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All,

Apologies if this has been asked here before, and I have searched high and low and cannot find an answer...

The boat I navigate on has a full Trtion2 package, great, but the calibrations leave something to be desired. We are considering the upgrade path to H5000, and the big question I cannot find an answer to is if the H5000 Graphic Display is required for the H5000 processor to be "happy"? The local installers say yes and I can't find a single wiring diagram on the B&G site that shows a H5000 WITHOUT a Graphic Display, but something in my gut says its not needed!

Current setup is as follows:

1) Triton2 Instruments above deck

2) Vulcan7 Chartplotter

3) WS320 MHU, as part of this swap we would move to an analog speedo from B&G.

4) Laptop running Expedition.

Basically I'd like to add a Hercules processor to the system to store the calibrations in the processor and have offset tables for port/starboard etc., but don't need the H5000 graphic display at present, unless some processor menu is unavailable through the other devices on the boat??

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I think you may be right.  All the configuration that I see you do on the Graphic Display can be done on the H5000 via the web interface.  And it is usually easier on the web interface.   Need to check if things like boat speed can be set to be GPS speed on the web interface.  I know those are the kinds of things I do on the graphic display.  (We keep our paddle wheels out and only put them in when racing so flip that a bunch.)  I am going to the boat today and can unplug the Graphic displays and see what happens and let you know.

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It can run without H5000 display. All setup can be done with the H5000 web interface. This is what I have, Zeus3, Zeus Touch, H5000 Hercule, 5 Triton T41, 213MHU, AC12 pilot computer.

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Proper calibrations. The Triton2 setup requires individual calibrations per screen for every instrument on the boat and these get lost over the winter. You cannot drive calibrations into Triton2 screens easily from Expedition. Finally, only the H5000 Hercules package enables the instruments to store calibration offsets for each tack, which is important on this boat as the speedo is off-centerline. This is all critical where we sail and for the racing we are doing, as without proper speed calibrations, current readouts are not readily available to the navigator or tactician. These things matter if you want to win races...

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12 minutes ago, F18 Sailor said:

You cannot drive calibrations into Triton2 screens easily from Expedition. Finally, only the H5000 Hercules package enables the instruments to store calibration offsets for each tack, which is important on this boat as the speedo is off-centerline

I don't think that's right. If you get Exp to talk to N2K through an Actisense NGT-1 it can output calibrated PGNs on N2K, just need to select the NGT-1 as your source in the N2K menu on the Triton 2s. I think Exp can also save separate P&S cal tables.

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Try Chicago Marine Electronics  http://www.chicagomarineelectronics.com/

Contact us, Write, Fax, E-Mail,

Call M-F [9.00am-5.00pm Central US (- 6h GMT)] at:
Hellas Marine, Inc.

Chicago Marine Electronics
212 E. Crescent Ave.
Elmhurst IL. 60126

USA
Phone : +1 (630) 501-1938

http://www.chicagomarineelectronics.com/images/cme_email.gif
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My boat has similar components to PeterSailor's:  Old T41s, H5000 computer (Hydra firmware), Zeus2 (nav station) and Zeus3 (cockpit) plotters.  The tech said the T41s can't program the H5000 and can't display some of its output.  I added a Triton2 mostly for an autopilot display and can do some calibration through that, but I mostly use the Zeus's or the web interface.

Farallon Electronics (Eric Steinberg) has always been able to get the higher-end components I've needed.

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I needed to use the H5000 Graphic Display to discover the IP address of the H5000. I presume the IP address is the same for every H5000. After that I can't remember not doing everything else from websockets.

The H5000 is a very low power for what it does, and get's a lot of information in it's screen real-estate. So maybe keep that in mind when planning your system.

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21 hours ago, F18 Sailor said:

Proper calibrations. The Triton2 setup requires individual calibrations per screen for every instrument on the boat and these get lost over the winter. You cannot drive calibrations into Triton2 screens easily from Expedition. Finally, only the H5000 Hercules package enables the instruments to store calibration offsets for each tack, which is important on this boat as the speedo is off-centerline. This is all critical where we sail and for the racing we are doing, as without proper speed calibrations, current readouts are not readily available to the navigator or tactician. These things matter if you want to win races...

Interesting.

Seems like a great raspberry pi / N2K project.

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I've got H5000 Herc, graphic display, and Zeus 3. So far the graphic display has just gone along for the ride. Calibration is done through web interface (IP address is in the manual iirc) and most everything can be done through the Zeus including offsets and source selection. Nick says it's preferable to do calibration through H5000 rather than Expedition.

Achillefs at CME was very helpful getting everything working.

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On 4/20/2021 at 12:27 PM, SimonGH said:

So dumb question, but what does the H5000 get you?

what capability are you trying to achieve?

 

 

H5000 Graphic has everything the Triton 2 has plus a few more pages like start line and laylines.  I do all my cal stuff on the H5000 Hercules using an ethernet connected PC and Websocket.  The H5000 processor does a bunch of corrections that are not available with just the Zeus 3/ Triton setup. Wind corrections are much more thorough with the H5000. 

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20 hours ago, jdazey said:

I've got H5000 Herc, graphic display, and Zeus 3. So far the graphic display has just gone along for the ride. Calibration is done through web interface (IP address is in the manual iirc) and most everything can be done through the Zeus including offsets and source selection. Nick says it's preferable to do calibration through H5000 rather than Expedition.

Achillefs at CME was very helpful getting everything working.

Thank you! That has been my experience thus far, to do proper calibrations in Expediton is a minefield, as you are basically running your own moving average algorithm on the data set in real time to try and "numb" the sensors so you aren't seeing every wave-induced pressure change. I presume that the H5000 has a moving average filter built-in that has been calibrated in the tunnel.

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21 hours ago, SimonGH said:

Interesting.

Seems like a great raspberry pi / N2K project.

Certainly, if you have time and are good with algorithm development. It would help if you had the wind tunnel data from the WS310 series anemometer, and preferably water tunnel data for whichever speedo you are using. Yes I'm a nerd and can do both of those tests, and write the algorithms, and write software code for a Rasberry pay, but at rates starting at $200/hr JUST for tunnel time, and typically $150/hr to do the data reduction, you better be serious about this effort...otherwise, just buy an H5000!!

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On 4/20/2021 at 12:50 PM, Snowden said:

I don't think that's right. If you get Exp to talk to N2K through an Actisense NGT-1 it can output calibrated PGNs on N2K, just need to select the NGT-1 as your source in the N2K menu on the Triton 2s. I think Exp can also save separate P&S cal tables.

Snowden,

  You are correct on the P&S cal tables, and I think the NGT-1 talking to the displays is possible. I haven't spent enough time with it to sort that out. To your point, I am sure a better calibration can be achieved in this manner than what we have now, however, it's always a bit frustrating. I raced on a boat for a season that had a custom N2K instrument package driven by Expedition, and we could never really trust the speedo, and were always pondering if we were in adverse current or not! Compared with a Raymarine setup (lower $, worse sensors, screens etc.) I found the Raymarine to be far more accurate in telling me if there was current or not. All of the offshore boats I've sailed on had a B&G processor of some type (H2000/H3000) to manage the calibrations. The better one has dual speedo's mounted well aft on the hull and we could switch between them depending on which tack we were on (older H2000 processor). There is a reason you don't see any high end race boats going offshore in the manner you describe...

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2 hours ago, Techtoy said:

Apparently you need a graphical display to set up 20/20 displays on  a H5000 network. Can anyone confirm that you can’t use a zeus 3 to do that?

A friend with a J/122 has a Zues3 and 20/20 mast displays with no H5000 processor or H5000 graphic display.  The Zeus3 is able to control and setup via the N2K network the 20/20 displays.

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17 minutes ago, F18 Sailor said:

There is a reason you don't see any high end race boats going offshore in the manner you describe...

Of course, but that's no reason not to use the equipment you have already to the best of its capabilities before dropping £3k on an H5000 processor.

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2 hours ago, Snowden said:

Of course, but that's no reason not to use the equipment you have already to the best of its capabilities before dropping £3k on an H5000 processor.

Understood, if time wasn't also $!!

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On 4/22/2021 at 11:26 AM, Techtoy said:

Apparently you need a graphical display to set up 20/20 displays on  a H5000 network. Can anyone confirm that you can’t use a zeus 3 to do that?

You can set them up from the web interface on H5000

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