Bieker rudder on a J/111?

Roleur

Roleur

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Orcas Island
Successfully removed the old rudder, cut out the old lower bearing, then fitted and glued the new lower bearing in place.  Today is adding all of the carbon to bond the lower housing to the hull.  We did a test fit of the new rudder to check alignment towards the end of the day yesterday.  

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Roleur

Roleur

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Orcas Island
The new rudder is just slightly heavier than the old rudder.  Probably mostly due to the larger bearing boss, but also in part, due to the construction of the blade.  Interestingly, the blade is 89% of the area of the stock rudder, 4" longer, slightly narrower chord.  And it doesn't float.  

The notion of the new rudder killing OD racing, is it turns out, a ship that has already sailed.  In our region we have 7 J/111's.  There are currently at least 5 different rudder blades.  In addition, the two stock blades that were replaced by 206 Composites were not the same "stock" blades.  It appears that within 1-2 years, there will be 4 J/111's in our area with the same blade.  The Bieker blade.  

The Bieker designed blade is all carbon.  The stock blade had a carbon post.  Don't know about the blade.  

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Roleur

Roleur

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T sailor said:
Any idea on the rating effect under ORC or ORR?  
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No.  We'll do an ORC next year, but won't get a cert for it until next year as well.  

To be clear, that last motivation for the new rudder was a speed improvement.  That may be an outcome, but the overwhelming goal was to have a rudder that won't break.  The next goal was to improve downwind control.  If we achieve those two then we've hit 100% of our goals.  If it turns out to be a faster rudder that is just icing on the cake.  

 
Roleur

Roleur

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At least 6", may 9".  We were able to insert the new rudder into the hull with the keel on the ground, with no worries about scraping the rudder on the ground.

 
ProaSailor

ProaSailor

dreaming my life away...
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dolphinmaster said:
any chance you can repaste here?  
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Looks pretty sweet!  Seven photos.

https://www.facebook.com/rakuracing/posts/508759507703423

Pacific Cup starts in exactly 1 month.  Perhaps the biggest item on our to do list in preparation for the race was getting a new rudder for Raku.  It turns out the original rudder stock for a J/111 may not be the most appropriate for crossing an ocean and the rudder blade maybe not the best hydrodynamic shape either.  So, last summer we decided to get a new rudder.  The primary goals were a stronger rudder and better control downwind.  In the PNW 4 of the 7 J/111’s already have new rudders and they are all different, so we had some options.  This ended up being a fairly easy decision as one of the local boats (Recon) had a rudder designed by Paul Bieker.  Paul designs some of the coolest race boats around (Ripple, Longboard, Blue, Dark Star, etc.) and has designed a number of new rudders for boats over the years.  He may also have helped Team Oracle fix their foils to come from behind to win the America’s Cup in San Francisco.  Simon Miles (206 Composites) down in Port Townsend built the rudder over the winter and then came up to West Sound Marina to install it 2 weeks ago.

It was great fun installing the rudder over the weekend with the Tasar Nationals taking place at OIYC at the same time.  Lots of eyes on the new rudder and everyone confirmed, if nothing else, it looks sexy and very fast.  The rudder stock and lower bearing on the new rudder are 50% bigger than the original rudder.  That meant cutting a very big hole in the bottom of the boat to accommodate the new lower bearing and housing.  Once cut, we (by “we” I mean Simon did all the planning and work, and I did important things like fetch tools and cut out 56 little polygons of carbon used to laminate the new bearing housing into place) did a test fit of the rudder and into the new lower bearing to check alignment and then epoxied it in place.  What seems completely daunting to me turned out to be pretty straightforward stuff if you know what you are doing (Simon).  Once installed we were able to get a couple of coats of Baltoplate onto the rudder and spend a pleasant Sunday evening getting the rudder very, very smooth.  Baltoplate burnishes up so nice!

Less than a week after installing the new rudder we were off to Victoria for Swiftsure with the goal of giving everything a good test before sailing down the coast to SF and off to Hawaii for Pac Cup.  The race was meh, as we found a big wind hole on the way to Neah Bay, but it was a great training day for us.  We felt super fast in light air and we were able to sail upwind and downwind in 20-25 knots for a good test of control.  I cannot convey in words how much better the boat handles now in big breeze.  Just a night and day difference.  We cruised through Race Passage in 20-25 knots with standing waves thanks to a very strong ebb, the A3 up, and boat speeds in the low teens with no issues at all.  We could just point the boat where we wanted to go, rock it up to a nice heel angle and let her rip.  A completely different experience from previous breezy days we’ve had on Raku.  Now, we are so looking forward to 2070nm of mostly downwind racing to Hawaii.  Send it!
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hrothgar

hrothgar

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Cool rudder.  How would that impact your ability to compete in a one-design regatta?  Like a Worlds or a Nationals?  Is this allowed by the class rules?   Maybe not a concern for you.  Just curious.  Here in the Midwest we have a decent one-design fleet and I would suspect there would be some grumbling if someone showed up with the fancy rudder and wanted to compete.

Hroth

 
George Dewey

George Dewey

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hrothgar said:
Cool rudder.  How would that impact your ability to compete in a one-design regatta?  Like a Worlds or a Nationals?  Is this allowed by the class rules?   Maybe not a concern for you.  Just curious.  Here in the Midwest we have a decent one-design fleet and I would suspect there would be some grumbling if someone showed up with the fancy rudder and wanted to compete.

Hroth
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This is exactly my concern. We're doing more offshore than W/L races, but I don't want to lose the ability to go to an OD event... That said, it seems many people are changing their J/111s so the class needs to address this stuff. Not sure how that can be done. 

 
Roleur

Roleur

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Recon upgraded the rudder stock on their original rudder to fit into the new lower housing.

We have the old rudder in the garage.  No plans upgrade the stock.  No interest in OD racing on this boat, or fully crewed racing for that matter.  Something a future owner could deal with if they wanted.  They won't though because the new rudder is so much better.

As mentioned, here in the Salish Sea, we have 7 boats, with at least 5 different rudder blades.  

 
S

SlackWater_SF

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Kriese

Kriese

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Detroit
ryley said:
go back and research how many 111's have lost their rudders offshore, and you'll quickly come to the conclusion that any rudder is an improvement over the original design, even if its just the post/bearings that are upgraded.
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Do American or French boats loose them the most?
 
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