Complete race boat instrument system

bushsailor

Anarchist
638
127
QLD Australia
We run a complete B&G H5000 system.

I am seeking alternatives to the system with pretty basic criteria.

  • Accurate wind information, speed, AWA, TWA, wind direction.
  • Boat speed through the water and GPS speed.
  • Current.
  • Clear displays.
  • Autopilot that can steer an accurate course and can also steer well to TWA/AWA.

If I could find a reliable simple alternative I would sell the B&G system 

 

solosailor

Super Anarchist
3,644
595
San Francisco Bay
I'd say, if you haven't already, get your system properly calibrated......   "accurate" wind is not as easy as it sounds (tall wand?).  If the AP is critical take a look at NKE.

 

BobJ

Super Anarchist
1,206
150
I also have a B&G 5000 system.  I've hit a plateau in my own ability to calibrate it and the local gurus only want to work on the high-end race boat$.

Solo, any suggestions?

 

solosailor

Super Anarchist
3,644
595
San Francisco Bay
First, stick index finger in mouth.....   raise in the air.    Well I don't have any wind instruments but I have been around a few that have been professionally calibrated.   So many variables that are effected by angle to the wind, etc....  updraft, downdraft, etc.    I wish I had a good referral.  

 

Robc

New member
43
1
uk
Try A&t.... can probably keep your displays, much simpler to calibrate / see what’s going on via web interface, just launched their own pilot too....

 

bushsailor

Anarchist
638
127
QLD Australia
well after a winter campaign I bit the bullet and sold the whole B&G H5000 system and installed a raymarine system.

Much less expensive, easy to install except for the stupid idea of different cables and surprise surprise it works perfectly after about 10 minutes of calibration.

We are using Axiom 7 as the displays, again easy to use and fully programmable.

Wind data appears stable and accurate, plenty good enough to steer to at night.

This is just a heads up to others that may have been suffering from the same problems as us. (Half these forums are about how to fix B&G this and that.....)

 

George Hackett

Super Anarchist
I too am thinking of shit canning the H5000 stuff on Misty and all the others stuff that comes with it for a Raymarine setup.  
 

On our J35, I am running the wireless masthead unit, the Airmar Tri-Ducer and Fluxgate Compass on the wireless Hull Transmitter, which is picked up by the MicroTalk.  The MicroTalk is wired into the Axiom 9 which feeds info in both direction. And then the MicroTalk feeds the racy looking Wireless Readouts on the mast.  
 

and I get all the same info the H5000 gives me.  It is easy to install. I can ping start lines. There are performance comparisons to other boats that are similar if not, your boat like let’s say a J109. I actually use the J109 as my performance comparison and if I hit 90% or better, I know I am doing something right. 
 

it is a shame that Raymarine is known as a fishing company when their sailing side is really good for the price you pay.  If I remember, there is a large Mills designed Cruiser/Racer that runs Raymarine with three Axioms on the mast.  So yes, Raymarine is more than capable of doing good sailing setups. 

 

Itsabimmerthing

Anarchist
768
11
Europe
Haven't seen a Raymarine system that gives useful data at all points of sail, heel, and so on. As far as I know the RM system(s) are limited in calibrations, damping, processing power, you name it. (I'm pretty sure there is a reason no ambitious teams use RM)

I think the OP's problem is/was the lack of effort needed for proper calibration. And of course the systems needs to be installed and set up correctly.

 

George Hackett

Super Anarchist
Haven't seen a Raymarine system that gives useful data at all points of sail, heel, and so on. As far as I know the RM system(s) are limited in calibrations, damping, processing power, you name it. (I'm pretty sure there is a reason no ambitious teams use RM)

I think the OP's problem is/was the lack of effort needed for proper calibration. And of course the systems needs to be installed and set up correctly.
Raymarine, never that I know of, claimed to be an America’ Cup level product. But it is a dam good product just like the rest of them including B&G’s club level packag. So if you are looking for a good quality club level products that you can take to an occasional international regatta?  Raymarine can, and has done it. 

 

Hitchhiker

Super Anarchist
4,257
987
Saquo-Pilia Hensha
I’m in the process of buying a “gasp” powerboat! It has a Raymarine multifunction chart plotter.  I will definitely be buying a wind sensor package for it.  Should work a beaut in that app.  Later on I will be buying a smallish boat for short handed racing.  It will not be fitted with any type of Raymarine wind or boat speed package.  Their systems are great for cruising sailing and power boating.  But if you want true hi res sailing data, IMHO the only systems in the game are from B&G, NKE and A+T.  Then Sailmon and Garmin.  For sure, the high end systems require care and feeding, that initially seems intimidating, but once the routine is established the pay off is huge.

As @Itsabimmerthing noted above.  There is a reason the top teams aren’t using Raymarine packages

 

Alex W

Super Anarchist
3,300
292
Seattle, WA
As far as I know the RM system(s) are limited in calibrations, damping,
On my RM system (most components are 7 years old and predate Axiom) has multipoint calibration curves for speed through water (but single point for wind) and dampening settings for everything.  It’s possible to make it more accurate than I’ve ever invested the time in. 

It can also show current (someone asked that). 

 

bushsailor

Anarchist
638
127
QLD Australia
I agree that one of our main complaints with the B&G was the constant calibrations that were required.

I want to turn up to the boat turn everything on and expect it to work.

Having said that we have had top level sailors on the boat for campaigns(world champions/Americas cup) and they were just as frustrated as I was.

The new system is fairly accurate, the only thing it seems to do is overread wind speed when sailing fast downwind(it is a very fast boat). That can probably be calibrated out as well. (and no it is not updraft as it does it with fractional gear as well)

The last boat had a B&G H2000 system which was 12 yr old and it worked perfectly.

The display numbers are not as crisp as the B&G displays though.

 

JMOD

Super Anarchist
1,173
91
Netherlands
B&G works great if you know what you want from it. friend who does high level sailing runs h5000 systems with expedition and has added different polars for starting and racing etc. but they spend a day before a regatta on finetuning the numbers if they have new sails for the race. but again, that is high level sailing. for most people, an h5000 system like that is overkill. Also, if you have not calibrated your sensors or laser aligned your wind unit, measurements will be off. computing numbers with garbage, gives garbage output. 

most people can/should live happily with a Raymarine set or B&G triton set as they do not need (or want) the flexibility an H5000 brings to the table. 

 

bfp

Member
459
4
The new system is fairly accurate, the only thing it seems to do is overread wind speed when sailing fast downwind(it is a very fast boat). That can probably be calibrated out as well. (and no it is not updraft as it does it with fractional gear as well)
Still an upwash issue and your might struggle to cal it out with Raymarine - hence one of the advantages of the H5000/processor type systems, if you put the effort into getting it right.

It would be interesting to see the stability of the your wind data with the Raymarine - what I found was rather disappointing.

I am going the other way right now after becoming frustrated with the lack of ability to calibrate the Raymarine gear on my boat and am now installing a full H5000 set-up.

I guess it is the difference between wanting to turn up and turn the gear on and go sailing and wanting to turn up, turn the gear on and wanting it to output the most correct answer it can rather than just "an" answer.

 
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