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260 Mass Shootings 160 Days, When Will it be Too Much?


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Not offended at all. Not by anything you have said. Offended by the state of America.

But you'll never give up your personal armory without being forced to. So your just another member in the club.

It's kinda depressing when you realize there are quite a few folks who've simply decided we had it too good, and now need to tear it all down. I suppose a Great Depression and war every 3 generations

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39 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

Here it is, a thread that will go absolutely nowhere.

Well, you just keep on posting threads then.

Can't win 'em all.

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2 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

See? I did say solutions only.

Other than hiding/deleting the thread, you can't control a thing on the internet.

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you are right, it wont go anywhere because i am not giving up the right to my guns. i deserve to own an ar15 more than you deserve to breathe. fuck you, its Darwinism.

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2 minutes ago, basketcase said:

you are right, it wont go anywhere because i am not giving up the right to my guns. i deserve to own an ar15 more than you deserve to breathe. fuck you, its Darwinism.

When the people of this country get tired of this shit you will see a change. I don't know how it manifests, but it will be a sea change and it will be painful to you.

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A planetary government could effect this "sea change".

Yes, it will be tough at first, but a couple/few generations down the line will enjoy less gunplay.

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19 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

When the people of this country get tired of this shit you will see a change. I don't know how it manifests, but it will be a sea change and it will be painful to you.

Mate .. i missed the purple font. I figured my sarcasm would be clear without it. 

 But im curious, when do you think you guys will be sick of the needless violence? After a mass shooting in Las Vegas? After a mass shooting in Sandy Hook? How many children have to be killed? How many innocent people? You want a solution? More guns. Fuck ya, more guns. Give everyone a gun. Make bullets cost 1k each.

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2 hours ago, badlatitude said:

And what? Come back after everyone has been shot to death?

 

You asked for only those proposals that would work. Walking away is the only one I can think of.

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3 minutes ago, basketcase said:

Mate .. i missed the purple font. I figured my sarcasm would be clear without it. 

 But im curious, when do you think you guys will be sick of the needless violence? After a mass shooting in Las Vegas? After a mass shooting in Sandy Hook? How many children have to be killed? How many innocent people? You want a solution? More guns. Fuck ya, more guns. Give everyone a gun. Make bullets cost 1k each.

We have plenty of guns in circulation for more than 1 per person.

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1 minute ago, Raz'r said:

You asked for only those proposals that would work. Walking away is the only one I can think of.

That's a fair response and I considered it, but this is my country too. I'll stay and fight for what's balanced for us as a country.

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1 minute ago, badlatitude said:

That's a fair response and I considered it, but this is my country too. I'll stay and fight for what's balanced for us as a country.

It's kinda depressing when you realize there are quite a few folks who've simply decided we had it too good, and now need to tear it all down. I suppose a Great Depression and war every 3 generations or so is necessary to wake people the fuck up, but then again I just saw a hundred million people look at a 1% killer pandemic and say "lies"

Place has lost it's mind.

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1 hour ago, badlatitude said:

When the people of this country get tired of this shit you will see a change. I don't know how it manifests, but it will be a sea change and it will be painful to you.

And im actually kind of shocked that my initial reply could be taken as being serious. Actually I am a lot shocked, saddened and disappointed.... Because there are actually people who think that way..... 

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1 hour ago, basketcase said:

And im actually kind of shocked that my initial reply could be taken as being serious. Actually I am a lot shocked, saddened and disappointed.... Because there are actually people who think that way..... 

Yes, there are plenty of people who think that way. I'm afraid I don't know basketcase(good name), that well, I should know you by now, I surely won't miss the sarcasm a second time and I apologize if you were offended.

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6 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

Yes, there are plenty of people who think that way. I'm afraid I don't know basketcase(good name), that well, I should know you by now, I surely won't miss the sarcasm a second time and I apologize if you were offended.

Not offended at all. Not by anything you have said. Offended by the state of America.

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I am reading the book 'Skin in the Game' by Nassim Nicholas Taleb.  In that book, he postulates that 10,000 Americans die every year by suicide simply because guns are available and handy.  

I don't expect American gun culture to change for a generation or two.  

 

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1 minute ago, Bugsy said:

I am reading the book 'Skin in the Game' by Nassim Nicholas Taleb.  In that book, he postulates that 10,000 Americans die every year by suicide simply because guns are available and handy.  

I don't expect American gun culture to change for a generation or two.  

 

Very possibly much longer than that.

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12 minutes ago, Bugsy said:

I am reading the book 'Skin in the Game' by Nassim Nicholas Taleb.  In that book, he postulates that 10,000 Americans die every year by suicide simply because guns are available and handy.  

I don't expect American gun culture to change.  

 

Fify.

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The 2nd Amendment is child's play in the area of public safety and security.  The 1st Amendment almost took down this county a few months ago and is highly likely to eventually start a civil war that could leave thousands dead and our democracy in flames.  Wake up to the real threat if you want something to bleat about.  

Just saying.

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28 minutes ago, Bugsy said:

I am reading the book 'Skin in the Game' by Nassim Nicholas Taleb.  In that book, he postulates that 10,000 Americans die every year by suicide simply because guns are available and handy.  

I don't expect American gun culture to change for a generation or two.  

 

Who fucking cares?  First of all, this thread is about mass shootings.  Suicides are not them.  2nd of all, they're quitters.  Self-selection at work.    

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5 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

The 2nd Amendment is child's play in the area of public safety and security.  The 1st Amendment almost took down this county a few months ago and is highly likely to eventually start a civil war that could leave thousands dead and our democracy in flames.  Wake up to the real threat if you want something to bleat about.  

Just saying.

What weapon will kill those thousands?

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5 hours ago, badlatitude said:

 

 

Here it is, a thread that will go absolutely nowhere. Please don't reply unless you have a possible solution.

Honest and sincere question.....  how many of those were gang or drug war related?  I'm betting most of them.  Know why???  Aside from the couple that have made the news, the ones that don't get covered are almost always gang shootings.     

nevermind - I went to the source and started going through the incidents starting with the most recent.  Drive By, Drive-by, Drive-by, drive-by, Block party, drive-by..... and then I got bored because it was just so easy to answer my own question.  

Sorry, but these gangstas - mostly black teens and young adults - (Hi Joe) are not the "American Gun Culture".  I am the American gun culture and I have as much in common with these murderous thugs as Mikewoofers has with humility and brevity.  

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14 minutes ago, roundthebuoys said:

What weapon will kill those thousands?

Freedom to speechify.

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18 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Sorry, but these gangstas - mostly black teens and young adults - (Hi Joe) are not the "American Gun Culture".  I am the American gun culture and I have as much in common with these murderous thugs as Mikewoofers has with humility and brevity.  

 Tom already did such research for us. He dominated the AW thread with anecdotes for months, in a dedicated fashion. 

Which is what scapegoating looks like. It becomes the basis for stop-and-frisk type behavior, mate.

 

Get your actual statistics out. Get your sources out. Because ne anarchist posted a sound, sourced, 13% gangsta gun fatality figure to you, last week. Take a look.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/jan/09/philip-van-cleave/are-most-murders-gangbangers-killing-gangbangers-v/

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6103a2.htm

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Just now, jocal505 said:

 Tom already did such research for us. He dominated the AW thread with anecdotes for months, in a dedicated fashion. 

Which is what scapegoating looks like. It becomes the basis for stop-and-frisk type behavior, mate.

 

Get your actual statistics out. Get your sources out. Because ne anarchist posted a sound, sourced, 13% gangsta gun fatality figure to you, last week.

Go down Bad lat's list in the OP and see for yourself.  How many of those "mass shootings" are gang or drug related?  

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1 minute ago, Burning Man said:

Go down Bad lat's list in the OP and see for yourself.  How many of those "mass shootings" are gang or drug related?  

FLUFFY BOY RIDES AGAIN

Stats, mate. Let's see total homicides divided by verified (or even alleged) gansta shootings.

Sir, you would do well to seek the level of justice demanded within rap music (which I cannot stand FWIW).

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3 minutes ago, jocal505 said:

FLUFFY BOY RIDES AGAIN

Stats, mate. Let's see total homicides divided by verified (or even alleged) gansta shootings.

Sir, you would do well to seek the level of justice demanded within rap music (which I cannot stand FWIW).

So you won't even bother to look at the list BL provided from the GVA.  Typical.  

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I will, if you will read the Pulitzer Prize-winning 1619 Project.

Hmmm, you are back to cooing Chicago now. I thought I schooled you. (And you thought my head would explode. We were both mistaken.)

 

Dude, from what I have seen of you, you ever fail to ponder the mess behind the mess. You are predictable in missing the "heart of the matters" of both race, and gunz. And here, these are combined, and you are so confused you are... extra fluffy.

 

Tell you what, MLK offered a road map for this one, based on respect.

And Gary Slutkin has offered the successful model for inner cities: opportunity, combined with the re-assessment of violence on the playing field.

The doctor who predicted Chicago's homicide epidemic

 

 

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1 hour ago, basketcase said:

And im actually kind of shocked that my initial reply could be taken as being serious. Actually I am a lot shocked, saddened and disappointed.... Because there are actually people who think that way..... 

You'd rather people stick it out in a cuntry that freewheelingly kills innocents than elect to remove themselves and their support for a poorly thought out constitutional amendment. 

Right?

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Here you go, joey.  I'll do the work for you, and this is just page 1:

6-10-2021 MICHIGAN DETROIT 4-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Child Involved Incident
  • Child injured (not child shooter)
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

Near Woodrow Wilson St; 2 shooters

6-10-2021 NEW YORK YONKERS 4-0

ncident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Gang involvement
 

6-08-2021 TENNESSEE NASHVILLE 4-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Accidental Shooting
  • Accidental Shooting - Death
  • Stray bullet
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

north Nashville, woman killed in car stopped at light next to three shot in another car that crashed driving to hospital in 2100 block of Hayes St at 20th Ave N

6-08-2021 TEXAS HOUSTON 5-3

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Bar/club incident - in or around establishment
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

6-07-2021 OHIO CLEVELAND 6-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

6-06-2021 MISSOURI SAINT LOUIS 4-0

ncident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

Notes

near Chestnut St; near Kiefer Plaza, up to 3 subjects with assault rifles

6-06-2021 NORTH CAROLINA SNOW HILL 4-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

Notes

Block party at trailer park

6-06-2021 OHIO CLEVELAND 8-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

6-06-2021 FLORIDA MIAMI (KENDALL) 9-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Bar/club incident - in or around establishment
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

6-06-2021 CALIFORNIA OAKLAND 5-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
 

6-06-2021 UTAH SALT LAKE CITY 5-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
 

6-06-2021 ILLINOIS CHICAGO 8-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

6 men, 2 women wounded, standing on sidewalk;

6-05-2021 INDIANA INDIANAPOLIS 4-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

parking lot

6-05-2021 LOUISIANA NEW ORLEANS 9-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

6-02-2021 OHIO SPRINGFIELD 6-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party
  • Possession of gun by felon or prohibited person

Notes

Celebration of life party at event hall. 2 suspects arrested. Victims range from 20-25 y/o. Multiple shooters.

5-31-2021 OHIO CLEVELAND (GARFIELD HEIGHTS) 6-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Accidental Shooting
  • Accidental Shooting - Injury
  • Accidental/Negligent Discharge
  • Self-Inflicted (not suicide or suicide attempt - NO PERP)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

Notes

Person fired shots at random at party. Man accidentally shot self in leg while dropping victim off at hospital.

 

5-30-2021 FLORIDA MIAMI 23-3

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Defensive Use
  • Defensive Use - Shots fired, no injury/death
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Shootout (where VENN diagram of shooters and victims overlap)
  • Bar/club incident - in or around establishment
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

Notes

rap concert; 21 shot; hooded subjects fired into crowd with assault rifles, handguns; multiple people return fire, unclear if subjects hit

 
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35 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Honest and sincere question.....  how many of those were gang or drug war related?  I'm betting most of them.  Know why???  Aside from the couple that have made the news, the ones that don't get covered are almost always gang shootings.     

nevermind - I went to the source and started going through the incidents starting with the most recent.  Drive By, Drive-by, Drive-by, drive-by, Block party, drive-by..... and then I got bored because it was just so easy to answer my own question.  

Sorry, but these gangstas - mostly black teens and young adults - (Hi Joe) are not the "American Gun Culture".  I am the American gun culture and I have as much in common with these murderous thugs as Mikewoofers has with humility and brevity.  

You can't separate guns from those reponsible and irresponsible, the NRA worked hard to make access to everyone. You may be the American gun culture, and you will pay just the same.  I am looking for solutions, not finger pointing.

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6 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Here you go, joey.  I'll do the work for you, and this is just page 1:

6-10-2021 MICHIGAN DETROIT 4-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Child Involved Incident
  • Child injured (not child shooter)
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

Near Woodrow Wilson St; 2 shooters

6-10-2021 NEW YORK YONKERS 4-0

ncident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Gang involvement
 

6-08-2021 TENNESSEE NASHVILLE 4-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Accidental Shooting
  • Accidental Shooting - Death
  • Stray bullet
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

north Nashville, woman killed in car stopped at light next to three shot in another car that crashed driving to hospital in 2100 block of Hayes St at 20th Ave N

6-08-2021 TEXAS HOUSTON 5-3

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Bar/club incident - in or around establishment
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

6-07-2021 OHIO CLEVELAND 6-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

6-06-2021 MISSOURI SAINT LOUIS 4-0

ncident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

Notes

near Chestnut St; near Kiefer Plaza, up to 3 subjects with assault rifles

6-06-2021 NORTH CAROLINA SNOW HILL 4-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

Notes

Block party at trailer park

6-06-2021 OHIO CLEVELAND 8-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

6-06-2021 FLORIDA MIAMI (KENDALL) 9-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Bar/club incident - in or around establishment
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

6-06-2021 CALIFORNIA OAKLAND 5-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
 

6-06-2021 UTAH SALT LAKE CITY 5-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
 

6-06-2021 ILLINOIS CHICAGO 8-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Drive-by (car to street, car to car)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

6 men, 2 women wounded, standing on sidewalk;

6-05-2021 INDIANA INDIANAPOLIS 4-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)

Notes

parking lot

6-05-2021 LOUISIANA NEW ORLEANS 9-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

6-02-2021 OHIO SPRINGFIELD 6-2

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party
  • Possession of gun by felon or prohibited person

Notes

Celebration of life party at event hall. 2 suspects arrested. Victims range from 20-25 y/o. Multiple shooters.

5-31-2021 OHIO CLEVELAND (GARFIELD HEIGHTS) 6-0

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Accidental Shooting
  • Accidental Shooting - Injury
  • Accidental/Negligent Discharge
  • Self-Inflicted (not suicide or suicide attempt - NO PERP)
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • House party / Block Party / Park Party

Notes

Person fired shots at random at party. Man accidentally shot self in leg while dropping victim off at hospital.

 

5-30-2021 FLORIDA MIAMI 23-3

Incident Characteristics

  • Shot - Wounded/Injured
  • Shot - Dead (murder, accidental, suicide)
  • Defensive Use
  • Defensive Use - Shots fired, no injury/death
  • Mass Shooting (4+ victims injured or killed excluding the subject/suspect/perpetrator, one location)
  • Shootout (where VENN diagram of shooters and victims overlap)
  • Bar/club incident - in or around establishment
  • Assault weapon (AR-15, AK-47, and ALL variants defined by law enforcement)

Notes

rap concert; 21 shot; hooded subjects fired into crowd with assault rifles, handguns; multiple people return fire, unclear if subjects hit

 

^^^ research by fluffy jeff  :)

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49 minutes ago, Burning Man said:

Honest and sincere question.....  how many of those were gang or drug war related?  I'm betting most of them.  Know why???  Aside from the couple that have made the news, the ones that don't get covered are almost always gang shootings.     

nevermind - I went to the source and started going through the incidents starting with the most recent.  Drive By, Drive-by, Drive-by, drive-by, Block party, drive-by..... and then I got bored because it was just so easy to answer my own question.  

Sorry, but these gangstas - mostly black teens and young adults - (Hi Joe) are not the "American Gun Culture".  I am the American gun culture and I have as much in common with these murderous thugs as Mikewoofers has with humility and brevity.  

I would think that the people doing the shooting are the gun culture defined. You’re just a poseur.

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1 minute ago, badlatitude said:

I am looking for solutions

Better minds than ours have been looking also.

Admit it. The US won't fix it. Not with the current system.

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Get used to it, none of us will see any change.

Other than it getting worse.

Maybe our great grandchildren will but I'm not optimistic about even that.

Actually, I'm not even that optimistic about their mere survival.

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6 minutes ago, justsomeguy! said:

Better minds than ours have been looking also.

Admit it. The US won't fix it. Not with the current system.

You are likely right. It will take a reconstruction from revolution.

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 Why haven't the 2ndA supporters come out and said what's really on their minds: "It's mostly black gang kids killing each other, and nobody's shot up my kid's school yet, and I really love my customized 1911 and my P226 and both my Glocks and my AR15 and my shotguns, so fuck all y'all! Freedom!!"

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59 minutes ago, Excoded Tom said:

End the stupid drug war.

That would take most of the money out of the drug trade.

It wouldn't take the need/desire for money away from those who have few prospects. What crimes do you think they'd go into if not drug sales?

FKT

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15 hours ago, badlatitude said:

Please don't reply unless you have a possible solution.

Fund the police. 

This won’t solve, but right now crime in general is skyrocketing and many of the mass and single shootings are a symptom of the crime problem. Chicago, NY, LA have a lot less cops than 2 yrs ago. Education, body cams, more cops.

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24 minutes ago, Fah Kiew Tu said:

That would take most of the money out of the drug trade.

It wouldn't take the need/desire for money away from those who have few prospects. What crimes do you think they'd go into if not drug sales?

FKT

Crimes that should be crimes, perhaps. Better than crimes that should not be crimes IMO.

We used to have alcohol gangs, then prohibition was ended and they mostly went away. But we still have moonshiners and bootleggers and for those who actually care enough to look at the individual mass shootings being cited by badlat, a large number of them involve bars late at night. Some of those are probably crimes that have to do with the stupid drug war, but most are probably because the Temperance Movement people had a point. Alcohol is a dangerous drug and leads to societal problems. It's just that prohibiting it was worse.

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17 hours ago, badlatitude said:

Please don't reply unless you have a possible solution.

 

You could redefine mass shootings to 5 or more killed not including the offender like we did in Australia so things like this aren't counted as mass shooting when spruiking off the success of gun laws. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monash_University_shooting

Quote

Main Outcomes and Measures  Changes in mass fatal shooting incidents (defined as ≥5 victims, not including the perpetrator) 

Conclusions and Relevance  Following enactment of gun law reforms in Australia in 1996, there were no mass firearm killings through May 2016. There was a more rapid decline in firearm deaths between 1997 and 2013 compared with before 1997 but also a decline in total nonfirearm suicide and homicide deaths of a greater magnitude. Because of this, it is not possible to determine whether the change in firearm deaths can be attributed to the gun law reforms. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2530362

 

There is a bit of a difference with GVA they include all shootings even self defence to boost their numbers which helps by using fear to push their gun grabbing agenda.

Quote

GENERAL METHODOLOGY

Rather than just collecting incidents of death, GVA also catalogs incidents where a victim was injured by shooting or by a victim who was the subject of an armed robber or home invader. Incidents of defensive gun use, home owners who stop a home invasion, store clerks who stop a robbery, individuals who stop an assault or rape with a gun are also collected. The overall goal is to provide information on most types of gun violence, and gun crime, no matter where it is on the political table. https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/methodology

 

Is Mother Jones a credible source or is it leftist bullshit? 

Mother Jones says 125 mass shootings in the US since 1982, if we use the Australian definition of 5 or more killed not including the offender then this number drops to less than 100 mass shootings since 1982.

Quote

US Mass Shootings, 1982–2021: Data From Mother Jones’ Investigation

The full data set from our in-depth investigation into mass shootings.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-data/

 

The problem with discussing mass shootings is there is no common definition for them the gun grabbers use whatever definition boosts their numbers. It gets even worse when comparing different countries that have different definitions.

We have an absurd definition in Australia where 5 or more have to be killed for it to be a mass shooting which means the Monash University shooting isn't counted as a mass shooting because the required quota of deaths wasn't reached.

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Mass shooting

There is a lack of consensus on how to define a mass shooting. Most definitions describe a minimum of three or four victims of gun violence (not including the shooter), although an Australian study from 2006 proscribed a minimum of five; and added a requirement that the victims actually died as opposed to being shot and injured but not necessarily killed.[1].

Most mass shootings occur in the United States where the Violent Crimes Act of 2012 defines mass shootings as events in which three or more people are shot - generally in a public place such as a school or workplace. Media outlets such as CNN and some crime violence research groups such as the Gun Violence Archive define mass shootings as involving "four or more shot (injured or killed) in a single incident, at the same general time and location, not including the shooter".[2] Sometimes shootings involving three or more victims occur in non-public situations such as when one member of a family shoots all the other members in the family home. These killings are known as familicides and are not included in mass shooting statistics.

The motive for mass shootings (which occur in public situations) is a defining feature in that they are usually committed by deeply disgruntled individuals seeking revenge or payback for failures in school, career, romance and life in general.[3] If multiple people are shot in a robbery or killed in a terrorist attack, these deaths are also not included under the definition of mass shootings.[4]  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_shooting

 

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The gun grabbers use mass shootings as one of their reasons to ban semi auto rifles. A clear case of hoplophobia from the grabbers.

Is the Journal of The American College of Surgeons an acceptable source?

Wounding Patterns Based on Firearm Type in Civilian Public Mass Shootings in the United States

Conclusions

Civilian public mass shooting events with a handgun are more lethal than those associated with use of a rifle.
 
 

 

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5 hours ago, Happy said:

 Why haven't the 2ndA supporters come out and said what's really on their minds: "It's mostly black gang kids killing each other, and nobody's shot up my kid's school yet, and I really love my customized 1911 and my P226 and both my Glocks and my AR15 and my shotguns, so fuck all y'all! Freedom!!"

Jeffreaux did 

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20 minutes ago, Mohammed Bin Lyin said:

 

You could redefine mass shootings to 5 or more killed not including the offender like we did in Australia so things like this aren't counted as mass shooting when spruiking off the success of gun laws. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monash_University_shooting

 

There is a bit of a difference with GVA they include all shootings even self defence to boost their numbers which helps by using fear to push their gun grabbing agenda.

 

Is Mother Jones a credible source or is it leftist bullshit? 

Mother Jones says 125 mass shootings in the US since 1982, if we use the Australian definition of 5 or more killed not including the offender then this number drops to less than 100 mass shootings since 1982.

 

The problem with discussing mass shootings is there is no common definition for them the gun grabbers use whatever definition boosts their numbers. It gets even worse when comparing different countries that have different definitions.

We have an absurd definition in Australia where 5 or more have to be killed for it to be a mass shooting which means the Monash University shooting isn't counted as a mass shooting because the required quota of deaths wasn't reached.

Mother Jones is indeed a leftist magazine, mostly, their investigations are factual and keep a standard.

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18 minutes ago, Mohammed Bin Lyin said:

Mass shooting

There is a lack of consensus on how to define a mass shooting. Most definitions describe a minimum of three or four victims of gun violence (not including the shooter), although an Australian study from 2006 proscribed a minimum of five; and added a requirement that the victims actually died as opposed to being shot and injured but not necessarily killed.[1].

Most mass shootings occur in the United States where the Violent Crimes Act of 2012 defines mass shootings as events in which three or more people are shot - generally in a public place such as a school or workplace. Media outlets such as CNN and some crime violence research groups such as the Gun Violence Archive define mass shootings as involving "four or more shot (injured or killed) in a single incident, at the same general time and location, not including the shooter".[2] Sometimes shootings involving three or more victims occur in non-public situations such as when one member of a family shoots all the other members in the family home. These killings are known as familicides and are not included in mass shooting statistics.

The motive for mass shootings (which occur in public situations) is a defining feature in that they are usually committed by deeply disgruntled individuals seeking revenge or payback for failures in school, career, romance and life in general.[3] If multiple people are shot in a robbery or killed in a terrorist attack, these deaths are also not included under the definition of mass shootings.[4]  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_shooting

 

I think that one of the things that should be done is address suicide and separate it from gun death totals. It is a public health issue, and suicide should be addressed separately. Currently, suicide accounts for 60% of gun deaths https://health.ucdavis.edu/what-you-can-do/facts.html.

This gives us a more realistic and less sensational way of looking at the problem.

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2 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

Mother Jones is indeed a leftist magazine, mostly, their investigations are factual and keep a standard.

 

They say 125 mass shootings since 1982 which is much lower than Gun Violence Archive which includes defensive gun use where nobody was charged with their numbers. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-data/

 

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6 minutes ago, Mohammed Bin Lyin said:

 

They say 125 mass shootings since 1982 which is much lower than Gun Violence Archive which includes defensive gun use where nobody was charged with their numbers. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-data/

 

Sensationalism is another issue that should be addressed. It keeps surveys from focusing on actual problems.

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6 minutes ago, badlatitude said:
30 minutes ago, Mohammed Bin Lyin said:

Mass shooting

There is a lack of consensus on how to define a mass shooting. Most definitions describe a minimum of three or four victims of gun violence (not including the shooter), although an Australian study from 2006 proscribed a minimum of five; and added a requirement that the victims actually died as opposed to being shot and injured but not necessarily killed.[1].

Most mass shootings occur in the United States where the Violent Crimes Act of 2012 defines mass shootings as events in which three or more people are shot - generally in a public place such as a school or workplace. Media outlets such as CNN and some crime violence research groups such as the Gun Violence Archive define mass shootings as involving "four or more shot (injured or killed) in a single incident, at the same general time and location, not including the shooter".[2] Sometimes shootings involving three or more victims occur in non-public situations such as when one member of a family shoots all the other members in the family home. These killings are known as familicides and are not included in mass shooting statistics.

The motive for mass shootings (which occur in public situations) is a defining feature in that they are usually committed by deeply disgruntled individuals seeking revenge or payback for failures in school, career, romance and life in general.[3] If multiple people are shot in a robbery or killed in a terrorist attack, these deaths are also not included under the definition of mass shootings.[4]  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_shooting

 

Expand   Expand  

I think that one of the things that should be done is address suicide and separate it from gun death totals. It is a public health issue, and suicide should be addressed separately. Currently, suicide accounts for 60% of gun deaths https://health.ucdavis.edu/what-you-can-do/facts.html.

This gives us a more realistic and less sensational way of looking at the problem.

I agree suicide should be a separate issue before our gun laws shooting was the most common method for suicide now it's hanging. Is it really an improvement having  people hang themselves instead of using a gun?

I don't think defensive gun use where nobody is charged or justifiable shootings from law enforcement should be counted with gun deaths they should be counted in a different category.

Homicides are the only relevant number for gun deaths.

With mass shootings there are various types from family killings to gang violence to a nutjob who kills people who are unknown to them or someone who kills people they worked with. There is no one size fits all solution to them.

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Mohammed Bin Lyin said:

I don't think defensive gun use where nobody is charged or justifiable shootings from law enforcement should be counted with gun deaths they should be counted in a different category.

Focus groups and press sensationalism are issues that need to be addresses but how? The people want some of that.

Anger is the cause of much gun violence what is the proper way to address that?

Man Shot 6-Year-Old; Attacked Him With A Sledgehammer For Leaving His Bike On Front Lawn

A Michigan man is accused of opening fire on a 6-year-old boy who left his bicycle in front of the man’s home. 

Ryan Le-Nguyen, 29, faces charges of assault and intent to murder in Ypsilanti Township. 

Coby Daniel, 6, suffered a gunshot wound to his arm and was rushed to hospital following the Saturday incident. He’s expected to make a full recovery. 

Arnold Daniel, the boy’s father, told Detroit television station WJBK that Le-Nguyen first attacked the young boy with a sledgehammer when he left his bike on the man's front lawn. When the boy went to retrieve the bike, his father say Le-Nguyen opened fire, shooting the child in the arm. 
 



Later in the story it says he was released on bail of $10K. 

https://www.oxygen.com/crime-news/ryan-le-nguyen-allegedly-shot-6-year-old-over-bicycle

 

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5 minutes ago, NeedAClew said:

If they all know each other it's a family picnic with a dispute about how to make potato salad. 

We are asking for solutions only, thread drift is not helpful.

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Sorry.  I don't think there is a solution in the US unless Constitutional changes are made to profile for mental illness or sociopathy. 

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2 minutes ago, NeedAClew said:

Sorry.  I don't think there is a solution in the US unless Constitutional changes are made to profile for mental illness or sociopathy. 

There is a very large resistance to mental health exams, and the bulk of those are from military veterans who want PTSD benefits, but don't want to lose their right to gun ownership.

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41 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

Focus groups and press sensationalism are issues that need to be addresses but how? The people want some of that.

Anger is the cause of much gun violence what is the proper way to address that?

Man Shot 6-Year-Old; Attacked Him With A Sledgehammer For Leaving His Bike On Front Lawn

A Michigan man is accused of opening fire on a 6-year-old boy who left his bicycle in front of the man’s home. 

Ryan Le-Nguyen, 29, faces charges of assault and intent to murder in Ypsilanti Township. 

Coby Daniel, 6, suffered a gunshot wound to his arm and was rushed to hospital following the Saturday incident. He’s expected to make a full recovery. 

Arnold Daniel, the boy’s father, told Detroit television station WJBK that Le-Nguyen first attacked the young boy with a sledgehammer when he left his bike on the man's front lawn. When the boy went to retrieve the bike, his father say Le-Nguyen opened fire, shooting the child in the arm. 
 



Later in the story it says he was released on bail of $10K. 

https://www.oxygen.com/crime-news/ryan-le-nguyen-allegedly-shot-6-year-old-over-bicycle

 

Perfect illustration of the American insanity on all levels.

$10K bail for shooting a small child? WTF has happened to you?

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7 hours ago, Happy said:

 Why haven't the 2ndA supporters come out and said what's really on their minds: "It's mostly black gang kids killing each other, and nobody's shot up my kid's school yet, and I really love my customized 1911 and my P226 and both my Glocks and my AR15 and my shotguns, so fuck all y'all! Freedom!!"

you obviously missed jeffies posts .......

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4 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Perfect illustration of the American insanity on all levels.

$10K bail for shooting a small child? WTF has happened to you?

The outcry forced the city attorney to adjust the bail amount.

On Tuesday, the Washtenaw County Prosecutor’s Office filed an emergency motion to raise Le-Nguyen’s bond to $100,000. Prosecutors argued Le-Nguyen poses a risk to the public and that his low bail has “compounded” the community’s “pain and anger” in the brazen shooting’s aftermath.

“A 6-year-old child was shot in our community,” Washtenaw County District Attorney Eli Savit said in a Wednesday statement disputing the low bond. “The most important thing is that he will survive — and hopefully has a long life ahead of him. But it could have been much different."

Other county officials also cast doubt on Michigan’s bail reform efforts in response to Le-Nguyen’s release ahead of trial. 

"I've been consistent since day one that I agree with the premise on reform around bail, that your ability to pay or not to pay a dollar amount shouldn't be the determining factor on whether you stay incarcerated through the adjudication process," Sheriff Jerry Clayton also told WJBK. "We owe it to the system and the community we serve, to evaluate whether we are getting those outcomes. And if we are not we need to be smart enough and courageous enough to say this is not what we intended, let's make our adjustments."  

From the link above.

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53 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

Focus groups and press sensationalism are issues that need to be addresses but how? The people want some of that.

Anger is the cause of much gun violence what is the proper way to address that?

Man Shot 6-Year-Old; Attacked Him With A Sledgehammer For Leaving His Bike On Front Lawn

A Michigan man is accused of opening fire on a 6-year-old boy who left his bicycle in front of the man’s home. 

Ryan Le-Nguyen, 29, faces charges of assault and intent to murder in Ypsilanti Township. 

Coby Daniel, 6, suffered a gunshot wound to his arm and was rushed to hospital following the Saturday incident. He’s expected to make a full recovery. 

Arnold Daniel, the boy’s father, told Detroit television station WJBK that Le-Nguyen first attacked the young boy with a sledgehammer when he left his bike on the man's front lawn. When the boy went to retrieve the bike, his father say Le-Nguyen opened fire, shooting the child in the arm. 
 



Later in the story it says he was released on bail of $10K. 

https://www.oxygen.com/crime-news/ryan-le-nguyen-allegedly-shot-6-year-old-over-bicycle

 

This is a perfect example of just how fucked up things are in the USA.

Too bad.

The founders gave you all a good running start, and now look what you have.

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6 minutes ago, Keith said:

This is a perfect example of just how fucked up things are in the USA.

Too bad.

The founders gave you all a good running start, and now look what you have.

What's your excuse? different country, different weapons

Four members of a Muslim family were killed in a "premeditated" vehicle attack on Sunday, Canadian police say. 

The attack took place in the city of London, Ontario province. A boy aged nine, the family's only survivor, is in hospital with serious injuries. 

A 20-year-old Canadian man has been charged with four counts of murder and one count of attempted murder.

The attack was the worst against Canadian Muslims since six people were killed in a Quebec City mosque in 2017.

"It is believed that these victims were targeted because they were Muslim," Det Supt Paul Waight told a news conference on Monday. 

Police are weighing possible terrorism charges, he said, adding that it is believed to be a hate crime.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57390398

 
 

 

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11 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

The outcry forced the city attorney to adjust the bail amount.

On Tuesday, the Washtenaw County Prosecutor’s Office filed an emergency motion to raise Le-Nguyen’s bond to $100,000.

Why was he given bail at all?

JFC if attempted murder of a small child doesn't warrant remand, what does?

I'm beginning to think that getting rid of the shitstain isn't nearly enough to save America.

I think the fat lady has stepped onto the stage.

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5 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

What's your excuse? different country, different weapons

Four members of a Muslim family were killed in a "premeditated" vehicle attack on Sunday, Canadian police say. 

The attack took place in the city of London, Ontario province. A boy aged nine, the family's only survivor, is in hospital with serious injuries. 

A 20-year-old Canadian man has been charged with four counts of murder and one count of attempted murder.

The attack was the worst against Canadian Muslims since six people were killed in a Quebec City mosque in 2017.

"It is believed that these victims were targeted because they were Muslim," Det Supt Paul Waight told a news conference on Monday. 

Police are weighing possible terrorism charges, he said, adding that it is believed to be a hate crime.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57390398

Nobody says we're perfect but any comparison to the current insanity in the States is ludicrous in the extreme.

Canada 2021 - 5 dead & wounded in mass killing.

USA 2021 - 1,288 dead & wounded in mass killing

Yeah - that's pretty much the same thing.

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2 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Why was he given bail at all?

JFC if attempted murder of a small child doesn't warrant remand, what does?

I'm beginning to think that getting rid of the shitstain isn't nearly enough to save America.

I think the fat lady has stepped onto the stage.

The Washtenaw County Prosecutor's Office is seeking to return to custody a man accused of shooting a 6-year-old boy last weekend in Ypsilanti Township.

"We share in the community's pain and anger from a child being shot. And we know that, for many, the pain and anger is compounded by the fact that the defendant was able to make his bond as set by the court," said Washtenaw County Prosecutor Eli Savit in a Facebook statement on Wednesday.

"To be clear: our office recommended significantly more restrictive bond conditions, and we disagree with the bond decision that was handed down by the court. That is why, on Tuesday afternoon, we filed an emergency motion to cancel the defendant's bond, and for his bond to be reconsidered."

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2021/06/10/shooting-suspect-makes-bail-washtenaw-prosecutor/7630142002/

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1 minute ago, SloopJonB said:

Nobody says we're perfect but any comparison to the current insanity in the States is ludicrous in the extreme.

I disagree, you are 1/10th the size of the U.S. and are doing a heckuva job of trying to keep up. Just wait until your population is equal the U.S

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13 minutes ago, badlatitude said:

I disagree, you are 1/10th the size of the U.S. and are doing a heckuva job of trying to keep up. Just wait until your population is equal the U.S

A trifle arithmetically challenged are we?

10 X 5 = 50, not 1288

We had one incident this year and one incident last year totaling 30 people - one decent weekend in the States.

Then it was back to 2018

We've had 953 victim like this since the 17th century.

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14 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Nobody says we're perfect but any comparison to the current insanity in the States is ludicrous in the extreme.

Canada 2021 - 5 dead & wounded in mass killing.

USA 2021 - 1,288 dead & wounded in mass killing

Yeah - that's pretty much the same thing.

Canada had 249 gun homicides in 2018. You have a good chance to catch up.

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