POR151 3 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Hi all, Have you been paying attention to LaserPerformance social media? They have been posting some stories and some pictures of a new design boat, allegedly in carbon. I leave nearby Setubal, in Portugal, and last week i've spotted a LP van towing a boat, that doesn't seem familiar to me Do you guys know anything about this? Fair winds all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
torrid 451 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Who designed it, and what sort of protection does he have for his intellectual property? 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 I just hope whoever designed it doesn’t expect to be paid Quote Link to post Share on other sites
WestCoast 427 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 LP released (or is planning to?) a new plastic boat called the 'Cascais.' https://www.laserperformance.us/pages/cascais -- Interestingly, the picture of the boat you spotted is different than the Cascais... We're not an LP dealer anymore, so couldn't be sure. Looks plastic from the picture though. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
onepointfivethumbs 321 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Big boy Pico? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hot and Soggy 17 Posted September 4, 2021 Share Posted September 4, 2021 On 9/3/2021 at 11:58 AM, WestCoast said: LP released (or is planning to?) a new plastic boat called the 'Cascais.' https://www.laserperformance.us/pages/cascais -- Interestingly, the picture of the boat you spotted is different than the Cascais... We're not an LP dealer anymore, so couldn't be sure. Looks plastic from the picture though. Agree, defo not a Cascais. Cascais is available to order in NA now. I was quoted arrival between November and Summer about a week after the detailed order page and brochure hit their website. Did not actually order, just inquiring. Concerned it would be slow without any in the water to get feedback/press about. Only the Fun package was available with aluminum mast/boom and rec sails. XD and Race models would be available "later". The 1 to 4 crew seemed too good to be true in a boat that size, but we'll see. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hot and Soggy 17 Posted September 4, 2021 Share Posted September 4, 2021 23 hours ago, onepointfivethumbs said: Big boy Pico? Might be interesting - between the Cascais and Bahia - maybe 14 foot 2 up rotomoulded? Could be. Looks a little like a Melges 14 from the rear but the gunwales/wings don't seem quite as pronounced forward. I don't see a thwart or sidestays Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wavedancer II 177 Posted September 4, 2021 Share Posted September 4, 2021 It's their new ILCA! LP finally saw the light... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted September 6, 2021 Author Share Posted September 6, 2021 On 9/5/2021 at 12:15 AM, Wavedancer II said: It's their new ILCA! LP finally saw the light... How's that? it doesn't seem anything like a Laser or an Ilca as you might call it these days. I've been looking for the Cascais video present at the LP Cascais website and if you pay attention, in the end you can spot a Cascais a Laser and some other boat.. It might be interesting to see what are they planning... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kazrob 8 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 Not sure about elsewhere, but in the UK LP (as was) churned out lots of different boats* over the years so it would not be surprising to see some more coming along. *these are just the ones I can remember (excluding Dart catamarans)- Laser 13, Laser 16, Laser 2000, Laser 3000 Laser 4000, Laser 5000, Laser EPS, Laser Bahia, Laser Vortex, Laser Vago, Laser Stratos, Laser Pico, Laser Bug, Laser Funboat 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bored Stiff 106 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 On 9/3/2021 at 4:25 PM, torrid said: Who designed it, and what sort of protection does he have for his intellectual property? Ahem… “do they have for their intellectual property”. 3 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ojfd 73 Posted September 6, 2021 Share Posted September 6, 2021 Btw, the car and trailer in the picture both have German registration number plates (Cologne), if that helps anyone in their detective work. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted September 7, 2021 Author Share Posted September 7, 2021 Do you think that the LaserPerformance German Dealer has something to do with it? I know that their family have a well known company that makes dinghies..i wonder what type of boat is that... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ojfd 73 Posted September 7, 2021 Share Posted September 7, 2021 I have no idea, but, to be honest, that thing on the trailer looks very much like RS something (Feva?) to me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 I don't see any RS that has a transom like that, but well.. I don't know them all. The boat looked really nice, i will pay attention to the waters here in Setubal, where i sail.. maybe it will appear again.. till then.. we will just have to wait.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ojfd 73 Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 If it's important to you, just ask JulianB or SimonN - they will be able to tell you what it is in no time 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
F18sailor 0 Posted September 10, 2021 Share Posted September 10, 2021 true detective work... video on Laserperformance - Cascais website at 1m18s, you can see the bow of the boat you are talking about... LOL Still, don't have a clue what it is... dam... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Roller Skates 92 Posted September 10, 2021 Share Posted September 10, 2021 So taking the LP ARC laser rig... and new carbon boat? Their instagram is doing teaser drops of nonidentifiable photos and blurred out renderings, but did state carbon. https://www.instagram.com/laserperformance/?hl=en Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 11, 2021 Share Posted September 11, 2021 If that’s a carbon boat , I will shave my head 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VDinghy 1 Posted September 12, 2021 Share Posted September 12, 2021 I like inverted bow... Carbon sounds good... LP, bring it on, let’s se how it does. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Justaquickone 67 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 On 9/11/2021 at 12:53 AM, F18sailor said: true detective work... video on Laserperformance - Cascais website at 1m18s, you can see the bow of the boat you are talking about... LOL Still, don't have a clue what it is... dam... Interesting bow in the background . Any clues as to what it is ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bored Stiff 106 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 2 hours ago, Justaquickone said: Interesting bow in the background . Any clues as to what it is ? It’s the new LP Fugly. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jethrow 409 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 2 hours ago, Justaquickone said: Interesting bow in the background . Any clues as to what it is ? Didn't the Shaw 4.0 have a bow like that? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Justaquickone 67 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 11 minutes ago, Jethrow said: Didn't the Shaw 4.0 have a bow like that? Have never seen or heard of a Shaw 4.0 At first glance I thought multihull , then saw the rig and thought unstayed singlehanded mono . Will do a search on the Shaw for interest sake . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jethrow 409 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 There was a thread in here a while back, maybe archived now. I'll see what I can find, I don't remember the name of the thread. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jethrow 409 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jethrow 409 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 https://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?/topic/139538-new-class-dev/ 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted September 13, 2021 Author Share Posted September 13, 2021 That Saw 4.0 looks good! i didn't know it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 Jethrow. You might be onto something with this . I wonder if LP have bought the hull design and put a version of the ARC rig on it . If it is, this is boat that’s missed its time . The gap in the market has gone. For any one under 100kg the Aero and Zero are a much better and well sorted boats . And if your over 100kg in the uk you already have the choice of boats like the phantom, Hadron h2 or Finn. But I am still interested on any further news or info on its launch date . TBH I am a little suspicious that we are being played . A new posters first post is a shot of a new dinghy that no one has seen before . Put the other one it’s got bells on. Lol 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Justaquickone 67 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 16 hours ago, Jethrow said: Found the site and a couple of youtube videos . Not alot of activity considering they're from 2013 . 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Justaquickone 67 Posted September 13, 2021 Share Posted September 13, 2021 That's disregarding anything on Boat Design posted by "The Lord". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jethrow 409 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 7 hours ago, Justaquickone said: Found the site and a couple of youtube videos . Not alot of activity considering they're from 2013 . @Justaquickone I believe that even though it was a nice looking boat and quite a promising design, only one was ever built... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
F18sailor 0 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 Xeon I'm 1.75m and 91kg, I own a RS Aero 9, great for light winds, but when it gets above 12knots and choppy the boat is a disaster, the hull cant support a sailor above 90kg, the lack of bow buoyancy is horrendous downwind. It's so bad, that on the Europeans this year the Aero 9 had no class, even in the UK nationals they only had 11 boats. I don´t know the Phantom (never sailed it), but compare to more modern boats with seams heavy and big, out dated design and very expensive!!! H2, looks good, still extremely expensive and only available in the UK. I believe there is still the lack of a boat that is light, performant good looking (even owning an Aero I find the boat ugly as hell) and well priced... (ILCA priced) If someone would have such a boat, it would be a success... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 The problem is no boat of this size can be ILCA priced and still have a carbon mast and have carbon or epoxy in its hull construction. Anyway doesn’t the Melges 14 with its largest rig already fill this section of the market ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VDinghy 1 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 Xeon... don't really know why such a boat cannot be ILCA priced. Have you seen latest ILCA prices!!!! 9.000€ for a 50 year old design, made of a bunch of fibre glass and aluminium tubes... it’s offensive. ILCA is not a boat anymore it’s a world class business. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 It’s so nice to see so many new people posting about a boat they haven’t seen and telling us how there is a gap in the market for it .While slyly dissing some of their competitors. Call me suspicious if you will , but think this thread is turning into LP sock puppet heaven Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted September 14, 2021 Author Share Posted September 14, 2021 42 minutes ago, Xeon said: It’s so nice to see so many new people posting about a boat they haven’t seen and telling us how there is a gap in the market for it .While slyly dissing some of their competitors. Call me suspicious if you will , but think this thread is turning into LP sock puppet heaven Xeon, as you might see, i am not new in SA. i am a registered user since 2008 maybe in that time you didn't even know what sailing was or you just didn't know the SA forum yet.. i don't care..i just don't like to come here and publish bullshit...i'd rather be sailing,. I just like to post when i believe i have something to add to this community and not spam them with conspiracy theories Returning to the point of this Topic... i don't know what they are planning but if it is a fast & fun boat i believe it will find it's place on the market, as long as it's a good boat everyone loves to spend their time on the water having fun. I just think that everyone should think more about having fun and sailing amongst friends than racing or the olympics... We have to grow the base of the pyramid having loads of people sailing.. and then from that maybe 1 or 2% will go to the olympics... but to make the sport sustainable for clubs and federations we have to attract recreational sailors.. and what better way than to have a fun and afordable boat?? Just my thoughts.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 POR151, I tell you what, you should get a job writing LP press releases. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hot and Soggy 17 Posted September 15, 2021 Share Posted September 15, 2021 Alright, I'll bite. So in my area LP has no representation. Once upon a time we had LP, Hobie, and recently RS. Now none. Bit of an outlier maybe. Does LP still have the heft/respect/interest internationally to get people to buy their boats? I'd be leery of plunking down money on a new LP boat design without a track record and worried about continued support for parts and uptake in the international community. It'd have to be a homerun design that every sailing magazine was declaring as boat of the year or something for me to part with money as an early adopter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AnIdiot 166 Posted September 15, 2021 Share Posted September 15, 2021 They are currently trailing this (very little to go on, don't get your hopes up for a grand reveal, yet): https://www.facebook.com/92222353425/posts/10159509812898426/ It doesn't look likely to me that it shares a stern with the boat on the trailer above. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jethrow 409 Posted September 15, 2021 Share Posted September 15, 2021 WTF was that @AnIdiot? All I saw in that link was some swirly coloured lines over a breaking wave and text telling me to stay tuned! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 On 9/14/2021 at 9:59 PM, POR151 said: Xeon, as you might see, i am not new in SA. i am a registered user since 2008 maybe in that time you didn't even know what sailing was or you just didn't know the SA forum yet.. i don't care..i just don't like to come here and publish bullshit...i'd rather be sailing,. I just like to post when i believe i have something to add to this community and not spam them with conspiracy theories Err I’ve been sailing since 1988 and have owned quite a few boats over that time . I was also a friend of one of the old directors of performance sail craft in the uk when that company had quality customer service at its core . So yes I know a little about sailing and the sailing industry. Yes you have been registered since 2008, but in all that time until you started this thread, you posted nothing . Two other new posters made this thread their first post , said positive things about the possibility of a new boat and slyly dissed competitors boats. I have found in life, if it looks like marketing [email protected]@hit , smells like marketing [email protected]@hit , it’s normally marketing [email protected]@hit Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted September 16, 2021 Author Share Posted September 16, 2021 Well.. that is your opinion and i respect it. i am not here to argue just to discuss topics of my interest. I also had quite a few boats from dinghies to Cruiser/Racers. At this moment i own an Archambault M34 and a Nacra F18 but i am on the market to replace the Nacra with a single handed monohull. i am 1.84 meters and weight 90 kg and tried several boats.. i don't have the physical capability to sail the Laser Standard and i am to heavy for the Radial. Tried the Aero but i don't think that it suits my needs..(weight x fluctuation) I heard that the Melges 14 is being produced at Nelo in the north of Portugal so i am willing to try it soon. and than this thing appeared and I became curious. Other option is to try a foiler like the Wazsp but the nearest dealer is in Barcelona so they don't do demos in Portugal. i am with @Hot and Soggy i don't know what they are planning but unless it proves to be good and with good reviews by international sailing magazines i won't consider it... Someone on Instagram commented that it looked like an EPS... looking better at it it has some lines.. let's see what they will came out with.. or even if they will... meanwhile take it easy @Xeon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted September 16, 2021 Share Posted September 16, 2021 No props POR151 . More that happy to agree to disagree and wait and see what appears. One things for certain , a EPS doesn’t have a reverse bow . I have seen a few in my time. The EPS was a interesting boat in some ways but deeply flawed . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted September 16, 2021 Author Share Posted September 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Xeon said: No props POR151 . More that happy to agree to disagree and wait and see what appears. One things for certain , a EPS doesn’t have a reverse bow . I have seen a few in my time. The EPS was a interesting boat in some ways but deeply flawed . I never saw one in real life..i thing that the concept was great.. never understand why it didn't have the success Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hot and Soggy 17 Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 Three latest posts on Instagram from LaserPerformance hinting something new is coming. The taglines are "A new story is about to be written. Will you be a part of it? #don't miss the shift", and "we've been in the shed. It's all coming together now #carbon". The image on the second one is of something black. Kinda looks like they are laying up a hull with carbon fabric. ? I don't know. The other posts (video) shows what looks like a one line outline of plan view and side view - hull with wings perhaps and square topped sail. Tack of the sail is at the deck with the upswept bit (I don't know what this is called) like a 29er or 49er. The way they do the outline, it disappears as it draws so I can't get a good screen capture of it. Looks like there was another post previously that's even more ambiguous looking over a computer modeler's shoulder at a somewhat blurry screen. LaserPerformance Instagram 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spokey Doke 15 Posted September 21, 2021 Share Posted September 21, 2021 Yawn 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 Anymore info forthcoming about this ? Or was it just a tease Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted October 21, 2021 Author Share Posted October 21, 2021 TBH i didn't see anything relevant yet... just a picture with some numbers on a Sailmon..i don't know if it is related or not but.. If it is... i don't know the top speeds on other single handed boats.. after a quick search i found that the top speed registered on a Laser was about 16.8knots..the top speed of the RS Aero is registered at 23.8 with 37knt wind... so unless they share the conditions.. that doesn't surprise me that much.. But they have been surprisingly quite these last weeks 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dex Sawash 722 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Xeon said: Anymore info forthcoming about this ? Or was it just a tease Seized by bailiffs 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Dex Sawash said: Seized by bailiffs Lol, lol . TBH I am not that bothered ( never bought anything new from LP and never will ). I was just shaking the tree to see if a LP sock puppet fell out . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Just been reading the Sunfish forum and also reading the Sunfish worlds thread on SA. Any more news of this high quality all carbon singlehander ? It’s all gone very quiet . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bill5 2,111 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 I think the Sailmon was strapped to the LP employees fleeing the factory. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Foredeck Shuffle 306 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 A carbon Laser? Not sure it's worth it since the hull needs updating. But sure, buy one, ding it up a bit, savage the centerboard slot some for the typical too large of a slot opening quality issues, throw some leaves on it and wet them daily so the tannin stains the deck, turn it over and let the sun take some of the shine off the hull, go racing and pretend it's a Laser. That's worse than the new ILCA rig I just put on a Laser that was nearly 2lbs lighter, but what the heck, it looks like a one design, that seems to be all that really matters. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Err nothing to do with LP Lasers , they are dead and buried, unlike the ILCA . This is a rumour that LP might be launching a new all carbon boat . We will see in time if there is any truth in it . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bill5 2,111 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 A carbon Laser with an updated rig. Look out Aero! LP have you in their sights! I hear it is going to be called a Laero. Or Aeser. And class memberships are free! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MR.CLEAN 4,187 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 Free kiddie-finger guillotines with every boat! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tillerman 2,287 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 8 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said: Free kiddie-finger guillotines with every boat! Talking of finger guillotines, the stupidest think I ever did in a Laser was, while sailing a borrowed boat with the black stopper thingie on the daggerboard missing, I put my left index finger in the hole where the black stopper thingie should go, and slammed the daggerboard down. Without the black stopper thingie, the top of the dagger board disappeared down the daggerboard slot with the top of my finger still in the hole where the black stopper thingie should go. Ouch! I really thought that I had lost the top joint of my finger, but thanks to the generous dimensions of the daggerboard slot on a Laser my finger was only crushed and bleeding, not amputated. Do not attempt this trick at home. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 Ouch Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bill5 2,111 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 10 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said: Free kiddie-finger guillotines with every boat! I believe it is on the dolly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dex Sawash 722 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 I know a guy who was clearing an override in the jammed CB cable drum of a Flying Scot, he LoPpEd a finger off when the board did drop. Was a chartered boat, think it was ussailing CoC regatta Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted December 3, 2021 Share Posted December 3, 2021 Come on all you LP sock puppets , isn’t it about time you gave us a up date ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
European Bloke 861 Posted December 3, 2021 Share Posted December 3, 2021 1 hour ago, Xeon said: Come on all you LP sock puppets , isn’t it about time you gave us a up date ? They're busy with warranty repairs on a bunch of Sunfish, so wind your neck in. Wait, warranty repairs? Scrub that, they're in the pub. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted December 3, 2021 Share Posted December 3, 2021 1 hour ago, European Bloke said: They're busy with warranty repairs on a bunch of Sunfish, so wind your neck in. Wait, warranty repairs? Scrub that, they're in the pub. Lol lol . Don’t think the workers in the Portuguese factory would be seen dead in a ‘ pub ‘. More likely they are in a proper Portuguese bar on the interweb searching for a job with a better boss . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
POR151 3 Posted December 6, 2021 Author Share Posted December 6, 2021 They are very quiet about that..i've been paying attention to their social media.. but no news... and there is a guy at LP Facebook asking for news... no replies yet.. it was not in April, Otherwise one could think it was an Aprils foul.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tillerman 2,287 Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chuso007 731 Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 Now that's an ugly rig... 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobbieB 1,549 Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 8 minutes ago, chuso007 said: Now that's an ugly rig... Is it a roto-mold product? Looks like a pig compared to the Melges 15. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alan Crawford 603 Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 I wouldn't buy one but looks like it could be fun for the right people. What's this boat that made a brief appearance starting around 1:18? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 No one is saying anything now . There were hints on [email protected] fb page, a couple of [email protected] sock puppets posted snippets on here and there is the above pic. Then nothing ….. Either it’s been caned or the launch date has been pushed back because of covid . Personally I think it’s a bit of a Unicorn Singlehander, a full carbon hull and rig for the price of a laser is not going to happen . But time will tell 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chuso007 731 Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 7 hours ago, RobbieB said: Is it a roto-mold product? Looks like a pig compared to the Melges 15. No idea, but if I had a nightmare about mainsails, that one would be starring on it... 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dex Sawash 722 Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 TFW when you need to bid some sails but the only one who returns your call is an awning maker 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin T 294 Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 Thought maybe that's a L12 Lowrider? 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 It could be a boat following the same kind of design philosophy. But it’s definitely not the same boat, the freeboard height is wrong as is the shape of the wave piecing bow. The L12 is a lovely looking little boat but to my mind it does nothing that a Dzero doesnt do better and with the added advantage of more waterline length. That aside I would love to have a sail in a L12 , looks to have a sweet hull shape and I do like the high boom too . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin T 294 Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 Agree the bow is not exactly the same, now I look more closely. The sail could be the ARC sail that was developed for the Laser? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 8 hours ago, Martin T said: Agree the bow is not exactly the same, now I look more closely. The sail could be the ARC sail that was developed for the Laser? I did think think the same thing. Lets hope it works better on a new hull than it ever did on the laser Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlatantEcho 250 Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 8 hours ago, Martin T said: Agree the bow is not exactly the same, now I look more closely. The sail could be the ARC sail that was developed for the Laser? This is correct. They are using the ARC rig and putting a new hull under it. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 The problem with this is every sail maker and boat builder I know has rubbished this rig saying it’s no better than the rooster rig . So my forecast is , we will end up with a rubbish rig on a roto moulded hull . Just what the sailing world needs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlatantEcho 250 Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 3 hours ago, Xeon said: The problem with this is every sail maker and boat builder I know has rubbished this rig saying it’s no better than the rooster rig . So my forecast is , we will end up with a rubbish rig on a roto moulded hull . Just what the sailing world needs You're confusing boats. The Cascais is a rotomolded boat, designed to try to take on the RS Feva (it's dimensions are quite similar, imagine that). It is available for sale, although, I don't know if they are selling many - their supply chain is quite the mess, with no industry trust/respect left via dealer network. ******** The new boat LP is teasing in this thread, is a carbon hulled, single person race boat, designed underneath the carbon/ARC rig first deployed on the Laser. Effectively, LP is attempting to design a hull to use that rig. This new boat is built directly to fit the criteria of World Sailing / Olympic Selection Committee that picked the Aero on technical merits. That is their target. Name, availability, etc, is not known. It's my understanding the design hasn't even been finalized. The boats you see/layup, is all pre-production boat that they will test. Will it see the light of day? Who knows. But, that's the backstory on it. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 Blatant echo . You misunderstand me . I understand they have said it will be a carbon boat and I guessed it was the arc rig. But the sock puppets on here have said it will it will be in the same price range as a laser and this is just not possible . SO, 1) It will be a all carbon boat and rig and be a lot more money. OR 2) It will be a roto moulded boat with a carbon rig and hit the price point. As I’ve said before , time will tell Tbh I don’t expect it to hit the market at all . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Roller Skates 92 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 On 12/31/2021 at 3:59 AM, Xeon said: But the sock puppets on here have said it will it will be in the same price range as a laser and this is just not possible . With where the price went on the ILCA in the last two years, wouldn't surprise me if they could hit it. New boat in the USA is breaking five digits. Laser spars, plus a hull discounted just enough to hit it. There's no reason the ILCA sail should cost the same as my windsurfing sails for what it is. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Xeon 379 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 15 hours ago, Roller Skates said: With where the price went on the ILCA in the last two years, wouldn't surprise me if they could hit it. New boat in the USA is breaking five digits. Laser spars, plus a hull discounted just enough to hit it. There's no reason the ILCA sail should cost the same as my windsurfing sails for what it is. You may be correct but if it it was that easy it would have been already. There are no mainstream singlehanded adult boats ( in the 12” to 15” range) that cost less than a ILCA in the uk never mind being a full carbon hull and rig . The nearest boats are probably the Aero and Zero and both are more expensive to buy than a ILCA and neither of them are full carbon hull and rig. If two well run companies like RS and Devoti cannot do it why would you think a company with [email protected] history could . I totally agree about ILCA sails but they are still relatively cheap for dinghy sails . Aero sails are in the £500 to £550 range , my last British moth sail was £800 and if I want a new sail for my D-zero that is £1000. Plus sails for all the big uk singlehanded classes are in the £750 to £1100 range . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Roller Skates 92 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 11 hours ago, Xeon said: If two well run companies like RS and Devoti cannot do it why would you think a company with [email protected] history could . Because I don't expect them to do it sustainably, I expect them to drive it into the ground. The whole thing seems like a "steal market share" move not a "build a sustainable alternative boat with decades of support". I fully expect them to turn 100 of them at a loss, get some press at a single-handed IOC trial thing, then fizzle. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Roller Skates 92 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 11 hours ago, Xeon said: I totally agree about ILCA sails but they are still relatively cheap for dinghy sails . Aero sails are in the £500 to £550 range , my last British moth sail was £800 and if I want a new sail for my D-zero that is £1000. Let's pretend for a second that the ILCA sail takes half the materials, labor, and finesse to produce (because it's really a quarter, compared to a moth sail). You're absolutely right, it is a relatively cheap sail, sold for way to much. I just get frustrated when I'm turning over the price of my boat by buying 2-3 sails. That ain't right. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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