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Cabin Sole replacement


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I’m replacing the main cabin sole on my Alerion Express 28.  The original is 1/2” ‘teak & holly’ plywood and I’ve bought a sheet of same. 
The two removable sections of the original sole are secured to the floors by small elbow catches on the underside.
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They’re accessed through 1” ID finger holes in the ply which are finished with 1” ID teak finger pulls glued in place.
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They’re accessed through 1” ID finger holes which are finished in the plywood by teak rings glued in place. I think they’re commonly called finger pulls.  

I have two questions .
Where can I get those teak rings?  A can only find them in 7/8” ID and that’s tight for my pudgy finger. 
Are there other panel fastening gubbins which I might prefer. 

 

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I don’t like the hole, teak ring 

it ages poorly 

I prefer a suction cup for lifting floor boards 

ive never found a hold down that I like 

Ive used this lift style  they are OK

aircraft panel hold down screws  also work 

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1 hour ago, Fleetwood said:

I specified the 'aircraft panel hold down screws' Slug showed, for my cabin sole.

Removed them soon after, I found them impossible to seat and remove easily.

A simple system of shock cord fastened to the sole,  and  a hook on the side of one of the floors works well for me now.

(You can make up similar teak rings with some scrap timber and a couple of hole saws, any size you like. Not quite as aesthetic, but once sanded smooth will look OK).

Boats move ..temperature , rigging loads 

difficult to deal with floorboards, hold downs and this movement 

many times it’s better to eliminate removable floorboards and go with a fixed floor and  framed, hinged and locked down hatches  set into this fixed floor 

on small boats this may be difficult 

 

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3 hours ago, slug zitski said:

Ive used this lift style  they are OK

Are there versions suitable for deck hatches?

I need to get my cockpit locker hatches tight and would prefer putting one of these in each corner instead of outside latches. But if water just seeps through the latch itself, then it would be a wasted effort.

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Just now, allweather said:

Are there versions suitable for deck hatches?

I need to get my cockpit locker hatches tight and would prefer putting one of these in each corner instead of outside latches. But if water just seeps through the latch itself, then it would be a wasted effort.

Many waterproof deck hatch type hold downs 

they use O rings on the shaft penetration 

do a google search 

avoid cheap stuff , look for US or European brands 

 

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4 hours ago, Fleetwood said:

I specified the 'aircraft panel hold down screws' Slug showed, for my cabin sole.

Removed them soon after, I found them impossible to seat and remove easily.

A simple system of shock cord fastened to the sole,  and  a hook on the side of one of the floors works well for me now.

(You can make up similar teak rings with some scrap timber and a couple of hole saws, any size you like. Not quite as aesthetic, but once sanded smooth will look OK).

I also specified the quarter turn fasteners in the picture (the vendor is PYI). I also changed them shortly afterwards. They depend on very accurate depth adjustment as there is nearly zero compliance in the depth grip length. They were impossible to adjust and keep adjusted. This is even with cored carbon fiber floorboards, which should be more stable than wood. I left the finishing ring in place, made new sockets that were simply a threaded hole, and use flat head machine screw in place of the 1/4 fastener. It works, but not as quick access and the screws are not captive in the holes. 

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Those Dzus fasteners are really only good for sheet metal panels - as noted they require extremely precise alignment.

For panels that require only occasional removal I use these with machine screws.

If you use Robertson or Allen head fasteners you can zip them out in seconds with a cordless screwdriver or drill.

 

Wood Insert, M8 x 20mm

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Actually real Dzus fasteners are much more tolerant of misalignment and depth variation than the PYI floor anchors. The typical Dzus fastener (they make many types) engages a wire spring and has a lot of compliance. There is another PYI 1/4 turn panel anchor that contains a spring for depth compliance, I used a bunch of those on other panels and they work reasonably well. The floor anchors in contrast have to be exactly on position (that is possible with care) and set to exactly the right depth (that is nearly impossible over time). The only compliance is the compression of a small O ring. 

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1 hour ago, DDW said:

Actually real Dzus fasteners are much more tolerant of misalignment and depth variation than the PYI floor anchors. The typical Dzus fastener (they make many types) engages a wire spring and has a lot of compliance. There is another PYI 1/4 turn panel anchor that contains a spring for depth compliance, I used a bunch of those on other panels and they work reasonably well. The floor anchors in contrast have to be exactly on position (that is possible with care) and set to exactly the right depth (that is nearly impossible over time). The only compliance is the compression of a small O ring. 

Sounds to me like you never had to open & close the hood of a Triumph TR3. ;):D

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6 hours ago, Quickstep192 said:

Diamond Jim,

I can make those trim rings for you if you'd like. If you'll send me some dimensions, I should be able to make them fairly quickly. 

Fine.
I’ll PM you. 
Jim

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1 hour ago, SloopJonB said:

Sounds to me like you never had to open & close the hood of a Triumph TR3. ;):D

If I had a Triumph TR3 I'd leave the hood off for ready access. I did own a Triumph Bonneville for awhile. You could not let it idle on the centerstand or it would walk away and you wouldn't find it again. 

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27 minutes ago, phill_nz said:

i had TR7'S

worst vehicle ever made

Not even close.

But plenty bad, I agree. Their ugliness kept me away.

Your comment implies plural. Did you have 2 or 3 so one was always available?

Or just a slow learner? ;)

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British Ausin in 1968 in a northern Ontario Canadian winter.

.

Left side front disc brake fractured into 2 pieces and was held together by ice for a while.

Apart from that, the rust and the engine needing a rebuild at 20000 miles it was an excellent car in the snow.

 

 

 

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29 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

Not even close.

But plenty bad, I agree. Their ugliness kept me away.

Your comment implies plural. Did you have 2 or 3 so one was always available?

Or just a slow learner? ;)

3

all of the above

and they were a good looking car with great handling and a real pleasure to drive  ... on the occasions they could complete the fuel to movement cycle

did read in the dog and lemon guide they were a winner in all categories .. even scored higher than the amc gremlin .. the reliant robin was classed as a bike .. so didnt count 

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I love the TR3. During my research I've read that there are now turnkey electronic fuel injection systems for the older British cars that can actually make them reliable. 
 

Seen this one?9306C2E2-8D4D-4C60-B6CD-950094C2FDA5.jpeg.f2143297c1d96fa3e4e1a3030ebb8890.jpeg

 

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the power train in the TR7 wasn't the problem

they could never solve the loom shorting or the popup headlights not sitting properly in the fully up or fully down position and consequently the electric motor to raise and lower them was almost always running ... about 2-3 hours to flatten a fully charged battery

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3 hours ago, Zonker said:

On my last monohull I used the same threaded fastener as Jon and 1/4" flush head machine screws. Super easy. Super secure

with the cost and power of modern magnets .. has anyone tried using them .. self aligning. secure. easyish to get off, easy to make flush

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1 hour ago, phill_nz said:

with the cost and power of modern magnets .. has anyone tried using them .. self aligning. secure. easyish to get off, easy to make flush

Cool idea. But for some reason magnets usually have serious corrosion issues. Even the fancy alloys. 

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The problem with magnets for this is the same as the PYI floor fasteners: no depth compliance. Even a small gap between them greatly reduces the attraction (by greater than d^2). I use nickel plated rare earth magnets to hold the companionway door open, small lockers closed, etc. They work well but must be set at a depth that they touch. The nickel plating works pretty well to keep corrosion at bay. I tried to use some really big ones to hold the transom door closed, embedding them with a single layer of 6 oz cloth on each separating. This reduced the attraction by maybe 70 or 80%. If only air were as permeable as iron....

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7 hours ago, phill_nz said:

with the cost and power of modern magnets .. has anyone tried using them .. self aligning. secure. easyish to get off, easy to make flush

I've used mag catches in a few spots - small locker doors, the drop down panel my small electrical panel is mounted on - but I wouldn't even consider them for anything heavy or anything that gets wet.

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4 hours ago, phill_nz said:

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002655615860.html?

 

they make them a lot bigger and stronger than when we first played with them

the  new 'sport' of magnetic fishing has created a market for very strong robust magnets

( for metal stuff not the flappy things )

 

If they are strong enough to properly retain floorboards the they will be too strong for anyone to lift those floorboards.

Maybe electromagnets with a switch?

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I’m uneasy about magnets on a boat with a magnetic compass.

Many years ago, before the coming of Loran or GPS, on a foggy morning in Downeast Maine, we got quite lost. 
A guest had put her boom box in the quarter berth and its speaker magnets made the ship’s compass useless. 

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