Aftermarket Bowsprits

[DFG]

I am looking to add a bowsprit to my C&C 115 in order to fly a Code Zero.  I have looked at two alternatives - the Trogear Bow Sprit and the Selden tube.  Does anyone have any  experience or recommendations for which is more effective and simpler to use.  We regularly use a spin pole with our assymentric sails, so the sprit would mostly be used for the Code Zero,.

 

[RImike]

I like the Trogear, it's an all around better product that feels like it is part of the boat and is more suited to reaching conditions. The Selden is ok, the fit and finish isn't as nice though. 

The end of the day you are going to pay for what you get. 

 

[B dock]

I have had both on different boats.  I like the trogear better than the selden.  The on the deck pole and fittings just adds clutter and since you will be using it with a Code Zero you are still going to need a bobstay.  Depending on your deck construction I think trogear is stronger.  I had my trogear painted to match the hull.

 

[George Hackett]

IMHO.  If you race, do a proper bowsprit. J-Boat style or a TP-52 style.  You want projection to really get the Asy’s working well.  For berthing concerns, just make sure you can unbolt the sprit when not racing. 
 

if you cruise and maybe do a race, then Trogear types are the way to go.  

 

[Ultraman]

I installed a Trogear on an S-40 this year.  Well made product and a lot less intrusive on deck compared to the Seldon.  I'm set up for Syms and Asyms on a pole.  My Trogear doesn't go much further than the pole so was able to use existing A1, A2, A3 without recut.  Have dropped the pole for now and can sail 5-6 up round the cans vs. 7-8 needed for the Sym dip pole gybe set up.  I'm planning on adding a Code Zero to the set up in the spring.  Pretty sure I'll put the pole back on for any serious offshore work, but quite happy with the product.  Relatively easy to remove or flip it up for docking/moorage.

 

[Ultraman]

I installed a Trogear on an S-40 this year.  Well made product and a lot less intrusive on deck compared to the Seldon.  I'm set up for Syms and Asyms on a pole.  My Trogear doesn't go much further than the pole so was able to use existing A1, A2, A3 without recut.  Have dropped the pole for now and can sail 5-6 up round the cans vs. 7-8 needed for the Sym dip pole gybe set up.  I'm planning on adding a Code Zero to the set up in the spring.  Pretty sure I'll put the pole back on for any serious offshore work, but quite happy with the product.  Relatively easy to remove or flip it up for docking/moorage.

Couple of pics.  Sure it would be better if it was 6 feet longer, but would need new sails/re-cut and too much messing around docking.  Right now I back in and the prod sticks out into the marina.  Really should hang a round orange fender on it... 

If you go ahead and need some round G10 for the bobstay attachment, let me know.  Had to order a 5' long piece and used 6".  Drilling through the hull on an angle near the waterline is not for the faint of heart.  Measure a couple of times first!

 

[Irish River]

Couple of pics.  Sure it would be better if it was 6 feet longer, but would need new sails/re-cut and too much messing around docking.  Right now I back in and the prod sticks out into the marina.  Really should hang a round orange fender on it... 

If you go ahead and need some round G10 for the bobstay attachment, let me know.  Had to order a 5' long piece and used 6".  Drilling through the hull on an angle near the waterline is not for the faint of heart.  Measure a couple of times first!

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Use the sprit to gybe the assym and then put assym back on pole.  The kiwis did that way back in 90s in the IACC. 

 

[Ultraman]

Use the sprit to gybe the assym and then put assym back on pole.  The kiwis did that way back in 90s in the IACC. 

Yeah, definitely for long distance/ offshore/ fully crewed.  Basically this is how we were doing it before the sprit, just off the bow tack point.

PHRF-BC gives a 6 second credit for no pole and my sprit length is within the allowed amount relative my SPL and current spin size.  For shorthanded/covid-size crews/round the bay racing, just the little sprit has been great.

 

[DFG]

Thanks for the input.  Seems like you all have had good experience with the Trogear.  Given the limited conditions when you can use the Code, is it worth the -6 to -9 second hit to my PHRF rating that I would get?  

 

[solosailor]

Only once in a while.....   you'll pay that penalty all the time.

 

[Ultraman]

Thanks for the input.  Seems like you all have had good experience with the Trogear.  Given the limited conditions when you can use the Code, is it worth the -6 to -9 second hit to my PHRF rating that I would get?  

Round the Cans.  Likely won't pay.  And likely will pay to be able to pole back and sail deep on a C&C115.

Point to Point racing.  If you can get the Code Zero up, you will be looking great. 

I've never sailed on a boat with a Code Zero who thinks its a bad idea.  Especially with non-overlapping headsails.

 

[DFG]

Ultraman, I think you hit it on the head concerning the plusses and minuses of the Code.

 

[The Dark Knight]

I had a Selden which worked fine. Except I was cruising and when fitted it blocked access to the anchor locker

 

[sierrawhiskeygolf]

Thanks for the input.  Seems like you all have had good experience with the Trogear.  Given the limited conditions when you can use the Code, is it worth the -6 to -9 second hit to my PHRF rating that I would get?  

Does your local PHRF body permit a bowsprit of minimal projection? PHRF Lake Ontario permits an no-penalty sprit with length of J+15% which is gets the luff of a sail tacked ahead of the forestay to just clear of the pulpit. On my 30' boot the sprit projects about 21" and does not trigger a penalty. The Code 0 works fine on this length of sprit.

 

[EarthBM]

Use the sprit to gybe the assym and then put assym back on pole.  The kiwis did that way back in 90s in the IACC. 

Could you explain how? Once the assy is set on the sprit you attach the pole to the takline on the windward side of the forestay? And then remove it before gybing?

Also, I saw many triangular sprits like Trogear that didn't have Trogear logo and were slightly different. It doesn't look like a very difficult design - just get the angles and the strength right. Who else can make them? Any carbon fiber shop I imagine?

 

[Trovão]

Could you explain how? Once the assy is set on the sprit you attach the pole to the takline on the windward side of the forestay? And then remove it before gybing?

Also, I saw many triangular sprits like Trogear that didn't have Trogear logo and were slightly different. It doesn't look like a very difficult design - just get the angles and the strength right. Who else can make them? Any carbon fiber shop I imagine?

I'll give some old broken windsurf carbon masts a try . let's see if I manage do fabricat e "trogear" backyard contraption...

 

[Zonker]

I built a stern arch for my catamaran from old windsurf masts (not broken ones). The % of carbon varied a lot. Try to get at least 50% carbon or it will be too flexy. All carbon is great but seldom goes for as cheap. You can also laminate extra carbon uni and wrap with some biax carbon to add a bit more meat. Use the bottom part that has the largest diameter.

 

[Ultraman]

Could you explain how? Once the assy is set on the sprit you attach the pole to the takline on the windward side of the forestay? And then remove it before gybing?

Also, I saw many triangular sprits like Trogear that didn't have Trogear logo and were slightly different. It doesn't look like a very difficult design - just get the angles and the strength right. Who else can make them? Any carbon fiber shop I imagine?

1. It's a bit of a dance, but tackline and both guys attach to the tack of the Asym and they stay there.  Pole back with the Guy and ease Tackline (and Foreguy) to sail deeper when possible.   When going for a gybe, pole forward to forestay, tack up the load on the tack line, then completely off on guy.  Remove pole (usually remove from mast and switch to the other side of Forestay - depends on pole length).  Gybe Asym on sprit as per usual.  Attach pole to new guy.  Pole back while easing tackline transferring load to Guy and Foreguy.  Rinse.  Repeat.  Allows you to project the sail to weather more and sail deeper when possible if the wind is up.

2. Depends on what you end up paying for the Trogear.  I picked mine up on SA Classifieds (new in box) for $1500+$100 shipping.  We were about to manufacture a custom sprit for my S-40, but the person working me said there was no way he could make something of similar quality for anywhere near the price including all the hardware.  Trogear has the benefit of being able to easily remove or pivot up and out of your LOA moorage calculation with your Harbour Master.  Trogear is pretty simple in design, but is good quality in execution. 

 

[miketennant]

I am looking to add a bowsprit to my C&C 115 in order to fly a Code Zero.  I have looked at two alternatives - the Trogear Bow Sprit and the Selden tube.  Does anyone have any  experience or recommendations for which is more effective and simpler to use.  We regularly use a spin pole with our assymentric sails, so the sprit would mostly be used for the Code Zero,.

What did you end up installing on your 115?  I bought a C&C 115 this past winter and I would like to add a sprit so I can fly a code 0, but I'm up in the air as what to buy.  I'm leaning toward the Trogear.