505 alternatives
- Thread starter toster
- Start date
Are you looking to race one, or just to have a fun boat to blast around in? You could totally buy an older generation 505 and have a good time sailing it without keeping it at a competitive level. Have you sailed a 29er with someone who knows what they're doing and seen how the sheeting actually works in practice?
Steam Flyer
Sophisticated Yet Humble
It's easier to get used to the off-boom sheeting than it is to save up the money for a better boat.
Besides, it's actually quite practical and being used to it will add to your sailing skill & enjoyment.
Besides, it's actually quite practical and being used to it will add to your sailing skill & enjoyment.
- Thread starter
- #4
I am looking to race and I have sailed a 29er quite a lot I just couldn’t handle the off boom sheeting for some reason there was a lot I liked about the boat however
PaulK
Super Anarchist
If you think maintaining a 505 is too expensive, why even mention 29er's? Perhaps there's a Flying Scot in your future???? 505 drivers are supposed to be light - you want a tall, heavy crew.
peterivanac
Member
- 329
- 25
Not sure where you are but if in Australia, Lightweight Sharpies are a beautiful boat, low drag and great fun. Some cheap ones around. And very low cost to sail competitively.
Liquid
NFLTG
Uhh OK? So which is it? Too expensive to buy or too expensive to own or you're too light or off boom sheeting is too advanced for you?
Couldn't handle it how exactly: As a helm, a crew or a concept?
If you want to steer and trim main I think there are a TONS of other slower, easier options....
If you really do want to race you'd be best to hunt down the closest fleets to you.
What do they sail?
Liquid
NFLTG
Foredeck Shuffle
More of a Stoic Cynic, Anarchy Sounds Exhausting
What did you not like about boom sheeting? I have gone through a lot of dinghies and have just started with skiffs, both of them boom sheeted and it is a wonderful change. Some of my old dinghies I would like to have boom sheeted with. If you want a 29er but do not want to boom sheet, I would consider figuring out how to put a block on the deck of a 29er. The nice thing about a 29er is it is uncomplicated to rig and fix, the parts are very standard and OD parts are easy to get, and there are lot of used hulls for low prices.
To put a block on the deck would require at least putting in a plate above with 4 screws for mechanical bonding and I would add 4200 to the plate for chemical bonding. Or put in an inspection port that makes it easy to access the point where the block will go and put a G10 plate under the deck to thru-bolt the block. What I've done on other boats is simulate the block being on a piece of wood that is pretending to be the deck. Put on the self locking nuts under the G10 plate with some glue, 4200 again, so that when you put the plate underneath, the nuts are already there to bold into and the bolts can be removed for maintenance issues. Can also be removed and the holes filled with epoxy and some white coloring and a pin prick of black to get the off white of the boat gelcoat if you decide to switch back.
I have had several 505's and currently have a 29er that might come up for sale soon as I'm considering two other boats. Single handing the 29er has been fun but I need a spare arm to go downwind. I'm going to let the kids at the club play with it for a while before I let it go though. One of the nice things about the boom sheeting is that there is no bridle or block below you to get tangled up in or foul the tiller extension with during a tack or gybe. I converted one of my 505's to boom sheeting, it was a good change. You are correct about the running costs of a 505. Keeping up to speed in the fleet and fixing the breakages is much higher than anything in that size range.
- Thread starter
- #10
My crew was had the most difficulty with it I was mostly fine with it just took some getting used to my crew is slightly to light for it he is a few years younger than me and does have some growing to do so that may change I am quite light so I couldn’t provide much help to him I could buy one but having money to do work on one would be difficult I could handle an of boom sheeted boat however it was just really weird for me and I couldn’t get used to it and as for my club none of them really do class racing it’s mostly all handicap (apart from the occasional nationals every year)
- Thread starter
- #11
I didn’t like handing the sheet to my crew (nether did he) taking felt really weird for me it was really the only complaint I had about it I did find some positives (lots more space etc) but I just couldn’t get used to it
Foredeck Shuffle
More of a Stoic Cynic, Anarchy Sounds Exhausting
Interesting. On the 505 the driver had the mainsheet as the jib/spin sheets and the pole launchers were the job of the crew. I found I experienced fewer capsizes on windy days when coming into the mark with the main on the boom, though it was always difficult to bring it in at the mark. Started doing more of the take down a couple of boat lengths offset from the leeward mark, then turning up to reach to the mark while sheeting in.
I cannot think of a reason a 29er could not be rigged with a deck block if properly supported underneath. I'll take a look at mine this week and think more about the stress loads on the deck and how to mount a mainsheet block without ripping it out of the deck.
Back to the 505, even with a brand new Rondar fully rigged, it will take you several years to get up to speed at fleet events. It's a very fun boat, but part of the fun is the complexity. A cheap, beat up Parker (common old, 505 hull, I had one, called it Battleship, it was primer gray) would be a good start. Often you'll get your hands on better boats before they are advertised publicly by being in the fleet.
Or convert a 29er. If you are young, I'd go 29er, it is cheaper and easier. Then go to the 505 later. Or maybe you'll find an old Parker and do both. Cheers and good luck.
- Thread starter
- #13
Thanks I’ll take all that into consideration
another 505 sailor
Super Anarchist
- 7,723
- 295
Where do you live? This is the most important question if you are on a budget.
There are no alternatives to a 505, but you might want to sail something different.
There are no alternatives to a 505, but you might want to sail something different.
- Thread starter
- #15
I live in the uk
Please don't ruin the the 29er with a deck block. It will just get in the way and make sailing harder and some light wind maneuvers impossible.
I jumped onboard a 29er lately to introduce some opti kids to skiff sailing and it took them not even a day to get to a level where they have fun and don't capsize all the time when on their own. The learning curve is much steeper if someone on board knows what they are doing.
If your crew is very light you might consider switching positions. An experienced heavy crew can handle the 29er almost by himself.
This is the answer right there. Get yourself someone experienced for an hour or two to switch through positions and that should do the trick.
I jumped onboard a 29er lately to introduce some opti kids to skiff sailing and it took them not even a day to get to a level where they have fun and don't capsize all the time when on their own. The learning curve is much steeper if someone on board knows what they are doing.
If your crew is very light you might consider switching positions. An experienced heavy crew can handle the 29er almost by himself.
- Thread starter
- #17
When I sailed the 29er I found it a nice boat to handle but the sheeting was uncomfortable just the angles felt all wrong (+my crew didn’t really want to have the main sheet)
Liquid
NFLTG
Best of luck.
That the angle of the sheet is a deal breaker is just...
Get 2 RC sail boats!
That the angle of the sheet is a deal breaker is just...
Get 2 RC sail boats!
Foredeck Shuffle
More of a Stoic Cynic, Anarchy Sounds Exhausting
If you could, please impart some wisdom my way?
Upwind I've had no problems and love sailing the 29er single handed. Downwind with the spinnaker up has been a bit of... ..a... ...mess? I've watched videos of people doing it and they always seem to be in light air and there are a more capsizes than is sustainable for doing it all the time.
Pewit
Member
Depending on where you sail, I have a left-field suggestion for a boat which is faster (on paper) than a 505, doesn’t have boom sheeting (because it has no boom), can be raced solo or two up and as a one-design class with a simple 3-sail rig, is cheaper to run. A Weta Trimaran.
It may be a multihull but it sails like a skiff with stabilisers - upwind at 12 knots and 20 knots downwind. Room for 3 adults or a bunch of kids (240kg max).
They’re hard to capsize but easy to right without assistance or effort, even in winds over 30 knots (I’ve done it).
Hulls are foam core fibreglass everything else is carbon, 20 SqM sails are Norths and it weighs 120kg. Self tacking jib (like the 29er) and twin tiller extensions for hands-free turns.
Contact Steven Harvey at Adrenawindsports for a demo sail on 07738 440841
It may be a multihull but it sails like a skiff with stabilisers - upwind at 12 knots and 20 knots downwind. Room for 3 adults or a bunch of kids (240kg max).
They’re hard to capsize but easy to right without assistance or effort, even in winds over 30 knots (I’ve done it).
Hulls are foam core fibreglass everything else is carbon, 20 SqM sails are Norths and it weighs 120kg. Self tacking jib (like the 29er) and twin tiller extensions for hands-free turns.
Contact Steven Harvey at Adrenawindsports for a demo sail on 07738 440841
