Canada bans 1,500 types of assault firearms YES!

[Pertinacious Tom]

Then why can't we (or you) have lawn darts? 

Is "having" something possessing it or selling it in your world?

 

[00seven]

And a guy kills a whole family with his automobile over religion. My bad, a 9 yo still in a coma.

What's up Canada?

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Actually you are wrong yet again.  Where did I say they were illegal to possess?  I said sale was banned.  Not the same thing.  Isn't this fun?  

Imagine if guns were as dangerous as, like, lawn darts.  They'd be banned.

You said "banned." Not the same thing. Isn't this fun?

Also, we should delve into lawn dart self-murders, to continue the gun comparison. Most of the gun violence you've cited a couple of times in this thread can be avoided by the simple expedient of not shooting yourself. Has there been a problem with people self-murderizing themselves with lawn darts?

 

[Ishmael]

And a guy kills a whole family with his automobile over religion. My bad, a 9 yo still in a coma.

What's up Canada?

We have whack jobs too. 20 years old and full of hate. I wonder where he learned to hate Muslims.

 

[Rain Man]

Is "having" something possessing it or selling it in your world?

Ah, I mis-typed, should have said "Why can't we buy lawn darts".

There - happy?  Still having fun?  It seems you are off your game a bit in the last day or so...

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Ah, I mis-typed

Twice, in two different threads. Once might have been a typo. Twice is a pattern.

But go ahead and implausibly claim a typo. Anything is better than admitting you actually learned something from a mere libertarian.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

I am reading the book 'Skin in the Game' by Nassim Nicholas Taleb.  In that book, he postulates that 10,000 Americans die every year by suicide simply because guns are available and handy.  

And yet, Canada's suicide rate is about the same as ours. Are Canadian battlefield .22 owners causing this?

 

[Bugsy]

And yet, Canada's suicide rate is about the same as ours. Are Canadian battlefield .22 owners causing this?

Hi Tom, 

I think you come across as a good guy.  You like boats, you seem like a good neighbour and you seem like the kind of guy I could sail with or have a beer with.  

From what I have read, Canada's gun suicide rate is not about the same as yours (meaning the USA).  I reference a book I am reading with that had an interesting note.  I quoted and referenced that.  

I just Googled "compare suicide rates canada vs usa"

Here is what I found right away:

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0232252

A published, peer reviewed article that supports the numbers quoted by Taleb.  Here is a quote:

Relative to Canada, the male suicide fatality rate in the US standardized population was greater in every age group. The proportion of male suicide fatalities due to firearms in the US standardized population ranged from 46% among those aged 25 to 34 to 78% among those aged 65 or older. In contrast, the proportion of male suicide fatalities due to firearms in Canada ranged from six percent among those under the age of 15 years to 32% among those aged 65 or older. We estimated that if males in the US had the same firearm suicide fatality rate as Canada, we would observe 76.9% fewer suicide fatalities due to firearms and 32.8% more non-firearm suicide fatalities. The overall male suicide fatality rate would be 28.8% lower if males in the US had the same firearm suicide fatality rate as Canada, and would be equivalent to approximately 9,992 fewer suicide fatalities each year.

I am not going to engage in debate about this.  It really doesn't interest me very much.   I just thought this interesting.  If you want to quibble, please take up your arguments with Taleb or the author of the paper above. 

I plan to retire soon and want to take some road trips.  Meeting you, chatting and having a beer would be great (I will buy the beer).  If you invited me sailing, I would go as I have seen pictures of your SunCat and it looks like a hoot.  Let's just not talk about guns or politics.  

Cheers.  

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Thanks for the friendly reply, Bugsy. I'll just note that I was talking about our suicide rate, not our gun suicide rate. We disproportionately use guns, Canadians don't, but our countries have a similar suicide rate. Japanese people virtually never use a gun and have a much higher rate. I doubt the conclusion that we could cut our suicide rate in half through gun control.

The Sun Cat was fun but we sold it a few years ago. I still have Hobie Adventure Islands, which are great fun, and a year or so ago a Stray Goat followed me home. I expect to finally be sailing it this month and would welcome you to join me if you pass through this area.

 

[jocal505]

Hi Tom, 

I think you come across as a good guy.  You like boats, you seem like a good neighbour and you seem like the kind of guy I could sail with or have a beer with.  

From what I have read, Canada's gun suicide rate is not about the same as yours (meaning the USA).  I reference a book I am reading with that had an interesting note.  I quoted and referenced that.  

I just Googled "compare suicide rates canada vs usa"

Here is what I found right away:

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0232252

A published, peer reviewed article that supports the numbers quoted by Taleb.  Here is a quote:

Relative to Canada, the male suicide fatality rate in the US standardized population was greater in every age group. The proportion of male suicide fatalities due to firearms in the US standardized population ranged from 46% among those aged 25 to 34 to 78% among those aged 65 or older. In contrast, the proportion of male suicide fatalities due to firearms in Canada ranged from six percent among those under the age of 15 years to 32% among those aged 65 or older. We estimated that if males in the US had the same firearm suicide fatality rate as Canada, we would observe 76.9% fewer suicide fatalities due to firearms and 32.8% more non-firearm suicide fatalities. The overall male suicide fatality rate would be 28.8% lower if males in the US had the same firearm suicide fatality rate as Canada, and would be equivalent to approximately 9,992 fewer suicide fatalities each year.

I am not going to engage in debate about this.  It really doesn't interest me very much.   I just thought this interesting.  If you want to quibble, please take up your arguments with Taleb or the author of the paper above. 

I plan to retire soon and want to take some road trips.  Meeting you, chatting and having a beer would be great (I will buy the beer).  If you invited me sailing, I would go as I have seen pictures of your SunCat and it looks like a hoot.  Let's just not talk about guns or politics.  

Cheers.  

If you want to relate to Tom, within limited dimensions, go for it. Make the boundaries clear. These points of discussion could remain off limits:

• The felony of housing an AW can be neutralized, *voila*, by the mere mention of boating accidents.
  
• 22's are to be confused with AW's. A lot. 
  
• If you support Bloomberg, you are a racist.
  
• If you want gun control, you are a pro-rapist.
  
• Gun control does not work.
  
• MLK was proof positive for the need for must-issue gun permits.
  
• MLK's church has gone to gunz, all across Georgia.
  
• Japan's suicides can be (frequently and endlessly) compared to suicides in the USA.
  
• The CDC has been free to conduct research on the subject of gun violence for the last 25 years.
  
• However, all peer-reviewed gun violence research can be discounted.
  
• The facts of peer-reviewed history can be denied, *voila*, by the use of "The Standard Model...which Tom carefully avoids discussing.
  
• Judge Taney is the bar by which to measure racial equality.
  

Enjoy the beer, and the boats, and the sailing--sadly, I was not invited. But look beneath the surface with this man, and help him where you can. He will be in good company.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Mass Shooting Near Toronto

And your country is going to wait most of another year before beginning to confiscate battlefield .22's and other such weapons of mass destruction?

Canada 2021 - 5 dead & wounded in mass killing.

Just because you did not notice a mass shooting does not mean it didn't happen. It might just mean you don't have a billionaire in the business of scaring people.

 

[bpm57]

But look beneath the surface with this man, and help him where you can. He will be in good company.

Speaking of that, when are you going to explain that a DGU for you is acceptable, but not for anyone else?

Maybe after that we can work on having you admit that the American Revolution happened.

 

[jocal505]

Speaking of that, when are you going to explain that a DGU for you is acceptable, but not for anyone else?

Maybe after that we can work on having you admit that the American Revolution happened.

first rot it hell, my friend, and do it soon

 

[bpm57]

first rot it hell, my friend, and do it soon

I realize it is hard, Joe, when you can't just cut-n-paste an answer - but give it a try.

Or are you just that special when it comes to DGUs, and nobody else in the entire country meets "the Joe standard"?

After that we can move on to your denial of basic US history.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Not to people who write laws in Australia, Canada, or the US Congress.

Not true of Canadian firearms law, there's nothing there specific about rifle cartridges. It's just that only .22 can have a high capacity magazine, and that predates the "assault rifle" controversy. The same thing would apply to a battle rifle. 

You missed the shopping list in this thread?

 

[spankoka]

Yes, as a card carrying conservative-I am generally happy with the status quo Canadian gun laws.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Yes, as a card carrying conservative-I am generally happy with the status quo Canadian gun laws.

Well, OK, but "high capacity" means 5 rounds, or sometimes 10, or, with the correct label, 15 rounds in Canada. By any of those definitions, lots of guns other than battlefield .22's can have a high capacity magazine.

The ban in this thread on various specific battlefield .22's seems pretty specific to me.

 

[spankoka]

As I understand it the rationale for allowing .22 LR high capacity rifle magazines in Canada is pest control. However, you are right that the magazine for every other rifle would be 5 rounds. It's the IPSC that keeps many guns legal in Canada by giving the guns a "sporting use". 

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

.223 on the left, .22LR on the right. Same same, right?

Yes, which is why so many battlefield .22's were on the shopping list Trudeau created for me.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

Why give easy fire arm access to so many ignorant and under educated people.

It's a reasonable question. In Canada, if people are too ignorant to know that firearm is one word, are they allowed to own guns or lecture others about them?