charleston race week

Randy did not ditch yachtscoring, when he had to go live with this years website Luiz had just passed away and nothing had been figured out about how it would be maintained. Regatta dates are picked on a lot of factors and it just backed into this date. Fleets of various boats being down is a reflection of many factors, like maybe the J70 class has burned itself out with all the $1,000+ per day semi pros.
What utter bullshit. Within days of Luiz passing everything was sorted on that front.  Even if there was some uncertainty dont you think the family of the man who literally built the world of online regatta management and gave tirelessly to the sport deserved all the support in the world?

 

Meat Wad

Super Anarchist
Charleston race week dead as shit. No viper fleet, no big boat course racing, entries down in the J/70 and M24 fleets, they ditched yachtscoring for a buggy and confusing system, title sponsor (Sperry) pulls their support because CORA plays footsie with white supremacists.

oh, and they scheduled it for later in the spring than ever before so less desire to go to a “warm” regatta. 
I haven't followed Yachtscoring since Luis' passing. Has something changed since then, Prices way up, no support?? I only like the online tools for registration and displaying the registered fleets. Once the day is scored with Sailwave, the results are posted as Preliminary. Sailwave rocks for scoring and is so simple to use, also you do not have to worry about your connection as it is all local host.

Also I know nothing about CORA other than what has been posted here on SA. What Supremacists groups does CORA affiliate with, KKK? I've seen black people in the proud boys so it can't be them. What other groups are you talking about?

Warm Regatta ??  You guys like it cold or is it because of lighter winds?

 

sunseeker

Super Anarchist
3,585
548
What utter bullshit. Within days of Luiz passing everything was sorted on that front.  Even if there was some uncertainty dont you think the family of the man who literally built the world of online regatta management and gave tirelessly to the sport deserved all the support in the world?
It’s not utter bullshit. It’s what I was told by someone who I know to be completely trustworthy. I think it was really just a question of timing, zero Ill intent by anyone at crw. When luiz died Randy had no idea what was going to happen, I know those two were pretty close. Maybe Randy wasn’t trying to hunt down the Kahl family out of respect. 

 

sunseeker

Super Anarchist
3,585
548
Perhaps using a superior software is more important than getting the registration page up when he "had to go live" no matter the fact that other national events were flexible and didn't suffer by waiting after the webmaster passed away. 

Sunseeker, could you ask your buddy Randy if he's glad he lost his title sponsor because CORA was playing footsie with white supremacists by keeping the Confederate flag in their bugee?

It’s not clear to me why Sperry pulled out, I know there had been a fairly big turnover within their corporate structure, and it’s entirely possible they did pull out because there’s a lot about the Charleston area that’s still fighting the civil war. Either way, I don’t much care, because I’m not a Sperry customer and the Charleston area isn’t high on my travel list. Sponsors come and sponsors go, they’ll figure it out.

 

Meat Wad

Super Anarchist
Perhaps using a superior software is more important than getting the registration page up when he "had to go live" no matter the fact that other national events were flexible and didn't suffer by waiting after the webmaster passed away. 
Knowing how difficult it is to get people to want to learn these scoring systems, I understand why people are afraid to jump in for a big event like CRW. I can't imaging what the old folks at our club will do when I finally sell my boat and move on.

Once you are the person doing what is perceived as complicated (it really is not) you are stuck until you walk away or unfortunately, pass away.

 

RobbieB

Super Anarchist
3,160
1,655
Charleston, SC
Charleston race week dead as shit. No viper fleet, no big boat course racing, entries down in the J/70 and M24 fleets, they ditched yachtscoring for a buggy and confusing system, title sponsor (Sperry) pulls their support because CORA plays footsie with white supremacists.

oh, and they scheduled it for later in the spring than ever before so less desire to go to a “warm” regatta. 
No Vipers but 36 VXOnes.  Tied for their biggest fleet ever.  I think M24's have been struggling for some years now nationally?   CORA changed their flag to make Sperry happy and they were gone anyway.  I think they just were trying for an excuse and when they got what they asked for they went quiet...

The date change was perfect.  I've done at least 10 of these events and it was the first year I can remember sailing a full, solid 3 days without some sort of weather delay or shut down.  I'll take a 10 race regatta any day.

 

SkookumZ

New member
I crewed in Circle 1 PHRF, my first time participating instead of observing.  What a blast!  My only complaint is that they kept moving the course due to wind shifts.  The wind was shifty all weekend and adjusting the course 4 times a day kept delaying the action.  Why not just keep the course and let everyone adapt??  Either way, I am sunburnt and windburnt and sore and ready to do it all again next year.

Those VXOnes looked FUN.

-Z

 

mundt

Anarchist
853
322
=
As a relatively neutral observer I'd say the event looked pretty damned great.  I'd challenge Mr. O'Lantern or anyone else to offer a better event in North America.  For example, virtually all racing in Southern California these days involves the same handful of older guys racing the same handful of older boats around the same handful of old courses they've been doing for decades.  Seeing the variety and size of fleets and participants ripping all over Charleston was very refreshing.  It's a challenging venue with ridiculous currents, windshifts, giant ships, absurd motorboaters and scary shallows everywhere.  The guys that won in the bigger fleets absolutely proved themselves, 100%.

 

LionessRacing

Super Anarchist
4,351
592
Myrtle Beach,
For what little it may be worth: 

  1. We had a great time, crew wants to do it again. 



    3 ladies > 60, 1 > 45
  2. 2 men > 60

[*]The positive aspects: 


  1. Superb weather for event, sunny, 5-15 kts winds
  2. Nice balance of shoreside activities, good food and drink
  3. Welcoming regatta staff/volunteers
  4. Welcoming and helpful venue staff  at Charleston Harbor Marina

[*]Negative aspects: 


  1. Phlotilla App


    Poor functionality on limited bandwidth
  2. Advertising was more prominent than information
  3. Messaging all skippers (attendees?) on all protests

[*]Overnight delivery leads to mental fatigue ($100/day dock fee discourages longer tenancy)


  1. Sailed outside 100 miles offshore in 17 hours dock to dock 
  2. Motored back inside ICW 18 hours dock to dock

[*]2+ knots of current IN the marina leads to interesting docking with a full keel boat

[*]Starting at or before onset of the Ebb leads to sailing entire race in a single current direction


  1. low favorable current going out, strong adverse current returning due to timing of starts


    Effect is to benefit the lower rated later starters... 



[*]Requiring use of Commercial Ship Channel marks as Gates forced racers into Channel 


  1. Worst adverse current (> 3Kts) location
  2. Busy Ship Traffic added complexity

[*]Focus on little boats made it clear that the circle 5&6 fleets were low priority to Regatta, while our RO and mark boats did a great job. 



[*]Suggestions: 


  1. Time the event weekend/starting times to get a tide direction change mid race, or for the windward leeward small boats, between races. 
  2. Provide WiFi on "the beach", as was available in the marina to facilitate Phlotilla

[*]Take aways: 


  1. Be more sure you are looking at the course selection vs the Start table (retired from race 1 for sailing wrong course) 
  2. Be more aware that the radio channel for check in is not used for announcements
  3. Be content when you have "Grannies for grinders" that the tacking will be more sedate than you are used to. 


    Leave sufficient room that if the tack is blown, you don't hit the sea buoy in the current

[*]When your foredeck has never set an Asymmetric before, be prepared for some learnings 





We took a "retired", 5th, & 7th to come in 8th overall in Pursuit B. 

 
I crewed in Circle 1 PHRF, my first time participating instead of observing.  What a blast!  My only complaint is that they kept moving the course due to wind shifts.  The wind was shifty all weekend and adjusting the course 4 times a day kept delaying the action.  Why not just keep the course and let everyone adapt??  Either way, I am sunburnt and windburnt and sore and ready to do it all again next year.

Those VXOnes looked FUN.

-Z
I was one of the two old guys on the weather mark on Circle One. It was amazing that we never had to move the windward mark on Friday. In Charleston!!

On Saturday and especially Sunday, when there is a change of wind direction on the course from 220 to 180 degrees, the course must be changed or there is no windward leg.

That's why they have the offshore courses, so that going around government marks and "permanent" set marks, you know where to go, regardless of the wind direction.  Dave Ellis

 

RobbieB

Super Anarchist
3,160
1,655
Charleston, SC
I crewed in Circle 1 PHRF, my first time participating instead of observing.  What a blast!  My only complaint is that they kept moving the course due to wind shifts.  The wind was shifty all weekend and adjusting the course 4 times a day kept delaying the action.  Why not just keep the course and let everyone adapt??  Either way, I am sunburnt and windburnt and sore and ready to do it all again next year.

Those VXOnes looked FUN.

-Z
Welcome to CRW!  You picked one of the best ones ever to sail in.  Typically course changes don't require so much time.  However, on Saturday and Sunday the shifts were such that the RC had to move the boat as well in the re-config which takes the most time.  They did paint themselves in a corner with the initial boat location on Sunday in particular as the westerly shift made the boat the "right corner" of the racecourse.  Our PRO was one of the best out there so I'm sure there's good reason for setting up where he did.  Either way we got in 4 races on Saturday, 4 on Sunday and doing 2 on Sunday was definitely the right call to allow for on shore boat management time for the many travelers we had.  Personally, I'd much prefer to sail as square a course as possible than do a drag race.  Tactics are a wonderful thing to use when you don't win the start.

 

WCB

Super Anarchist
4,407
865
Park City, UT
No Vipers but 36 VXOnes.  Tied for their biggest fleet ever.  I think M24's have been struggling for some years now nationally?   CORA changed their flag to make Sperry happy and they were gone anyway.  I think they just were trying for an excuse and when they got what they asked for they went quiet...

The date change was perfect.  I've done at least 10 of these events and it was the first year I can remember sailing a full, solid 3 days without some sort of weather delay or shut down.  I'll take a 10 race regatta any day.
Melges 24s had 33 last year I think it was but this year the Worlds are next week in Ft. Lauderdale so teams that would have done Charleston are in Florida prepping and practicing.

 

Gone Drinking

Super Anarchist
1,402
48
Hopefully this lets Phlotilla fade off in the distance. 









[SIZE=10.5pt]North Sails Group is pleased to announce the addition of Yacht Scoring to its family. Founded in 2016 by Luiz Kahl, Yacht Scoring is an easy-to-use yet powerful web-based race management and scoring tool used by hundreds of yacht clubs and race organizers around the globe. Kahl, who passed away unexpectedly in 2021, was a software developer by trade, a competitive sailboat racer, and a passionate race committee volunteer. This addition to North Sails Group is part of an ongoing mission to support the sport of sailing and increase participation. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt] [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]Yacht Scoring[/SIZE][SIZE=10.5pt] is a race management and scoring system that simplifies the task of event registration and communications while allowing for complete results in near-real-time. The single online data-based platform streamlines regatta management and eliminates the need to maintain multiple independent spreadsheets for entry lists, scratch sheets, ratings, and competitors' information. For sailors, Yacht Scoring's quick and easy sign-in and live scoring program delivers immediate race results, helping sailors know the score before they return to the dock. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt] [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]"Luiz uniquely blended an innovative business model with an unmatched level of customer support," comments Ken Read, President of North Sails Group. "It was not uncommon to see him working hand-in-hand with race committees to ensure the success of their event. He didn't do this because it was a requirement of using his services; Luiz did it because he was committed to helping sailors at all levels of the sport. It is our intention to follow his lead with this same service that he prided himself on.” [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt] [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]"Yacht Scoring is a tool to help race committees focus on what's important, letting sailors have fun on the water," says Gui Kahl, Luiz’s brother. "In just ten years, Luiz grew Yacht Scoring into a must-have regatta management platform used by thousands of sailors. Beyond his business, Luiz was an avid supporter of Warrior Sailing, youth sailing, and Bayview Yacht Club, his home club, which will continue to be supported by Yacht Scoring.” Gui further explains, “The continuation of Yacht Scoring by the North Sails Group preserves Luiz's legacy and will keep building on his vision.” [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]The ease and accuracy of Yacht Scoring for race committees, sailors and volunteers with regard to all aspects of sailboat racing, from entry to scoring, will remain unchanged. The Kahl family extends their gratitude to Rob Bunn for his dedication and time over the last several months. A personal friend of Luiz’s, Rob was instrumental in keeping Yacht Scoring moving forward and operational for sailing and the sailing community. He will remain as interim manager of Yacht Scoring to ensure a seamless transition with the North Sails Group. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt] [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]For more information on:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]Yacht Scoring:[/SIZE][SIZE=10.5pt][/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]https://www.yachtscoring.com/howitworks.cfm[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt] [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]Media Inquiries:[/SIZE][SIZE=10.5pt][/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]Bridgid Murphy  |  [email protected][/SIZE]









 
We had a situation at the weather mark of Circle One that I'd never encountered before.

The last J-24 around the mark was a little short, tried to shoot the mark and, with the strong current, ended up with the mark alongside. Yes, there was a heavy weight, signal, down the anchor rode 7 feet. But that only served to 'anchor' the buoy to the boat. The weather mark was dragged down beyond the offset mark with the current, still in the right direction for the course, perpendicular to the wind direction. Finally, after some minutes, the mark was disentangled. 

The two old guys on the windward mark-set boat immediately picked up the yellow mark. But it had tangled with the offset anchor rode. Here came the 35+ VX1 fleet. We had no choice but to let the mark go.

Every boat went around the offset first, then the yellow windward mark. It was a bummer to those who were aiming for the usual rounding to find a white little ball over to starboard fifty feet. Fun to watch, though.

The only other alternative was to abandon the race for that big fleet and take the time to extract the mark. Happily, the fleet would rather count the otherwise outstanding contest.

If we had just a little more time, we would have tied the two marks together. Those VX1s are just too fast!

 Dave Ellis

 

RobbieB

Super Anarchist
3,160
1,655
Charleston, SC
We had a situation at the weather mark of Circle One that I'd never encountered before.

The last J-24 around the mark was a little short, tried to shoot the mark and, with the strong current, ended up with the mark alongside. Yes, there was a heavy weight, signal, down the anchor rode 7 feet. But that only served to 'anchor' the buoy to the boat. The weather mark was dragged down beyond the offset mark with the current, still in the right direction for the course, perpendicular to the wind direction. Finally, after some minutes, the mark was disentangled. 

The two old guys on the windward mark-set boat immediately picked up the yellow mark. But it had tangled with the offset anchor rode. Here came the 35+ VX1 fleet. We had no choice but to let the mark go.

Every boat went around the offset first, then the yellow windward mark. It was a bummer to those who were aiming for the usual rounding to find a white little ball over to starboard fifty feet. Fun to watch, though.

The only other alternative was to abandon the race for that big fleet and take the time to extract the mark. Happily, the fleet would rather count the otherwise outstanding contest.

If we had just a little more time, we would have tied the two marks together. Those VX1s are just too fast!

 Dave Ellis
Thanks for that explanation.  As one of the Vx'ers I wondered how things got fubar'ed.  I think we all just quickly figured we had to leave both marks to port and so we did!  Damn J24's....

 

Semper_Windy

New member
41
10
Charleston
For what little it may be worth: 

  1. We had a great time, crew wants to do it again. 



    3 ladies > 60, 1 > 45
  2. 2 men > 60

[*]The positive aspects: 


  1. Superb weather for event, sunny, 5-15 kts winds
  2. Nice balance of shoreside activities, good food and drink
  3. Welcoming regatta staff/volunteers
  4. Welcoming and helpful venue staff  at Charleston Harbor Marina

[*]Negative aspects: 


  1. Phlotilla App


    Poor functionality on limited bandwidth
  2. Advertising was more prominent than information
  3. Messaging all skippers (attendees?) on all protests

[*]Overnight delivery leads to mental fatigue ($100/day dock fee discourages longer tenancy)


  1. Sailed outside 100 miles offshore in 17 hours dock to dock 
  2. Motored back inside ICW 18 hours dock to dock

[*]2+ knots of current IN the marina leads to interesting docking with a full keel boat

[*]Starting at or before onset of the Ebb leads to sailing entire race in a single current direction


  1. low favorable current going out, strong adverse current returning due to timing of starts


    Effect is to benefit the lower rated later starters... 



[*]Requiring use of Commercial Ship Channel marks as Gates forced racers into Channel 


  1. Worst adverse current (> 3Kts) location
  2. Busy Ship Traffic added complexity

[*]Focus on little boats made it clear that the circle 5&6 fleets were low priority to Regatta, while our RO and mark boats did a great job. 



[*]Suggestions: 


  1. Time the event weekend/starting times to get a tide direction change mid race, or for the windward leeward small boats, between races. 
  2. Provide WiFi on "the beach", as was available in the marina to facilitate Phlotilla

[*]Take aways: 


  1. Be more sure you are looking at the course selection vs the Start table (retired from race 1 for sailing wrong course) 
  2. Be more aware that the radio channel for check in is not used for announcements
  3. Be content when you have "Grannies for grinders" that the tacking will be more sedate than you are used to. 


    Leave sufficient room that if the tack is blown, you don't hit the sea buoy in the current

[*]When your foredeck has never set an Asymmetric before, be prepared for some learnings 





We took a "retired", 5th, & 7th to come in 8th overall in Pursuit B. 
Glad to have you out there - certainly looked nice seeing a great ketch going round our marks!  Sorry I missed this thread til it was all over.  I was out there with you on Cheers (Santana 30/30) and missed you at the party as I was chasing my little toddler dancing around the beach...

This was my second CRW and a great improvement vs last year where we didn't have any real shore events.  

I'd agree your suggestions would be better for offshore, but I think they have to optimize for the four inshore circles with the majority of racers.  They run so many races in a day they can't really time the tides.  Not to mention they have to thread the dates every April between Easter, some other local event the name I forgot, etc and you're only left with so much.  But when we do local offshore stints, they do try to time it so you at least get a friendly tide coming back in - though that can be hard when you have a mixed fleet with PHRF anywhere from -90 (trimaran) and -6 (Club Swan 42) all the way to the guys who finish bloody damn near a day later with full keels at 280+!  Sooo - we end up having to dip into the channel with max ebb tide and you're barely making headway as you round the mark!!  Still - makes for lively conversations at the back of the boat!

 
Thanks for that explanation.  As one of the Vx'ers I wondered how things got fubar'ed.  I think we all just quickly figured we had to leave both marks to port and so we did!  Damn J24's....
Here is a question: The offset mark was to starboard of the windward mark, rather than the standard off to port, looking upwind.

Marks left to port.

What if a boat rounded the windward mark between it and the now misplaced offset and just took off downwind. Would it not have then left both marks to port in the final analysis? The "string' would seem to make it OK. I think. What do you think.....

One VX1 did just that, as shown on the TP2 Day Two film. 

 




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