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26 minutes ago, Sail4beer said:

9F3AB195-271C-45BB-BEFF-46EB2A58716B.jpeg

Done a couple of boats like this with paracord. Other than wear and tear on hands it is not hard. Put a layer of double-sided tape around the circumference to help it not slip. Pull really tight after each half hitch. Lots of colours.

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1 hour ago, Fleetwood said:

Boatleather.com

Leather works well but the OP specifically said "Aside from leather/elkhide...".

 

1 hour ago, Quickstep192 said:

I’d think Alcantara would be a nice choice. 

Alcantara For Steering Wheels: 5 Benefits You Should Know
https://autointeriorspecialists.com/blogs/news/alcantara-for-steering-wheels-5-benefits-you-should-know

ALCANTARA VS LEATHER STEERING WHEEL: WHY ALCANTARA FABRIC IS BETTER
https://hydesleather.com/blogs/news/5-myths-about-alcantara-fabric-debunked
https://hydesleather.com/pages/alcantara

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OP may have said other than leather... but as others have said, there maybe no better choice.

I didn't like the cost of a kit from BoatLeather or alternative commercially available options... so I bought a hide, lacing punch, and did it from scratch.  Less than $70 total, including the tools... all in, about 8-hours for a 42-inch wheel.  The stitching was 6-hrs of that... but honestly one of the most satisfying boat projects I've done. 5438A471-A29F-446D-A3EE-F85534520A8D.thumb.jpeg.5f990b0cdf667a6f5e8cf9f43285f4a6.jpeg

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2 hours ago, gt-MTb said:

OP may have said other than leather... but as others have said, there maybe no better choice.

I didn't like the cost of a kit from BoatLeather or alternative commercially available options... so I bought a hide, lacing punch, and did it from scratch.  Less than $70 total, including the tools... all in, about 8-hours for a 42-inch wheel.  The stitching was 6-hrs of that... but honestly one of the most satisfying boat projects I've done. 5438A471-A29F-446D-A3EE-F85534520A8D.thumb.jpeg.5f990b0cdf667a6f5e8cf9f43285f4a6.jpeg

Congrats. Looks good. I like coxcombing on cruising boats and naval vessels. For big, stainless wheels on race boats, it's elk all the way.

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3 hours ago, gt-MTb said:

OP may have said other than leather... but as others have said, there maybe no better choice.

I didn't like the cost of a kit from BoatLeather or alternative commercially available options... so I bought a hide, lacing punch, and did it from scratch.  Less than $70 total, including the tools... all in, about 8-hours for a 42-inch wheel.  The stitching was 6-hrs of that... but honestly one of the most satisfying boat projects I've done. 5438A471-A29F-446D-A3EE-F85534520A8D.thumb.jpeg.5f990b0cdf667a6f5e8cf9f43285f4a6.jpeg

We did the same, but over a 2mm closed cell foam. Grippy and soft. We do keep it covered.

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22 hours ago, 10thTonner said:

Ok, seriously - this is the stuff. Look for the "cork" taoe by Cinelli that feels dry even when it's wet.

Any idea how much I would need for a 40" wheel for a J/35?

I did the Edson kit but it took forever and did not last long on an uncovered wheel (~6 yrs). I tried tennis racket tape but it didn't take to the curved wheel very well. 

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23 hours ago, Sail4beer said:

The traditional leather wheel cover can last decades if it is properly covered after use and stored below in the off season

image.jpg

Whatsa "offseason" and what kind of stick do I need for that?

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1 hour ago, DrewR said:

Any idea how much I would need for a 40" wheel for a J/35?

I did the Edson kit but it took forever and did not last long on an uncovered wheel (~6 yrs). I tried tennis racket tape but it didn't take to the curved wheel very well. 

I've taped a lot of bike bars, and that is nice stuff but I'm not sure how good it would be on a boat wheel. The issue will be dealing with the joins, you'll need a few rolls. I'm not sure how you avoid it being lumpy while doing a job that won't come apart where the rolls meet.

It'll certainly be the cheapest option.

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11 minutes ago, European Bloke said:

I've taped a lot of bike bars...

Oops!  I forgot we are talking about tape instead of Alcantara or leather.  Let's try again.

2 hours ago, DrewR said:

Any idea how much I would need for a 40" wheel for a J/35?

wheel circumference = D * π = 125.7 inches.

rim circumference = D * π = 7/8" * π = ~2.75 inches per wrap.

If the tape is 1.18  inches wide and overlapped by half then there are 125.7 / 0.59 = 213 wraps

213 wraps times 2.75"/wrap = 586 inches = 49 feet of tape!

One source says "Each roll bicycle handlebar tape is about 2350mm(Length) * 30mm(Width) * 2.5mm(Thickness)".  (that's 92.5 inches by 1.18" inches wide)

So 586 / 92.5 = 6.33 roles of tape?

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14 hours ago, European Bloke said:

I've taped a lot of bike bars, and that is nice stuff but I'm not sure how good it would be on a boat wheel. The issue will be dealing with the joins, you'll need a few rolls. I'm not sure how you avoid it being lumpy while doing a job that won't come apart where the rolls meet.

It'll certainly be the cheapest option.

I think if you can lead it around the brake/shift levers of a road bikes handlebar, it should go around the spokes of a typical wheel easily. Joining the rolls, however… yea, there will be a lump where the tape is doubled. 

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I can definitely advise AGAINST ever using Bird shit... In an emergency I had to move a boat once that had broke its mooring only to find the wheel and surroundings liberally coated with Gull shit.. It provides absolutely no traction and the smell was less than idea too! But i think once its on there and dry it is reasonably long lasting.

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8 hours ago, bgytr said:

This.  Windsurfer boom grip.

Yup!  but i have founds some other alternatives.  My supplier of the blue grip no longer can get it.  I haven't found a new source, yet.  I've just done several wheels in Black, and have a couple lined up for Red grip.  

On 12/26/2021 at 11:04 AM, slug zitski said:

That’s contact cement as the adhesive and superglue for the joint ?

can 5200 be used as the adhesive ?

Any adhesive can be used.  It's just a matter if you want, or need, to ever remove it!  Unfortunately, it sometimes get's damaged.  

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On 12/26/2021 at 11:04 AM, slug zitski said:

That’s contact cement as the adhesive and superglue for the joint ?

can 5200 be used as the adhesive ?

Use 5200 everywhere.  Never any worries with that stuff!  The fast cure is the most fun.  

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17 hours ago, Sail4beer said:

You could go organic

CD6D0592-4A06-403F-8F1A-844631598634.jpeg

Truthfully the wood on Passport wheels look damn good and have plenty of grip. One more varnish point but would be worth the effort. But I'm sure they would be ridiculously priced.

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37 minutes ago, Fleetwood said:

For a chemist, 'organic' means C-H bonds, not a lot of them in carbon fibre.....

Agree to disagree...

Organic: "Although there are many definitions of "organic," in the scientific disciplines, the basic definition comes from chemistry. In chemistry, organic means chemical compounds with carbon in them."

As for Organic Compounds... 'most' contain C-H, but not all.

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27 minutes ago, gt-MTb said:

Agree to disagree...

Organic: "Although there are many definitions of "organic," in the scientific disciplines, the basic definition comes from chemistry. In chemistry, organic means chemical compounds with carbon in them."

As for Organic Compounds... 'most' contain C-H, but not all.

if we are getting picky:

<nitpick> carbon itself (in the form of graphite diamond etc.) is generally not considered an organic compound because is it not a compound.  </nitpick>

I would generally say that carbon fibers are made from organic precursors, but are not themselves organic. Of course when most people talk about carbon fiber, they are generally referring to carbon fiber reinforced polymers, so we are right back to organic chemistry.

I always have to resist the urge to be picky when people talk about their carbon fiber masts etc; without the polymer it wouldn't be a particularly useful mast :) . And a 'carbon fiber' wheel is a lot less usable than a carbon-epoxy wheel :) .

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1DF481B1-E0DF-4749-92A0-5C1B6A35B8E6.thumb.jpeg.0cb9327d734671c2083694af755fef68.jpegI like paracord. I did my 42” wheel last winter. Much cheaper than leather. 

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I had a boat done with a soft hand 1 or 1.5mm cord instead of 3mm paracord. It took someone a long time, but was really comfortable and held up for at least a decade.  I’ve sailed with Paracorded wheels and this one was much more comfortable  

This photo is of a stove gimbal that I made, but you can see the wheel too:

i-WSWtFVv-D.jpg

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3 hours ago, Je Prefere said:

So stainless steel, an iron compound with added carbon, counts as organic?

 

Definitely not. Steel is a mixture of elements. Organic molecules have carbon atoms covalently bonded to other atoms like hydrogen and nitrogen. 

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9 hours ago, gn4478 said:

Definitely not. Steel is a mixture of elements. Organic molecules have carbon atoms covalently bonded to other atoms like hydrogen and nitrogen. 

Agreed- most current definitions include the requirement for a covalent bond between carbon and another element.

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On 12/29/2021 at 6:48 PM, Fleetwood said:

Agree, definitions only exist to be useful, and generally get a bit messy around the edges.

Hard to think of a (useful) organic molecule tho' that doesn't contain H (maybe carbon tetrafluoride?), but then I am (was) a physicist, not a chemist.....

Carbon tetrachloride. Very useful.

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  • 1 month later...

I just finished up the red grips.  The material is a little less dense than the windsurfer boom grip.  I warned the boat nanny that I wasn’t as confident in the material as I was in the boom grip, but the owner was adamant about wanting red.  We’ll see how it holds up, but I wouldn’t recommend it to others!  

F313B3BF-EBF1-4307-8A5C-9B3533859132.jpeg

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On 12/26/2021 at 9:59 AM, Mulligan said:

EVA Foam grip.  
 

 

4BB8E6E2-F4DF-4515-BE5D-28187C86F408.jpeg

1A177AA8-9705-469C-8FC5-D56A4D0306D6.jpeg

There's no need to cover a carbon wheel.  They are warm to the touch, aren't particularly slippery and the whole point is light weight.  I've got two wheels just like that one and live in a cold. damp climate.  Never even thought about a rim cover. 

Wheel cover - absolutely.

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On 1/5/2022 at 6:35 PM, Alex W said:

I had a boat done with a soft hand 1 or 1.5mm cord instead of 3mm paracord. It took someone a long time, but was really comfortable and held up for at least a decade.  I’ve sailed with Paracorded wheels and this one was much more comfortable  

This photo is of a stove gimbal that I made, but you can see the wheel too:

i-WSWtFVv-D.jpg

You can buy a very sturdy stove gimbal for a jet boil out of England for not a lot of $.  Well made and all-axis gimbal.

www.safire.uk.com

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47 minutes ago, Go Left said:

There's no need to cover a carbon wheel.  They are warm to the touch, aren't particularly slippery and the whole point is light weight.  I've got two wheels just like that one and live in a cold. damp climate.  Never even thought about a rim cover. 

Wheel cover - absolutely.

I’ve been on boats with all sorts of carbon wheels.  Clear coat, glossy AwlGrip, matte AwlGrip, spiral peel ply finish, non-skid stripes, and many others.  The grip does help a lot when the conditions are WET!  It doesn’t matter what kind of finish is on the wheel, it get’s slippery!  Most of the boats that I do the grips on race on the offshore races in SoCal.  They’re commonly doing Mexico and Hawaii races, where it’s commonly wet and cold at night.  As for the weight, the foam is mostly air.  The red covers maybe added a pound between the two, not a factor!  

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38 minutes ago, Mulligan said:

I’ve been on boats with all sorts of carbon wheels.  Clear coat, glossy AwlGrip, matte AwlGrip, spiral peel ply finish, non-skid stripes, and many others.  The grip does help a lot when the conditions are WET!  It doesn’t matter what kind of finish is on the wheel, it get’s slippery!  Most of the boats that I do the grips on race on the offshore races in SoCal.  They’re commonly doing Mexico and Hawaii races, where it’s commonly wet and cold at night.  As for the weight, the foam is mostly air.  The red covers maybe added a pound between the two, not a factor!  

I wonder if soft touch paint would do the trick for that.  It's the stuff you find on higher end computer mice, has sort of a rubbery feel and relatively durable.  This stuff says it's got UV resistance.

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$380 a Quart, $80 for Hardener, $80 for Thinner!  How much more to prep and spray?  Mine aren’t cheap, but it’s a proven system.
 

One company that I’ve seen does a Plasti-Dip type coating, but I’ve never seen it in real life.  But it seems like it has a glossy finish. The windsurfer boom grip has suede feel of finish.  I’ve had the boom grip wheels last almost 10 years without a cover on them. 

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1 hour ago, Mulligan said:

I’ve been on boats with all sorts of carbon wheels.  Clear coat, glossy AwlGrip, matte AwlGrip, spiral peel ply finish, non-skid stripes, and many others.  The grip does help a lot when the conditions are WET!  It doesn’t matter what kind of finish is on the wheel, it get’s slippery!  Most of the boats that I do the grips on race on the offshore races in SoCal.  They’re commonly doing Mexico and Hawaii races, where it’s commonly wet and cold at night.  As for the weight, the foam is mostly air.  The red covers maybe added a pound between the two, not a factor!  

It is not cold at night on a Mexico or Hawaii race.  Nor is it particularly wet.  I've worn the required single layer of poly and goretex jacket.  

Come a bit further north and we can show you cold at night if you bring enough fleece.  And we can show you wet.  Very wet.  The bare carbon wheels are just fine.

Good point about the weight of the foam, but a red pound or two on the rim of the wheel?  I'd rather not have it.

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Suum cuique pulchrum est; To each their own.  I just give my customers what they want.  I’ve done wheels for some of the top sleds, that have had some of the top helmsmen (and women), and I’ve never had a complaint.  Jason Carrington was very proud of super lightweight wheels that he made for the Volvo 60, until w wave washed another crewmember into the wheel, breaking it.  They had to tack the remaining wheel for the rest of the leg.  After that, he went back to aluminum wheels, as they could be bent back into shape.  

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13 hours ago, Mulligan said:

Suum cuique pulchrum est; To each their own.  I just give my customers what they want.  I’ve done wheels for some of the top sleds, that have had some of the top helmsmen (and women), and I’ve never had a complaint.  Jason Carrington was very proud of super lightweight wheels that he made for the Volvo 60, until w wave washed another crewmember into the wheel, breaking it.  They had to tack the remaining wheel for the rest of the leg.  After that, he went back to aluminum wheels, as they could be bent back into shape.  

So what is your source for the EVA foam?

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16 hours ago, Mulligan said:

$380 a Quart, $80 for Hardener, $80 for Thinner!  How much more to prep and spray?  Mine aren’t cheap, but it’s a proven system.
 

One company that I’ve seen does a Plasti-Dip type coating, but I’ve never seen it in real life.  But it seems like it has a glossy finish. The windsurfer boom grip has suede feel of finish.  I’ve had the boom grip wheels last almost 10 years without a cover on them. 

Plastidip is an interesting idea.  I use it for my mast boot and it has worked extremely well.  When I had my mast pulled a couple months ago to get shrouds replaced, the guys at the yard wanted to know who did the mast boot, how it was done, etc.  I might consider that for my wheel after the eva foam I have on there now gets beat in a few years.

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On 2/20/2022 at 5:50 AM, T sailor said:

yeah, Mulligan, where do you get this stuff?  how much do you charge to cover a wheel?  I am east coast so shipping could be a problem.  

I can’t give up my source at this time.  I’m having a hard time getting it, myself.  I’m charging about $500 a wheel for the smaller wheels, up to over $1000 for the big wheels.  There’s  fair amount of prep work to be done, then applying it, treating the seam, and trimming out the spokes.  Along with running around for all the supplies.  It takes me a full day to do the small wheels. 
 

A38729D5-47A5-4215-9115-78D74FB7566C.jpeg

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Usually they just little chunks taken out by wear and tear and nervous helmspersons with sharp fingernails.  One of Pyewacket’s wheels was taken out by Grand Illusion a few years ago.  I had just redone them.  the red grips have a nice cover going over them!  
 


 

 

CF8BEC52-F966-4213-8C69-66AE0B827E55.jpeg

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2 minutes ago, Mulligan said:

Usually they just little chunks taken out by wear and tear and nervous helmspersons with sharp fingernails.  One of Pyewacket’s wheels was taken out by Grand Illusion a few years ago.  I had just redone them.  the red grips have a nice cover going over them!  
 


 

 

CF8BEC52-F966-4213-8C69-66AE0B827E55.jpeg

The wheel I saw in the workshop for re skinning had physical damage …rope burn 

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3 minutes ago, Mulligan said:

It happens.  When the cover is fresh, I can scarf in patches. 

that yacht was in for a paint job

Seems that when a new clear coat  on the carbon is needed it’s time to repair the skin 

Evidently the skin was a few seasons old …seems  durable 

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On 2/19/2022 at 11:32 AM, Mulligan said:

I just finished up the red grips.  The material is a little less dense than the windsurfer boom grip.  I warned the boat nanny that I wasn’t as confident in the material as I was in the boom grip, but the owner was adamant about wanting red.  We’ll see how it holds up, but I wouldn’t recommend it to others!  

F313B3BF-EBF1-4307-8A5C-9B3533859132.jpeg

Nice job. Yup - that RED will be Pink after about 2 months of use even with a cover.

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1 hour ago, Irrational 14 said:

Nice job. Yup - that RED will be Pink after about 2 months of use even with a cover.

Bolt!  I tried to talk him out of it, but Sam said the owner wanted it!  A light sanding with 150 brings back the original surface color and texture!  It’s already pink!  

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I redid the grip on a few windsurfing booms back in the day and it wasn't to hard and they held up pretty well.  I would think that the wear and tear on windsurfing booms would be significantly worse than on a wheel.  There are quite a few videos on how to do a windsurfing boom.

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3 hours ago, gkny said:

I redid the grip on a few windsurfing booms back in the day and it wasn't to hard and they held up pretty well.  I would think that the wear and tear on windsurfing booms would be significantly worse than on a wheel.  There are quite a few videos on how to do a windsurfing boom.

Agreed.  I did a wheel back in 1990 and it lasted about 7 years.  But back then I could go to my local board shop and get the boom grip from a huge selection.  Now I can't find the stuff anymore in lengths and colors and density I want.  I did my wheel 2 years ago with some eva foam I had to scrape online to find in a color I didn't want, that is not as dense as the boom grip I used to get, and took about a month to ship.  

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On 2/21/2022 at 2:48 PM, Mulligan said:

I can’t give up my source at this time.  I’m having a hard time getting it, myself.  I’m charging about $500 a wheel for the smaller wheels, up to over $1000 for the big wheels.  There’s  fair amount of prep work to be done, then applying it, treating the seam, and trimming out the spokes.  Along with running around for all the supplies.  It takes me a full day to do the small wheels. 
 

A38729D5-47A5-4215-9115-78D74FB7566C.jpeg

That is some pretty work right there! I don’t care who you are.

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