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Turnbuckle cotter pins or rings?


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So what do you use? I've seen recommendations for using pins, rings, and even what I think is safety wire. I don't drop the mast very often and I only really mess with the tune once or twice a year. Also, as I have looked around and on the majority of turnbuckles neither the cotter pins or cotter rings look like they would prevent the turnbuckle or threaded rod from turning. Are they done wrong or am I missing something? 

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I prefer rings were I can see or have to remove them periodically them and pins where I can't or don't.

It's amazing to me the number of people who put rings in turnbuckles and don't wrap them around the body, just through the threaded shaft. I noticed them done that way just now on the lifelines of a boat near mine.

Just little dangly bits doing absolutely nothing.

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1 hour ago, Al Paca said:

Cotter pins. Properly sized for the hole it’s going. Trimmed to length, ends filed smooth and bent open approximately 20%. 

I see you read Rod Stephens as well. ;)

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If more than one turnbuckle share a chainplate, a lashing through the turnbuckle body works fine. It's been done on J22 and J24's for years. If you don't need to adjust much, cotter pins and rigging tape.

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The majority of boat round here use rings and on my boats I always tape them, I've seen several ripped off particularly those at deck / jib sheet level). If I were long term seagoing, I'd use correctly sized cotter pins, with the turnbuckle wired as they do on aircraft components.

Never seen those velcro pins before... Time to investigate..

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2 hours ago, Ishmael said:

I prefer toothpicks, the little coloured ones you get to spear pieces of cheese and Viennese sausages. If they break, put something bigger in, like a 4d nail.

Oh surely it should be a quick blow fuse...B)

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18 hours ago, ordkhntr said:

So what do you use? I've seen recommendations for using pins, rings, and even what I think is safety wire. I don't drop the mast very often and I only really mess with the tune once or twice a year. Also, as I have looked around and on the majority of turnbuckles neither the cotter pins or cotter rings look like they would prevent the turnbuckle or threaded rod from turning. Are they done wrong or am I missing something? 

Don’t know your project 

in the perfect world I prefer to use locking nuts

the initial expense pays off over time  

E1F3CB20-20C8-4CD7-8F72-1818E78CD420.jpeg

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15 hours ago, Zonker said:

I have seen a jib sheet snag a ring and just -flick- it was gone. If I hadn't been watching I wouldn't have noticed.

So cotter pins for me please.

 

I have seen a leg snag a ring and riiiiiiiiiip.  They are bleeding.  I would have noticed from the screaming, even if I hadn't been watching.  Velcro wrapped cotter pins for me.

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3 hours ago, slug zitski said:

Don’t know your project 

in the perfect world I prefer to use locking nuts

the initial expense pays off over time  

E1F3CB20-20C8-4CD7-8F72-1818E78CD420.jpeg

Closed barrel turnbuckle with "lock" nuts - worst possible choice IMO

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6 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Closed barrel turnbuckle with "lock" nuts - worst possible choice IMO

Yup. That is what my tractor three-point has. Thoroughly agricultural. At best an architectural bit of glam found below ritzy deck railings. However, I do have them in one place in the yacht: The saloon overhead where the mast braces the mast partner hardware down. Beneficial because my bride's flowing locks pass closely by on her way to our love nest. 

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21 hours ago, yoyo said:

I like the Brion Toss version using silicone bronze tig wire.  Easy install, easy removal.

Quick search and I found a video link - about 4-minutes into the video.  I dont do facebook but it does play.

Brion Toss - Cool Sail Rigging Tips #1 – Turnbuckles & Pins (facebook.com)

 

Wow, I could watch that guy all day long. Super concise and pleasant delivery. Thanks!

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1 hour ago, Grande Mastere Dreade said:

Brion doesn't seem to have a problem with them...

"Didn't" - (he passed away last year).  That might be some boat where the boat came to him with those turnbuckles. A picture of him adjusting them isn't really his stamp of approval.

The upper end isn't where I'm worried. It is attached to a somewhat flexible wire, often with a swage stud. The lower end, if attached to a chainplate can only articulate in one direction.

image.png.283be836b443f19f498f8e843a1291d0.png

You can also get closed body turnbuckles with toggle ends. So I'm not opposed to closed body turnbuckles. Just the ones without a lower toggle fitting like the one above. Some chainplate are oriented fore/aft, some transversely. As shrouds load and unload I think most of the fluctuating lateral load is sideways. I would think fore/aft chainplates with this type of turnbuckle are more likely to fail than transversely oriented one, but that's just a guess.

Here's a typical open body turnbuckle with a toggle end.  If you attach the lower end to a chainplate it can flex in any direction.

image.png.288bc4c7007e382686820be2a42388d8.png

 

 

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3 hours ago, Grande Mastere Dreade said:

Brion doesn't seem to have a problem with them...

 

untitled.jpg

Most likely that has a toggle on the bottom for articulation. Its not required at the top. 

I do prefer the open barrel style, you can see where the thread is at much easier, can't tell with those ones, but a lot of the cheaper ones are all stainless as well & have a tendency to gall. 

image.thumb.png.656f61d37396d3c626e4c2491c7b2cf9.png

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For those keeping score at home I went with rings (and wrapped them around the turnbuckle) and a bit of rigging tape to decrease the snagging opportunities. 

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