B&G Zeus3, Triton2 and Airmar questions

[Ajax]

A few quick and easy questions for the hard-core set:

My old Datamarine speed/depth/temp combo went up in smoke.  I have a Zeus3 plotter. I'd like to buy the Triton2 speed/depth/temp package.

• When properly networked, can I display speed/depth on the Zeus as well as the Triton display?
  
• Can I later add a wind transducer, network it in and display it on the Triton and the Zeus without adding a 3rd display?
  
• This link: DST810 specs  shows dimensional info but does not show the width of the threaded section, only the mushroom head. I want to know how much smaller/larger the hole in my boat needs to be.
  

I'm not a hardcore racer so I don't need to stare at the wind information all the time. Simply toggling it occasionally on the Zeus or the Triton would be sufficient.

Thanks.

 

[Slick470]

The answer to the first two questions is yes. Once networked all displays will be able to pull and display data from any networked transducers, including wind. There are default and selectable screens to show the wind display on the tritons and probably the Zeus too, there is definitely one on my Vulcan. 

Not sure on the third question, it depends I guess. I replaced an old Autohelm speed and separate depth transducers with the DST810. The new one used the same size hole as the old speed so it was only a matter of cutting out the old sleeve and installing the new. I had to fill in the old depth hole, but that wasn't too hard. A lot of the through hull transducers are made by Airmar, even the older ones, so there is a decent chance the hole size will be close. 

 

[Slick470]

Also, looking at that dimensional drawing, my guess is the 2" - 12 threads call out may mean that it is 2" wide at the threads with something like 12 threads per inch, maybe. Again, just a guess. 

Just looked a bit deeper and the install instructions reference needing a 2" hole saw. 

 

[ryley]

it's a 2" hole. you can put any of the data from the 810 on any other nmea display including the chart plotter.

 

[Tom Keffer]

• This link: DST810 specs  shows dimensional info but does not show the width of the threaded section, only the mushroom head. I want to know how much smaller/larger the hole in my boat needs to be.
  

They are 2"-12 threads, so the hole size would be 2", yes?

For a cored hull, they have you drill a bigger hole, then do the epoxy donut thing, resulting in a 2" hole.

See the owner's guide: https://www.airmar.com/uploads/InstallGuide/17-435-01.pdf

 

[Ajax]

GTFO... check this- it appears that my current through-hull is an exact match.  I guess the old Datamarine transducers are Airmar?

The  "12" thread is 12 threads per inch,  right? If so,  I'm golden. 

 

[ryley]

GTFO... check this- it appears that my current through-hull is an exact match.  I guess the old Datamarine transducers are Airmar?

The  "12" thread is 12 threads per inch,  right? If so,  I'm golden. 

yes on the threads. It makes sense that even if datamarine weren't airmar that airmar would want to make something that is pretty compatible. I'm glad it's going to work out for you though

I'm installing an 810 this winter, we'll see how well it works.

 

[LionessRacing]

Think a bit about future expansion.

The basic speed, depth, wind transducers are pretty generic, as you have noted.

You WILL want a fluxgate such as the Precision 9, to augment the gps in your Zeus. And splitting the screen with chart and number panels is easy. 

a baroplug gives pressure and air temp, trend them on your Zeus long time plots. 

AIS IS a nice to have as an overlay, as is Radar and forward scan when you venture into thin water. 

Tying the data together for derived values such as TWA, TWD has benefits, especially when you trend them, to track weather. 

 

[Ajax]

And splitting the screen with chart and number panels is easy. 

Yes, it's easy but I only have a Zeus3 7".  Once you split the screen too many times it becomes like looking at an array of tiny cell phone screens.  While sailing to/in Maine, I set the screen for dual charts- The left half was zoomed in very close and the right half was zoomed out so that I could monitor my progress and overall position.  I was trying to avoid a "Team Vestas" kind of mistake.

Yeah, a barometer would be nice for ocean sailing to keep tabs on real-time weather. I already have AIS piped in from the VHF. Radar is in the plan. In fact, it would have been sooner if I hadn't fried half the boat's electronics.

 

[Ajax]

One final question:

This whole situation is an unanticipated expense.  If I were to buy the Airmar DST810 by itself, can I plug it directly into the NMEA2000 jack on the Zeus3 or do I still need the NMEA networking backbone and terminators?

I understand that I need all the NMEA networking stuff once I add Triton displays and other transducers.

 

[ryley]

Ajax,

you'll need two terminators, two tees, one power tee, and a backbone that reaches from your dst to your chart plotter. you'll need a cable from the chart plotter to the T as well, but the unit may have come with one if you kept all the accessories.

ignore the GPS. the box off 4 imagine is your speed transducer. it plugs into a T that is terminated. your chart plotter is at T2 and that is also terminated. you need the power T, preferably in the middle of your backbone but if it's a short run it can be closer to an end. Note that the terminators are separate from the T's so as you expand you can just add more backbone.

When I started, my "backbone" was essentially a bunch of T-connectors all together with the spurs running to the various instruments, but the system is a lot more sophisticated now and I have a proper backbone in the boat.

Hope this helps.

 

[Ajax]

Ajax,

you'll need two terminators, two tees, one power tee, and a backbone that reaches from your dst to your chart plotter. you'll need a cable from the chart plotter to the T as well, but the unit may have come with one if you kept all the accessories.



ignore the GPS. the box off 4 imagine is your speed transducer. it plugs into a T that is terminated. your chart plotter is at T2 and that is also terminated. you need the power T, preferably in the middle of your backbone but if it's a short run it can be closer to an end. Note that the terminators are separate from the T's so as you expand you can just add more backbone.

When I started, my "backbone" was essentially a bunch of T-connectors all together with the spurs running to the various instruments, but the system is a lot more sophisticated now and I have a proper backbone in the boat.

Hope this helps.

Yes, that's helpful.  Some networks don't require terminators if you only have one device, which is why I asked the question. NMEA 2k obviously isn't one of them.

Power:  For me, #5 will be the "Nav Instruments" circuit breaker, not the battery directly.  Yes, I can plumb power into the middle of the backbone. I'll buy a proper backbone to start with since I know where all this is eventually leading... (more gadgets)

Cheeze and rice... so I have to attach a T-fitting on the back of my plotter so that I can attach the depth transducer to one side and a "terminator" on the other side of the T?

Also, NMEA 2k is a standard, right? It doesn't matter if I buy Ancor brand or B&G, it's the same pinout, the same plug format?

 

[SimonGH]

Yes, that's helpful.  Some networks don't require terminators if you only have one device, which is why I asked the question. NMEA 2k obviously isn't one of them.

Power:  For me, #5 will be the "Nav Instruments" circuit breaker, not the battery directly.  Yes, I can plumb power into the middle of the backbone. I'll buy a proper backbone to start with since I know where all this is eventually leading... (more gadgets)

Cheeze and rice... so I have to attach a T-fitting on the back of my plotter so that I can attach the depth transducer to one side and a "terminator" on the other side of the T?

Also, NMEA 2k is a standard, right? It doesn't matter if I buy Ancor brand or B&G, it's the same pinout, the same plug format?

to the last bit -   Yes, most devices have standardized on the Micro-C connector (the round one with 5 pins and threads).  However, Raymarine has their own connector, and SIMRAD has their own.  The SIMRAD is standard N2K information, so it's just a physical adapter, and the Raymarine (SeaTalkNg) is predominantly the same, so again you can get adapters to go from one to another.  For Raymarine it's basically a drop cable with different ends (SeaTalkNg one end, Micro-C the other), SIMRAD has a line of handy multi-port connectors that replace all the discrete 'T's, so those are more adapters that allow you to connect a Micro-C to SIMRAD hub.

See the attached pic - this was the pretty complicated setup on my B 41.1

But for the most part, all the smaller third party stuff (think the gadgets from Digital Yacht, Vesper, ShipModule, etc) are all pretty much using the micro-c connector.

 

[ryley]

Also, NMEA 2k is a standard, right? It doesn't matter if I buy Ancor brand or B&G, it's the same pinout, the same plug format?

correct, although there are micro and mini cables and plugs. my installations use micro, which I think are the cables that B&G usually supply. There *is* a difference in quality and as I go I'm replacing most of the B&G cables with Maretron - beefier and better made - although I've only had one T-fitting fail.

As to the terminator stuff.. I do have two displays that are daisy-chained and they work fine, but it's technically against the rules. Maretron has a network-building app that you can download to plan it all out. 

Also, yes - definitely a good idea to have a breaker or fuse on your N2K backbone power supply.

Edit: As Simon points out, raymarine's seatalk is "proprietary," but you can actually cut the ends off and put a field-installable n2k fitting on it and plug it right in, or buy an adapter cable. the only proprietary part for all intents and purposes are the connectors.

 

[Ajax]

However, Raymarine has their own connector, and SIMRAD has their own.

Oh bother, are you saying that the NMEA2k socket on the back of the Zeus3 is a proprietary connector and that I'll need an adapter? 

The reason I'm bitching about it is because it's becoming a giant wart on the back of the plotter (adapter, T-fitting, dummy load terminator and finally, the network cable all hanging on a single NMEA 2k socket).

 

[ryley]

The reason I'm bitching about it is because it's becoming a giant wart on the back of the plotter (adapter, T-fitting, dummy load terminator and finally, the network cable all hanging on a single NMEA 2k socket).

well, you could terminate the backbone elsewhere and then just run a spur to the back of the plotter.

 

[SimonGH]

No the B&G connectors on their devices are Micro-C.

The SIMRAD stuff are the hubs in the diagram.  I know, SIMRAD = B&G.  So they use Micro-C on their devices (Zeus, Triton, etc), but the hubs are a different push-in connector.  I've not seen anything but an old 608 wind sensor with the SIMRAD push in connector on the device itself.  Go figure!

 

[Ajax]

No the B&G connectors on their devices are Micro-C.

The SIMRAD stuff are the hubs in the diagram.  I know, SIMRAD = B&G.  So they use Micro-C on their devices (Zeus, Triton, etc), but the hubs are a different push-in connector.  I've not seen anything but an old 608 wind sensor with the SIMRAD push in connector on the device itself.  Go figure!

Whew, Ok.  Thanks.

To eliminate the wart on the back of the plotter, I can run a Micro-C cable down through the pedestal guard tubing under the cockpit sole and connect the T-fitting, dummy load terminator and network cable there, out of sight and in a sheltered location.

 

[ryley]

To eliminate the wart on the back of the plotter, I can run a Micro-C cable down through the pedestal guard tubing under the cockpit sole and connect the T-fitting, dummy load terminator and network cable there, out of sight and in a sheltered location.

exactly.