Covid Casualty or Deliberate Fraud? Not such a Great Circle

Ncik

Super Anarchist
2,175
395
Fuck that, I've ordered & received 2 sails Feb 2020 through today.
Made locally or internationally?

For sure the lack of communication is concerning.

I'm just pointing out that the pitchforks may be presumptuous. Unless someone has news to the contrary the guy could be lying in a hospital bed, with no extra help choking required.

 
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Sail4beer

Super Anarchist
9,791
3,256
Toms River,NJ
Let's just wait for a better explanation for a long-running and arguably well-regarded business going bust than "he's a fraudster".
We waited long enough for this to be anything other than fraud. I got a set of sails during Covid. I also know the sailmaker so I have a high level of trust. Brian Hancock had made his own bed and that you think that this peanut gallery is being judge and jury is “kind of” funny. We’re just reacting to a crazy story of theft and fraud by a guy in the industry. You don’t have to be the SJW for Onesails either.

And the claim that covid is the logical explanation is purely your opinion. Perhaps you can contact Brian and clear all this up for us. He will appreciate you brokering his re-emergence into the professional sailmaker’s world. 
 

As a victim of fraud myself, I doubt that Mr. Hancock will even return your email or call. If he does, get back to us and the people who are out their hard earned money and let us know his side of the story.
 

My rip off artist tried to use the money I gave him for a centerfold spread in Sailing World in 2016 instead of being an honest businessman. But, that’s just my opinion and my bank’s as well. At least I got to see boat as boat of the year in a magazine with sails up and sailing. 

 

gn4478

Member
404
194
Perth Amboy, NJ
Made locally or internationally?

For sure the lack of communication is concerning.

I'm just pointing out that the pitchforks may be presumptuous. Unless someone has news to the contrary the guy could be lying in a hospital bed, with no extra help choking required.
He screwed multiple people by the posts on many sites. He went dark. He is a fraud.

 

Fiji Bitter

I love Fiji Bitter
4,467
1,296
In the wild.
Is this shit still going on?

And has the Ed still not put another one of his "opinion" pieces on the FP, a kind of "bye bye, I'm off, fuck you all" farewell piece?

Come on @Editoryou could even write it yourself, same style...

PS. Don't forget to mention the Whitbread, and Skip.

PPS. To be honest, I'm afraid this somehow must be a sad story, actually.

 
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Ncik

Super Anarchist
2,175
395
NCIK, if wearre youre monney, woude you be so patiente and forgiveng?  S4B hasse showen patients and udderstandeng, plesae tellus howe/when you you haive done the saime.  Ime am open to annythinge you maye offere.                :)
I have been defrauded thousands of dollars by an employer, years prior to covid. It was frustrating but I let the administration of the business progress and still ended up with nothing. I certainly didn't suggest "choking" my ex-boss, as was mentioned in this thread.

I'm holding off on buying anything major until the pandemic is settled down a bit, sails included, although I'm only a dinghy sailor so not a major purchase. I fully understand teh frustration, particularly if you ordered in October 2019 before the pandemic. It's a fine line between fraud and failed business, there's no manual for how to end a failing business.

 

Snaggletooth

Morrelle Compasse
32,880
5,046
I have been defrauded thousands of dollars by an employer, years prior to covid. It was frustrating but I let the administration of the business progress and still ended up with nothing. I certainly didn't suggest "choking" my ex-boss, as was mentioned in this thread.

I'm holding off on buying anything major until the pandemic is settled down a bit, sails included, although I'm only a dinghy sailor so not a major purchase. I fully understand teh frustration, particularly if you ordered in October 2019 before the pandemic. It's a fine line between fraud and failed business, there's no manual for how to end a failing business.
OK, I appreciatte youre losse and patiente approache, and Ime am siurre youre debtores do to, butte why go aftere S4B whoise reactione ist moeste normalle?

( Youre karma bildes at geometric rate.              :)    )

 

Ncik

Super Anarchist
2,175
395
Still, I'd be interested to know if anyone knows any scuttlebutt about Jan Reuvers / Dynasails.
A cross-over from another case of sails not being delivered...

https://www.gonewiththewynns.com/sailmakers-stole-our-money

A relevant quote from link...

"

Court Case

Here is the court case I mention in the video: Quantum Sail Design Grp. v. Jannie Reuvers Sails, Ltd. 

"

There seems to be more to this than Great Circle Sails and simple fraud.

(I see this was already mentioned up thread.)

 
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Somebody Else

a person of little consequence
7,591
769
PNW
Always deal with someone you know or someone who someone you know can vouch for.
Yes.

As near as 150 years ago one would send a Letter of Introduction ahead of conducting business. A letter from a mutually trusted person was doubleplusgood. Never mind that you could travel there as quickly as the letter could; letters and humans both crossed oceans via sailboats.

 

Decay

New member
23
14
For those of you saying "buy from a local reputable loft" Brian Hancock WAS a local reputable loft. Great Circle Sails is run out of his house in Marblehead, local to lots of sailors (this isn't doxing, it's public info). There were plenty of good reviews and testimonials.

Anyway, as I said in the other thread, in one of his very last communications before disappearing Brian told me that Jan Reuvers (not Craig Millar) actually manufactured my sail. He said the sail was finished but Jan was unreachable. I emailed Jan and received one reply confirming it was the right person, then nothing when I mentioned Brian and the missing sail. So the problem may well be with Jan Reuvers. Brian might not be quite as full of shit as some are saying.

However, I ended up filing a small claims suit against Great Circle Sails. It would be one thing if the sails were delayed for a long time by covid (or anything else explainable) and Brian stayed in touch about it, but he disappeared with my deposit and won't communicate. It's not my job to chase his contract manufacturer.

 
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gn4478

Member
404
194
Perth Amboy, NJ
For those of you saying "buy from a local reputable loft" Brian Hancock WAS a local reputable loft. Great Circle Sails is run out of his house in Marblehead, local to lots of sailors (this isn't doxing, it's public info). There were plenty of good reviews and testimonials.

Anyway, as I said in the other thread, in one of his very last communications before disappearing Brian told me that Jan Reuvers (not Craig Millar) actually manufactured my sail. He said the sail was finished but Jan was unreachable. I emailed Jan and received one reply confirming it was the right person, then nothing when I mentioned Brian and the missing sail. So the problem may well be with Jan Reuvers. Brian might not be quite as full of shit as some are saying.

However, I ended up filing a small claims suit against Great Circle Sails. It would be one thing if the sails were delayed for a long time by covid (or anything else explainable) and Brian stayed in touch about it, but he disappeared with my deposit and won't communicate. It's not my job to chase his contract manufacturer.
It is a tangled web indeed.  I believe that after Jan Reuvers and Quantum severed ties, Jan continued operations in the same physical loft. Quantum sued him and Ullman for using their methods. Ullman was dropped from the suit. Quantum initially lost the first decision but a later decision against Jan was for millions.  The same contract loft was being used by Ullman sails.  Craig Millar at one time worked for Quantum and then was the International President of Ullman sails.  Jan and Craig had some falling out over an issue of which I am not privy to. Ullman maintained a relationship with Jan. Craig went on his own.  Sounds like Brian was using multiple contract lofts.  Sorry that Jan would not honor the deal. Craig did.  

 

MauiPunter

Will sail for food
So, in this same vain, if I am dealing with Doyle Sails in Marblehead/Salem, who am I really dealing with?  I had always assumed the loft was owned and run by Doyle Sails.  I know some of the sails are still coming from Asia, and I am sure there are some made onsite, or at least modified when the loft in Asia screws something up or need to be tweaked.  What are the details with Doyle Sails?

 

gn4478

Member
404
194
Perth Amboy, NJ
So, in this same vain, if I am dealing with Doyle Sails in Marblehead/Salem, who am I really dealing with?  I had always assumed the loft was owned and run by Doyle Sails.  I know some of the sails are still coming from Asia, and I am sure there are some made onsite, or at least modified when the loft in Asia screws something up or need to be tweaked.  What are the details with Doyle Sails?
I think you need to ask! I do know that many lofts are owned by the local sailmaker and not the National Brand

 
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