a DoG match was to happen under mutuel consent that would be a firts in the AC :)

Not at all. It was the norm for the first 100 years or so. 

TC subtle knowledge play just really fucked you over and shows how little you really know.

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1 hour ago, strider470 said:

Changing subjetc, I think that letting the defender taking part to any competition during the challengers series is not something that as a COR, I would permit. You gave the defender an even greater advantage.

It happened in Bermuda without any major problem.

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1 hour ago, Sailbydate said:

Sounds expensive.

More than it may look. Building a boat is not that expensive: designing and developing it is where the money goes. 
You basically will end up with the Challengers to double they cost. And developing two different boats for two different venues means having two teams in two different places for three years.
Sound pretty ridiculous...

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3 hours ago, animeproblem said:

The point here is that a spending cap IMHO is ANATHEMA to the whole concept of a design contest, which the cup should always be!

We are now living in a Covid world, corporate sponsors are not going to dig into their pockets like they use to.  The alternative is delaying the cup 5 years so the world economy has recovered

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6 minutes ago, Thewas said:

More than it may look. Building a boat is not that expensive: designing and developing it is where the money goes. 
You basically will end up with the Challengers to double they cost. And developing two different boats for two different venues means having two teams in two different places for three years.
Sound pretty ridiculous...

outa likes, +1

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7 minutes ago, mako23 said:

We are now living in a Covid world, corporate sponsors are not going to dig into their pockets like they use to.  The alternative is delaying the cup 5 years so the world economy has recovered

outa likes, +1

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11 minutes ago, mako23 said:

We are now living in a Covid world, corporate sponsors are not going to dig into their pockets like they use to.  The alternative is delaying the cup 5 years so the world economy has recovered

Haven't the $quillionnaires actually multiplied their net worth substantially in the COVID world, or have I been talking to too many socialists?

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6 minutes ago, Sailbydate said:

Haven't the $quillionnaires actually multiplied their net worth substantially in the COVID world, or have I been talking to too many socialists?

Correct, the top 10 Billionaires by a $400 Billion during 2020 and billionaires in total by $1 Trillion, according to the Guardian. And at a time of enormous human difficulty and many millions unemployed, it doesn't see right or just. 

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Hi would you like to compete in a really expensive boat race?

erm well how much are we talking

'literally everything you have there is no limit at all''

right that sounds like a pretty shit offer to be fair.

'ok then what if we capped it at 100 mil?'

hmm that sounds better  you might get a few other people in at that kind of price?

 

yup that's the thinking really as we want more teams entering, you sure the unlimited spend thing isn't for you though? there are some super smart people that cant wait to spend the national debt of a small country on a once every four year boat race that you might not get to take part in.

 

sorry wait a sec, I spend all that cash and I have to qualify to race in it?  

er yeah its super good value though lots of people on Sailing Anarchy like it, so we can put you down for the unlimited  or teh 100 mil version.....  hello ? are you still there ..

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16 minutes ago, Sailbydate said:

Haven't the $quillionnaires actually multiplied their net worth substantially in the COVID world, or have I been talking to too many socialists?

Yes, but that isn't the point. How many want to ante up in this environment is the point.

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7 minutes ago, Paddywackery said:

Correct, the top 10 Billionaires by a $400 Billion during 2020 and billionaires in total by $1 Trillion, according to the Guardian. And at a time of enormous human difficulty and many millions unemployed, it doesn't see right or just. 

Neither do I, but you can thank the elected governments for that.

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8 minutes ago, The Advocate said:

Neither do I, but you can thank the elected governments for that.

Not really.     But that is another story

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18 hours ago, JALhazmat said:

agreed defence in NZ for 2024, but with a one on one race around the island as a spectacle underwritten by Jim as a hype build, NOT a DOG challenge.

As an independant pre-event, possibly associated with an ACWS round this would be fine.

If RYS representative syndicate wants a DoG, this would also be fine. (I've been trying to think what you would build for a DoG now)

 

But if they want an AC raced on the Solent the ONLY way that should ever happen is if they actually win the damn thing themselves first.

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16 minutes ago, hoom said:

As an independant pre-event, possibly associated with an ACWS round this would be fine.

If RYS representative syndicate wants a DoG, this would also be fine. (I've been trying to think what you would build for a DoG now)

 

But if they want an AC raced on the Solent the ONLY way that should ever happen is if they actually win the damn thing themselves first.

unless Grant wants to put it on the line for the RTI with the caveat that if Jim wins it the defence is in Auckland with Jim picking up the tab..;)

 

but no think my original suggestion is far more likely, with RTI being a standalone spectacle, couple of modded 75s hammering around the island with tides to account for, wind shifts, sea state variances and no course boundaries ? what's not to like, ok he pays for the kiwi compound and set up but it would be awesome.

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13 minutes ago, JALhazmat said:

 

but no think my original suggestion is far more likely, with RTI being a standalone spectacle, couple of modded 75s hammering around the island with tides to account for, wind shifts, sea state variances and no course boundaries ? what's not to like, ok he pays for the kiwi compound and set up but it would be awesome.

An interesting concept all the same. Sort of like a warm-up pre AC 37?

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Just now, Paddywackery said:

An interesting concept all the same. Sort of like a warm-up pre AC 37?

pretty much, also if you are going to be asking for changes to boats/ foils rigs etc it actually gives a decent trash to see how well it all works far enough out that any new teams don't rock up with an unproven design concept

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27 minutes ago, .......................... said:

I am hearing that the GBR’s Royal Yacht Squadron challenge is NOT INEOS, but is from another UK based billionaire, has anyone in the UK heard the same?

This seems unlikely but would be an interesting turn of events... Maybe the other Brexit backing, offshore tax haven resident Mr Dyson has found a new interest in yacht racing??

 

Regarding the RTI race - are they going to heli-drop in new grinders on the way round or just start with extra and heave the knackered ones over the side to be collected by the chase boats?

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37 minutes ago, .......................... said:

I am hearing that the GBR’s Royal Yacht Squadron challenge is NOT INEOS, but is from another UK based billionaire, has anyone in the UK heard the same?

Where did you hear that? I can’t believe that for one minute.

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Nice to see people getting over-excited about something that someone has heard may happen on the UK racing....good old Butterworth. I think I’ll wait and see what actually comes out first!

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4 hours ago, strider470 said:

For many reasons.

1) the events would be necessarily held in different seasons from NH and SH (6 months apart), and you need to optimize the boats for the local conditions. Unless you want to race during British winter weather with AC 75... and that would be even worse.

2) challengers not getting enough local training on the Match racecourses and less knowledge of wind/waves typical of Auckland

3) Logistics. it would be necessary to build facilities and bases in two different places for the teams. More costs and less time for development/training

just to say a few

Add to that ETNZ developing and training in home waters for the entire cycle, while the Challengers fight it out in a venue that has nothing to do with the Match venue. 

The boat that wins a CSS in (for example) the UK may not be the best boat to take to a Match in NZ. Unless there are very liberal component limits, the Challenger may have used up all their component cards before even getting to NZ. All their development will have gone into winning the CSS, and they may have neither the time nor the equipment options to re-gear for the Match.

Meanwhile, NZ is operating at home, and the entire teams sleeps in their own beds every night. No logistical costs and time out for shipping. Sure, you can set embargo periods where the Defender can't sail while Challengers are being shipped, but those are always serious bones of contention, and do not stop ongoing development.

Effectively, the budgets for each Challenger will be at least 50% more than that of the Defender.

It's like telling the All Blacks they have to prepare for the Rugby World Cup by climbing Everest while all the other teams play rugby.

It is a virtual guarantee that the Defender will retain the Cup.

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4 hours ago, Sailbydate said:

But that's structural/cultural problems, is it not?

ETNZ spent what, north of $60 million? Where would you suggest the cap sits?

You'd have to know what teams have actually been spending and on what to answer that sensibly. I don't know that, anyone who does know isn't about to post the budget spreadsheet here.

Outwith AC33, all recent cycles have had budget caps by proxy. Limits on hulls and other components built, limits on training periods etc. I wonder if scrapping those proxy limits and replacing them with a single budget limit might lead teams to making different decisions with more interesting results.

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1 hour ago, JALhazmat said:

pretty much, also if you are going to be asking for changes to boats/ foils rigs etc it actually gives a decent trash to see how well it all works far enough out that any new teams don't rock up with an unproven design concept

Cool, so like testing that new teams aren't invited to.

Am sure the two teams will openly share the data.

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15 minutes ago, accnick said:

The boat that wins a CSS in (for example) the UK may not be the best boat to take to a Match in NZ.

In theory but not, I'd say, in practice. Solent condition seem fairly similar to those we've seen in Auckland over recent months and wind limits can always be applied to exclude, say, the Solent's more boisterous moods.

Conditions on the south side of the Isle of Wight, that's another story.

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20 minutes ago, accnick said:

Add to that ETNZ developing and training in home waters for the entire cycle, while the Challengers fight it out in a venue that has nothing to do with the Match venue. 

The boat that wins a CSS in (for example) the UK may not be the best boat to take to a Match in NZ. Unless there are very liberal component limits, the Challenger may have used up all their component cards before even getting to NZ. All their development will have gone into winning the CSS, and they may have neither the time nor the equipment options to re-gear for the Match.

Meanwhile, NZ is operating at home, and the entire teams sleeps in their own beds every night. No logistical costs and time out for shipping. Sure, you can set embargo periods where the Defender can't sail while Challengers are being shipped, but those are always serious bones of contention, and do not stop ongoing development.

Effectively, the budgets for each Challenger will be at least 50% more than that of the Defender.

It's like telling the All Blacks they have to prepare for the Rugby World Cup by climbing Everest while all the other teams play rugby.

It is a virtual guarantee that the Defender will retain the Cup.

Well said

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1 hour ago, .......................... said:

I am hearing that the GBR’s Royal Yacht Squadron challenge is NOT INEOS, but is from another UK based billionaire, has anyone in the UK heard the same?

I heard the same thing at 32 flavours last night.

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1 hour ago, JALhazmat said:

unless Grant wants to put it on the line for the RTI with the caveat that if Jim wins it the defence is in Auckland with Jim picking up the tab..;)

 

but no think my original suggestion is far more likely, with RTI being a standalone spectacle, couple of modded 75s hammering around the island with tides to account for, wind shifts, sea state variances and no course boundaries ? what's not to like, ok he pays for the kiwi compound and set up but it would be awesome.

Dreamland, like most your posts.

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12 minutes ago, The Advocate said:

Cool, so like testing that new teams aren't invited to.

Am sure the two teams will openly share the data.

assumptions much?

you recon you could get a new  team off the ground, boat built to new specs and being sailed competitively by next UK summer to compete in an event that hasn't actually been confirmed yet?

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8 minutes ago, The Advocate said:

Dreamland, like most your posts.

still being cunty and failing to see that the first paragraph was laughable conjecture, haven't you got a cousin to go fuck or something that passes for normal in your neck of the woods?

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1 hour ago, .......................... said:

I am hearing that the GBR’s Royal Yacht Squadron challenge is NOT INEOS, but is from another UK based billionaire, has anyone in the UK heard the same?

that's what Magnus has been peddling for a while, recons some of his city trader vampire types are keen

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1 hour ago, .......................... said:

I am hearing that the GBR’s Royal Yacht Squadron challenge is NOT INEOS, but is from another UK based billionaire, has anyone in the UK heard the same?

No, but Land Rover v  Grenadier would be competitive, with JCB in reserve :lol:

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19 hours ago, dg_sailingfan said:

When Alinghi Won AC31 in Auckland 2003 BMW Oracle Racing and Alinghi held the MOET CUP in San Francisco in 2003

2003moetcup2.jpg

https://www.yachtsandyachting.com/news/11105/Moët-Cup-Day-1

And Alinghi held the UBS Trophy in Newport 2004

http://cupinfo.com/en/NewportUBS2004main.php

Something similar could happen between ETNZ and INEOS now that we have the AC75 Class established.

i think there's a reason why no one remembers this happening!

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1 hour ago, .......................... said:

I am hearing that the GBR’s Royal Yacht Squadron challenge is NOT INEOS, but is from another UK based billionaire, has anyone in the UK heard the same?

did Sir Jim not want to do it, or is there really a better offer?

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I think we need to understand what is motivating Dalts in all this, and that's keeping ETNZ afloat financially and together to bridge the gap to the next regular cycle. If he can get sponsors, host money or Ineos money for some kind of pre-regatta, I'm sure he'd prefer that.

But if he needs to make it an actual America's Cup match to attract the money, that's also what he'll do.

While I wouldn't necessarily agree with it, I can understand Ratty saying "No mate, if you want me to foot the bill, we're racing for the cup, not a point in the CSS."

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19 minutes ago, shebeen said:

i think there's a reason why no one remembers this happening!

From the stories I've heard most of the team members don't remember it happening....

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23 minutes ago, shebeen said:

 

 

did Sir Jim not want to do it, or is there really a better offer?

Dalton has tasked the ORIGIN Sports Group to look at Overseas Venues. ORIGIN Sports is owned by Sir Keith Mills who was a former backer of Ben Ainslie's Land Rover BAR Team in 2017. Ben went for the money with Sir Jim Ratcliffe dumping his former backers which did not sit well with them.

Yes, I acknowlege this chance is very remote but it could be that the Royal Yacht Squadron challenged on behalf of Sir Keith Mills & Sir Charles Dunstone with Iain Percy being the Skipper of that new British Team.

Unless the RNZYS confirms RYS as CoR and the RYS confirms INEOS is still their Team it's a chance. Mills, Dunstone and others may want payback.

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4 hours ago, mako23 said:

We are now living in a Covid world, corporate sponsors are not going to dig into their pockets like they use to.  The alternative is delaying the cup 5 years so the world economy has recovered

We are now living in a world where the wealthy and super wealthy are accumulating assets faster than anytime in the last 50 years - as a class, COVID has had little effect.  Sure some businesses and people have been hurt - but yacht sales are just fine.  To have another AC event, all the Kiwis need to find is one bird with the itch to play this game and scratch to fund it.  Plenty of bored birds with the scratch.

Sounds like they found one with the itch.

As always, the DoG will be bent to that birds fancy.

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Maybe I'm a little bit early, but it's better discuss this matter now than when it's already late!

In a few AC cycles from now, we will suffer something like the millennium bug. the Deed of Gift and even SA AC will probably collapse.

It will be almost impossible to understand if we are talking about a class of boats or AC editions.

It's called the AC45 bug. In about 27 years there will be only chaos.

You are warned.

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11 hours ago, strider470 said:

If Ineos, as a COR, will decide to have CSS in Europe and then going to NZ only for the Match or maybe the INEOS Cup finals .. they are shooting themselves in the foot, and shooting also in other challengers' feet. And since this is not a shooting contest, a more cost-effective strategy could be to simply leave the Cup to the Kiwis without even going there for the Match.

You're not gonna win if you don't compete.

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47 minutes ago, strider470 said:

Maybe I'm a little bit early, but it's better discuss this matter now than when it's already late!

In a few AC cycles from now, we will suffer something like the millennium bug. the Deed of Gift and even SA AC will probably collapse.

It will be almost impossible to understand if we are talking about a class of boats or AC editions.

It's called the AC45 bug. In about 27 years there will be only chaos.

You are warned.

Huh? You're not one of these doomsday preppers are you?

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4 hours ago, The Main Man said:

Where did you hear that? I can’t believe that for one minute.

Someone in one of the camps - I did not either, but it is someone that was a backer in the past and active at the highest levels of GP racing, so there is passion, not just green-washing. 

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4 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

You're not gonna win if you don't compete.

That's ok. But a strong COR wouldn't agree on such unfavourable conditions.

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1 minute ago, Zaal said:

I don't know why, but I keep thinking that Ineos won't be a very collaborative COR.. ( happy to be proven wrong )

 

This is the last go for Ben, should he fail to win or being at least in the Match, I fear. They will be very strong and competitive for sure.

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14 minutes ago, strider470 said:

That's ok. But a strong COR wouldn't agree on such unfavourable conditions.

You do what you have to to win. Ben isn't a quitter. Its never okay to just give up when things don't favour you.

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5 minutes ago, Forourselves said:

You do what you have to to win. Ben isn't a quitter. Its never okay to just give up when things don't favour you.

I agree on that. What I think is that they also will try to obtain the most favourable agreement with the defender. And in my opinion, splitting the event like that between the two hemispheres is not a particularly smart move challenger-wise

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Just now, strider470 said:

I agree on that. What I think is that they also will try to obtain the most favourable agreement with the defender. And in my opinion, splitting the event like that between the two emisphere is not a particularly smart move challenger-wise

Depends what point of view you look at it from. Clearly they saw the crowds lined up down at the Viaduct to watch our team dock out every day. Maybe Ben thinks he can do the same thing in the UK. To have thousands of people down to support the home team in the UK would definitely be an inspiration for his team. I absolutely agree that its not an ideal scenario challenger-wise with logistics etc, but the UK would be far more convenient for TV coverage for European fans, and therefor sponsorship.

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