260 Mass Shootings 160 Days, When Will it be Too Much?

Blue Crab

benthivore
16,999
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Outer Banks
I'm sorry (not sorry), but I'm not willingly giving up my Big C rights for a [small] bunch of quitters who refuse to avail themselves of the myriad of pathways they can to get help to get over what they consider an untenable situation. Boo hoo.
My emphasis added.

On suicide, I'm not a stats guy but our suicide rate isn't high by world standards. stats And consider that authoritarian countries likely under report negative news as a routine matter whereas our own authorities finesse the crap out of every factoid to fit their narrative. Change my mind.

We all lament when a teen offs themselves becuz yada yada but on a nat'l scale there seems a direct correlation between aging and suicide with white oldsters leading the way all down the scale. 2016 data: old guys

(years)10 – 1415 – 2425 – 3435 – 4445 – 5455 – 6465 – 7475+UnknownAll
Males2654575588752946198574534633291234727

"White men account for nearly 70% of suicides in the United States."

Big whoop. And the older whites have more access to guns, by far, but also are "patients with chronic pain are twice as likely to attempt suicide compared with those without chronic pain." When the day comes that we can get an RX for a death cocktail, I'd bet gun suicide deaths drop to nothing. Takers?

I'm sure plenty of folks are against death cocktails too. I say we need a const'l amend allowing them.

Mental health aspects of younger people: "Studies have found very high rates of suicide in people with autism spectrum disorders, including high functioning autism and what was formerly known as Asperger syndrome. Autism and particularly Asperger syndrome are highly associated with clinical depression and as many as 30 percent or more of people with Asperger syndrome also suffer from depression.[57]

Those with ADHD are 3-5 times more likely to die by suicide. A comorbidity of depression with ADHD is the best predictor of suicidal thoughts in adolescence.[58][59]" These two kid groups may well be helped by applying more resources. Let's do it.

But let's also face the reality a) that suicide isn't homicide and b) life is not that precious ... we're constantly breeding biological animals. There are 8 BILLION of us so far many without adequate food or water. Koyaanisqatsi ... Hopi for life out of balance and a must see for realists worldwide.

We have much larger fish to fry than gun suicides. Guns are far more efficient for suicide. That is a feature, not a bug.
 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
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De Nile
OK, so what safety equipment should be required by government on guns? What is making them so unsafe for gun owners? Touching that you're so concerned about those who defy TeamD and own guns. Also weird that no gun owners seem to be demanding this safety equipment.

Um... which safety equipment again?

Cue crickets. There's no such equipment. He's just mad that gun (and car) owners are not held responsible for the actions of criminals. That's the only liability exemption guns get but let's see if Raz will admit that's the real objection here.
Biometric trigger locks to start.
 

Steam Flyer

Sophisticated Yet Humble
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It's curious that all remedies are too much of a burden of some sort or another.

It's curious to me how Burning Jeff can propose some solutions and then spin-spin-spin into a tantrum objecting to everything including stuff that hasn't been proposed.

Well, no, actually. It's not even a slight surprise to me. He's a born RWNJ even if he is one of the somewhat more sensible ones.
 

basketcase

Fuck you second amendment
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Its all an illegal gun problem. All we have to do is get rid of illegal guns. We can leave Jeff and Tom alone, if we could identify where the illegal guns come from. If we could only identify the illegal gun factory and shut it down....... Oh, wait.... Each and every last illegal gun was once a legal gun.
Fuck you second amendment.
 

Mark_K

Super Anarchist
It still doesn't make them "unsafe" machines. They work as exactly as intended. A trigger pull fires a single round - discharging a projectile downrange at a specified velocity. They don't crash, they rarely blow up, they don't catch on fire, they don't spontaneously break out of the safe on their own and start shooting down small puppies, children and catholic nuns. It has ZERO to do with what the tool was "designed" for. Any tool can be dangerous if used incorrectly and 100% safe if used responsibly.

It takes a human with a malicious heart to deliberately use that tool irresponsibly and unsafely. If someone REALLY wanted to be a mass murderer and go for the high score....... they would rent a box truck, fill it with gasoline and propane tanks and drive down the sidewalk on the Vegas Strip at 10pm on a Saturday night with a deadman switch to an ignitor in the back. He/she would get at least 100 in just the kinetic impact into the crowd. Probably 200 if you could get onto Freemont St on the Old strip. Depending on how far they got..... the deadman switch released and the resulting FAE explosion would probably take out 50 first responders.

But Box trucks, propane and gasoline are not intended nor advertised to kill. Yet they easily can. It's all about the human that wields the hammer.......
How many schools been filled with slaughtered kids by the purchasers of box trucks?
 

Fakenews

Super Anarchist
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Meanwhile things get worse wrt the cowardly police response.


Video surveillance footage suggests that police never attempted to open the doors to two classrooms at Robb Elementary behind which alleged gunman Salvador Ramos massacred 19 students and two teachers during the May 24 school shooting in Uvalde, Texas, according to a law enforcement source close to the investigation who spoke with the San Antonio Express-News's Brian Chasnoff.
 

Mark_K

Super Anarchist
So you're saying that battlefield .22's and other such weapons of mass destruction are suitable militia weapons?

I tend to agree. I think that inclusion in an "assault" weapon ban is a sure indication that a weapon should receive the highest level of second amendment protection. Of course, I read the first half of that amendment and think that militias operated outdoors, so I have lots of wacky ideas that are not at all TeamD friendly.
Depends on what Congress, constitutionally empowered to regulate the militia, determines. Could limit them to hash language if they want. Pretending all the people who want to play with military weapons are militia might not be a good tack to take.
 
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basketcase

Fuck you second amendment
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Meanwhile things get worse wrt the cowardly police response.


Video surveillance footage suggests that police never attempted to open the doors to two classrooms at Robb Elementary behind which alleged gunman Salvador Ramos massacred 19 students and two teachers during the May 24 school shooting in Uvalde, Texas, according to a law enforcement source close to the investigation who spoke with the San Antonio Express-News's Brian Chasnoff.
But I thought that good guys with guns stopped bad guys with guns.... Or that our kids would be safe if you armed teachers..... Fuck you second amendment.
 

Burning Man

Super Anarchist
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Back to the desert
Interesting how how lie your ass off.... deliberately... on something that's easy to check.... about suicide statistics; then call me a liar just because I point out you're making yourself look like a fool.

So, is your point that until there are no suicides by gun, there should be no restrictions on gun purchase? Isn't that like it's OK for cops to shoot black people because black people shoot other black people?
Can you translate that into English please? That was some authentic frontier gibberish. That entire post made zero sense.

Do you even read my posts before you start slamming on the "reply" button in a spittle filled rage??? Because if you had, none of what you wrote makes ANY sense.
 

Burning Man

Super Anarchist
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But let's also face the reality a) that suicide isn't homicide and b) life is not that precious

We have much larger fish to fry than gun suicides. Guns are far more efficient for suicide. That is a feature, not a bug.

Thank you, couldn't agree more. That was my entire point that suicides are not the same as homicides and adding the numbers together, essentially doubling the homicide #'s to make guns look like they are being used to deliberately kill others on that scale is a cunt move. And they all know it, but a tiger doesn't change it's spots. ;)
 

Burning Man

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Agreed. BM replied (as I recall) it's an unreasonable financial burden.
That, but It's far more than that. They are also unreliable and in the heat of the moment if something goes bump in the night - I want muh gunz to work the first time.

Also, at the range - most shooters let others try their gunz and vice versa.

Stolen gunz ARE an issue. But they are not the biggest source of illegal gun use. Also NONE of the recent mass shootings would have been prevented with this even if it was mandated. All of those shooters bought and owned their gunz legally and passed BGCs.

So yeah, the desire for the the Bio locks is just yet another financial and regulatory hurdle to throw up in the face of law-abiding gun owners to make ownership more difficult to exercise their enumerated right. Their theory is that if we make it hard enough and expensive enough - many will just give up on it. And the ones who CAN still afford it generally are not the ones shooting up Schools anyway. So yet again, the poor folks will suffer. It's ALWAYS the poor folks who suffer when punitive regulations get put up to deter people from exercising their rights.

It's absolutely no different than the morain red states who are putting up roadblocks to make both voting and abortion so hard and expensive that people just give up. The rich will still be able to vote and get abortions. But the poor will not. Sadly though.... the poor also need their rights in order to protect themselves. Probably even more so than the rich white guy. The rich white guy can always avoid the bad neighborhoods. The poor black or brown families are usually stuck in the high crime neighborhoods.
 

Burning Man

Super Anarchist
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It's curious that all remedies are too much of a burden of some sort or another.
100% Not true. I have offered numerous numerous remedies. Some are burdens on law abiding gun owners, but I think they are still reasonable. For instance, I have said I am in favor of ALL sales of gunz to go through an FFL to verify the backgrounds and suitability of the buyer and seller as well as determining if the gun itself is legal to sell. I am in favor of UBCs for all sales. And lots of other things like red flag laws, etc. I am in favor of safe storage laws and punishing irresponsible gun ownerz who allow their gunz to be used to hurt others. ALL of those are burdens on the gun owner. But they are reasonable and balanced (if the law is written properly) and don't deny ownership to those that qualify.

Others are not reasonable and are simply punitive and meant to be a deterrence rather than a good faith regulation that addresses the issues and improves safety. For instance, towns that require a "training" burden on the buyer/owner and then promptly close all the gun ranges in the city so there is no possible way to meet that requirement without lots of burden$.

ALL laws are a balance between burden and public safety. But there are obvious measures being proposed that are not intended to create a safer environment but rather to make the exercise of that right too onerous for many.
 

Burning Man

Super Anarchist
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Meanwhile things get worse wrt the cowardly police response.


Video surveillance footage suggests that police never attempted to open the doors to two classrooms at Robb Elementary behind which alleged gunman Salvador Ramos massacred 19 students and two teachers during the May 24 school shooting in Uvalde, Texas, according to a law enforcement source close to the investigation who spoke with the San Antonio Express-News's Brian Chasnoff.

Yeah. I'm generally pretty pro P0-LEECE. But in this case, I hope there are a lot of heads that will roll.

Furthermore, while I'm not a religious man even slightly - these situations make me wish there actually was a vengeful and spiteful god so these shits will burn in hell for all eternity. I do fervently hope those cops ARE religious, because they will most likely go to their grave dreading the moment they meet their maker. I don't think even the merciful baby jesus hisself will give these cowards a pass......
 

Mark_K

Super Anarchist
Yeah. I'm generally pretty pro P0-LEECE. But in this case, I hope there are a lot of heads that will roll.

Furthermore, while I'm not a religious man even slightly - these situations make me wish there actually was a vengeful and spiteful god so these shits will burn in hell for all eternity. I do fervently hope those cops ARE religious, because they will most likely go to their grave dreading the moment they meet their maker. I don't think even the merciful baby jesus hisself will give these cowards a pass......
THe article doesn't say what he thinks it said.

The instant damning of the police in this is something we should come to expect. The Capital police were similarly damned early on.

I feel a kinship with them because I trained to do that myself. I know the "common knowledge" the rule is charge all the time is bullshit, and those who claim that's how they are trained have never seen their training manuals or current procedures. I also know situations may not allow for the person(s) in charge to wait for all the facts before making a call. Drills are formatted specifically to test this, you have to be willing to make a call and live with it.

I imagine myself in that team in the hall. In full knowledge, from being tagged dozens of times in drills, placing my life on the line. Obeyed orders and saw the butchered kids. Went home and woke up the next morning to discover CNN has irrevocably labeled me the worst kind of coward, and any who say different are ostracized for even suggesting there might be more to the story that CNN's valiant reporters know. Can't live in that town again, it would be unfair to my family, who also catch the hell. It's something that sticks. Need a new career no matter how the investigation shakes out because it won't get covered much. It will be months away anyway, and the people of that town will be spitting on ya every chance they get. The people who scream obscenities at police in that town are depicted as fully justified.

Perhaps they were cowards. But we don't know that yet, we just think we do.
 
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