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We did the rebuild over a number of years. We would race and cruise in the summer, then in the winter we would pick an area and refit that area as our winter project. So we used the boat pretty much f

One of the biggest challenges facing div yacht racing is the wholesale de skilling of people through lack of opportunity to learn in adverse conditions races get called off , no one does deliveri

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Extasea (sp?) was coming in through the heads to Port Philip and may have taken some shots of Andy Doolan setting off for his 1000nm qualifier in his MiniTransat 116.

 

Has anyone got a ctc on the Extasea crew that I could contact re: photos?

 

PM me.

 

Cheers TBG.

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Extasea (sp?) was coming in through the heads to Port Philip and may have taken some shots of Andy Doolan setting off for his 1000nm qualifier in his MiniTransat 116.

 

Has anyone got a ctc on the Extasea crew that I could contact re: photos?

 

PM me.

 

Cheers TBG.

Dools heading back due to gear breakages - damn.

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Thanks GRS for the reply - seriously, i would've given you a week ! ;)

And a phone number at last. Do i ask for grs ?

 

But still no real answers - look forward to yr next installment.

 

when you call ask for glen stanaway, that way when i answer i'll know to put me on so i can speak to you

 

next installement coming soon.

 

Ok, I'm back. I beg your collective forgiveness for my late reply. I have no excuse for not putting communications with the sailinganarchy community as my highest priority. I shall cast myself face down on the ground in humility and submission as I await for what I hope will be a kind, caring and intelligent response.

 

The IRC service is a not for profit activity.

 

We sat down and looked at it in detail a couple of years ago, hence the shifts in price you would have seen over the last couple of years. We had to get it up to cover the costs involved with running the system. The fees we collect over the year are needed to cover all sorts of stuff. For every dollar of IRC income, we have to allow for...

  • Before even starting to cover our own costs, we forward a significant chunk is payable to RORC (and they own it, so thats not unreasonable)
  • And after that, we then forward a proportion to the state MYAs. We do this because each MYA has to factor in costs toward paying staff they use, such as at YV there are people there employed and helping run IRC. The amount of work varies between state to state based on their capabilities and the number of IRC applications annually. This duplication of services is one aspect we're looking at.
  • Several staff are employed by YA who help look after IRC. Primarily Bob Chapman, a fair chunk of me, part of an accounts person, a little bit of others as well.
  • Travel costs nationally related to IRC. Meetings in Melbourne, Perth, Brisbane etc.
  • Prorata costs toward commercial office space in Sydney
  • Prorata costs towards all the admin costs here.
  • An annual AUS IRC Measurers conference. The measurers from Melbourne are coming up for this.
  • Representation for AUS at the annual IRC Congress in GBR. We're represented by Malcolm Runnalls who has done a great job and has really worked hard on the UNCL & RORC to get a fairer system.

The costs of the system are spread across the fleet... its all balanced out between the applications that have one minor change, and those that occupy a large amount of YA's time. Not everything travels easily and IRC issues come up that occupy a significant amount of staff time, which are handled for the good of the fleet rather than individual boats.

 

You should all be pleased to know that if we proceed per the discussion document linked to further in a previous post, the local MYA administration fees which are applied in some states would disappear with no corresponding increase in YA's fees. This will obviously reduce costs to the boat owner in many states (not VIC though I understand, sorry guys). There's no plans to increase fees this coming year - assuming the $AUS doesn't nose dive, we are looking okay.

 

As I'd offered before, call me if you want to discuss it. I even published my direct line but no-one has called... not one... I'm starting to feel a little hurt, unloved.

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Thanks GRS for the reply - seriously, i would've given you a week ! ;)

And a phone number at last. Do i ask for grs ?

 

But still no real answers - look forward to yr next installment.

 

when you call ask for glen stanaway, that way when i answer i'll know to put me on so i can speak to you

 

next installement coming soon.

 

Ok, I'm back. I beg your collective forgiveness for my late reply. I have no excuse for not putting communications with the sailinganarchy community as my highest priority. I shall cast myself face down on the ground in humility and submission as I await for what I hope will be a kind, caring and intelligent response.

 

The IRC service is a not for profit activity.

 

We sat down and looked at it in detail a couple of years ago, hence the shifts in price you would have seen over the last couple of years. We had to get it up to cover the costs involved with running the system. The fees we collect over the year are needed to cover all sorts of stuff. For every dollar of IRC income, we have to allow for...

  • Before even starting to cover our own costs, we forward a significant chunk is payable to RORC (and they own it, so thats not unreasonable)
  • And after that, we then forward a proportion to the state MYAs. We do this because each MYA has to factor in costs toward paying staff they use, such as at YV there are people there employed and helping run IRC. The amount of work varies between state to state based on their capabilities and the number of IRC applications annually. This duplication of services is one aspect we're looking at.
  • Several staff are employed by YA who help look after IRC. Primarily Bob Chapman, a fair chunk of me, part of an accounts person, a little bit of others as well.
  • Travel costs nationally related to IRC. Meetings in Melbourne, Perth, Brisbane etc.
  • Prorata costs toward commercial office space in Sydney
  • Prorata costs towards all the admin costs here.
  • An annual AUS IRC Measurers conference. The measurers from Melbourne are coming up for this.
  • Representation for AUS at the annual IRC Congress in GBR. We're represented by Malcolm Runnalls who has done a great job and has really worked hard on the UNCL & RORC to get a fairer system.

The costs of the system are spread across the fleet... its all balanced out between the applications that have one minor change, and those that occupy a large amount of YA's time. Not everything travels easily and IRC issues come up that occupy a significant amount of staff time, which are handled for the good of the fleet rather than individual boats.

 

You should all be pleased to know that if we proceed per the discussion document linked to further in a previous post, the local MYA administration fees which are applied in some states would disappear with no corresponding increase in YA's fees. This will obviously reduce costs to the boat owner in many states (not VIC though I understand, sorry guys). There's no plans to increase fees this coming year - assuming the $AUS doesn't nose dive, we are looking okay.

 

As I'd offered before, call me if you want to discuss it. I even published my direct line but no-one has called... not one... I'm starting to feel a little hurt, unloved.

All this to 'run' IRC. Pardon me, but I thought RORC ran IRC. <_<

 

Perhaps I could save you all the trouble and costs, and forward my IRC form & payment direct to RORC ?

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Like your style phb!!

 

Have YA heard of conference calling via WebEx, or Skype (free), or YugmaSE (free), or InnerPass (free) or any number of other free or subsription applications.

These would certainly reduce travel costs for conferences of congresses.

Unless of course there are other reasons for travelling?????

 

Regardless, until IRC resolve the small light displacement yacht penalty(s) there is no point me wasting any cash on a certificate.

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Extasea (sp?) was coming in through the heads to Port Philip and may have taken some shots of Andy Doolan setting off for his 1000nm qualifier in his MiniTransat 116.

 

Has anyone got a ctc on the Extasea crew that I could contact re: photos?

 

PM me.

 

Cheers TBG.

Dools heading back due to gear breakages - damn.

 

I believe Andy was about 30nm SE of Cape Otway and was reefing the Jib for the afternoon when the winch handle on the cabin top gave out whilst tensioning the halyard and he went back into the tiller damaging the pintle and crossbeam pivot for the twin rudders. To turn around and head home was the prudent decision.

 

Reports are that he was just hitting his stride clocking up a run of 110+nm in 16 hours and was in a sensational weather system before the failure.

 

Details http://aaayachting.wordpress.com/

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Thanks GRS for the reply - seriously, i would've given you a week ! ;)

And a phone number at last. Do i ask for grs ?

 

But still no real answers - look forward to yr next installment.

 

when you call ask for glen stanaway, that way when i answer i'll know to put me on so i can speak to you

 

next installement coming soon.

 

Ok, I'm back. I beg your collective forgiveness for my late reply. I have no excuse for not putting communications with the sailinganarchy community as my highest priority. I shall cast myself face down on the ground in humility and submission as I await for what I hope will be a kind, caring and intelligent response.

 

The IRC service is a not for profit activity.

 

We sat down and looked at it in detail a couple of years ago, hence the shifts in price you would have seen over the last couple of years. We had to get it up to cover the costs involved with running the system. The fees we collect over the year are needed to cover all sorts of stuff. For every dollar of IRC income, we have to allow for...

  • Before even starting to cover our own costs, we forward a significant chunk is payable to RORC (and they own it, so thats not unreasonable)
  • And after that, we then forward a proportion to the state MYAs. We do this because each MYA has to factor in costs toward paying staff they use, such as at YV there are people there employed and helping run IRC. The amount of work varies between state to state based on their capabilities and the number of IRC applications annually. This duplication of services is one aspect we're looking at.
  • Several staff are employed by YA who help look after IRC. Primarily Bob Chapman, a fair chunk of me, part of an accounts person, a little bit of others as well.
  • Travel costs nationally related to IRC. Meetings in Melbourne, Perth, Brisbane etc.
  • Prorata costs toward commercial office space in Sydney
  • Prorata costs towards all the admin costs here.
  • An annual AUS IRC Measurers conference. The measurers from Melbourne are coming up for this.
  • Representation for AUS at the annual IRC Congress in GBR. We're represented by Malcolm Runnalls who has done a great job and has really worked hard on the UNCL & RORC to get a fairer system.

The costs of the system are spread across the fleet... its all balanced out between the applications that have one minor change, and those that occupy a large amount of YA's time. Not everything travels easily and IRC issues come up that occupy a significant amount of staff time, which are handled for the good of the fleet rather than individual boats.

 

You should all be pleased to know that if we proceed per the discussion document linked to further in a previous post, the local MYA administration fees which are applied in some states would disappear with no corresponding increase in YA's fees. This will obviously reduce costs to the boat owner in many states (not VIC though I understand, sorry guys). There's no plans to increase fees this coming year - assuming the $AUS doesn't nose dive, we are looking okay.

 

As I'd offered before, call me if you want to discuss it. I even published my direct line but no-one has called... not one... I'm starting to feel a little hurt, unloved.

Glen, thanks for posting.

But, it would seem that YA is beginning to resemble our state governments here - bloated, expensive, inefficient, and self-serving - your main reason for existing is to prop up the organisation itself, and you've forgotten the original reason for being there.

Seriously, all that shit to run a rule that you don't run.....

 

Really, tell me that YA runs IRC.

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Glen, thanks for posting.

But, it would seem that YA is beginning to resemble our state governments here - bloated, expensive, inefficient, and self-serving - your main reason for existing is to prop up the organisation itself, and you've forgotten the original reason for being there.

Seriously, all that shit to run a rule that you don't run.....

 

Really, tell me that YA runs IRC.

 

my pleasure. we're here to help.

 

thats all pretty heavy stuff, and stuff that i'll leave to the politicians. i will focus on my job in the trenches. or perhaps "on the winches" would be more apt.

 

But you got me, we dont run it. we administer it locally. there is a difference and i shouldn't have used the word "run".

 

if i meet you at the melbourne irc boat owners forum, i shall buy you a glass of the sandringham's cheapest red wine. out of my own pocket (i cant afford the good stuff).

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and i'm still a bit miffed

(i might have to get pissed)

that for all the opinions

and varied dominions

not one person calls

not a sound through the walls

of the sports governing body

who they say is quite shoddy

but works pretty hard

at managing the yard

of yachts and grots

who haul sheets and tie knots

pack sails

and drink ales

but all more or less fail

to make one bloody call

to find out the truth and all

about how it is run

sorry, "administered" my son

but i must now go

as it will start, the fine show

of the QLD Reds

leaving the Sharks for dead....

 

sorry guys for the above, but a bloke's entitled to amuse himself.

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What ever happened to the Jones 40' CadibArra 7

 

Was somewhere in Qld. Was entered in last Melb-Osaka 2H but pulled out. Now known as just "Cadi" Was up for sale a while back so don't know whre she might be now.

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What ever happened to the Jones 40' CadibArra 7

 

Was somewhere in Qld. Was entered in last Melb-Osaka 2H but pulled out. Now known as just "Cadi" Was up for sale a while back so don't know whre she might be now.

 

Mooloolaba YC.

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What ever happened to the Jones 40' CadibArra 7

 

Was somewhere in Qld. Was entered in last Melb-Osaka 2H but pulled out. Now known as just "Cadi" Was up for sale a while back so don't know whre she might be now.

 

Mooloolaba YC.

 

Are you sure you aren't getting your 7's and 8's mixed up 7= Kontrol 8= Up North or maybe I have it wrong!

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What ever happened to the Jones 40' CadibArra 7

 

Was somewhere in Qld. Was entered in last Melb-Osaka 2H but pulled out. Now known as just "Cadi" Was up for sale a while back so don't know whre she might be now.

 

Mooloolaba YC.

 

Are you sure you aren't getting your 7's and 8's mixed up 7= Kontrol 8= Up North or maybe I have it wrong!

Wrong

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Actually, Cadi 7 became Kontrol/Alex.

Cadi 8 was just Cadibarra with no numeric - and started osaka.

 

What's she doing in Moo - racing? rotting ?

 

 

...sweating :(

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Actually, Cadi 7 became Kontrol/Alex.

Cadi 8 was just Cadibarra with no numeric - and started osaka.

 

What's she doing in Moo - racing? rotting ?

 

 

...sweating :(

 

been 18 months since I saw her but noted she did the Bris-Keppel Race again as well as ABRW last year. She looked ok despite the ONJ sweat bands

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It's getting tight at the top for the Range Series. Should make for an interesting last couple of races.

 

Who's your tip ? I'll go for Coombsy.

 

1 SM2008 AUDI CENTRE MELBOURN Chris Dare SYC 29.00 3.00 4.00 2.00 3.00 0.00A 0.00A 2.00 2.00 5.00 5.00 3.00 [7.00]

2 SM46 DEKADENCE Philip Coombs SYC 30.00 5.00 2.00 5.00 4.00 0.00A 0.00A 1.00 5.00 2.00 2.00 [5.00] 4.00

3 SM5200 COUGAR II Alan Whiteley SYC 33.00 4.00 1.00 7.00 2.00 0.00A 0.00A 13.00C [13.00C] 3.00 1.00 1.00 1.00

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It's getting tight at the top for the Range Series. Should make for an interesting last couple of races.

 

Who's your tip ? I'll go for Coombsy.

 

1 SM2008 AUDI CENTRE MELBOURN Chris Dare SYC 29.00 3.00 4.00 2.00 3.00 0.00A 0.00A 2.00 2.00 5.00 5.00 3.00 [7.00]

2 SM46 DEKADENCE Philip Coombs SYC 30.00 5.00 2.00 5.00 4.00 0.00A 0.00A 1.00 5.00 2.00 2.00 [5.00] 4.00

3 SM5200 COUGAR II Alan Whiteley SYC 33.00 4.00 1.00 7.00 2.00 0.00A 0.00A 13.00C [13.00C] 3.00 1.00 1.00 1.00

 

Any idea how the drops will come into play? NoR says....

Division 0 will have 14 races in their series of which the best 11 results are to count towards the Division 0 Championship.

 

Guess that means the abandoned races (7&8) have to count as drops...? Otherwise Cougar II looks strong.

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It's getting tight at the top for the Range Series. Should make for an interesting last couple of races.

 

Who's your tip ? I'll go for Coombsy.

 

1 SM2008 AUDI CENTRE MELBOURN Chris Dare SYC 29.00 3.00 4.00 2.00 3.00 0.00A 0.00A 2.00 2.00 5.00 5.00 3.00 [7.00]

2 SM46 DEKADENCE Philip Coombs SYC 30.00 5.00 2.00 5.00 4.00 0.00A 0.00A 1.00 5.00 2.00 2.00 [5.00] 4.00

3 SM5200 COUGAR II Alan Whiteley SYC 33.00 4.00 1.00 7.00 2.00 0.00A 0.00A 13.00C [13.00C] 3.00 1.00 1.00 1.00

 

Any idea how the drops will come into play? NoR says....

Division 0 will have 14 races in their series of which the best 11 results are to count towards the Division 0 Championship.

 

Guess that means the abandoned races (7&8) have to count as drops...? Otherwise Cougar II looks strong.

 

Are the NOR & SI on any website?

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What ever happened to the Jones 40' CadibArra 7

 

Was somewhere in Qld. Was entered in last Melb-Osaka 2H but pulled out. Now known as just "Cadi" Was up for sale a while back so don't know whre she might be now.

 

Mooloolaba YC.

 

Are you sure you aren't getting your 7's and 8's mixed up 7= Kontrol 8= Up North or maybe I have it wrong!

Did PHS at Hamo in 08. Had for sale signs on the cabin sides. Maybe a charter that week....."Goldfinger". Might be wrong????

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It's getting tight at the top for the Range Series. Should make for an interesting last couple of races.

 

Who's your tip ? I'll go for Coombsy.

 

1 SM2008 AUDI CENTRE MELBOURN Chris Dare SYC 29.00 3.00 4.00 2.00 3.00 0.00A 0.00A 2.00 2.00 5.00 5.00 3.00 [7.00]

2 SM46 DEKADENCE Philip Coombs SYC 30.00 5.00 2.00 5.00 4.00 0.00A 0.00A 1.00 5.00 2.00 2.00 [5.00] 4.00

3 SM5200 COUGAR II Alan Whiteley SYC 33.00 4.00 1.00 7.00 2.00 0.00A 0.00A 13.00C [13.00C] 3.00 1.00 1.00 1.00

 

Any idea how the drops will come into play? NoR says....

Division 0 will have 14 races in their series of which the best 11 results are to count towards the Division 0 Championship.

 

Guess that means the abandoned races (7&8) have to count as drops...? Otherwise Cougar II looks strong.

 

Are the NOR & SI on any website?

 

 

 

 

They are on the SYC website. Click on Keel boat racing , they are on the LHS under "sailing instructions".

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It's getting tight at the top for the Range Series. Should make for an interesting last couple of races.

 

Who's your tip ? I'll go for Coombsy.

 

1 SM2008 AUDI CENTRE MELBOURN Chris Dare SYC 29.00 3.00 4.00 2.00 3.00 0.00A 0.00A 2.00 2.00 5.00 5.00 3.00 [7.00]

2 SM46 DEKADENCE Philip Coombs SYC 30.00 5.00 2.00 5.00 4.00 0.00A 0.00A 1.00 5.00 2.00 2.00 [5.00] 4.00

3 SM5200 COUGAR II Alan Whiteley SYC 33.00 4.00 1.00 7.00 2.00 0.00A 0.00A 13.00C [13.00C] 3.00 1.00 1.00 1.00

 

Range Series is coming down to the wire for several divisions:

 

Div 0 IRC - Audi by 1 point over Dekadence

Div 1 IRC - Reverie by 1 point over Exec Decision

Div 1 AMS - Horizon Spring by 1 point over Exec Decision

Div 3 AMS - Spellbound by 1/2 point over Rhiannon

 

Good quality of racing.... last race on Apr 4th will be critical.

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Anyone have any solid information regarding a rumour that Cougar 11's owner has been mulling over the purchase of a certain R/P 62 "Limit"?

 

Don't know about any purchase/sale, but did hear that the same R/P may have been put into storage with no more racing for the time being, and the paid crew "released".

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Anyone have any solid information regarding a rumour that Cougar 11's owner has been mulling over the purchase of a certain R/P 62 "Limit"?

 

Don't know about any purchase/sale, but did hear that the same R/P may have been put into storage with no more racing for the time being, and the paid crew "released".

 

I think "eased" is the more appropriate term. There's a thread in OR Anarchy on the split between Hicko and Alan Briety.

 

Mex

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Anyone have any solid information regarding a rumour that Cougar 11's owner has been mulling over the purchase of a certain R/P 62 "Limit"?

 

There really is no better time than the present to be dropping shit-loads of cash on huge expensive boats. You'd think that it would be no brainer.

 

Azza would have to get his head around those kooky Quantum rags.

 

Thommo could do a quick dredge every Friday afternoon so they could get it in and out of the marina.

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Anyone have any solid information regarding a rumour that Cougar 11's owner has been mulling over the purchase of a certain R/P 62 "Limit"?

 

There really is no better time than the present to be dropping shit-loads of cash on huge expensive boats. You'd think that it would be no brainer.

 

Azza would have to get his head around those kooky Quantum rags.

 

Thommo could do a quick dredge every Friday afternoon so they could get it in and out of the marina.

 

Imagine the depreciation on it in the short time it's been around, it's going to be ugly I would imagine.

 

STAY CALM

 

Nice. Confirmed or rumour ?

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While it is nice to hear about new boats arriving on the scene - why don't we get back to trying to find out what the hell ANYBODY does when employed - and I say employed because they don't WORK - down at good old YA?

 

To say that they are like a government is a slight on the government - they are a worse, they are a body of self egotistical wind bags - I forget the dudes name who said how sad he was that even after posting his number no one rang him !! Well dude, go figure - don't you get it ?? No one likes you and no one wants to talk to you because all we ever get from you and your dickhead friends - should that be overpaid and uncaring co workers is "Blah,Blah Blah, we spend your money wisely etc,etc etc" and when taken to task on anything hide behind "Oh - I didn't realy mean to say that and no that it not really an area controlled by us, we are just paid to look at all the work they do and pass on any questions real yachties have, because we don't know any answers or have any true understanding of the sport that we are paid very well to (sic) represent.

 

I did ring them last year about an issue that I would love to bring to the forum again - and this young little prick - still wet behind the ears, and not with spray from a boat - it was some kind of gel substance that he applied to keep his hair controlled into some form of questionable fashion - fucking hung up on me !!!! He said he could not explain to me the answer to my question, so therefore it was not worthy of any further discussion and rather than put me onto someone that my have been able to help (you know now that by saying someone at YA is going to help - you do know I'm kidding, Right !!)the little prick just said I don;t have to explain this to you and hung up !! Well, as I pay him - I thought that I might have some right to question him, but obviously how wrong was I.

 

Don't get me started with these no good - non caring - self centred - travel hungry - meeting going - dinner attending - egotistical wankers.

 

They shit me and do nothing for OUR SPORT and something should be done about it.

 

A question for anyone out there regarding how STUPID are the boffins from YA? Think about this - Why was last years big galah (sic) dinner for YA held at Power House????

If all attending are yachties ( who support their clubs by memberships etc ) why would the "helping" (sic) body pay how much - a shitload - to an outside catering company and an unassiosiated venue????? It could not have been the location - it was a prick of a joint to get to and get home from, parking was well non existent. It could not have been chosen for the view, if views came into the criteria would not we have held the event somewhere with a bay view?? I wonder where !!!! If you had to pick a venue for a yachties function to celebrate sailing excellence on Port Phillip over the year, would your picking preference not be - in no favourite order - Royal Victoria, Sandy, Squadron, Royal Brighton - and this venue could be rotated year x year. Oh just think that the Yacht Clubs might be able to make some money from hosting this event - What a stupid idea - Generating money that really belongs to the clubs members that was given to dichheads to help yacht clubs and their members and give this back to the clubs - no fuck that - give it all to someone else!!

 

YA just does not think fullstop - I know for a fact that Royals and Sandy were both free that night and are more than capable in hosting and holding large coperate functions and would do soooooo much better than what was provided by an average venue. But as I have mentioned - why would YA do anything that may benefit a Yacht club or any of the clubs members???

 

Any one have any thoughts on any good they do? I would like to hear.

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While it is nice to hear about new boats arriving on the scene - why don't we get back to trying to find out what the hell ANYBODY does when employed - and I say employed because they don't WORK - down at good old YA?

 

To say that they are like a government is a slight on the government - they are a worse, they are a body of self egotistical wind bags - I forget the dudes name who said how sad he was that even after posting his number no one rang him !! Well dude, go figure - don't you get it ?? No one likes you and no one wants to talk to you because all we ever get from you and your dickhead friends - should that be overpaid and uncaring co workers is "Blah,Blah Blah, we spend your money wisely etc,etc etc" and when taken to task on anything hide behind "Oh - I didn't realy mean to say that and no that it not really an area controlled by us, we are just paid to look at all the work they do and pass on any questions real yachties have, because we don't know any answers or have any true understanding of the sport that we are paid very well to (sic) represent.

 

I did ring them last year about an issue that I would love to bring to the forum again - and this young little prick - still wet behind the ears, and not with spray from a boat - it was some kind of gel substance that he applied to keep his hair controlled into some form of questionable fashion - fucking hung up on me !!!! He said he could not explain to me the answer to my question, so therefore it was not worthy of any further discussion and rather than put me onto someone that my have been able to help (you know now that by saying someone at YA is going to help - you do know I'm kidding, Right !!)the little prick just said I don;t have to explain this to you and hung up !! Well, as I pay him - I thought that I might have some right to question him, but obviously how wrong was I.

 

Don't get me started with these no good - non caring - self centred - travel hungry - meeting going - dinner attending - egotistical wankers.

 

They shit me and do nothing for OUR SPORT and something should be done about it.

 

A question for anyone out there regarding how STUPID are the boffins from YA? Think about this - Why was last years big galah (sic) dinner for YA held at Power House????

If all attending are yachties ( who support their clubs by memberships etc ) why would the "helping" (sic) body pay how much - a shitload - to an outside catering company and an unassiosiated venue????? It could not have been the location - it was a prick of a joint to get to and get home from, parking was well non existent. It could not have been chosen for the view, if views came into the criteria would not we have held the event somewhere with a bay view?? I wonder where !!!! If you had to pick a venue for a yachties function to celebrate sailing excellence on Port Phillip over the year, would your picking preference not be - in no favourite order - Royal Victoria, Sandy, Squadron, Royal Brighton - and this venue could be rotated year x year. Oh just think that the Yacht Clubs might be able to make some money from hosting this event - What a stupid idea - Generating money that really belongs to the clubs members that was given to dichheads to help yacht clubs and their members and give this back to the clubs - no fuck that - give it all to someone else!!

 

YA just does not think fullstop - I know for a fact that Royals and Sandy were both free that night and are more than capable in hosting and holding large coperate functions and would do soooooo much better than what was provided by an average venue. But as I have mentioned - why would YA do anything that may benefit a Yacht club or any of the clubs members???

 

Any one have any thoughts on any good they do? I would like to hear.

 

A bit early to be on the piss isn't it?

 

You got a problem with YA? Talk to Andrew Plymton. He's approachable. Don't start with abuse though - that will NEVER get you anywhere.

 

(Sorry Plymmo)

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BlueV.

I've not met a keelboat owner or sailor, who could tell me how YA benefits them or their sport.

 

So why are we forcibly affiliated (give them money) ?

 

Try thinking how it would be if YA and the MYA's did not exist. No RRS to begin with.

 

If you don't want to be affiliated, then don't give them your money.

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BlueV.

I've not met a keelboat owner or sailor, who could tell me how YA benefits them or their sport.

 

So why are we forcibly affiliated (give them money) ?

While this is a bit of a hijack of the Melbourne thread to be talking about what YA does or doesn't do, all I can do is relate my experience last year when our club's existence was threatened by a local council's plan to put a road in front of us, cutting us off from the water. I sent an email to Yachting Tas, the President of YT drove an hour an a half on a Sunday to come and look for himself, and wrote us a letter of support. As for YA, some week's later, again on a Sunday, my mobile rang at 9.30 pm. It was Phil Jones CEO of YA, ringing about a letter he was writing in support (he was actually writing it as we spoke). The club in question is located in a small town of 500 people and has about 25 members. I reckon that was service from YA above and beyond what could be reasonably expected.

 

So while I have issues with the IRC charges, when our club needed YA, YA answered the call.

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BlueV.

I've not met a keelboat owner or sailor, who could tell me how YA benefits them or their sport.

 

So why are we forcibly affiliated (give them money) ?

 

Try thinking how it would be if YA and the MYA's did not exist. No RRS to begin with.

 

If you don't want to be affiliated, then don't give them your money.

 

 

YA's President is down at SYC on a regular basis with Flirt. Introduce yourself to Andrew & express your concerns as a member of YA.

We are fortunate to have the Pres at the club. Has done plenty for the sport and participates on a regular basis. Won many a championship in his own right.

He will listen, but show him the respect of his position and not the dumb fuck who hung up on you.

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BlueV.

I've not met a keelboat owner or sailor, who could tell me how YA benefits them or their sport.

 

So why are we forcibly affiliated (give them money) ?

 

 

You aren't forced to do anything phb. Don't pay and you can't enter your boat in a race so you'll have to take up golf, which may be a bit hard on one good leg :lol: . They have us by the S & Cs and besides, YA has some serious Olympic campaigns to fund along with costly Coaches etc... so we may even get to feel good about our contributions once every 4 years or so.

 

Note to YA officers reading this thread- Perhaps you could tell us what you actually do for the mainstream sport of sailing in Australia, apart from collecting revenue that is. Many enquiring minds would genuinely like to know...

 

The timing is right - YC subscriptions complete with the annual YA impost in question are nearly due again so the forum is yours. We wait with 'bated breath, (but faint hope) for your revelations.

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I know, take it to political anarchy but meanwhile, Kev is over in Seppoland espousing Australias assets to the less fortunately endowed...

 

"I'm telling you Hillary, you should see my wife Therese, shes got this magnificent set of hooters..."

 

post-13013-1237956588_thumb.jpg

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I know, take it to political anarchy but meanwhile, Kev is over in Seppoland espousing Australias assets to the less fortunately endowed...

 

"I'm telling you Hillary, you should see my wife Therese, shes got this magnificent set of hooters..."

 

post-13013-1237956588_thumb.jpg

 

 

Thats a good one of our ......... "Secretary ... ah...um ... Prime Minister" Watch the news tonight.

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Firstly, I must make apology to YA - as someone pointed out in an earlier post - it was a little early in the morning, I was up with a crying kid (mine by the way ) and was not 100% awake.

 

SO - TO ALL AT YA -

 

PLEASE ACCEPT MY HEARTFELT APOLOGY.

 

Having now cleared up my little slip on the keyboard of only one letter , I would like to confirm and stand right behind all the thinks I said in my earlier posts but would have them levelled at YV.

 

I have met AP from YA on several occasions and can only agree with all that have defended him, and his good intent for the sport - if only we could get him to do something about the good for nothing pricks down at YV.

 

In reply to the post who said don't pay your YA/YV subs, how little you know, this was part of my original "beef" with firstly the wet behind the ears upstart from YV - then followed up with "El Presidenti" himself. As you are blissfully un aware - YV now do not have any individual members such as you an I, and have not for a couple / few years. The only members of YV are the 28??? Yacht clubs and those clubs pay a "set fee" to YV based on numbers of members. The clubs then charge a fee to you in your membership to cover this cost - if you are a member of more than 1 club, the fee is compounded and there is nothing you can do about it.

 

Oh sorry, after discussing this with YV - they did come up with a solution - and they were very serious when they explained this - and remember they are PAID TO REPRESENT THE SPORT BY US !!!!! - I was told to pay the fees only to one club, sounds great. When I questioned as to what or who paid this charge if there was multiple billing to one person, I was told that it was just bad luck for the club(s) who were not nominated as the priciple club and that those clubs would "just be out of pocket" When I protested that this was not a fair and just reply, and that you CAN NOT / NOR SHOULD not be able to be a member and pay for the same person multiple times - nor should clubs be held to ransom for this injustice - I was "offically informed" that the best course of action was to quit membership to all but one club, as this action would reduce any problems with having duel YV membership.

 

What if you live in Sandy - and have holidays @ Port Fairy for example - they told me to just dump one of the clubs was the easiest solution, how can not supporting other clubs be of benefit to the clubs or the sport in general. To the guy in Tassie that posted - imagine if you did not have the support of your members due to some governing body making it difficult for your existing members and telling them the best course of action is not to support you but to QUIT. It would be interesting to see how many people have more than one club membership.

 

AGAIN - I APOLOGISE TO YA for the slip of the keyboard - but I take no backward steps in my belief of the boffins at YV. And AP - if you read this you should have a good look into it - it is an absolute rort!

 

Please note again AP - is an good representative for sailing and does well in representing the sport, if only we could get rid of the weeds that grow under the trees.

 

Hope this clears up any errors posted earlier.

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Regarding the YA/YV memberships.

Up until last year, you could nominate a 'primary' club, and your affiliation fee would be paid only by that club. (and thus extracted from you by that club)

And i believe the fee goes to YA, not YV.

 

They have changed the structure - now they charge all clubs a fee based on their member numbers - different brackets have different fees. The net result being that you will be paying a fee to YA for every club you are a member of.

Easier for them to administer, but probably more expensive for the yachtie.

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PHB - You are right - although not 100% sure that this has only been the case this year, I think it has been at least 2 maybe 3, but whatever you are correct. It is way easier for them to admin. but IS an added expense to the yachtie.

Still no word on all the fantastic things they YV do for the average yachtie

You mention less expense to them - just take postage - a few years ago YV had to send out 25k of invoices,stamps alone $12k plus if you have been part of a large mailout - all other expenses + labour costs then to admin all of this !!!!!

 

Now 28 invoices $14.oo in postage ( saving approx $12,ooo.oo ) + all admin and affilated costs - not mentioning that from what I have been told - most of, if not all clubs pay this account propmtly therefore not forcing extra admin follow up costs.

 

It all seems petty until you sit down and figure what is going "out the door" and what you are getting back in return - and unfortunately this is nearly always done when it is all to late and the business or sport has folded and the fat cats who ran it into the ground just walk out and into another perk without a care about the pile of shit they have left behind.

 

Think I'm out there and just bangin"on - Head of telstra - I can't even remember the payout it was so big - Macquarie Bank - How many boys in the pig trough sucking it out - Bonds - lady muck and her 2m.

I have nothing against people making shitloads of money but as long as the business goes up with them, and they earn thier keep.

 

I ask again - what do they do for joe average???

 

Any takers.

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PHB - You are right - although not 100% sure that this has only been the case this year, I think it has been at least 2 maybe 3, but whatever you are correct. It is way easier for them to admin. but IS an added expense to the yachtie.

Still no word on all the fantastic things they YV do for the average yachtie

You mention less expense to them - just take postage - a few years ago YV had to send out 25k of invoices,stamps alone $12k plus if you have been part of a large mailout - all other expenses + labour costs then to admin all of this !!!!!

 

Now 28 invoices $14.oo in postage ( saving approx $12,ooo.oo ) + all admin and affilated costs - not mentioning that from what I have been told - most of, if not all clubs pay this account propmtly therefore not forcing extra admin follow up costs.

 

It all seems petty until you sit down and figure what is going "out the door" and what you are getting back in return - and unfortunately this is nearly always done when it is all to late and the business or sport has folded and the fat cats who ran it into the ground just walk out and into another perk without a care about the pile of shit they have left behind.

 

Think I'm out there and just bangin"on - Head of telstra - I can't even remember the payout it was so big - Macquarie Bank - How many boys in the pig trough sucking it out - Bonds - lady muck and her 2m.

I have nothing against people making shitloads of money but as long as the business goes up with them, and they earn thier keep.

 

 

 

Any takers.

 

I presume you know where the YV office is (they have to pay rent for it, it's not free). I'ts not out of bounds. Go down there and have a look one day. You might be surprised how much actually goes on in that pokey little place. Then they have the training boats that they take all over the state, introducing & teaching kids sailing at various schools. Then there is Sail Melbourne regatta to run. (Oh. Sorry. You dont sail in it so why should you contribute). Then the admin for YV handicaps (ex VYC dinghies handicaps that you don't have any part of) Then they represent all sailors in Victoria when it comes to dealing with MSV trying to introduce new regulations that WILL IMPACT ON YOU. I suppose you think that all the people in the office are only working there 40 hours a week for the love of the sport, not for wages.

You are the kind of guys who would object to your taxes being spent on some govt. project up north or out west because you get no visible benefit for it.

 

I ask again - what do they do for joe average??? A fucking whole lot more than you think. If YOU got involved in running affairs in sailing then you might find out.

 

It's NOT a business. They're certainly NOT pocketing any money out of it as your post suggests.

 

I'm not sure but I think Sail Melbourne is fiscally independant of YV, though run out of the same office,

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Regarding the YA/YV memberships.

Up until last year, you could nominate a 'primary' club, and your affiliation fee would be paid only by that club. (and thus extracted from you by that club)

And i believe the fee goes to YA, not YV.

 

They have changed the structure - now they charge all clubs a fee based on their member numbers - different brackets have different fees. The net result being that you will be paying a fee to YA for every club you are a member of.

Easier for them to administer, but probably more expensive for the yachtie.

 

I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

It would be unlikely that your second membership would tip a clubs membership over into the next "band"

The club collects (or not) that figure from their members as they see fit. If you're paying it twice, one of your clubs is ripping you off.

Where it fell down is that some clubs (especially in QLD) returned higher numbers (to make themselves seem more important) & were stung with a higher charge.

I don't think YA ever intended to collect twice from every sailor. I do think YA want to know as close as possible, how many sailors they've got out there.

 

Personally, I don't think the "banding system" is a success. The previous system wasn't working because a few clubs were collecting the Silver Card fees and not passing it on to their MYA. THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT.

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I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

From what we were told (and this is from YT not YV) is that the banding system is not based on number of members but capacity of the club to generate revenue. So if a club has a marina, hardstand, haulout, restaurant etc, it would pay more than a club of similar size in members but no revenue-generating facilities. In TAS this worked out pretty much the same across the board apart from some anomalies which meant that two clubs, one a big Hobart club, and one a very small country club, had to pay significantly more than would be expected.

 

The problem we are facing in TAS is that the system does not seem to be transparent and YT won't give us an answer on exactly how they came up with the figures. There was a meeting last week about it. I'll try to find out more.

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I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

From what we were told (and this is from YT not YV) is that the banding system is not based on number of members but capacity of the club to generate revenue. So if a club has a marina, hardstand, haulout, restaurant etc, it would pay more than a club of similar size in members but no revenue-generating facilities. In TAS this worked out pretty much the same across the board apart from some anomalies which meant that two clubs, one a big Hobart club, and one a very small country club, had to pay significantly more than would be expected.

 

The problem we are facing in TAS is that the system does not seem to be transparent and YT won't give us an answer on exactly how they came up with the figures. There was a meeting last week about it. I'll try to find out more.

 

Sounds a little different. I don't know for sure but think each state can use their own method of levy collection.

 

I don't think the "banding" system is good. Too confusing & too many variations in memberships across the country. I hope someone can come up with a system that is easy & works.

 

The biggest problem is some very vocal people just want it for nothing. They don't want to pay unless they get a dirct benefit - greater than what they might have to pay.

 

The facts are that the yachting authorities everywhere are necessary and they CANNOT be run for nothing.

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Regarding the YA/YV memberships.

Up until last year, you could nominate a 'primary' club, and your affiliation fee would be paid only by that club. (and thus extracted from you by that club)

And i believe the fee goes to YA, not YV.

 

They have changed the structure - now they charge all clubs a fee based on their member numbers - different brackets have different fees. The net result being that you will be paying a fee to YA for every club you are a member of.

Easier for them to administer, but probably more expensive for the yachtie.

 

I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

It would be unlikely that your second membership would tip a clubs membership over into the next "band"

The club collects (or not) that figure from their members as they see fit. If you're paying it twice, one of your clubs is ripping you off.

Where it fell down is that some clubs (especially in QLD) returned higher numbers (to make themselves seem more important) & were stung with a higher charge.

I don't think YA ever intended to collect twice from every sailor. I do think YA want to know as close as possible, how many sailors they've got out there.

 

Personally, I don't think the "banding system" is a success. The previous system wasn't working because a few clubs were collecting the Silver Card fees and not passing it on to their MYA. THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT.

 

 

Well Johnny Saint - you seem to know all - If you did support more than one club (being a member and financially supporting) a club is the best thing you can do for it - you would or should know that what you say is CRAP - and that'a a fact.

You are 100% correct about the clubs memberships numbers dictate how much they pay in fees - fees which I am favour of paying - where you are 100% wrong is when you think that one club is ripping you off by charging you a second time. Listen - the FACT is - YA/YV charge the clubs per member - the clubs then divide this charge by their member base and "on charge" EACH member an arrived at figure. IF YOU SUPPORT MULTIPLE CLUBS YOU PAY MULTIPLE TIMES - if the secordary (thirdary!!) clubs do not pass this cost on the the end user (multiple member) they are stiffed with the bill!!!

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - which would see any multiple members having to more costs at some clubs.

 

It cannot be easier to understand - the above is fact - if you just want to maintain your beliefs and do not want to know the truth - fine by me, but stop all this bullshit you spew out and take the time to get the truth.

 

If you don't want to believe in reality - take a walk off the edge of the earth - you still believe it's flat - right !!!

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Regarding the YA/YV memberships.

Up until last year, you could nominate a 'primary' club, and your affiliation fee would be paid only by that club. (and thus extracted from you by that club)

And i believe the fee goes to YA, not YV.

 

They have changed the structure - now they charge all clubs a fee based on their member numbers - different brackets have different fees. The net result being that you will be paying a fee to YA for every club you are a member of.

Easier for them to administer, but probably more expensive for the yachtie.

 

I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

It would be unlikely that your second membership would tip a clubs membership over into the next "band"

The club collects (or not) that figure from their members as they see fit. If you're paying it twice, one of your clubs is ripping you off.

Where it fell down is that some clubs (especially in QLD) returned higher numbers (to make themselves seem more important) & were stung with a higher charge.

I don't think YA ever intended to collect twice from every sailor. I do think YA want to know as close as possible, how many sailors they've got out there.

 

Personally, I don't think the "banding system" is a success. The previous system wasn't working because a few clubs were collecting the Silver Card fees and not passing it on to their MYA. THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT.

 

 

Well Johnny Saint - you seem to know all - If you did support more than one club (being a member and financially supporting) a club is the best thing you can do for it - you would or should know that what you say is CRAP - and that'a a fact.

You are 100% correct about the clubs memberships numbers dictate how much they pay in fees - fees which I am favour of paying - where you are 100% wrong is when you think that one club is ripping you off by charging you a second time. Listen - the FACT is - YA/YV charge the clubs per member - the clubs then divide this charge by their member base and "on charge" EACH member an arrived at figure. IF YOU SUPPORT MULTIPLE CLUBS YOU PAY MULTIPLE TIMES - if the secordary (thirdary!!) clubs do not pass this cost on the the end user (multiple member) they are stiffed with the bill!!!

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - which would see any multiple members having to more costs at some clubs.

 

It cannot be easier to understand - the above is fact - if you just want to maintain your beliefs and do not want to know the truth - fine by me, but stop all this bullshit you spew out and take the time to get the truth.

 

If you don't want to believe in reality - take a walk off the edge of the earth - you still believe it's flat - right !!!

 

Have you finished spewing your vitriol all over the place?

 

Now, your secondary club, if they are doing things right,should include YOU as a "paid affiliation fee elswhere" member with your Silver card number.

 

If they haven't done that they are falling down on the job.

 

If you haven't supplied that number then what the fuck are you complaining about. It's YOUR OWN FUCKING FAULT.

 

I do not know it all but I know that I or my clubs (only 1 now) did not pay it twice.

 

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - ----

That is exactly what I said. Read my original post.

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PHB - You are right - although not 100% sure that this has only been the case this year, I think it has been at least 2 maybe 3, but whatever you are correct. It is way easier for them to admin. but IS an added expense to the yachtie.

Still no word on all the fantastic things they YV do for the average yachtie

You mention less expense to them - just take postage - a few years ago YV had to send out 25k of invoices,stamps alone $12k plus if you have been part of a large mailout - all other expenses + labour costs then to admin all of this !!!!!

 

Now 28 invoices $14.oo in postage ( saving approx $12,ooo.oo ) + all admin and affilated costs - not mentioning that from what I have been told - most of, if not all clubs pay this account propmtly therefore not forcing extra admin follow up costs.

 

It all seems petty until you sit down and figure what is going "out the door" and what you are getting back in return - and unfortunately this is nearly always done when it is all to late and the business or sport has folded and the fat cats who ran it into the ground just walk out and into another perk without a care about the pile of shit they have left behind.

 

Think I'm out there and just bangin"on - Head of telstra - I can't even remember the payout it was so big - Macquarie Bank - How many boys in the pig trough sucking it out - Bonds - lady muck and her 2m.

I have nothing against people making shitloads of money but as long as the business goes up with them, and they earn thier keep.

 

 

 

Any takers.

 

I presume you know where the YV office is (they have to pay rent for it, it's not free). I'ts not out of bounds. Go down there and have a look one day. You might be surprised how much actually goes on in that pokey little place. Then they have the training boats that they take all over the state, introducing & teaching kids sailing at various schools. Then there is Sail Melbourne regatta to run. (Oh. Sorry. You dont sail in it so why should you contribute). Then the admin for YV handicaps (ex VYC dinghies handicaps that you don't have any part of) Then they represent all sailors in Victoria when it comes to dealing with MSV trying to introduce new regulations that WILL IMPACT ON YOU. I suppose you think that all the people in the office are only working there 40 hours a week for the love of the sport, not for wages.

You are the kind of guys who would object to your taxes being spent on some govt. project up north or out west because you get no visible benefit for it.

 

I ask again - what do they do for joe average??? A fucking whole lot more than you think. If YOU got involved in running affairs in sailing then you might find out.

 

It's NOT a business. They're certainly NOT pocketing any money out of it as your post suggests.

 

I'm not sure but I think Sail Melbourne is fiscally independant of YV, though run out of the same office,

 

 

Another reply for you Johhnny saint - I have been down to the yv office and i do believe they are busy - but as the post from Tassie (and others) we are not sure with what - they won't tell us anything and it seems ( only my opinion ) that 5% may benefit and the other 95% do not even get birhtday card - shit - my daughter even gets a card from Bendigo Bank twice a year. As for the training boats etc - why do we never hear or see these, I am yet to see them at several clubs, maybe I am always in the wrong spot at the wrong time. Sail Melbourne regatta - who are you to say you know I do not sail in this regatta - Saints are not meant to lie - you should - as I said earlier about most things you talk about - get up to speed on your facts and learn the truth, or you just don't ever want to learn the truth, why bother with facts when you can just spew bullshit.

Again,love of the sport and helping young and impaired sailors - you have no clue what I have done - nor will you ever, but as for me being the type of person who has to receive a benefit - visible, tangable or financial - you as always are way off track.

Shareholders are entitled to question the CEO of companies in an open forum - this is what happens in the real world - the "employees" are reportable to all members.

 

Maybe you should take a walk down the Yelow brick road and have a look at where the rest of us play - I don't think we are in Kansas anymore.

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YA almost needs its own thread.

 

On the subject of IRC, I understand YA has/will made a move that will make it compulsory for all yachts wanting to compete offshore to have an IRC cert. The cash cow grows. :(

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Regarding the YA/YV memberships.

Up until last year, you could nominate a 'primary' club, and your affiliation fee would be paid only by that club. (and thus extracted from you by that club)

And i believe the fee goes to YA, not YV.

 

They have changed the structure - now they charge all clubs a fee based on their member numbers - different brackets have different fees. The net result being that you will be paying a fee to YA for every club you are a member of.

Easier for them to administer, but probably more expensive for the yachtie.

 

I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

It would be unlikely that your second membership would tip a clubs membership over into the next "band"

The club collects (or not) that figure from their members as they see fit. If you're paying it twice, one of your clubs is ripping you off.

Where it fell down is that some clubs (especially in QLD) returned higher numbers (to make themselves seem more important) & were stung with a higher charge.

I don't think YA ever intended to collect twice from every sailor. I do think YA want to know as close as possible, how many sailors they've got out there.

 

Personally, I don't think the "banding system" is a success. The previous system wasn't working because a few clubs were collecting the Silver Card fees and not passing it on to their MYA. THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT.

 

 

Well Johnny Saint - you seem to know all - If you did support more than one club (being a member and financially supporting) a club is the best thing you can do for it - you would or should know that what you say is CRAP - and that'a a fact.

You are 100% correct about the clubs memberships numbers dictate how much they pay in fees - fees which I am favour of paying - where you are 100% wrong is when you think that one club is ripping you off by charging you a second time. Listen - the FACT is - YA/YV charge the clubs per member - the clubs then divide this charge by their member base and "on charge" EACH member an arrived at figure. IF YOU SUPPORT MULTIPLE CLUBS YOU PAY MULTIPLE TIMES - if the secordary (thirdary!!) clubs do not pass this cost on the the end user (multiple member) they are stiffed with the bill!!!

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - which would see any multiple members having to more costs at some clubs.

 

It cannot be easier to understand - the above is fact - if you just want to maintain your beliefs and do not want to know the truth - fine by me, but stop all this bullshit you spew out and take the time to get the truth.

 

If you don't want to believe in reality - take a walk off the edge of the earth - you still believe it's flat - right !!!

 

Have you finished spewing your vitriol all over the place?

 

Now, your secondary club, if they are doing things right,should include YOU as a "paid affiliation fee elswhere" member with your Silver card number.

 

If they haven't done that they are falling down on the job.

 

If you haven't supplied that number then what the fuck are you complaining about. It's YOUR OWN FUCKING FAULT.

 

I do not know it all but I know that I or my clubs (only 1 now) did not pay it twice.

 

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - ----

That is exactly what I said. Read my original post.

 

 

Johhny Johnny Johnny - Again - you go on with your knowledge of what to do based on the "good book of Johnny" take a lesson from your own posts, you state that you are only a member of 1 club (by the way kudos on being a member - and I DO mean that - there are many other who "pretend, so good on you!!) but go down to or at least contact the YA/YV/YQLD and find out the facts - I did and this is what I wirte my comments on - the facts as told by me face to face (yes I have meet) by the head of YV.

 

The clubs are billed - if I don't pay - the club does. Also if I got the bit about the clubs fudging figures - I guess you mean the clubs under estimated their membership - I understand - but over or under - multiple members still have to pay - it is only the ammount that changes not the amoount of times you pay for the same "based" membership.

 

I am getting tired now - you do some homework - with the facts this time - thing I'll sit down for a while!!!

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PHB - You are right - although not 100% sure that this has only been the case this year, I think it has been at least 2 maybe 3, but whatever you are correct. It is way easier for them to admin. but IS an added expense to the yachtie.

Still no word on all the fantastic things they YV do for the average yachtie

You mention less expense to them - just take postage - a few years ago YV had to send out 25k of invoices,stamps alone $12k plus if you have been part of a large mailout - all other expenses + labour costs then to admin all of this !!!!!

 

Now 28 invoices $14.oo in postage ( saving approx $12,ooo.oo ) + all admin and affilated costs - not mentioning that from what I have been told - most of, if not all clubs pay this account propmtly therefore not forcing extra admin follow up costs.

 

It all seems petty until you sit down and figure what is going "out the door" and what you are getting back in return - and unfortunately this is nearly always done when it is all to late and the business or sport has folded and the fat cats who ran it into the ground just walk out and into another perk without a care about the pile of shit they have left behind.

 

Think I'm out there and just bangin"on - Head of telstra - I can't even remember the payout it was so big - Macquarie Bank - How many boys in the pig trough sucking it out - Bonds - lady muck and her 2m.

I have nothing against people making shitloads of money but as long as the business goes up with them, and they earn thier keep.

 

 

 

Any takers.

 

I presume you know where the YV office is (they have to pay rent for it, it's not free). I'ts not out of bounds. Go down there and have a look one day. You might be surprised how much actually goes on in that pokey little place. Then they have the training boats that they take all over the state, introducing & teaching kids sailing at various schools. Then there is Sail Melbourne regatta to run. (Oh. Sorry. You dont sail in it so why should you contribute). Then the admin for YV handicaps (ex VYC dinghies handicaps that you don't have any part of) Then they represent all sailors in Victoria when it comes to dealing with MSV trying to introduce new regulations that WILL IMPACT ON YOU. I suppose you think that all the people in the office are only working there 40 hours a week for the love of the sport, not for wages.

You are the kind of guys who would object to your taxes being spent on some govt. project up north or out west because you get no visible benefit for it.

 

I ask again - what do they do for joe average??? A fucking whole lot more than you think. If YOU got involved in running affairs in sailing then you might find out.

 

It's NOT a business. They're certainly NOT pocketing any money out of it as your post suggests.

 

I'm not sure but I think Sail Melbourne is fiscally independant of YV, though run out of the same office,

 

 

Another reply for you Johhnny saint - I have been down to the yv office and i do believe they are busy - but as the post from Tassie (and others) we are not sure with what - they won't tell us anything and it seems ( only my opinion ) that 5% may benefit and the other 95% do not even get birhtday card - shit - my daughter even gets a card from Bendigo Bank twice a year. As for the training boats etc - why do we never hear or see these, I am yet to see them at several clubs, maybe I am always in the wrong spot at the wrong time. Sail Melbourne regatta - who are you to say you know I do not sail in this regatta - Saints are not meant to lie - you should - as I said earlier about most things you talk about - get up to speed on your facts and learn the truth, or you just don't ever want to learn the truth, why bother with facts when you can just spew bullshit.Again,love of the sport and helping young and impaired sailors - you have no clue what I have done - nor will you ever, but as for me being the type of person who has to receive a benefit - visible, tangable or financial - you as always are way off track.

Shareholders are entitled to question the CEO of companies in an open forum - this is what happens in the real world - the "employees" are reportable to all members.

 

Maybe you should take a walk down the Yelow brick road and have a look at where the rest of us play - I don't think we are in Kansas anymore.

 

Admirable that you are involved in helping young and impaired sailors. YV does that as you should know.

 

You're from Melbourne. If you want to know if I know the truth or not or talk bullshit, just ask around. My ID is not a secret.

 

You've really got a chip on your shoulder.

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Regarding the YA/YV memberships.

Up until last year, you could nominate a 'primary' club, and your affiliation fee would be paid only by that club. (and thus extracted from you by that club)

And i believe the fee goes to YA, not YV.

 

They have changed the structure - now they charge all clubs a fee based on their member numbers - different brackets have different fees. The net result being that you will be paying a fee to YA for every club you are a member of.

Easier for them to administer, but probably more expensive for the yachtie.

 

I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

It would be unlikely that your second membership would tip a clubs membership over into the next "band"

The club collects (or not) that figure from their members as they see fit. If you're paying it twice, one of your clubs is ripping you off.

Where it fell down is that some clubs (especially in QLD) returned higher numbers (to make themselves seem more important) & were stung with a higher charge.

I don't think YA ever intended to collect twice from every sailor. I do think YA want to know as close as possible, how many sailors they've got out there.

 

Personally, I don't think the "banding system" is a success. The previous system wasn't working because a few clubs were collecting the Silver Card fees and not passing it on to their MYA. THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT.

 

 

Well Johnny Saint - you seem to know all - If you did support more than one club (being a member and financially supporting) a club is the best thing you can do for it - you would or should know that what you say is CRAP - and that'a a fact.

You are 100% correct about the clubs memberships numbers dictate how much they pay in fees - fees which I am favour of paying - where you are 100% wrong is when you think that one club is ripping you off by charging you a second time. Listen - the FACT is - YA/YV charge the clubs per member - the clubs then divide this charge by their member base and "on charge" EACH member an arrived at figure. IF YOU SUPPORT MULTIPLE CLUBS YOU PAY MULTIPLE TIMES - if the secordary (thirdary!!) clubs do not pass this cost on the the end user (multiple member) they are stiffed with the bill!!!

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - which would see any multiple members having to more costs at some clubs.

 

It cannot be easier to understand - the above is fact - if you just want to maintain your beliefs and do not want to know the truth - fine by me, but stop all this bullshit you spew out and take the time to get the truth.

 

If you don't want to believe in reality - take a walk off the edge of the earth - you still believe it's flat - right !!!

 

Have you finished spewing your vitriol all over the place?

 

Now, your secondary club, if they are doing things right,should include YOU as a "paid affiliation fee elswhere" member with your Silver card number.

 

If they haven't done that they are falling down on the job.

 

If you haven't supplied that number then what the fuck are you complaining about. It's YOUR OWN FUCKING FAULT.

 

I do not know it all but I know that I or my clubs (only 1 now) did not pay it twice.

 

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - ----

That is exactly what I said. Read my original post.

 

 

Johhny Johnny Johnny - Again - you go on with your knowledge of what to do based on the "good book of Johnny" take a lesson from your own posts, you state that you are only a member of 1 club (by the way kudos on being a member - and I DO mean that - there are many other who "pretend, so good on you!!) but go down to or at least contact the YA/YV/YQLD and find out the facts - I did and this is what I wirte my comments on - the facts as told by me face to face (yes I have meet) by the head of YV.

 

The clubs are billed - if I don't pay - the club does. Also if I got the bit about the clubs fudging figures - I guess you mean the clubs under estimated their membership - I understand - but over or under - multiple members still have to pay - it is only the ammount that changes not the amoount of times you pay for the same "based" membership.

 

I am getting tired now - you do some homework - with the facts this time - thing I'll sit down for a while!!!

 

I've been (and still are) a member of BRYC for over 50 years. I was until very recently a member of a club in QLD. I never paid affiliation fees twice in ANY year. My clubs knew how to deal with it.

 

As I stated in an earlier post, some clubs (in QLD) overstated their memberships at the beginning of the banding system. Made them seem bigger than they really were. Then they got a shock when YQ believed them and sent them a big bill.

 

It's up to your club to sort out their records. not YV to sort out your clubs records.

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YA almost needs its own thread.

 

On the subject of IRC, I understand YA has/will made a move that will make it compulsory for all yachts wanting to compete offshore to have an IRC cert. The cash cow grows. :(

 

 

Hey phb - the cow does grow, I do not mind it growing or how much the feed costs, if it is doing the right thing - kudos to it, I just want to know am I ever going to taste or see a steak or am I going go continue to have soy milk.

 

Can we do something with Johnnysaint ?? He is harder to get an answer out of than YV !!!! Remember - we run IRC - oh hang about no we don't (now that someone asked them something that they didn't understand) they come back we just sort of do a bit of admin for them !!!

No care - no responsibility.

 

I know they do some good - I just wish I understood what !! And I don't think I'm alone.

 

Cheers to you and fair sailing

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YA almost needs its own thread.

 

On the subject of IRC, I understand YA has/will made a move that will make it compulsory for all yachts wanting to compete offshore to have an IRC cert. The cash cow grows. :(

 

I would say that is all about stability factors, which is a safety issue. Probably cheaper than getting a surveyor to do the required stability test, and from experience thats a bit of a drag. Not sure though.

 

Edit. I was required to get an IMS certificate for my boat to enter the '94 Hobart. If I had entered PHF I still had to have stability proof. Either an IOR cert (which did not have a division) or IMS.

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YA almost needs its own thread.

 

On the subject of IRC, I understand YA has/will made a move that will make it compulsory for all yachts wanting to compete offshore to have an IRC cert. The cash cow grows. :(

 

I would say that is all about stability factors, which is a safety issue. Probably cheaper than getting a surveyor to do the required stability test, and from experience thats a bit of a drag. Not sure though.

 

Edit. I was required to get an IMS certificate for my boat to enter the '94 Hobart. If I had entered PHF I still had to have stability proof. Either an IOR cert (which did not have a division) or IMS.

Yeah, it's about stability. The change is they'll no longer accept an IMS cert from a sister ship, so you'll need your own IMS cert - and who has one of those these days. And yes, too expensive to get IMS measured.

So you'll need a current IRC. What would be wrong with the stability rating from last year's IRC, if nothing was changed ?

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Regarding the YA/YV memberships.

Up until last year, you could nominate a 'primary' club, and your affiliation fee would be paid only by that club. (and thus extracted from you by that club)

And i believe the fee goes to YA, not YV.

 

They have changed the structure - now they charge all clubs a fee based on their member numbers - different brackets have different fees. The net result being that you will be paying a fee to YA for every club you are a member of.

Easier for them to administer, but probably more expensive for the yachtie.

 

I'm not sure how it works but I believe it's the "banding system".

A club with say 50 to 99 members pays a set figure.

A club with 100 to say 199 members pays a higher set figure... and so on.

It would be unlikely that your second membership would tip a clubs membership over into the next "band"

The club collects (or not) that figure from their members as they see fit. If you're paying it twice, one of your clubs is ripping you off.

Where it fell down is that some clubs (especially in QLD) returned higher numbers (to make themselves seem more important) & were stung with a higher charge.

I don't think YA ever intended to collect twice from every sailor. I do think YA want to know as close as possible, how many sailors they've got out there.

 

Personally, I don't think the "banding system" is a success. The previous system wasn't working because a few clubs were collecting the Silver Card fees and not passing it on to their MYA. THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT.

 

 

Well Johnny Saint - you seem to know all - If you did support more than one club (being a member and financially supporting) a club is the best thing you can do for it - you would or should know that what you say is CRAP - and that'a a fact.

You are 100% correct about the clubs memberships numbers dictate how much they pay in fees - fees which I am favour of paying - where you are 100% wrong is when you think that one club is ripping you off by charging you a second time. Listen - the FACT is - YA/YV charge the clubs per member - the clubs then divide this charge by their member base and "on charge" EACH member an arrived at figure. IF YOU SUPPORT MULTIPLE CLUBS YOU PAY MULTIPLE TIMES - if the secordary (thirdary!!) clubs do not pass this cost on the the end user (multiple member) they are stiffed with the bill!!!

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - which would see any multiple members having to more costs at some clubs.

 

It cannot be easier to understand - the above is fact - if you just want to maintain your beliefs and do not want to know the truth - fine by me, but stop all this bullshit you spew out and take the time to get the truth.

 

If you don't want to believe in reality - take a walk off the edge of the earth - you still believe it's flat - right !!!

 

Have you finished spewing your vitriol all over the place?

 

Now, your secondary club, if they are doing things right,should include YOU as a "paid affiliation fee elswhere" member with your Silver card number.

 

If they haven't done that they are falling down on the job.

 

If you haven't supplied that number then what the fuck are you complaining about. It's YOUR OWN FUCKING FAULT.

 

I do not know it all but I know that I or my clubs (only 1 now) did not pay it twice.

 

If as you say it fell down - by clubs fudging figures - this would only increase the charge from YA/YV to the club which would then only force the club itself to lose money by paying this fee from club funds or passing on a greater "per member" cost assiosiated to this charge - ----

That is exactly what I said. Read my original post.

 

 

Johhny Johnny Johnny - Again - you go on with your knowledge of what to do based on the "good book of Johnny" take a lesson from your own posts, you state that you are only a member of 1 club (by the way kudos on being a member - and I DO mean that - there are many other who "pretend, so good on you!!) but go down to or at least contact the YA/YV/YQLD and find out the facts - I did and this is what I wirte my comments on - the facts as told by me face to face (yes I have meet) by the head of YV.

 

The clubs are billed - if I don't pay - the club does. Also if I got the bit about the clubs fudging figures - I guess you mean the clubs under estimated their membership - I understand - but over or under - multiple members still have to pay - it is only the ammount that changes not the amoount of times you pay for the same "based" membership.

 

I am getting tired now - you do some homework - with the facts this time - thing I'll sit down for a while!!!

 

I've been (and still are) a member of BRYC for over 50 years. I was until very recently a member of a club in QLD. I never paid affiliation fees twice in ANY year. My clubs knew how to deal with it.

 

As I stated in an earlier post, some clubs (in QLD) overstated their memberships at the beginning of the banding system. Made them seem bigger than they really were. Then they got a shock when YQ believed them and sent them a big bill.

 

It's up to your club to sort out their records. not YV to sort out your clubs records.

 

 

I am very envious of your long and loyal membership and do hope that I can achieve your heights, and I again - I do mean this - may cap goes off to you - in relation to your past club - who knows - maybe QLD and YV do things a different way, I was a member of 3 Vic clubs ( 4 if you count assiosiate) which is now only 2 clubs and what I said is FACT, I had letters,emails and contless phone calls to YV and Commodores and Admin staff and what I am telling you is FACT. You say that you quit QLD recently, maybe this was before YV chaged their system - about 2 years ago, if ths is the case you would not be aware that things have changed - I did state this in an earlier post. You USED to be able to nominate a Primary Club, but this is now NO LONGER THE CASE. You pay at ALL CLUBS, and what I am trying to find out is how can the same person have only one membership card, get only one lot of benefits (sic) and be only one entity in the offical system and pay multiple times for that ?? There now it is simple - there is the question that I put to YV about 2 or 3 years ago and they (or anyone else) has been able to answer it? Maybe Johnny - you can?

Again - if your club in Queensland was overstating their membership (as I thought you meant ) and they did get a bigger bill for YQ - then this goes further into what I am trying to stop - then if the bill was bigger from YQ (who cares how - if the club lied silly them !) but the bill that the club had to pay was bigger and IF (which they would have I suspect) passed this cost on YOU - the members, you are out of pocket more than if YQ did it all themselves and said Dear Johnny your YQ fees are $40.oo per year (whatever) now that they have outsourced to the club - you no longer are a concern to them nor is how much you pay the club for this - they have their money from the club - you do not matter to YQ now - Understand. This is the entire reason why I was so pissed off with the deal that was struck - it was ALL for YQ/YV whatever body - and not for the clubs or the members.

 

I was on your side - but very few people understood what and more to the point how it was manipulated and just put it all in the too hard basket - and the gov. bodies are away laughing.

 

Take a breath and think about what I have posted - do you pay your RBYC fees twice just because one of youe other addresses is in Qld, or is that one of the same person!!

 

Also, why have the end of year function at an outsite venue - I visit RBYC on many occasions for functions and I know your club would have been a much better choice of venue, and I sure would have liked the money that went with hosting the night.

 

Think about it - that's all it takes to do more than what the gov. body does - just a little lateral thought at what would be best in the long term.

 

If it is not looked after in general terms and for the average sailor - trust me - in the future there will be no one like you with 50 years of loyal service to one club - there are plenty of things and clubs that are marketing very hard to get players,members and dollars from the public - I just worry that we are doing it all arse up.

Do you have kids? and are they sailors? Or have they been marketted by other more "in your face" advertised sports with more on offer for the average player.

 

One of mine has already - I don't want any clubs to only have a public bar just for members and memories in 20 years - do you?

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I am very envious of your long and loyal membership and do hope that I can achieve your heights, and I again - I do mean this - may cap goes off to you - in relation to your past club - who knows - maybe QLD and YV do things a different way, I was a member of 3 Vic clubs ( 4 if you count assiosiate) which is now only 2 clubs and what I said is FACT, I had letters,emails and contless phone calls to YV and Commodores and Admin staff and what I am telling you is FACT. You say that you quit QLD recently, maybe this was before YV chaged their system - about 2 years ago, if ths is the case you would not be aware that things have changed - I did state this in an earlier post. You USED to be able to nominate a Primary Club, but this is now NO LONGER THE CASE. You pay at ALL CLUBS, and what I am trying to find out is how can the same person have only one membership card, get only one lot of benefits (sic) and be only one entity in the offical system and pay multiple times for that ?? There now it is simple - there is the question that I put to YV about 2 or 3 years ago and they (or anyone else) has been able to answer it? Maybe Johnny - you can?

Again - if your club in Queensland was overstating their membership (as I thought you meant ) and they did get a bigger bill for YQ - then this goes further into what I am trying to stop - then if the bill was bigger from YQ (who cares how - if the club lied silly them !) but the bill that the club had to pay was bigger and IF (which they would have I suspect) passed this cost on YOU - the members, you are out of pocket more than if YQ did it all themselves and said Dear Johnny your YQ fees are $40.oo per year (whatever) now that they have outsourced to the club - you no longer are a concern to them nor is how much you pay the club for this - they have their money from the club - you do not matter to YQ now - Understand. This is the entire reason why I was so pissed off with the deal that was struck - it was ALL for YQ/YV whatever body - and not for the clubs or the members.

 

I was on your side - but very few people understood what and more to the point how it was manipulated and just put it all in the too hard basket - and the gov. bodies are away laughing.

 

Take a breath and think about what I have posted - do you pay your RBYC fees twice just because one of youe other addresses is in Qld, or is that one of the same person!!

 

Also, why have the end of year function at an outsite venue - I visit RBYC on many occasions for functions and I know your club would have been a much better choice of venue, and I sure would have liked the money that went with hosting the night.

 

Think about it - that's all it takes to do more than what the gov. body does - just a little lateral thought at what would be best in the long term.

 

If it is not looked after in general terms and for the average sailor - trust me - in the future there will be no one like you with 50 years of loyal service to one club - there are plenty of things and clubs that are marketing very hard to get players,members and dollars from the public - I just worry that we are doing it all arse up.

Do you have kids? and are they sailors? Or have they been marketted by other more "in your face" advertised sports with more on offer for the average player.

 

One of mine has already - I don't want any clubs to only have a public bar just for members and memories in 20 years - do you?

 

First. I am a member of BRYC (Black Rock) not RBYC.

 

From the YA website..........

"Membership Fees

4.1 Youth Cardholders and Silver Cardholders will normally pay their Membership Fee to their Club. Where a person is already an Individual Cardholder by virtue of their membership of another Club they may, on presentation of their Card or other evidence of Individual Cardholder Status, request that the other Club(s) recognise their Cardholder Status. "

 

It was not the club I belonged to in QLD that overstated member numbers. I was on the club committee at the time it was introduced.

 

You can no longer join YA or any MYA directly. The reason is so that people who want to race cannot avoid joining a YC. Thereby supporting YCs. That, and not duplicating Silver card membership is NOT "it was ALL for YQ/YV whatever body - and not for the clubs or the members."

 

I have no idea why the annual dinner (or whatever it was) was not held at a YC. Like you I would like to know the reason.

 

I don't like the current "banding system" but I do not know what to replace it with that will work.

 

No. I do not have kids (that I'm aware of)

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YA almost needs its own thread.

 

On the subject of IRC, I understand YA has/will made a move that will make it compulsory for all yachts wanting to compete offshore to have an IRC cert. The cash cow grows. :(

 

I would say that is all about stability factors, which is a safety issue. Probably cheaper than getting a surveyor to do the required stability test, and from experience thats a bit of a drag. Not sure though.

 

Edit. I was required to get an IMS certificate for my boat to enter the '94 Hobart. If I had entered PHF I still had to have stability proof. Either an IOR cert (which did not have a division) or IMS.

Yeah, it's about stability. The change is they'll no longer accept an IMS cert from a sister ship, so you'll need your own IMS cert - and who has one of those these days. And yes, too expensive to get IMS measured.

So you'll need a current IRC. What would be wrong with the stability rating from last year's IRC, if nothing was changed ?

 

There have been sister ships in the past, one passing stability, the other not.

 

Give John Anderson (YA measurer in Sydney) a ring. He's approachable. See what he says.

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Johhny saint - A chip on my shoulder is someting that I don't have - a sometimes bais to the wellfare and future to a sport a love maybe - I am not going defensive,I have said in earlier posts, we do need have an admin body and I do understand that this takes money, but the money has to be spent wisely and more importantly in the right areas - and the top of the tree is not always the right area, if you only concentrate on the top you soon won't have a middle or a base - and the base is the future.

 

Having the gov. body tell people that the best and fairest way to deal with a problem that they started was to cease with memberships of clubs that they represent is stupid - I would hope you agree with this.

 

I want the next generation to also be able to do as we have done, as I said in an earlier post - do you believe that in 50 years there are going to be members of your club with 50 years membership under their belts?

 

I pay and have no problem paying - I just want to see growth - I do not work for nothing - nor do I want to see anyone work for an unjust reward, but I do want to see reward for payment - there is a big difference.

 

Sorry if you think or thought it was a chip up there - A chip it ain't - a passion it is!!

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Johhny saint - A chip on my shoulder is someting that I don't have - a sometimes bais to the wellfare and future to a sport a love maybe - I am not going defensive,I have said in earlier posts, we do need have an admin body and I do understand that this takes money, but the money has to be spent wisely and more importantly in the right areas - and the top of the tree is not always the right area, if you only concentrate on the top you soon won't have a middle or a base - and the base is the future.

 

Having the gov. body tell people that the best and fairest way to deal with a problem that they started was to cease with memberships of clubs that they represent is stupid - I would hope you agree with this.

 

I want the next generation to also be able to do as we have done, as I said in an earlier post - do you believe that in 50 years there are going to be members of your club with 50 years membership under their belts?

 

I pay and have no problem paying - I just want to see growth - I do not work for nothing - nor do I want to see anyone work for an unjust reward, but I do want to see reward for payment - there is a big difference.

 

Sorry if you think or thought it was a chip up there - A chip it ain't - a passion it is!!

 

Fair comment. Maybe it was seagull shit I saw.

 

Again......

 

From the YA website..........

"Membership Fees

4.1 Youth Cardholders and Silver Cardholders will normally pay their Membership Fee to their Club. Where a person is already an Individual Cardholder by virtue of their membership of another Club they may, on presentation of their Card or other evidence of Individual Cardholder Status, request that the other Club(s) recognise their Cardholder Status. "

 

It's an issue you need to take up with your club.

That said - I do remember some confusion or misunderstanding about multiple memberships when the "banding system" came in. Can't remember details though.

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I am very envious of your long and loyal membership and do hope that I can achieve your heights, and I again - I do mean this - may cap goes off to you - in relation to your past club - who knows - maybe QLD and YV do things a different way, I was a member of 3 Vic clubs ( 4 if you count assiosiate) which is now only 2 clubs and what I said is FACT, I had letters,emails and contless phone calls to YV and Commodores and Admin staff and what I am telling you is FACT. You say that you quit QLD recently, maybe this was before YV chaged their system - about 2 years ago, if ths is the case you would not be aware that things have changed - I did state this in an earlier post. You USED to be able to nominate a Primary Club, but this is now NO LONGER THE CASE. You pay at ALL CLUBS, and what I am trying to find out is how can the same person have only one membership card, get only one lot of benefits (sic) and be only one entity in the offical system and pay multiple times for that ?? There now it is simple - there is the question that I put to YV about 2 or 3 years ago and they (or anyone else) has been able to answer it? Maybe Johnny - you can?

Again - if your club in Queensland was overstating their membership (as I thought you meant ) and they did get a bigger bill for YQ - then this goes further into what I am trying to stop - then if the bill was bigger from YQ (who cares how - if the club lied silly them !) but the bill that the club had to pay was bigger and IF (which they would have I suspect) passed this cost on YOU - the members, you are out of pocket more than if YQ did it all themselves and said Dear Johnny your YQ fees are $40.oo per year (whatever) now that they have outsourced to the club - you no longer are a concern to them nor is how much you pay the club for this - they have their money from the club - you do not matter to YQ now - Understand. This is the entire reason why I was so pissed off with the deal that was struck - it was ALL for YQ/YV whatever body - and not for the clubs or the members.

 

I was on your side - but very few people understood what and more to the point how it was manipulated and just put it all in the too hard basket - and the gov. bodies are away laughing.

 

Take a breath and think about what I have posted - do you pay your RBYC fees twice just because one of youe other addresses is in Qld, or is that one of the same person!!

 

Also, why have the end of year function at an outsite venue - I visit RBYC on many occasions for functions and I know your club would have been a much better choice of venue, and I sure would have liked the money that went with hosting the night.

 

Think about it - that's all it takes to do more than what the gov. body does - just a little lateral thought at what would be best in the long term.

 

If it is not looked after in general terms and for the average sailor - trust me - in the future there will be no one like you with 50 years of loyal service to one club - there are plenty of things and clubs that are marketing very hard to get players,members and dollars from the public - I just worry that we are doing it all arse up.

Do you have kids? and are they sailors? Or have they been marketted by other more "in your face" advertised sports with more on offer for the average player.

 

One of mine has already - I don't want any clubs to only have a public bar just for members and memories in 20 years - do you?

 

First. I am a member of BRYC (Black Rock) not RBYC.

 

* Sorry - My mistake, watched the Sharpies(??) over Christmas - good job I hear.

 

From the YA website..........

"Membership Fees

4.1 Youth Cardholders and Silver Cardholders will normally pay their Membership Fee to their Club. Where a person is already an Individual Cardholder by virtue of their membership of another Club they may, on presentation of their Card or other evidence of Individual Cardholder Status, request that the other Club(s) recognise their Cardholder Status. "

 

*While this is what they say - that's fine - but my whole point was that I can get out of paying, but my club still gets stiffed with their share of the bill - this is the whole point Johnny, the body do a double dip and say - well it's not what we demand, no not out of the left hand but the right one - mirrors and strings. Go and ask, if they say I am wrong - post reply and I will get refunds - and donate to charity.

 

It was not the club I belonged to in QLD that overstated member numbers. I was on the club committee at the time it was introduced.

 

* Never did I think you would be apart of anything illegal !!!!

 

You can no longer join YA or any MYA directly. The reason is so that people who want to race cannot avoid joining a YC. Thereby supporting YCs. That, and not duplicating Silver card membership is NOT "it was ALL for YQ/YV whatever body - and not for the clubs or the members."

 

* Good idea - and I understand the reasons for this. Racingata club as a guest / member or not still attracts a fee payable to the host club - not right to do I know but club at least gets something.

 

I have no idea why the annual dinner (or whatever it was) was not held at a YC. Like you I would like to know the reason.

 

*So would I - Bloody stupid idea.

 

I don't like the current "banding system" but I do not know what to replace it with that will work.

 

*I have a thought that is based on the old original system - if anyone from YV would like to hear it - . Sort of like most clubs subs are due Aug ( but of a guess with this ??) why not when subs are sent out - copy of members registered to that club for renewal is sent to YV - they then send out invoice to each member with invoice - with payment for Oct. Sailing season starts - no YV card - no results, same as showing you comply to a safety cat. Dates or times can be changed to suit the requirement. Makes YV responsible for there own actions and stops the double dip - makes it harder for them but as I see it - it is there job, not the clubs to chase up there mess.

 

No. I do not have kids (that I'm aware of)

 

* Best check, you never know

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Well Johnny, we seem to have quite a way - I do spend a lot of time (to much if you ask my wife) down at the beach and in boats, so it may well have been the deposit of a "shit duck"on my shoulder that you saw. God only knows that there is plenty left this on my boat to scrub off each week to allow me to race

 

As for your memory of "some confusion" when this system came in - this was the confusion - the multiple member and the double dip, it is still a problem as has been highlighted by our last few hours of time wasted postings. It proves that what has been organised is not working and never since the start has.

 

Anyway - I think that we both have a little better understanding of each others thoughts, I would still like to know something - you have been a member for 50 years - how many kids that you knew or sailed with 20-30 years ago ( when they were young - sorry youger, say 10 - 18 ) who would now be 30 -40 years old would still be sailing down there and /or members?

 

Even an honest rough percentage - if low - where did they go?

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er? No Sharpies over Xmas. In fact no races over Xmas.

 

From memory (a bit vague) when filling out the membership return to YQ, there was a category for members who had membership at another club and provision for their Silver card number.

 

I don't ever remember paying the affiliation fee any way other than with my club dues.

A MYA having to send a bill to every club member duplicates work (clubs have to do it anyway) and increases expense.

 

With all its problems, the previous system worked better than the current one does. Except for accounting for late payers (and there are always plenty of those) and new members joining the club.

 

The current system is based on last years membership figures.

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Well Johnny, we seem to have quite a way - I do spend a lot of time (to much if you ask my wife) down at the beach and in boats, so it may well have been the deposit of a "shit duck"on my shoulder that you saw. God only knows that there is plenty left this on my boat to scrub off each week to allow me to race

 

As for your memory of "some confusion" when this system came in - this was the confusion - the multiple member and the double dip, it is still a problem as has been highlighted by our last few hours of time wasted postings. It proves that what has been organised is not working and never since the start has.

 

Anyway - I think that we both have a little better understanding of each others thoughts, I would still like to know something - you have been a member for 50 years - how many kids that you knew or sailed with 20-30 years ago ( when they were young - sorry youger, say 10 - 18 ) who would now be 30 -40 years old would still be sailing down there and /or members?

 

Even an honest rough percentage - if low - where did they go?

 

A hard one to answer. There are several members who remember (& like to remind me) of when I was a "snotty nosed kid of about 5 hanging on to my fathers hand) who used to race HW Sharpies with or against him.

There would be maybe 20 current members who have been at the club longer than I have.

There are maybe a dozen who I remember sailing Sabots when I was sailing 14's about 30 ( or was that 40) years ago. There are maybe another dozen who were in my generation when I was 16-18, who I've known for about 50 years.

Then there are several who "went missing" for several years who are now back with their kids (or sans family).

Some that I bump into now & then, or hear about, still sailing, moved out of the area & joined other clubs.

There are some long time members whose grandchildren are currently sailing Sabots or Optimists.

All sounds a bit incestous, now that I think of the generations there.

 

ps. It's a continuing problem with seaguls on the BRYC balcony. Can make your beer taste bad,

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Blueveiner, are you aware that your silver card, issued by Yachting Australia includes a fairly comprehensive personal insurance cover, + discounts from affiliated sponsors?

I am only a member at 1 club, but if I was to join another club, I would quote my Y.A. number so that I wasn't billed twice, or maybe if you pay twice, you can double any insurance benifits and discounts, that would throw a cat among the pidgeons....

 

Personal Accident Insurance

 

Yachting Australia arranges a group personal accident insurance covering all silver and youth members as well as students. The insurance is one of the benefits of becoming a card-holding member of Yachting Australia and is included in the fee for membership.

 

By way of brief summary the policy provides the following benefits:

 

 

 

§ Covering all Silver and Youth Members and Students participating in recognized training

 

§ Whilst sailing, cruising, boating and participating in organized racing, or on the premises of Yachting Australia YA or MYA affiliated Yacht Club

 

§ Including whilst traveling overseas

 

§ Death benefit - lump sum payment of $75,000

 

§ Total loss of a limb or sight of an eye or quadriplegia/paraplegia – up to $75,000

 

§ Loss of income benefit

 

o up to $300/week with a 52-week benefit period

 

o waiting period one week and sick leave entitlement

 

§ Domestic help where the insured person is a non-income earner and requires assistance at home

 

§ A parental allowance where the insured person is under 20 years of age and is wholly dependant on his/her parents for maintenance and support

 

§ Medical, physiotherapy, hospital, dental and like expenses

 

o 80% of the net cost of such expenses, up to $5,000 limit

 

o net cost after Medicare or private health fund rebate

 

o excess $50/claim

 

 

 

The policy includes other benefits which are detailed in the full policy document. The limits currently arranged by Yachting Australia provide a basic level of support for members surrounding their yachting activities. The cover is not intended to substitute for full private health insurance, vessel third party liability insurances or appropriate workers’ compensation or public liability insurances subject to the terms and conditions of the policy and claims settling procedures.

 

 

 

 

In the last 12-24 months the following are examples of some of the claims settled by the scheme.

 

 

 

 

§ Blow to face – teeth damaged – $1,568 paid to date – further invoices to come.

 

§ Slip and fall – damage to teeth – $1,361 paid to date – further invoices to come.

 

§ Injury to ankle - $2,042 paid to date – further invoices to come.

 

§ Slip and fall – fractured front teeth – dental treatment – $3,671 paid.

 

§ Fall – twisted knee – $5,000 paid.

 

§ Fall – tear of supraspinatus tendon – $4,093 paid.

 

§ Surgery on knee – several months off work. $3,461 paid to date - further invoices to come.

 

 

 

Accidents are inevitable and the Yachting Australia Personal Accident Scheme is designed to swiftly reimburse Members for relevant out of pocket expenses and loss of income, as per the policy terms and conditions.

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Hey Walkabout, good to hear from you and kudos on how you brought all this information to the floor (?) I was aware of the insurance side of things but as said, it was great to have all the points laid out as a reminder of how good we are looked after, and what a fantastic comfort is gives all members to know that this policy is in place and working extremely well.

 

And also that it seems that when claims are made - they are dealt with in a prompt and professional manner.

 

FANTASTIC JOB - and to you well outlined.

 

But, I hope your insurance for your house is just as good - and by the way, do you pay the same premium twice? Or as you stated - let's say you did purely by accident - pay your premium twice - maybe you paid and your wife (a liberty I have taken to guess you are married, no point in not being unhappy like the rest of us !! eh !!) and god forbid - something happens and your house burns to the ground, does your great insurance company that does everything in it's power to help with legit claims give you two houses because you paid twice - or just one???

 

I am not being silly - just realistic - how can there be 2 entries and 2 payments and 2 documented cases for the 1 single entity? I understand that a body is needed and has to have money to continue and grow - but really when they take over and start to put the organisation before what they represent, and dictate to that sport -something must be done.

 

Everyone I speak to wonders why the pay, but they just pay - as I do - multipe times - most of what big sports groups do is to put money back into grass roots, the base and the future of the sport. People that want to get into it and learn something about it, these people are the sports future. We have to support within the group and fund people representing the sport and a lot of this is done "in club" by fundraising and maybe helped in part by YA/YV - but I see very little of grass roots. Most of the grass roots stuff I see and participate in is organised by the clubs. Junior skippers in big boats, ladies skippers, sailing in new design boats, try sailing days etc etc.

We have a sport that has a shocking perception by outsiders - it is only for the rich - all sailors are snobs and silver spooners - the sport itself's rules are like reading Mandarin and just as hard to understand - even by the sailors themselves - there is seldom any form of "public viewing" - and no offical venue or field in which we play. Try to explain this compared to tennis where you hit the ball over the net into this square - repeat - repeat - repeat!!

 

The kids are the future - and our future unless addressed will not have any Johnnysaints in 50 years - and may the gov. body(s) should have a good think about this

 

To you Johnnysaint - which club down your way had the Sharpies over Christmas - I thought it was the Nationals, it looked like it was off BR?

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I gotta tell you, I thought i was covered by the much touted YA personal accident insurance, but $5K maximum does not cover much if you don't have private cover. I am now seeking private cover, as i am currently out of pocket at least $5K.

 

So beware anyone who thinks they are 'covered' by YA's insurance - it aint enough.

 

Add to that the underwriter (in the UK) is currently out of funds and can't pay anyone at the moment.

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Hey Walkabout, good to hear from you and kudos on how you brought all this information to the floor (?) I was aware of the insurance side of things but as said, it was great to have all the points laid out as a reminder of how good we are looked after, and what a fantastic comfort is gives all members to know that this policy is in place and working extremely well.

 

And also that it seems that when claims are made - they are dealt with in a prompt and professional manner.

 

FANTASTIC JOB - and to you well outlined.

 

But, I hope your insurance for your house is just as good - and by the way, do you pay the same premium twice? Or as you stated - let's say you did purely by accident - pay your premium twice - maybe you paid and your wife (a liberty I have taken to guess you are married, no point in not being unhappy like the rest of us !! eh !!) and god forbid - something happens and your house burns to the ground, does your great insurance company that does everything in it's power to help with legit claims give you two houses because you paid twice - or just one???

 

I am not being silly - just realistic - how can there be 2 entries and 2 payments and 2 documented cases for the 1 single entity? I understand that a body is needed and has to have money to continue and grow - but really when they take over and start to put the organisation before what they represent, and dictate to that sport -something must be done.

 

Everyone I speak to wonders why the pay, but they just pay - as I do - multipe times - most of what big sports groups do is to put money back into grass roots, the base and the future of the sport. People that want to get into it and learn something about it, these people are the sports future. We have to support within the group and fund people representing the sport and a lot of this is done "in club" by fundraising and maybe helped in part by YA/YV - but I see very little of grass roots. Most of the grass roots stuff I see and participate in is organised by the clubs. Junior skippers in big boats, ladies skippers, sailing in new design boats, try sailing days etc etc.

We have a sport that has a shocking perception by outsiders - it is only for the rich - all sailors are snobs and silver spooners - the sport itself's rules are like reading Mandarin and just as hard to understand - even by the sailors themselves - there is seldom any form of "public viewing" - and no offical venue or field in which we play. Try to explain this compared to tennis where you hit the ball over the net into this square - repeat - repeat - repeat!!

 

The kids are the future - and our future unless addressed will not have any Johnnysaints in 50 years - and may the gov. body(s) should have a good think about this

 

To you Johnnysaint - which club down your way had the Sharpies over Christmas - I thought it was the Nationals, it looked like it was off BR?

 

Sharpies were interstate but I don't know where (edit; maybe Perth). Nothing run at BR over January. I14's in Perth. S80's at SYC post Xmas. Sail Melbourne off SYC & BRYC in mid December. Can't think what you saw.

 

Sail training ... The Boat Shed is YV. you may already know this.

 

EDIT- Just remembered Sharpie State Titles, 9 boats in late Feb. Is that what you're tinking of?

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But, I hope your insurance for your house is just as good - and by the way, do you pay the same premium twice? Or as you stated - let's say you did purely by accident - pay your premium twice - maybe you paid and your wife (a liberty I have taken to guess you are married, no point in not being unhappy like the rest of us !! eh !!) and god forbid - something happens and your house burns to the ground, does your great insurance company that does everything in it's power to help with legit claims give you two houses because you paid twice - or just one???

 

I am not being silly - just realistic - how can there be 2 entries and 2 payments and 2 documented cases for the 1 single entity? I understand that a body is needed and has to have money to continue and grow - but really when they take over and start to put the organisation before what they represent, and dictate to that sport -something must be done.

 

Everyone I speak to wonders why the pay, but they just pay - as I do - multipe times - most of what big sports groups do is to put money back into grass roots, the base and the future of the sport.

 

I see that you (probably like quite a few others) still don't get it. I'll try one more time.

 

The banding system is difficult to understand at first so I can understand why you think you're being ripped off.

 

I have no details at hand of the “banding” system, but this is how it works. The numbers are just a guess. ........

 

Your club has, say 100 members.

A club with 100 members falls in the band of 51 to 150 members (theoretical) and by being in that band is liable for an affiliation fee of say $5000.

If the club has 190 members it falls in the next higher band of say 151 to 300, and may be liable for an affiliation fee of say $10000.

Your club divvies that figure up amongst the members as it sees fit, and collects say $50 from each. (or more if they choose) A club may devise a different method of raising those funds, maybe thru a racing levy. That might work as its more like user pays.

Whether or not you are a member, say the 101st, does not change your clubs “band” so does not cost the club any more. Unless in the unlikely event your membership tipped the member numbers over 150 to 151 & put the club in the next higher “band”.

You produce your Silver Card at your secondary club and they should not collect any affiliation fee from you, nor include you in the list of primary members in their YV/YA return.

Your problem is that your clubs are collecting the affiliation fee twice (or more).

YV & YA are NOT collecting that fee from you twice.

Your club is not passing on the $50 / head, but the required, fixed, affiliation fee.

Your club could charge $60 per member, collect $6000, but is still required to pass on only the affiliation fee of $5000.

Your club can do whatever they wish with the “overcollection”.

 

Does that help?

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But, I hope your insurance for your house is just as good - and by the way, do you pay the same premium twice? Or as you stated - let's say you did purely by accident - pay your premium twice - maybe you paid and your wife (a liberty I have taken to guess you are married, no point in not being unhappy like the rest of us !! eh !!) and god forbid - something happens and your house burns to the ground, does your great insurance company that does everything in it's power to help with legit claims give you two houses because you paid twice - or just one???

 

I am not being silly - just realistic - how can there be 2 entries and 2 payments and 2 documented cases for the 1 single entity? I understand that a body is needed and has to have money to continue and grow - but really when they take over and start to put the organisation before what they represent, and dictate to that sport -something must be done.

 

Everyone I speak to wonders why the pay, but they just pay - as I do - multipe times - most of what big sports groups do is to put money back into grass roots, the base and the future of the sport.

 

I see that you (probably like quite a few others) still don't get it. I'll try one more time.

 

The banding system is difficult to understand at first so I can understand why you think you're being ripped off.

 

I have no details at hand of the “banding” system, but this is how it works. The numbers are just a guess. ........

 

Your club has, say 100 members.

A club with 100 members falls in the band of 51 to 150 members (theoretical) and by being in that band is liable for an affiliation fee of say $5000.

If the club has 190 members it falls in the next higher band of say 151 to 300, and may be liable for an affiliation fee of say $10000.

Your club divvies that figure up amongst the members as it sees fit, and collects say $50 from each. (or more if they choose) A club may devise a different method of raising those funds, maybe thru a racing levy. That might work as its more like user pays.

Whether or not you are a member, say the 101st, does not change your clubs “band” so does not cost the club any more. Unless in the unlikely event your membership tipped the member numbers over 150 to 151 & put the club in the next higher “band”.

You produce your Silver Card at your secondary club and they should not collect any affiliation fee from you, nor include you in the list of primary members in their YV/YA return.

Your problem is that your clubs are collecting the affiliation fee twice (or more).

YV & YA are NOT collecting that fee from you twice.

Your club is not passing on the $50 / head, but the required, fixed, affiliation fee.

Your club could charge $60 per member, collect $6000, but is still required to pass on only the affiliation fee of $5000.

Your club can do whatever they wish with the “overcollection”.

 

Does that help?

JS - it used to be the case that you could nominate a primary club, or state your YA number, and only pay it once. That changed, certainly for us here in Vic, once the banding system came in. Because YA no longer charge per member, but rather a flat fee per band, the clubs now levy it as evenly as they see fit.

Downside for members of multiple clubs is they pay 'twice'.

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