Brisbane Finn sailor rescued after brutal boom hit

[maxstaylock]

Have been meaning to get a helmet for sailing for a while, watching this video (and especially hearing the clanging thud sound) spurred me on to make it happen. While I'm happy with gybing while concentrating in downwind mode, I can't dismiss the possibility of a brain fart, maybe I'm doing a penalty turn with upwind vang on, maybe I get distracted by nearby shouting at the crucial moment, maybe a part of another guys boat takes a swipe at me, whatever, it's time, have hopefully just enough brain cells to see me out, don't need any fewer.

Just got a WIP WIFLEX, looking forward to trying it out. It's malleable enough that it even fits my oddly shaped head, leaves my ears clear for wind awareness, and cost a heap less than I was expecting to pay, less than a decent pair of hiking wet boots. It doesn't have the hard shell a kayaking helmet might have, it seems more like a surfing bump cap, so it wouldn't protect against gravel rash, or sharp rocks, but hopefully that means it'll spread the impact more widely in contact with spars or foils. One size fits quite a large spread of head sizes, I had to buy without trying it on so this was a positive feature. It's so light you hardly know its on.

Maybe I'll have to get my head half an inch lower than I'm used to, am interested to see if it'll be a problem.

Your mileage may vary.

 

[Bored Stiff]

I understand it’s personal choice. But you have to balance the fact a helmet in a slow boat like a Finn can protect you from some head injuries but also makes it more likely to hit your head on the boom . So there is no clear advantage to wearing one. So back to personal choice .

That’s not how risk assessments work.

Multiply the frequency by the consequence. 50 glancing blows of insignificance is far more tolerable than 1 KO by boom.

First question is whether boom impact is a risk that needs mitigating. Second question is, if yes, what can be done to reduce likelihood of impact. Third question is what can be done to reduce consequence of impact. Helmets are one method that answer Q3, but Q1 and Q2 need answering firs.

 

[Blue One]

That’s not how risk assessments work.

Multiply the frequency by the consequence. 50 glancing blows of insignificance is far more tolerable than 1 KO by boom.

First question is whether boom impact is a risk that needs mitigating. Second question is, if yes, what can be done to reduce likelihood of impact. Third question is what can be done to reduce consequence of impact. Helmets are one method that answer Q3, but Q1 and Q2 need answering firs.

Totally agree . 😀

As a side issue I am not a fan of plank booms . The only time I’ve ever wished I was wearing a helmet, was after being hit with the one I had on my Lightning 368 ( for our American friends the rig was very similar to a 1980s Europe dinghy ). The modern Lightning 368 now has a round section boom .

 

[martin 'hoff]

That’s not how risk assessments work.

Multiply the frequency by the consequence. 50 glancing blows of insignificance is far more tolerable than 1 KO by boom.

First question is whether boom impact is a risk that needs mitigating. Second question is, if yes, what can be done to reduce likelihood of impact. Third question is what can be done to reduce consequence of impact. Helmets are one method that answer Q3, but Q1 and Q2 need answering firs.

Yeah, and you just learn to duck a bit lower. Humans learn and adapt. So there isn't a significant long term increase in frequency of hits.

We wear helmets on the N15, and I think it's a good thing.

 

[Karma -]

Why Finn guys have small Dicks?

I guess Medals doesn’t help them either. They get dumped and bitter. Right?“spectator”/mr. know it all.. JSYKDASTARD

Scary to read this about someone you know but very happy to hear Matt is well. We would race against each other in the Finn, so it's a bit close to home. Many thanks to the ones who came to the Matt's rescue! We need more like you. Cheers

 

[Curious2]

Wearing a helmet, even if it slightly increases your head height, is a far safer option than being belted by a heavy metal or carbon boom in an uncontrolled jibe, it is one thing to see stars and have bruising than be knocked unconscious.

Not necessarily true, as Bored notes. If wearing the helmet increases your chance of being hit hard to (say) one in ten races and without it you have the chance of being hit hard once in 100 races, then the helmet may actually be worse for your health. It's not just being knocked unconscious; it's the fact that even a helmet doesn't stop your brain sloshing around when your head is hit hard.

Cycling helmets, for example, are sometimes said to only reduce brain injury in a fall by 33%, despite their bulk which probably makes them better in a boom strike than a typical "sailing" helmet. So since a helmet is far from a cure for head impacts, one can only be sure that they improve safety if one can be sure that they don't cause significantly more boom impacts. That's a complex question, including issues like risk assessment (some studies show that cyclists with helmets ride in a more risky fashion because they feel safer, for example) so we don't actually know if helmets are safer.

If you are in a helmet and "seeing stars" then you've already probably injured your brain and are at risk of severe injury if you hit your head again. It's better than being knocked out, but far worse than not hitting your head at all because you ducked low enough. Risk assessment and the psychology around risk taking are complex issues so surely we should treat them as such.

 

[Couta]

^^^^ FFS Curious....you are talking complete nonsense...and just making up claims...let's be absolutely clear... Helmets reduce the risk of injury....if you don't want to wear one..that's up to you...but don't promulgate seriously spurious "facts" and pseudo scientific bullshit.
Here's a tip: Pull ya head in!!

 

[Xeon]

^^^^ FFS Curious....you are talking complete nonsense...and just making up claims...let's be absolutely clear... Helmets reduce the risk of injury....if you don't want to wear one..that's up to you...but don't promulgate seriously spurious "facts" and pseudo scientific bullshit.
Here's a tip: Pull ya head in!!

Err you seem to be the one making up facts and evidence.
It’s all about speed and looking at all the evidence in all situations
Re cycling . If I’m wearing a cycling helmet and I fall off my bike at slow speed it will protect my head from hitting the ground ( but overall, health wise I am still better off cycling even if I don’t wear a helmet) .
But if I am hit by a car doing 30 mph a helmet makes no difference to the injuries I have. The most important thing for my safety is not being hit in the first place .
These are real facts backed up by uk and Dutch cycling bodies.
You live in a country were cycling helmets are compulsory which means cycling journeys are down 30% since it was introduced which is not good for the health of the country.
As apposed to Holland which has the highest amount of cycling journeys and has the least amount of cycling head injuries per mile and no one wears a helmet . This is because they have great cycling infrastructure.
Simple fact wearing a helmet does not make you safer, not getting into a situation were you need a helmet makes you safer .
Simply saying wearing helmets reduce the the risk of injury in sailing is simplistic at best .
The fact you think a helmet reduces the risk of injury because you wear one doesn’t make it a fact .

 

[Couta]

Jesus Xeon...why do people keep talking crap about bikes...but ok here's a fact - I ride lots of bikes...triathlon, road, MTB, Gravel....and I just sold my downhill - and I wear a helmet in all cases...and yeah, from time to time I've been very glad to have been wearing one... and yep, it's been the law here for decades....so whatever stats you're quoting about reduced participation are seriously outdated (30 +years? incidentally bike riding has absolutely boomed over this period)...but let's get back to the "Facts" around sailing...
Some here are quoting as "fact" that wearing a helmet increases the risk of heads hitting booms...really? Please provide any research supporting this "fact". They go on to assert on this questionable basis... that it's MORE likely that wearing a helmet will INCREASE the risk to head injury...absolute fuckin bullshit. So for those that have any neural function remaining, let me say AGAIN...if you don't want to wear one, that's your choice, just don't go sprouting crap about helmets increasing the risk while sailing...unless you can show some research to back it up.

 

[Couta]

Acquired brain injury is more prevalent in the sailing fraternity than I realised.....

 

[Xeon]

I never said helmets increased the risk of head INJURYS so I don’t need to provide proof.

You on the other hand have said many times that helmets reduce head injuries in dinghy sailing .
So with due respect please provide a link to some peer reviewed research that proves your opinion.

 

[Couta]

Nah mate...you're just the bloke who defends the guy who makes that claim...then goes off on a rant about bike helmets ...completely ignoring the fact that the UCI and all professional bike riders wear helmets (Seriously!!!). If the pro's in the Tour de France wear 'em, there's probably a reason!! It's time to just let it go...helmets prevent injury..that is an established fact...bikes, motorbikes, racing car drivers, mountain climbers, downhill ski & snowboard racers...icehockey players, cricketers, baseballers, some football codes, and some sailors.....mate..the empirical evidence is all about you...but in our sport...as racers...it's still a personal choice. The day may well come when it isn't...I mean, there was a time when life jackets weren't mandatory...so enjoy the freedom to make your choice while you can.

 

[Xeon]

Still waiting for for the link to provide evidence to back up your opinions about the effectiveness of helmets in the sport of sailing.

 

[maxstaylock]

I have no problem with people deciding not to wear a helmet when doing dangerous stuff, quite the reverse. I don't mind at all if people choose not to have a vaccine, or wear a seatbelt. Jump off a bridge with a home made parachute for all I care. The world has too many people, if people self select for a Darwin award, it just leaves more scarce resources for the rest of us.

But to try and convince others that they shouldn't be as safe and careful as is practicable seems like a bit of a cunt move to me.

There was a period where there were no lifejackets, and lots of people drowned. Then we had lifejackets, for use when absolutely required, nobody wore them as a prevention measure, fewer people drowned, but more survived. Now we have better lifejackets, and wear them as a prevention measure, and even fewer people drown. Sure somebody will tell me that I am a fucking idiot, everyone knows real sailors can swim indefinitely, even with a broken arm in freezing water.

Now we have helmets, and are starting to wear them as a prevention measure. We truly live in a gilded age.

 

[Xeon]

I am not trying to stop any one wearing a helmet in any situation. People can wear them to cross the road if they wish.( Statistically we would all be safer if we did this but the safety gain is so small that it’s not worth the trouble of introducing it. Which is why hard evidence is so important in these areas )

But people have voiced their opinion that wearing a helmet when sailing reduces heat injuries and all I have done is ask for peer reviewed evidence.

As in things like motor racing , motorcycling or cycle racing the evidence is out there and can be found with a simple Google search. This is my last post on this subject .

 

[Jethrow]

Still waiting for for the link to provide evidence to back up your opinions about the effectiveness of helmets in the sport of sailing.

Not sailing but... "The testing does not support the supposition that water sports helmets would increase the likelihood of head or neck injury in a typical fall during recreational water sports"

Head and neck injury potential during water sports falls: examining the effects of helmets - Sports Engineering

Head and neck injuries sustained during water skiing and wakeboarding occur as a result of falls in water and collisions with obstacles, equipment, or people. Though water sports helmets are designed to reduce injury likelihood from head impacts with hard objects, some believe that helmets...

link.springer.com

 

[Jethrow]

Still waiting for for the link to provide evidence to back up your opinions about the effectiveness of helmets in the sport of sailing.

This one's more sailing oriented...
"Boom angular velocities and head accelerations for unhelmeted impacts were highly correlated (R2 = 0.996). The watersports helmet reduced head accelerations by 52 ± 4% when compared to accelerations from unhelmeted impacts"

https://asmedigitalcollection.asme.org/SBC/proceedings-abstract/SBC2010/305/460393

 

[GER308]

In the end if I knew someone was likely going to hit me in the head with a stick and I had the option of wearing a helmet or not I would choose to wear one.
Like when I was climbing, for me helmet use was situational, clean steep rock with little rockfall chance I might not wear, alpine, chossy low angle rock ... wear. Same for boats, Finn in 20-30+ wear, lighter maybe not. On a Snipe probably not...

 

[Alan Crawford]

I think this is, overall, a good discussion that I bet has more than a few people checking out helmets! Perhaps one reason that it's hard to find a lot of data on use of helmets in small boat sailing is that such use is really only getting started. I think the same could be said for Alpine resort skiing / snowboarding. At least in the US, say, 15+ years ago the use of helmets a Alpine resorts was still pretty small (my anecdotal first-hand observations). Go to any Alpine resort today in the US and you would need to look to see people NOT wearing helmets. For resort skiing / snowboarding, people found that not only do helmets reduce head injury rates, they also do a great job of keeping your heads warm! Backcountry skiing (again, US), could be now more like small boat sailing with regards to helmet use - not much but growing.

 

[Curious2]

^^^^ FFS Curious....you are talking complete nonsense...and just making up claims...let's be absolutely clear... Helmets reduce the risk of injury....if you don't want to wear one..that's up to you...but don't promulgate seriously spurious "facts" and pseudo scientific bullshit.
Here's a tip: Pull ya head in!!

I spent about a decade investigating accidents so have a lot of relevant professional experience. There is nothing "pseudo scientific" about the way the brain reacts to impacts. There is NOTHING "pseudo scientific" about the fact that many helmets don't do much to prevent mild brain injury through impact. This is not bullshit, it's reality.

Risk compensation is accepted by many (not all) of the people such as the professionals who publish in places like the British Medical Journal's Injury Prevention Journal, where they clearly outline the issue and its complexity; https://injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/6/2/82

There's an enormous amount of study on the field; for example;

https://journals.lww.com/cjsportsme...ation__a__side_effect__of_sport_injury.1.aspx ;

Risk compensation in children’s activities: A pilot study

The intent of protective equipment (PE) in sports and leisure activities is to reduce injuries. However, some postulate that any safety measure prompts riskier behaviour, a phenomenon known as ‘risk homeostasis’ or ‘risk compensation.’ ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/351014445_Examining_the_Role_of_Risk_Compensation_in_Extreme_Sports

etc etc etc

Risk compensation certainly doesn't always occur, and I didn't say it did. It may not occur with sailing and helmets at all. I did NOT say anywhere that people shouldn't wear helmets. All I was saying is that the question isn't as black and white as some people make out.

By the way, I used a helmet windsurfing sometimes as early as the 1990s.