“COVID Is over” thread deleted

Burning Man

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You apparently believe in some chapters of my immunology texts, but not others of them.

I didn’t realize science is an á la carte menu, and we could just choose those parts of the topic we find pleasing or intellectually satisfying to “believe in”.

Waning immunity is part of the science, and has been demonstrated by observational studies of COVID. You can’t “like” natural immunity without also respecting the power of a complete vaccine schedule to protect you and society from viral infection and transmission far longer into the future.

In other words, you’re entitled to have an opinion, but your immune system could care less. A complete vaccine schedule provides longer-lasting immunity than any single exposure to the virus.

A second exposure to the virus is far more dangerous than a second or third dose of the vaccine. 
Yup.  I think these idjits also forget that many vaccine shots we've had either as kids or as adults typically require a booster at some point.  MMR, Tetnus, Polio, etc all require boosters at some stage.  

In a perfect world - we would require the Covid vax for all eligible by X date.  After that, we round them all up into quarantine centers, expose them to live Covid and let god sort it out.  Those that don't die will at least have NI and would be released.  And those that did die.......  well darwinism.  

 

phillysailor

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Yup.  I think these idjits also forget that many vaccine shots we've had either as kids or as adults typically require a booster at some point.  MMR, Tetnus, Polio, etc all require boosters at some stage.  

In a perfect world - we would require the Covid vax for all eligible by X date.  After that, we round them all up into quarantine centers, expose them to live Covid and let god sort it out.  Those that don't die will at least have NI and would be released.  And those that did die.......  well darwinism.  
Any effort to "round them all up into quarantine centers" strikes me as the absolutely wrong approach.

Far better to go after the sources of disinformation and out-argue them, defeat them with facts, even suppress or ban them in order to save lives and our country than to ban or imprison people. 

Ideas don't have inalienable rights, especially not during times of emergency. Fighting a pandemic requires some restriction upon freedom. I think we've learned at least that much.

 
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Burning Man

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chum said:
You represent a vector for a deadly pathogen to infect your family, friends, coworkers, healthcare workers, “essential” workers.

Not giving a shit about them is called selfishness, lack of patriotism, or just being an asshole.

Sorry, but I eventually get pissed off.
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It’s ok, thanks or the reply. If the vaccines work, and at risk people and anyone else who feels they need it are vaxxed, why does it matter? 
For exactly the reason PS posted above.  Because those of you who choose to not get the vaccine are a potential vector of the disease to others AS WELL AS a breeding ground for the virus to mutate into even nastier strains.  It is the very epitome of selfishness.  We mandate vaccines for children for the exact same reasons.  If you want to be an anti-vaxxer because..... Selfish, then at least do the rest of society a favor and go live in the woods in a commune where you and your elk are separated from the rest of us.  

 

SloopJonB

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Had to check... I've a few on ignore. Some pretty toxic trolls have graced these pages, and I don't need that crap in my life. 

Freedom of speech laws currently are interpreted only with the speaker in mind, but we are seeing a nascent effort to consider the rights of the listener as well. Disinformation spread for ulterior motives does not have to be supported by third parties. There is a difference between opinion and the deliberate misrepresentation of facts, and the existence of hate speech and extreme anti-social attitudes doesn't mean a forum must host such content.

Banning Trump from FB and Twitter has reduced the impact of toxic and misleading information used solely for his gain. He has been judged by private corporations to have encouraged an assault on our democracy, on Jan 6th but also throughout his political career. 

Having accepted some degree of responsibility for content, forums and social media hosts are molding our national conversation, hopefully for the better. America is an experiment, and this is just another slight modification upon her basic structure.
To put it more succinctly, freedom of speech does not mean a requirement to listen.

 

phillysailor

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chum said:
Isn’t there still a large % of your peers still hesitant?
Large or small, it's a frustrating fact that there is hesitancy and reluctance among those with medical knowledge and experience.

The mandates imposed by hospitals, our government and patients are having an impact upon compliance. 

 
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Burning Man

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Any effort to "round them all up into quarantine centers" strikes me as the absolutely wrong approach.

Far better to go after the sources of disinformation and out-argue them, defeat them with facts, even suppress or ban them in order to save lives and our country than to ban or imprison people. 

Ideas don't have inalienable rights, especially not during times of emergency. Fighting a pandemic requires some restriction upon freedom. I think we've learned at least that much.
Sorry, I should have used the purple font.  I assumed the idea was so "out there" that it didn't need an explanation of its sarcasm.

 

Nice!

Super Anarchist
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quod umbra said:
But, was it not Kamala Harris and those of her 'elk' that originally said they would not take a vaccine that was developed under Trump's watch?
Fake news. What she actually said was that she wouldn't take a vaccine if Trump was the only person telling everyone to take it. She would take one where medical professionals told us it was safe and effective.

 

Sea warrior

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I am in favor of freedom of speech, after all I have the right to not listen.

OTOH rights come with responsibilities. The classic tag line about free speech is that it does not cover yelling FIRE! in a crowded theater. Deliberately spreading covid misinformation is worse than that.

Trumpublicans are empty-headed but that's not a reason to flick them. They are deliberately destructive, and will work at destroying public good will, mutual trust, and any respect for boundaries of speech or behavior. At some point, it is justified and even necessary to flick them.

- DSK
Ironic post to say the least.

By your metrics The 24/7 false news coverage of the Rittenhouse trial by the left is tantamount to yelling fire in the theater and therefore you all should be banned.

And before you sniveling bitches accuse me of defending BB , I’m on record here calling the poster a POS racist.

 

Rain Man

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Wet coast.
Don't kid yourself - it's political here - just far less so than in the States.

We have our full and fair share of right wing morons.
It is true that we had one political party campaigning on an anti-vax slate in the last federal election, and they did manage to get 5% of the popular vote.  I maintain we should have recorded who they were and offered them free bus tickets to Florida.

 

Nice!

Super Anarchist
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By your metrics The 24/7 false news coverage of the Rittenhouse trial by the left is tantamount to yelling fire in the theater and therefore you all should be banned.
I'm incredulous at the fantastical leaps that must happen in your brain that you somehow believe to be logical.

 

SloopJonB

Super Anarchist
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Any effort to "round them all up into quarantine centers" strikes me as the absolutely wrong approach.

Far better to go after the sources of disinformation and out-argue them, defeat them with facts, even suppress or ban them in order to save lives and our country than to ban or imprison people. 

Ideas don't have inalienable rights, especially not during times of emergency. Fighting a pandemic requires some restriction upon freedom. I think we've learned at least that much.
Nice idea but when after many, many readings of their idiocy and ignorance and fanaticism it becomes apparent there is no changing their minds or waking them up to reality, ignoring them becomes necessary for one own mental health.

As noted in my signature, I am likely less tolerant of fanatics, fools and ignoramuses than most but still, of all the thousands of members here, I only have a dozen on ignore and several of them are mere trolls with not even real stupid opinions to express, only childishly deliberate shit disturbing.

 

Burning Man

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chum said:
chum said:
Why do you suppose so many of your fellow professionals are hesitant, Ive been taking my cue from them, for one.
Isn’t there still a large % of your peers still hesitant?
When you mean Philly's peers - are you talking about the entirety of the medical profession?  Because if so, that is a bit disingenuous.  The vast majority of the medical field who are "hesitant" are nurses or lower (orderlies, admin, etc).  Not Doctors.  The AMA says that 96% of doctors nationwide are fully vax'd.  And while you would think nurses would know better, I'm here to tell you that they are not always the sharpest spoons in the drawer.  You can have nurses with 2 year associate degrees (LPNs iirc) and RN's get some additional training on top of that but do not require a Bachelor's degree.  So nurses are not the most highly educated group out there.  They are great at taking orders, administering meds, cleaning shit off of hospital beds.  I'm not denigrating nurses.  My mother was a lifetime nurse, but she was in the minority who got advanced degrees and ran entire hospitals and LTCFs.  So if you're taking your "Cue" from the hesitancy of of the "medical community" - then you and others are doing yourselves and society a huge disservice.  

So I would listen to those 96% of docs who chose to become fully vax'd over a minimally educated nurse who struggled to decide between beauty school, admin assistant courses, or nursing.  

Just saying.  

 
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phillysailor

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By your metrics The 24/7 false news coverage of the Rittenhouse trial by the left is tantamount to yelling fire in the theater and therefore you all should be banned.
I'm incredulous at the fantastical leaps that must happen in your brain that you somehow believe to be logical.
I take issue with much of the crap the left and main stream news sources have published and said about the trial. I do believe an injustice was done to the people of America by labeling those killed innocent protestors, for repeating false claims about Kyle and the source of his gun, the legality of his actions and the culpability of those who attacked him.

I do believe profit motives including social, political and economic underlaid these repeated misleading headlines and arguments. Because it was BLM adjacent activity, many people abandoned their fair-mindedness and principles which would have otherwise guided their reactions. We should hold them accountable if we expect reiich wingers to do the same.

 
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Not My Real Name

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chum said:
What does winning look like, seasonal boosters like the flu shot?
Flu shots themselves are not boosters of prior shots.

Generally they are new vaccinations against viruses and variants of viruses which are expected to be prevalent in the upcoming flu season.

China is generally a few months ahead of the US epidemiologically, so the folks who prepare the flu vaccines look at what is rampaging over in China a few months before our flu season and make up a cocktail of those viruses most likely to be encountered in our season. Which is one reason you can get a flu shot and still get the flu - you may encounter a variant which was not covered in this year's mix or any mix you've gotten.

 

Not My Real Name

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If the threads are gone - it's most likely the Ed himself who nuked him.  He typically uses the "erase" button or whatever it's called rather than banning them from the site but leaves their content intact.  At least according to what I remember BJ saying once.
The "Flag as Spammer" button is used against individual accounts and removes all traces of their existence. I think it deletes them, all their topics, all their posts, and blocks their IP addresses in one single step. Not 100% on the IP addresses.

So if BravoBravo and his "body of work" is gone, then that is likely what happened to him.

When I removed people I generally only banned the account, and left the content up there unless if was extremely egregious.

 

phillysailor

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Unfortunately, some of those with the most fixed opinions countering the efficacy of COVID vaccines are physicians. They speak with a powerful voice, using the symbols, language and platforms of the profession to spread their opinions. It would be great if they fact-checked with leading experts in the fields of virology, immunology and epidemiology before infecting YouTube, Twitter and news organs with their approach to understanding the issues involved.

Unfortunately, in any group of individuals, some will transgress codes of professionalism and challenge established science without sufficient work, knowledge or expertise. But if "first do no harm" is taken as all important, doing the math of vaccinations vs the risk posed by achieving natural immunity should guide advice to patients and the public.

Its comparable to the risk required of patients to drive on a major interstate to get to their doctor's appointment. Yes, the risk isn't zero, but it's worth it.

 
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Not My Real Name

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Any effort to "round them all up into quarantine centers" strikes me as the absolutely wrong approach.

Far better to go after the sources of disinformation and out-argue them, defeat them with facts, even suppress or ban them in order to save lives and our country than to ban or imprison people. 

Ideas don't have inalienable rights, especially not during times of emergency. Fighting a pandemic requires some restriction upon freedom. I think we've learned at least that much.
You don't have to round them up, and that wouldn't be appropriate. But participation in society does mean you agree to certain rules and behaviors WRT the safety of the community. Right wingers have been whining for years when it's pointed out that there is an unwritten 'social contract' to participating in society. They claim they never signed it...maybe it's time to make them.

We've required vaccinations for school for years. Requiring them of other public access is not unreasonable.

So anyone can choose to be unvaxxed and carry disease. And society can say "You may not come in here carrying disease" to everything from airports to movie theaters and other businesses. Participation in public can mandate vaccination.

Don't want to vaccinate? Fine...drive instead of fly, watch your movies at home, use click & collect for groceries, shop for goods online, and keep the willing plague rats away from the rest of the population.

 
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