AC36 CLASS RULE

surfsailor

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^ I heard rumblings that there was discussion of walking back the giant spider monkey design concept - but that was over a month ago, and I subsequently heard from the same source that he'd heard wrong and they were still all in. Maybe the release of the full rule is going to be delayed while they sort out rig options?

Either way, April fools day is coming right up!

 
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~HHN92~

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^ I heard rumblings that there was discussion of walking back the giant spider monkey design concept - but that was over a month ago, and I subsequently heard from the same source that he'd heard wrong and they were still all in. Maybe the release of the full rule is going to be delayed while they sort out rig options?

Either way, April fools day is coming right up!
I heard similar comment last weekend from someone close to the action. More ominous than just 'walking it back',

 

surfsailor

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Giant Hugo Boss style carbon monos would be pretty cool...if it came to that. I bet EV powered canting could be juiced up enough for real match racing, too.

But something like that wouldn’t be faster than an AC50. Ever.

 

Tornado-Cat

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Because the Rule will continue to undergo changes at the will of ETNZ and LR, for 3 more months past April 1?
Yep, in the most favourable interpretation of the protocol because that follows:

52.1         If this Protocol is amended pursuant to Article 52 after a challenge for AC36 has been received by RNZYS but before RNZYS has accepted or rejected such challenge, the applicant may withdraw its challenge by written notice to RNZYS within two (2) calendar days of being notified of the Protocol change, in which case all monies paid by the applicant with its challenge shall be refunded in full. If the applicant does not withdraw its challenge within the two (2) calendar days, its challenge for AC36 shall be considered to have been made under the revised Protocol.

Basically, STFU or bail out.

 

nav

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Why is it that whenever it comes to a rule discussion - you get it wrong TC?

This thread concerns the CLASS RULE.

Yet your quote is concerned with changes to the PROTOCOL

The fact that you have misinterpreted the intent of 52.1 as well, comes as no surprise :(

 

Stingray~

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There are 28 occurrences of 'Class Rule' in the Protocol but here is the full text of 52, bold mine

52. PROTOCOL AND CLASS RULE AMENDMENTS.

52.1 This Protocol may be amended at any time by mutual agreement of RNZYS and the Challenger of Record.

52.2 Once published, the AC75 Class Rule cannot be replaced. For a period of three months after the date of publication it may be amended for any reason by COR/D but thereafter can only be amended by unanimous agreement of Competitors whose entries have been officially accepted at such time or when specifically allowed and in accordance with the provisions Contained in the AC75 Class Rule.

52.3 If this Protocol is amended pursuant to Article 52 after a challenge for AC36 has been received by RNZYS but before RNZYS has accepted or rejected such challenge, the applicant may withdraw its challenge by written notice to RNZYS within two (2) calendar days of being notified of the Protocol change, in which case all monies paid by the applicant with its challenge shall be refunded in full. If the applicant does not withdraw its challenge within the two (2) Calendar days, its challenge for AC36 shall be considered to have been made under the revised Protocol.

 
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nav

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Exactly, TCs mis-numbered misinterpreted quote has nothing to do with this Class Rule thread

^ Nothing new in there......all good and sensible, for transparency,  management of the event plus an additional clause protecting challengers from changes they may deem negative - made during their acceptance period.

No one is going to have to quit this time because of an ambush, a la [email protected]

 
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Tornado-Cat

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Why is it that whenever it comes to a rule discussion - you get it wrong TC?

This thread concerns the CLASS RULE.

Yet your quote is concerned with changes to the PROTOCOL

The fact that you have misinterpreted the intent of 52.1 as well, comes as no surprise :(
^^ You should care reading before commenting,.

"52.1 This Protocol may be amended at any time by mutual agreement of RNZYS and the Challenger of Record."

Alles klar ? :D

 

nav

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I'd have to read bloody care(fully) to see what was not there now wouldn't I

^ Larry's twin enablers - Groucho and Harpo.

He has retired by the way - did you not get an invite to the party?

Any boat

 

Tornado-Cat

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I'd have to read bloody care(fully) to see what was not there now wouldn't I
If you read you still do not understand. You want to detach the rule, discussed in this thread, with the protocol, but the prot supercedes the rule and :

52.1 This Protocol may be amended at any time by mutual agreement of RNZYS and the Challenger of Record.

Alles klar ?  B)

 

nav

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If you can offer nothing new or pertinent to this particular case Councillor, I suggest you sit down.

There will be something for you and Harpo to misrepresent and whine about anew soon enough........

 
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Stingray~

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I suggest you sit down.
You make a lot of suggestions about what a lot of posters should do, despite the fact that nobody pays any attention to those suggestions. Why do you continue? Sheesh.

TC made a reasonable observation that the Prot does supercede the CR, apparently including the ability to replace it completely.

 
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Tornado-Cat

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If you can offer nothing new or pertinent to this particular case Councillor, I suggest you sit down.

There will be something for you and Harpo to misrepresent and whine about anew soon enough........
You still don't get it, or you try to spin it ?

I can't comment what is not published yet, but I point out that there is no guarantee whatsoever in the prot for the competitors as the Defender- CoR can change it at will. Yes, they can change the paragraph of the protocol saying they won't change the rule after 3 months. Got it ?

I don't say they will do it, I say that competitors have no guarantee excepted for goodwill, and we know what it is worth in the AC. Good for sponsors, isn't it ?

And now you can come back with your relevant suggestions. :)

 
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Forourselves

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You make a lot of suggestions about what a lot of posters should do, despite the fact that nobody pays any attention to those suggestions. Why do you continue? Sheesh.

TC made a reasonable observation that the Prot does supercede the CR, apparently including the ability to replace it completely.
Correct Me if I am wrong, but isn't that exactly what happened with the 62? The Class Rule couldn't be changed unless by Unanimous decision, but the protocal superceded the Class Rule which was why the AC62 class rule was replaced by the AC50 Class Rule.

 

Stingray~

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Correct Me if I am wrong, but isn't that exactly what happened with the 62? The Class Rule couldn't be changed unless by Unanimous decision, but the protocal superceded the Class Rule which was why the AC62 class rule was replaced by the AC50 Class Rule.
Yes. That could happen this time too, ETNZ and Prada Steve reserving that same right. But this time, there is not even a majority vote allowed on a Protocol change they might pull.

’COR/D’ can be as wreckless as they want, other Challengers have no say at all. Would you call that fair?

 
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Tornado-Cat

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Correct Me if I am wrong, but isn't that exactly what happened with the 62? The Class Rule couldn't be changed unless by Unanimous decision, but the protocal superceded the Class Rule which was why the AC62 class rule was replaced by the AC50 Class Rule.
Correct, but as SR points out, there is no vote. It had been a very long time since competitors were given absolutely no rights. The hip pocket in his most ignominious version.

 

Forourselves

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Correct, but as SR points out, there is no vote. It had been a very long time since competitors were given absolutely no rights. The hip pocket in his most ignominious version.
Are you telling Me there was a vote before? The vote was a formality only. Whatever Oracle wanted they got simply because every other challenger was in debt to Oracle for some reason or another. It just means that Challenger of Record has veto rights, as was the case before the last cycle. LR gave up their right of veto once, and they were taken advantage of by Oracle and Friends, this time they retain right of veto, right to make the decisions for the challenger group as per the DoG. Mutual Agreement exists only between the Defender and Challenger of Record. Thats how the DoG works. Thats how its always worked.

 
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Forourselves

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Yes. That could happen this time too, ETNZ and Prada Steve reserving that same right. But this time, there is not even a majority vote allowed on a Protocol change they might pull.

’COR/D’ can be as wreckless as they want, other Challengers have no say at all. Would you call that fair?
Come on Stingray, are you telling Me there was a vote before? The vote was a formality only. Whatever Oracle wanted they got simply because every other challenger was in debt to Oracle for some reason or another. It just means that Challenger of Record has veto rights, as was the case before the last cycle. LR gave up their right of veto once, in favor of "Goodwill and working together" that was the reason why the Challenger committee was formed, to work together. Unfortunately after Luna Rossa gave up those rights, they were taken advantage of by Oracle and Friends, the committee instead of working together, conspired together to eliminate Luna Rossa and by association, ETNZ. Luna Rossa were then forced to withdraw. This time they retain right of veto, right to make the decisions for the challenger group as per the DoG. Mutual Agreement exists only between the Defender and Challenger of Record. Thats the way the DoG works.

 
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Tornado-Cat

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Are you telling Me there was a vote before? Yes

The vote was a formality only. No

Whatever Oracle wanted they got simply because every other challenger was in debt to Oracle for some reason or another. No, wrong, and why would have they gone against their own interest ?

It just means that Challenger of Record has veto rights, as was the case before the last cycle. LR gave up their right of veto once, and they were taken advantage of by Oracle and Friends, this time they retain right of veto, right to make the decisions for the challenger group as per the DoG. They probably did not understand the difference of vote between the prot and the rule.

Mutual Agreement exists on between the Defender and Challenger of Record.

Yes, but Ernesto and Larry did much better than TNZ.

 
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