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Epifanes Two-Part Poly Topside Paint


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Looking at repainting a hull. The previous paint job is in terrible shape.

I was recommended Interlux Perfection by a family member who painted their boat a couple years ago, but it's backordered everywhere till mid-May. 

Does anyone have experience with the Epifanes two-part Poly? I would be rolling and tipping, not spraying. Color will be white over an old white. 

My research says both of these products are easier to work with for a non-professional than Awlgrip, especially when rolling it on. 

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You may want to give Alexseal a look.  The product rolls and tips well - and Alexseal has come out with a new additive that is suppose to making tipping unnecessary, just roll.  While I do not have experience with touch-ups with Alexseal, Alexseal claims it can be polished and touched-up.

Some great videos on boatworkstoday on youtube.

 

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I was super impressed with the Epifanes 2-part poly. I used the technique in Russell Brown's Rolling Perfection (roll only, no tip) and it turned out way better than it should have in far from perfect conditions.

The transom was painted in direct early morning sun with about 5kt wind blowing yet still flowed out fairly well (this angle really highlights the roller stipple - looks better than this from most angles). The transom gate, painted in my shed, looks like it was sprayed.

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5 hours ago, Team Subterfuge said:

You may want to give Alexseal a look.  The product rolls and tips well - and Alexseal has come out with a new additive that is suppose to making tipping unnecessary, just roll.  While I do not have experience with touch-ups with Alexseal, Alexseal claims it can be polished and touched-up.

Some great videos on boatworkstoday on youtube.

 

If you go for the Alexseal, do give us some feedback please.

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We had our boat sprayed with alex seal, so can't speak to the roll  & tip-ability of it, but so far (1 year out) happy with the job - the yard who did it told us that it was a lot easier to repair.  I know for a fact that awl grip is hard to repair - we had awl grip before, and while the good repair guys with a sprayer could make a patch disappear, about a year later it would show up again...  The patches where I rolled & tipped awl grip repairs were visible immediately.

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@Hike, Bitches! just posted these pics of Axel Seal on his boat....says he:

"Hull #511. It started out like this. It had some blue but no grey, so until I painted it, did not meet thread criteria! :ph34r:

The nice thing about Alexseal is you can buff it and repair it. That was a roll & tip job in a dusty boat yard that I did in 2019"

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Both of those finishes look really good. 

I did look into Alexseal a bit, but again found it hard to find vendors. When I did find a vendor the normal white colors were again out of stock. Any suggestions on where to buy it?

Defender has all of the Epifanes products in stock.

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What you are looking at is the difference between acrylic and polyester LPU’s;

Quote

There are, however, significant differences between these two linear polyurethane (LPU) paints. Both Imron and Awlgrip happen to be the best-known examples of the two main classes of LPU coatings but they are not he only ones. There are two basic types of LPU's acrylic polyurethanes (Imron, Awlcraft 2000, Interspray 800, PPG Concept, Sikkens Yachtcryl) and the polyester polyurethanes (Awlgrip, Interspray 900, Sterling, etc.) Both acrylic and polyester LPU coatings produce a beautiful wet-look shine that, with proper care, will last a full five or six years before any noticeable difference appears. The main difference is the polyester LPU yields a harder, more weather- and UV-resistant finish so your boat stays glossy longer, with less work, with Awlgrip than with Imron. This is the claim any way! 

Hatteras Yachts used Imron for years and years with very good results, this is why I say, "this is the claim".. If I'm not mistaken they have now switched to using Alwcraft 2000 which is very similar to Imron just made by Akzo and not Dupont..

The problem with the polyester LPU's, like Awlgrip and Sterling, is that when they cure a thin hard surface is formed like a built in clear coat. This becomes a problem when and if you try to buff Awlgrip or a polyester LPU. Most people don't realize it but are actually only buffing this very thin surface layer made up of mostly the clear solids. Picture oil and water. As you shake the bottle they almost form together but if you let it sit the oil rises to the surface. This, in a sense, is what Alwgrip cures like with the clear solids rising to the surface to protect the pigment layer. It's really more complicated than that but it's about as easy as I can explain it. In most instances, when buffing Awlgrip, you will burn through this thin outer layer quite quickly using compounds & polishes. Once you've done that you'll be a slave to the Awlgrip until it's worn away or re-painted. 

We've all seen Awlgrip that's been chaffed by a fender or a winter cover. This chafing has basically worn through the "clear solids" and has exposed the base layer of the paint leaving it unprotected from the sun. 

Many smaller boat shops recommend and use the acrylic LPU's because they are a lot easier to work with. An acrylic LPU, like Imron or Alwcraft 2000, dries faster, and because it’s a solid paint, it’s easier to perform the buffing required to force a smooth shine onto a mediocre spray job full of dust and dull areas. We did an after the fact buff job on Tim's Imron (the red boat above) and I can tell you this paint is plenty hard! Finesse It II and Chroma 1500 barely touched it until after we had buffed it with Superduty Rubbing Compound and a foam "polishing grade pad". 

Awlgrip is quite unforgiving and it’s a lot harder to get good results in marginal painting conditions with but it purportedly lasts longer. Both types, acrylic and polyester LPU's, can be repaired by spraying a patch or brush touch-up and then wet sanding and buffing to blend it with the surrounding finish. Special blending additives help as well as experience. 

One of the biggest problems in repair work is color matching and that's where Awlgrip shines. Alwgrip reportedly, I say reportedly because of the red boat above, has better fade resistance to the acrylic LPU's and an Awlgrip hull color stays stable and fade-free longer than an acrylic. How much longer I don't know but these are the claims.. The problem then becomes how good is your repair guy at feathering an Awlgrip job vs. the much easier feathering of a acrylic LPU like Imron. I'll take an acrylic LPU over a polyester LPU for just the ease of repair any day.

 

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8 hours ago, Aquila11 said:

Both of those finishes look really good. 

I did look into Alexseal a bit, but again found it hard to find vendors. When I did find a vendor the normal white colors were again out of stock. Any suggestions on where to buy it?

Defender has all of the Epifanes products in stock.

I had a little bit of trouble sourcing it as well..a "commercial" address helps a lot (I had it shipped to my office, with a commercial loading dock with permission, and no problems)...since it is generally considered hazardous. I bought at two different times.

My most recent purchase was from Hamilton Marine and they had all the stuff I needed. I also got some of the non-skid additive, not used yet, at BOATiD.com

I don't know about the other paints either, but for rolling/tipping...thin thin and thin, especially the topcoats, not so much the primers..you want build there to allow sanding with 600 and get a smooth base. I don't have my notes, but I was thinning like 40% and applying several topcoats..it is easy to run that thin too, but it flows right out, so be patient and resist the urge to apply too much paint at once. I used to review the Data Sheets as bedtime reading. 

I have also read Russell's book, and for areas where the flaws are not so noticeable, I am using his techniques in the cockpit and on deck with decent results.

I think any two-part will probably turn out fine, but practice on small areas first, like a hatch or something before attacking a big area. Prep, and a smooth base coat is KING....always. By the time you get to the topcoat, you are just trying to keep it from running so do NOT apply too thick, apply thin, and many coats. By the time I got to the boot & cove stripes, I was sanding them by hand in between coats with 600 grit.

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I decided to go with the Epifanes. I'll post my experience and results. 

Can't turn out much worse than what's on there now!

Capture.PNG

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I did a job using the 2 part Epifanes , seemed like really good stuff. It was easy to apply and get a good finish, at least compared to Perfection. I find Perfection to be a little too thin and somewhat finicky. I too would be very interested in a real world review of Alexseal. 

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I'm a big fan of the 2 part epifanes. it was designed to be rolled (no need to tip) I used it on my hinckley 38 and it came out looking great. yes nothing shines like awlgrip but the fact of the matter is that despite what the awlgrip marketing says it's really tricky to get a roll and tip awlgrip paintjob to come out looking right.  

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Sanded, filled, sanded, filled, and sanded today. The boat looked 100x better just taking the old paint off. 

The first coat of primer didn't cover or go as far as I thought it would. I've got a second "quart" to apply after a light sanding. I say "quart" because each container is really only 750ml.

Instructions said to thin the primer by 5%, this was way too little. Probably ended up somewhere closer to 10-12%

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