Circuit Breaker Question

[Junkyard Dog]

Sorry for my ignorance, but I need to find out if a 40 Amp 240v circuit breaker running an electric oven/range can be replaced with two 20 AMP single pole circuit breakers ganged together.

I'm trying to help out an elderly neighbor, but her stuff is very old and she can't afford to replace the entire panel.

The panel is antique, and finding replacement breakers is difficult.

While the brand is different, can I replace something like this:

with something like this?

 

[tommays]

1. While it might not need the full 40 amps (name plate on appliance should say) 20 is unlikely to be enough and needs to offer identical protection such as shutting off BOTH poles in a fault condition which is a requirement for this type of breaker 

2. It’s critically important that the breaker “snaps” onto the lugs correctly to avoid a fire from the excessive heat a bad connection would make 

3. The second breaker you picture has the poles connected which should function for tripping both 

 

[flyingdog]

No, you can use (2) 40A single pole breakers with a handle tie.

 

[Junkyard Dog]

No, you can use (2) 40A single pole breakers with a handle tie.

That's what I thought. I just can't find them. She really needs to replace the entire panel.

 

[mikewof]

Is the original Square D? If so, Schneider likely still makes that 40 amp one. It has to snap in correctly, usually can't cross brands. I needed some really weird breakers in the Square D slim tandem format, but I couldn't find them at the home stores. I went to the Square D dealer. Call this guy, I bet he has the one you need in stock, and the company is employee owned ...

Mike Smith
Dealers Electrical Supply
Denver
303-592-2800
[email protected]

If he asks who sent you, I'm a friend of the late Kurt, the mechanic on Downing.

 

[dyslexic dog]

First, my thought is if you don't understand it, you shouldn't be doing it. 

The Sq D breaker is a two pole 40a per leg breaker with one handle. No, you can not put two twenty amps together safely. Two 40a single pole are odd ducks but they are available but why would you do that? 

What is it you can not find? a QO240 breaker pictured?

 

[DA-WOODY]

like someone asking about handling a loaded gun

if ya gutta ask ..... Don't touch it !!!!!!

 

[Ventucky Red]

I don't think what you're looking for can be found at Home Depot... go to a REAL electrical supply house.  I do believe the Square D still makes them.

https://www.grainger.com/product/1D311?ef_id=EAIaIQobChMImtC73Ljx9gIVvyitBh1wyQxJEAQYBSABEgJEkPD_BwE:G:s&s_kwcid=AL!2966!3!281698275261!!!g!470952775331!&gucid=N:NSaid:GGL:CSM-2295:4P7A1P:20501231&gclid=EAIaIQobChMImtC73Ljx9gIVvyitBh1wyQxJEAQYBSABEgJEkPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Personally, I wouldn't mess with it.  I would help your neighbor get an electrician in there and have them look it over.  If it is tripping, maybe there is some other problem that needs to be looked at. 

Lastly, maybe your neighbor needs to upgrade the stove to one that draws less power.

 

[Point Break]

Well..............I would still run the question by an electrician but from a layperson point of view..........a single 40 amp breaker is meant to trip at 40 amps.......duh........a ganged 20 amp in a 240 configuration would protect each side or phase of the circuit at only 20 amps. If the oven draws 40 it would trip the 20 amp breaker on either/both sides?

What am I missing here?

 

[See Level]

Why does the breaker need replacing? Is there maybe something else wrong?

 

[mikewof]

like someone asking about handling a loaded gun

if ya gutta ask ..... Don't touch it !!!!!!

I had to change some breakers, was very much afraid of the box. My electrician friend told me that it's no big deal, just turn off the main breaker and get to work. Luckily, he was standing right there. I turn off the main, go to pull out the breaker, he's like "woah, man, what are you doing?" "I turned off the main." "But the bottom of the circuit is still hot, you nearly touched it!"

I was more careful after that, so yeah, you're probably right.

 

[Mrleft8]

40 amps!!!!??? My 30" Bandsaw didn't draw anywhere near that, even on start up!

Any single household item drawing over 40A is broken in some manner.

 

[F_L]

40 amps!!!!??? My 30" Bandsaw didn't draw anywhere near that, even on start up!

Any single household item drawing over 40A is broken in some manner.

The industry standard for an electric stove is a 50 amp double-pole circuit breaker.

The above from google.

 

[gptyk]

The industry standard for an electric stove is a 50 amp double-pole circuit breaker.

The above from google.

Also by my knowledge and experience. An electric range can really suck it down. 

Upthread is correct. A dual pole 40A with a tie is what is needed. if you can verify 6g wire 50A would be ok. 8g would be 40A.

What brand breakers? Some (like zinsco) it's way better to replace the panel. Yes, it's expensive. But so is a total fire loss.

 

[Cal20sailor]

The industry standard for an electric stove is a 50 amp double-pole circuit breaker.

The above from google.

It's been eons since I thought about any of this but the above is exactly what my condo has with a very plain vanilla electric stove.  I see 240v, and I run for cover.  I enjoy peace of mind way too much.

 

[Chris in Santa Cruz CA]

One of my long time friends is a master electrician and lives .8 miles away. Has helped me many times. I can run Romex and wire up 4 gang switch boxes and gfci sockets etc. if has to do with a box, circuit design/gauge, or breaker, he gets called and he gets paid. The code exists for a reason and that reason is fire. Fire is bad. He not only knows the code he knows what you should do beyond the code so you never have to think about it again. Running 220 out to an out building to do x? Design the circuit for 2x or 3x just in case a potter wants to put in a kiln or someone wants to weld. Running it underground? Oversized conduit and leave a fish line in it in case someone wants to pull tv cable or cat 6 or just run it all at once one time. Pulling cable is fun.

 

[Cal20sailor]

 Pulling cable is fun.

That's what she said!

 

[Point Break]

Pulling cable is fun.

I pulled big wire through conduit in my crawl space to serve the kitchen and landed it in a sub panel to feed the kitchen. I wouldn’t characterize it as……fun.  :lol:

 

[Cal20sailor]

I pulled big wire through conduit in my crawl space to serve the kitchen and landed it in a sub panel to feed the kitchen. I wouldn’t characterize it as……fun.  :lol:

First time I've seen 'crawl space' and 'fun' in the same sentence.