Jump to content

Investigating the boating life.


Recommended Posts

Hello friends,  

I am thinking about selling everything and buying a Catamaran to live and sail on.  I am new to sailing, so I would hire someone to train and mentor me.  It would just be me and my four dogs and a cat, so I would be looking for something that could be sailed under power for a good distance as I suspect that using the sails is pretty difficult for one person?  

I am in the US, and I would like to have something that could make it to Europe comfortably.  

I don't know the pros and cons of different models, so looking for advice on which ones you think would be suitable for what I am looking to accomplish.  I'd like to keep the price under $300K.  

Thanks!  

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow 4 dogs and a cat!  That many pets would make it very hard I think.  

Most decent sized catamarans can cross the Atlantic with a decent captain.  I wouldn't blow my whole $$$ in one place.  There's only 1 way to find out if it's really for you and that's to do it.  You could get an older cat and load it up with solar.  Try living on the hook somewhere around the ICW for a little bit.  You can cruise around while you get the hang of it.  If you start feeling adventurous maybe you can hire a captain or take some friends over to the Bahamas or down to the Keys and just slowly learn and get comfortable with the boat.

I'll throw a size and design out for the sake of discussion.  FP Athena 38'.  Motors well, comfy to live on.  Will hold it's value ok if you decide you love the life and want to upgrade.

https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/1994-fountaine-pajot-athena-38-8019564/

 

 

  

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the response, BeatmongerZ.  

Is there a good way to figure out the range these boats?  I estimated about 8 nm/gal.  Is that about right?  

From the ones I have been looking at online, I think something around 40'+ is what I am aiming for just because of the dogs.  Going to need a fairly decent sized relief area.  I look at the one below, and I just love the room of it all.  But as mentioned, I am pretty unfamiliar with the different brands.  

https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/2008-nautitech-44-7606516/

How does customs work in different countries?  Do you just show up at a port of entry?  Or do you have to let them know in advanced?  

What are the internet options?  I hope that Starlink is available by the time I buy.  

I find the Energy Observer idea fascinating, and I think in a few years when battery technology gets better, I would convert a power catamara to solar+ OceanWings sails.  

Has anyone here crossed the Atlantic via Greenland and Iceland?  


Thank you

Link to post
Share on other sites

We get 6kts on 1/2 gal/hr motoring on one engine at a time with a boat that is longer and easily driven (12:1 hull beam/length). Managing sails on a 40' cat is something that can be worked out for a single hander.

Link to post
Share on other sites

To get to Europa via Greenland/Iceland is the Leiv Erikson route - not much used - but very exciting - and the passages in not too long .... but some additional problems like icebergs and cold climate. From Greenland its usually good wind direction to Iceland - and further. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

"I am thinking about selling everything and buying a Catamaran to live and sail on. I am new to sailing, so I would hire someone to train and mentor me."

I suggest that you first take some lessons at a sailing school. There are cruising schools where you sail on the boat with an instructor and there are dinghy schools where you might sail with an instructor or you might sail by yourself with the instructor in a boat nearby. Sailing dinghys is the best way to learn sailing itself; sailing cruisers is the way to get to know the rules of the road, radio and all the rest.

Doing that will let you find out whether you actually like sailing; some people don't. And you'll build up knowledge and experience that will help you make a sensible choice when it comes to buying a boat. Don't rush it; you're likely to regret it.

  • Like 5
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/14/2021 at 8:26 PM, jdazey said:

We get 6kts on 1/2 gal/hr motoring on one engine at a time with a boat that is longer and easily driven (12:1 hull beam/length). Managing sails on a 40' cat is something that can be worked out for a single hander.

Is there a tranny to run both props on a catamaran when on one engine, or do you just correct the crab with rudder?  

I have been looking at boom furlers which seems like it would make solo sailing much easier and safer.  

On 10/15/2021 at 12:15 AM, SeaGul said:

To get to Europa via Greenland/Iceland is the Leiv Erikson route - not much used - but very exciting - and the passages in not too long .... but some additional problems like icebergs and cold climate. From Greenland its usually good wind direction to Iceland - and further. 


Don't mind the cold, but I could see how icebergs could be a problem.  Especially at night.  Is there any devices for detecting icebergs or other floating objects that might not be seen on radar?

On 10/15/2021 at 5:17 AM, djh said:

"I am thinking about selling everything and buying a Catamaran to live and sail on. I am new to sailing, so I would hire someone to train and mentor me."

I suggest that you first take some lessons at a sailing school. There are cruising schools where you sail on the boat with an instructor and there are dinghy schools where you might sail with an instructor or you might sail by yourself with the instructor in a boat nearby. Sailing dinghys is the best way to learn sailing itself; sailing cruisers is the way to get to know the rules of the road, radio and all the rest.

Doing that will let you find out whether you actually like sailing; some people don't. And you'll build up knowledge and experience that will help you make a sensible choice when it comes to buying a boat. Don't rush it; you're likely to regret it.

I have stayed on a sail boat before and I loved it.  I just haven't done the sailing myself.  

And rushing in and regretting is kind of my thing, man.  

On 10/15/2021 at 9:27 AM, Dex Sawash said:

Watch Youtube videos from 9to5less 

Thank you!

16 hours ago, DtM said:

Getting animals into other countries is a big task all on its own.  Take that into account.

Yes, I have been researching that.  Especially since one is a pibble. I am thinking about moving to Europe, so it seems they are a bit easier with the European pet passport.  Although some countries won't let the Pibble on shore.  Seems like people always have to find some prejudice in their lives to be happy.  

Link to post
Share on other sites

Any opinions on a 47 foot Crowther?  https://www.multihullcompany.com/boat-details/?catid=7391228

Seems to check a lot of boxes for me, and I really like the layout.  This one is of concern, because it looks like they found an amateur to do all the electrical work and then got them drunk before hand.  Eeeks!  But From the price I have seen on other Crowthers of the same size, this one might be a good deal and throw some money in it to fix it up. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Be very careful checking parts availability for the engine. I have Yanmar 3jh4te. Over size pistons & rings are not available. Our rebuild was problematic as a result.

Running with one engine does not result in significant crabbing once you're up to speed.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Have you sailed non-stop on any boat for a minimum 0f 96 hrs or more ?

Link to post
Share on other sites

The tone of this thread is gonna change fast :p  Nothing about this screams anything besides complete unmitigated disaster.  

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, BeatmongerZ said:

The tone of this thread is gonna change fast :p  Nothing about this screams anything besides complete unmitigated disaster.  

Why is that?  

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Keith said:

Have you sailed non-stop on any boat for a minimum 0f 96 hrs or more ?

This seems oddly specific?  

Link to post
Share on other sites

All good questions.  So let me break this down (at least for my point of view).  I’ve been sailing for over 30-years and I’m still learning.  So others may and will chime in.  I’m now on my second glass of rum – so no responses from me tonight.


This is social media, forum titles don’t really mean shit here or elsewhere.  Sailing Anarchy hands out titles to people who click a keyboard for a living (so it seems – no offense y’all).  So listen to what is said and be careful in adopting the advice (even mine).


However, I think many of us agree with what DJH said above.  First and foremost (since you have extenuating circumstances): go start sailing small dinghies.  Do it after work, do it on the weekends, get out to a marina near you and meet some folks.  No excuses or you aren’t serious with your request for assistance.  You need to post a picture of you sailing a Sunfish or a Flying Scot by next weekend – and/or – your girlfriend’s tits.


A lot of us here (a lot of mariners) are both sailors and aviators.  If you can master flying, you can master sailing.  But with all things it takes time to do well.  Don’t think of this as ground school.  You don’t need to drink from a firehose.  You just need to start building hours on small sailing boats and meet people (who will become friends - because that’s a big part of the lifestyle) on bigger boats to take you out day-sailing.  Then volunteer to help bring a boat back up from Mexico (as you are in California) and see what bashing into waves is like offshore for multiple days.  Since your first post have you gone down to your local marina and signed up for some introductory courses?


Next, you are living in the right place at the right time.  Big boats sailing across the world, the proliferation of multihulls and social media (God help me) are your friends for now (at least).  You’re going to be able to learn so much that many of us couldn’t (back in the day) prior to buying and shoving off on our first catamaran that it is incomprehensible.  But please understand we make fun of YT sailing folks.  As in 99.9% of it is bullshit.


You need to keep a journal, because you really shouldn’t be mixing skill sets here.  You need to develop skills in the following areas, and although there are some Boolean intersections many of these need specific attention for you to achieve your stated goals:


•    Learning and mastering initial, basic sailing skills – this needs to be #1 on your list OR you will never get insurance.  Just like aviation, marine insurance is predicated on experience and acquired knowledge of the owner/captain.  Well that and it might keep you alive…
•    Understanding weather and developing your own forecasting skills - #2 if you ever want to go offshore.
•    Learning and mastering navigation – this can be #3 or 4 on your list.
•    Go look at and get onboard every catamaran & monohull you think might be a good fit for you.  Everything looks good on the internet.  And don’t lie to the boat brokers (everyone needs to earn a living, so don’t lead them on); tell them you’re just starting your journey.  And that you need to see a lot of boats.  
•    Understanding of complex sailboats (catamarans) and their subsystems and fixing them under duress – Um, just run this in parallel with everything else.
•    Catamaran manufactures and their history – This will come to you with help from SA and other sites.
•    Obsolete components for said complex systems (sometimes as bad as aviation) – Anything Harken over 10-years old is going to be problematic in finding parts.  Per a previous post ditto for diesels, although at least the 3GM30’s from Yanmar are exempt from this concern.
•    Traveling with domesticated animals into other countries – Jesus, Joseph and Mary this is its own thread upon itself.  I travelled with a Cockatoo for the last 4 years in the Caribbean.  And the trouble this can cause is no joke.  Screw this up and some countries will impound and incinerate your pet to protect their livestock and citizens.  As in your pets will be DTS without a chance for appeal.


So what I’m saying is: a lot of people ignore conventional wisdom, buy a big boat, shove off and die from CFIT on their first trans-ocean trip (not all, but some).


And finally, that Crowther 47 could be a forever boat for you.  But if memory serves me right, it’s changed hands x2 or x3 times in the last 5 years.  So that’s a red flag to be investigated.  But when you’re talking about Lock Crowther, he pretty much started Catana (or at least kept them in business initially) and is a legend to many, many people.  Shit, even that bow sprit gets me hard.


Looking forward to seeing you in a dinghy soon, my friend I have not yet met.
 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, CappyJax said:

This seems oddly specific?  

And your answer is ?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Pretty tough to give you a good opinion, if your not able to understand your own personal on the water experience.  

So, Ill try again, and ill keep it even simpler.

Have you ever sailed on any type of boat non-stop for four days or more?

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, CappyJax said:

What the hell is with all the gate keeping?  This is ridiculous.  I thought aviation was bad.  

Highly  recommend you study this thread from start to finish. 

Its suits your internet searching experience level and should help you tremendously.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Keith said:

Highly  recommend you study this thread from start to finish. 

Its suits your internet searching experience level and should help you tremendously.

 

i miss  Squeaks.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, CappyJax said:

What the hell is with all the gate keeping?  This is ridiculous.  I thought aviation was bad.  

Hello CappyJax,

This hasn't been gate keeping. So for this thread has been unbelievably supportive. Take another look at Ruminator's reply. BeatmongerZ said "Nothing about this screams anything besides complete unmitigated disaster." This is true just barely short of 100% of the time. Ruminator has provided a carefully thought out way of dodging this bullet if you'll just listen.

And if you think this is gate keeping, just be grateful that the regular SA welcoming committee hasn't show up yet asking for pics of your girlfriends tits and calling you a moron.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

I did exactly the same jump as you are planning.. minus the "selling everything" part.

Pretty much zero experience in sailing. I am working on a sailing game/simulator and my youtube feed filled up with sailing channels.. me & wife got in love with the idea of sailing the world. We have 2 cats. Watching sailing catamarans became our obsession.

Everybody around me suggested to take it easy, go sail for a while, perhaps buy a smaller boat.. or, even better rent one for a week and see what's what.

I said fuck it, I am going all in or not going at all and got a brand new sailing catamaran and moved aboard to live exactly 1 year ago.

We lasted pretty much until xmas when real winter arrived.. life became miserable, slippery frozen pontoons, wind blowing you off them and LOTS of diesel to keep the boat warm, we decided to take a break, move back home and try again once summer arrived.

Summer pretty much didn't show up this year here in the Netherlands so we must have spent max 2-3 week onboard.. had some bad damage during a storm last January when 2 mooring poles snapped and the boat ended up in the sea wall... not nice, also got some additional small damage from freezing in February.

After all I can count the days I really enjoyed it on 1 hand.. they were GREAT, but they were few.

Result? This week I am getting the down payment for the sale of the boat, everything considered I didn't loose a lot of money (sailing catamarans are selling like crazy) and I call myself lucky.

Hope your story will be different.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, kunos said:

I did exactly the same jump as you are planning.. minus the "selling everything" part.

Pretty much zero experience in sailing. I am working on a sailing game/simulator and my youtube feed filled up with sailing channels.. me & wife got in love with the idea of sailing the world. We have 2 cats. Watching sailing catamarans became our obsession.

Everybody around me suggested to take it easy, go sail for a while, perhaps buy a smaller boat.. or, even better rent one for a week and see what's what.

I said fuck it, I am going all in or not going at all and got a brand new sailing catamaran and moved aboard to live exactly 1 year ago.

We lasted pretty much until xmas when real winter arrived.. life became miserable, slippery frozen pontoons, wind blowing you off them and LOTS of diesel to keep the boat warm, we decided to take a break, move back home and try again once summer arrived.

Summer pretty much didn't show up this year here in the Netherlands so we must have spent max 2-3 week onboard.. had some bad damage during a storm last January when 2 mooring poles snapped and the boat ended up in the sea wall... not nice, also got some additional small damage from freezing in February.

After all I can count the days I really enjoyed it on 1 hand.. they were GREAT, but they were few.

Result? This week I am getting the down payment for the sale of the boat, everything considered I didn't loose a lot of money (sailing catamarans are selling like crazy) and I call myself lucky.

Hope your story will be different.

Thanks for sharing your experience.  

I am one of those people who thinks even a miserable adventure is better than no adventure at all.  

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

To be positive - when the first boat you are looking at is a Crowther - there might be hope. 

Some can pull of a start on a big boat - then you need some basic skills and mindset - have a basic understanding of what you are doing. But the sell everything and buy an old boat thing- real estate are investments that can give you income in lots of ways - boating is usually just money running out all the time.

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Sail in warmer climates helps with the cold. A boat means being on the water. When I see water I like to swim. 

It's definitely harder if you're based in colder climates.

I would not own a 40ft + catamaran unless I planned on living on it for at least 6 months outta the year. 

They're not easy things to maintain. 

Charter at least 4-8 weeks prior to owning. You'll start to get an assemblance of what features you like.

Some folks like aft helms, so folks prefer to motor sail, some prefer marinas, there are many points to ponder.

The sailing part is easy. Boat management, not so much.

 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 4 weeks later...
On 10/17/2021 at 9:40 AM, CappyJax said:

...even a miserable adventure is better than no adventure at all. 

I agree with some of that... and i would still gently suggest that you take multiple smaller steps towards your ideal. Getting a bit of experience now will help you make more informed decisions later... and hopefully boat prices will slack a bit in the meantime (high demand and low supply now).

Bay Area Multihull Association can help you get your feet wet... or come to Sacramento and I'll take you out on my Hobie Tiger and walk you around my (parked on the dry) Tennant 30. 

Most multihullers I know are a friendly lot especially in person and would like to answer questions and share opinions. The more you learn, the more specific your questions will be -- and generally, specific questions get better answers (especially online).

Randii

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/16/2021 at 5:55 PM, CappyJax said:

What the hell is with all the gate keeping?  This is ridiculous.  I thought aviation was bad.  

Were you going to sell everything and fly around the world before you got into boats?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, my….

@CappyJax   You say, “ …rushing in and regretting is my kinda thing…”. Sounds like you’ve done that more than once before. How’d the flying work out for you?  Typically, folks learn from experience that “rushing in and regretting” is somewhat expensive not a motto to live by.  It seems that you’re already complaining about some of the counsel you’ve asked for here.  That doesn’t bode well for your success either.

I’m thinking that the tone here will soon turn to mockery if you persist in the “I’m gonna do it my way anyway” mode.  So, have fun and hopefully we won’t be posting a news article about your ill-fated voyage and the potentially tragic outcome….

Anyway, go for it…. We’ll watch. (Maybe)

 

Where’d I put that popcorn?

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Let's not overdo it. Lots of people rush in without knowing it all. Sometimes they get in trouble, but get through and learn. 

Easy to be judgemental on the internet.

To the op - get in trouble and make your mistakes in protected waters. Be aware of Dunning Kruger. That's all.

 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

I have been looking at boom furlers which seems like it would make solo sailing much easier and safer.  

If you think climbing up onto your boom in adverse conditions to try to make it work when it fails is "safer" you are in for a bad lesson.   

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Holy troll batman.  Scott must be getting desperate for hits.  Or the bald one is bored. 

Either way I suggest the OP get a Gunboat and hire a Captain and chief dog sitter.  Throw the cat and any bananas overboard for good luck.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Wess said:

Holy troll batman.  Scott must be getting desperate for hits.  Or the bald one is bored. 

Either way I suggest the OP get a Gunboat and hire a Captain and chief dog sitter.  Throw the cat and any bananas overboard for good luck.

Have anyone suggested a Proa yet.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, rustylaru said:

Have anyone suggested a Proa yet.

Outstanding idea.  But it should be an Atlantic proa because they are far superior to their Pacific proa cousins!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/14/2021 at 9:23 PM, solosailor said:

If you think climbing up onto your boom in adverse conditions to try to make it work when it fails is "safer" you are in for a bad lesson.   

Lot of truth here. I prefer my main without locks too. Even on the 72, simple slab reefing. You know it's coming down if you want it to.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...