Bowman and start line distance calling issues

[Plumber]

below the line, but that's neither here nor there. I appreciate your analysis, but what I was looking for is feedback on how to improve the skills of gauging that distance properly. So far, i got one good answer. 

 

[Plumber]

What would you have done if he told you you were early?

Hit the gas pedal, roll over boats sitting to leeward and initiate a restart around the PIN (we we're on I flag).

 

[Skaf]

Hit the gas pedal, roll over boats sitting to leeward and initiate a restart around the PIN (we we're on I flag).

... implying that you weren't already at full gas at a start, and even so, you were still early.  Dude you really blew it, and you're doing a really poor job of realizing that it has nothing to do with the bow.

 

[Plumber]

... implying that you weren't already at full gas at a start, and even so, you were still early.  Dude you really blew it, and you're doing a really poor job of realizing that it has nothing to do with the bow.

Listen Duke, you're a drawing a bunch of conclusions made up in your head without having a clue of the situation. if you want to defend the honor of all bowman out there, start your own thread. Until then stay in your lane and let the adults discuss the point at hand.

 

[Robin]

One of my drills ( when I still had my own program or when I have been asked to do crew training) was to actually set up a starting line with a couple of cheap bouys. Surprisingly easy to do (I often also set a windward mark).  If there are other boats in the vicinity invite them to join (does not matter if they are the same the purpose is to create the confusion of the starting line.  Do 3 to 5, 3 min rolling starts and then maybe go to the windward mark and do the same all over again.  Depending on the boat and team you may make the person in the bow responsible for providing distance to line information as opposed to time information.  This kind of thing is best accomplished during pre season practice, not on race day.

Robin

 

[Plumber]

One of my drills ( when I still had my own program or when I have been asked to do crew training) was to actually set up a starting line with a couple of cheap bouys. Surprisingly easy to do (I often also set a windward mark).  If there are other boats in the vicinity invite them to join (does not matter if they are the same the purpose is to create the confusion of the starting line.  Do 3 to 5, 3 min rolling starts and then maybe go to the windward mark and do the same all over again.  Depending on the boat and team you may make the person in the bow responsible for providing distance to line information as opposed to time information.  This kind of thing is best accomplished during pre season practice, not on race day.

Robin

Sounds like a plan. thanks man.

 

[sailronin]

Exactly, practice. Either with a couple of buoys or a channel marker and a point on shore. Sailing dinghys we would do 10 or 15 practice starts at least once per month. Of course it's easy to get one other guy to go practice, much tougher with a larger crew but it pays off.  We would practice Vanderbelt starts, how fast we could go from a complete stop, early and bleeding speed, coming for a dip start, just pretty much whatever we could think of to have alternatives for when a real start goes sideways.

 

[Onrust1368]

A 24-foot boat approaching the line will be moving at about the pace of a brisk walk...

When I was learning to start, I would walk to and from work...
And estimate the number of steps to the next lamp-post, fire hydrant, etc. -

I did this every day for 2 years...

100 steps/minute... so I got better at estimating time/speed/distance on start lines...

For longer distances, e.g., is that competitor boat gaining on us or not?,
I would picture hitting a golf shot into his/her cockpit...
If at first, I would hit an 8-iron, and then later it would take a 6-iron, he was gaining on me...

and vice versa...

I know, it sounds a little crazy, but it worked for me... YMMV...

 

[fufkin]

 

[madohe]

My bowman makes all kinds of random signals and noises up there before the start. I usually just ignore him.

This is best strategy with a good driver and tactician.........

The bowmonkey seems to enjoy screeching and flinging pooh......

 

[sadug]

I was a bowman for years and we trained using buoys and such almost every time we went sailing (even for fun). Before a race we always sail the line if time and traffic permit. To better help hone my timing skills, I used to time myself walking to a lighted intersection with crosswalk - will I time it just right as the red becomes green or will I be over early. I would also this while driving and it worked for me. Though now later in life, I still find myself walking up to lighted crosswalks and thinking will I be early? Especially here in SD as they have added lights with timers now for many crosswalks so you know exactly how many seconds before the light turns. Should I slow my walking down to get it right? So I guess it had an impact. May sound dumb but it helped me out. 

 

[Car Ramrod]

30 feet long. No bowmen. Nobody over. You should give your bowman a break. 

 

[wal']

What's someone doing on the bow of a 24' yacht at a start anyway.  24' and you can't see that far?

Time to give it up bloke

 

[See Level]

My guess is that as soon as he/she becomes good at calling distance to the start line he'll move to a another boat that doesn't have any assholes on it.

 

[Skaf]

I suppose I wasn't answering your question, about how to get a bow guy more practice.  Fine.  But I was trying to help improve your starts, the problems with which appear to be unrelated to your bow guy.  In any case, I apparently needed a lesson in not feeding the trolls... I'm out.  Peace.

 

[SOSOS]

Easier than teaching him to judge distance might be for him to teach you and skip what the pin looks like. We've found pin color if more important than shape if you need to start simple. 

 

[Meat Wad]

This must be learned unless your bow person as true spatial reasoning.

 

[Wet Spreaders]

My bowman makes all kinds of random signals and noises up there before the start. I usually just ignore him.

Mine is pretty quiet unless we get close to being over. Then he hops about, yells and waves his arms to make sure that we, the race committee, all of our competitors and the families on the beach building sandcastles are completely clear that we are over the line.

 

[some dude]

all due respect...you really shouldn't need a dude on the bow to call the line on a 24 foot boat (unless it's a huge fleet).

This.  The guy driving looks under the boom at the pin, speeds up or slows down accordingly 

 

[HFC Hunter]

Sure. Blame bowman, ignore useful advice here.

But know the Dancing Monkey Union has been informed of your slander and sailing indiscretions. Be prepared for sustained levels of unexpected gear failure, stained forepeaks, and a large ramp up in pregnancies amongst your wider family network. Some of this may be avoided if you buy your Bowman a beer and talk it through, and don't rag them on SA - ever again!

On a 4ktsb, bowman should be on the rail for the 60seconds leading to gun to help you power up. On a 24 foot 4ktsb this means he's probably less than 6feet from you and you can probably see aft and behind the jib better than he can. And unless you expect a major shift or current then don't start at pin end unless forced.