Block Island Race - Now Requiring AIS Transponder, Really??

[freewheelin]

First off, I love this race and have it on schedule this year. But the new NOR seems to say that it now requires an AIS transponder to compete. What?? for a short distance race mostly in the LIS? It really feels like Storm Trysail and Stanford are trying to drop smaller/older amateur boats. Making us install a blackbox transponder is a bridge (and cost, and battery drain) to far in my mind.

Am I reading this wrong?

Yacht Scoring - A complete web based regatta management, administration and yacht scoring program

Yacht Scoring is a web based regatta management, regatta administration and regatta scoring system that simplifies the task of competitor registration, event management, competitor and media communications while providing results in near-real time to competitors and the World following your...

yachtscoring.com

I wrote the ROs to clarify but they did not get back

 

[pqbon]

It does look like a hard requirement to have AIS.
Many UK coastal races now require AIS transceivers so this isn't really out of bounds.

Looking at the NOR amendments --- they are moving from standalone tracker to AIS tracking.

 

[accnick]

This may be as much about making sure yachts sail the course properly as it is about anything else.

 

[freewheelin]

This may be as much about making sure yachts sail the course properly as it is about anything else.

Last year we rented trackers that accomplished the same thing for the same race. It is also a two-mark out and back course, so posting a boat at the marks would help if that is really the issue. There was a collision last year, but that was because a double handed boat was not keeping watch (as far as I understood it), AIS would not have stopped that. They were in full visual despite the fog.

 

[pqbon]

I'm a big AIS transponder proponent because unlike race trackers they let other marine craft see you.

I've sailed around enough big ships that I'm really happy when they can see me.

 

[freewheelin]

Yeah, not trying to argue the merits of AIS or not. Just whether it should be required by this race entirely near coastal where small race boats compete.

 

[eliboat]

Last year we rented trackers that accomplished the same thing for the same race. It is also a two-mark out and back course, so posting a boat at the marks would help if that is really the issue. There was a collision last year, but that was because a double handed boat was not keeping watch (as far as I understood it), AIS would not have stopped that. They were in full visual despite the fog.

AIS actually could have helped in that situation. AIS provides good collision warning features that may have audibly alerted those not paying attention. My device literally says “Warning! Collision imminent!” Very hard to miss! All of that said, I happen to agree with your consternation about this requirement. No need and indeed forces folks into buying and registering equipment.

 

[kent_island_sailor]

Get the AIS transponder. Single best thing for safety I have bought in ages.
76th ANNUAL BLOCK ISLAND RACE
Friday, May 26, 2023
Notice of Race
Amendment #1 (031423)

1.8 [NP] An operational AIS Transponder shall be carried and be switched on, such that it is receiving and
transmitting throughout the race. The failure of any station to receive a signal from a boat’s AIS
Transponder shall not be subject to protest or grounds for redress (this amends RRS 60.1 and 62.1(a)
and RRS 63.1 shall not apply).

It does look like you need one. If I had to take a random guess, instead of a one-off tracking setup that needs to be rented or purchased for just one race, why not use the existing tech that everyone can see and thus gives the racers a significant safety advantage and they can use all year for everything.
If some fog rolls in and there is any commercial traffic around, you will be SO glad you have it.

 

[dacapo]

Yeah, not trying to argue the merits of AIS or not. Just whether it should be required by this race entirely near coastal where small race boats compete.

YRALIS has for the past few years followed the Safety reg requirements of USS

for 2023 and 2024

https://www.ussailing.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/Monohull-SER-2023.0-Coastal.pdf

https://admin.yralis.org/storage/file-manager/Phrf%20racing%20files/YRALIS-Position_on_Safety_Regs_v2_2021_onward_.pdf

 

[freewheelin]

It does look like you need one. If I had to take a random guess, instead of a one-off tracking setup that needs to be rented or purchased for just one race, why not use the existing tech that everyone can see and thus gives the racers a significant safety advantage and they can use all year for everything.
If some fog rolls in and there is any commercial traffic around, you will be SO glad you have it.

We are a 30fter running off of handhelds and ipads. I use AIS often on deliveries, etc. So I get the advantages (and also the over-reliance) that comes with it. Its not like any other races are using this for tracking, and at $1000 easy (plus the batter draw), I just cant see it being needed.

 

[dacapo]

the BI Race is not nearshore, but Coastal as it's in BI sound in May. I believe that the requirement for liferafts have been removed. but AIS transponder added. This was in the pipeline for a few years now

 

[inneedofadvice]

AIS actually could have helped in that situation. AIS provides good collision warning features that may have audibly alerted those not paying attention. My device literally says “Warning! Collision imminent!” Very hard to miss! All of that said, I happen to agree with your consternation about this requirement. No need and indeed forces folks into buying and registering equipment.

Most will switch it off in close racing situations as it will drive you crazy going off all the time. Minimum distance for a warning on mine is 500 meters I believe. That said, maybe having boats show up on your gps would be adequate notice.

 

[kent_island_sailor]

We are a 30fter running off of handhelds and ipads. I use AIS often on deliveries, etc. So I get the advantages (and also the over-reliance) that comes with it. Its not like any other races are using this for tracking, and at $1000 easy (plus the batter draw), I just cant see it being needed.

I didn't spend anywhere near $1000 on mine. Maybe half that?
I just took a look, prices have gone up. This is the one I have:

Diy Zdigait1500 Digital Yacht Ait1500 Ais Class B Nmea 0183 Internal Gps 81159830366 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Diy Zdigait1500 Digital Yacht Ait1500 Ais Class B Nmea 0183 Internal Gps at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

They look to be going for about $750 now.
You also can get into the Chinese knockoffs for cheap, depending on your tolerance for that kind of thing

GPS Chart plotter with built-in Class B+ AIS transponder KP-38A | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for GPS Chart plotter with built-in Class B+ AIS transponder KP-38A at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

I totally get someone MAKING you buy something is annoying. I bitched up a storm about ADS-B, but then did a delivery from California to here with it and now don't want to fly to Easton for a burger without it
(yes, airplanes got their own version of AIS and you don't need to be in an airplane race to be required to have it)

 

[freewheelin]

Yeah, life rafts have been removed from most of these races - mostly because they are not rentable anymore. It is disappointing to hear that YRALIS is going to AIS. There is already too much reliance on tech and too much expense going that way in my mind. Makes it hard to be anything but a big-budget boat.

AIS won't avoid collision. Proper watch will. Any settings that would be useful as collision deterrence will be switched off because they will be going absolutely haywire during the start and for the first half of the race.

 

[kent_island_sailor]

Yeah, life rafts have been removed from most of these races - mostly because they are not rentable anymore. It is disappointing to hear that YRALIS is going to AIS. There is already too much reliance on tech and too much expense going that way in my mind. Makes it hard to be anything but a big-budget boat.

AIS won't avoid collision. Proper watch will. Any settings that would be useful as collision deterrence will be switched off because they will be going absolutely haywire during the start and for the first half of the race.

I disagree strongly. Night/fog/heavy rain/etc. I can see a tanker coming from 20-30 miles away. NFW are you seeing that with your eyeballs. And even better, they can see you.
You are correct about other racers once you get close, the update rate is way too slow to use it like real time radar for boats within a 1/4 mile you.

 

[pudge]

It's not a bad idea to have one anyways, how much is your life worth to you? $300 plus tax?

 

[freewheelin]

It's not a bad idea to have one anyways, how much is your life worth to you? $300 plus tax?

where are you seeing one for $300?

 

[dacapo]

It's not a bad idea to have one anyways, how much is your life worth to you? $300 plus tax?

receives are $300

the best price Ive found for a transponder ( stand alone ) is $94

easier ( what I did) was buy a new B&G vhf with receives and transmitter included for $1200 and no need for a splitter ($200) for the antenna

like I said, no need to buy a liferaft ($$$$$$) , now just an ais

 

[slug zitski]

First off, I love this race and have it on schedule this year. But the new NOR seems to say that it now requires an AIS transponder to compete. What?? for a short distance race mostly in the LIS? It really feels like Storm Trysail and Stanford are trying to drop smaller/older amateur boats. Making us install a blackbox transponder is a bridge (and cost, and battery drain) to far in my mind.

Am I reading this wrong?

Yacht Scoring - A complete web based regatta management, administration and yacht scoring program

Yacht Scoring is a web based regatta management, regatta administration and regatta scoring system that simplifies the task of competitor registration, event management, competitor and media communications while providing results in near-real time to competitors and the World following your...

yachtscoring.com

I wrote the ROs to clarify but they did not get back

Oh well

might be handy for race management

It does raise the cost of entry

also in areas with a high Ais density the Ais becomes almost useless ….hundreds of targets

 

[freewheelin]

also in areas with a high Ais density the Ais becomes almost useless ….hundreds of targets

yeah, in a hundred boat race, the onboard will be useless (except to track competition). Maybe I am the only one looking to compete who doesn't have one, but I doubt it.

It seems like it might be a good reason to pick a different race. There are plenty.