Curious Double Fatality at Sea

[drude]

Very common on big boats. The sheet goes to a winch.

Thanks. Just read up on it. I've learned something today.

 

[MauiPunter]

Thanks.

It's a button control on the mast below the gooseneck or at least was back in 2019. Don't think it was ever changed. Meant you had to push the button and control the winch while holding on. It's one thing I did not like and hence the discussion with Anne-Marie and Volker. Not saying that was/is the cause but just one thing I didn't like. It's ok in calm seas but I'd prefer it back in the cockpit when the stress levels go up.

I think all we can ever do is learn from crap like this and try and make sure it doesn't happen to us. Just sad to lose two lovely people and thinking of their families.

What a terrible design. I cant believe CNB didn't place it at the helm like 99% of other boats with the same system. That could have been the difference between life and death for them.

 

[kent_island_sailor]

I vote no on a murder scheme because only the dumbest criminal would leave the bodies on the boat.
"A big wave washed them off" is a 100% foolproof scheme unless one of the two perps brags about throwing them off. Also they got nothing out of this, they didn't try to make off with the boat or anything else that would earn them a buck.

 

[SV Tom Crean]

Thanks. Just read up on it. I've learned something today.

Here you go. Powered winch on cockpit floor. No track.

 

[billy backstay]

Meant you had to push the button and control the winch while holding on. It's one thing I did not like and hence the discussion with Anne-Marie and Volker. Not saying that was/is the cause but just one thing I didn't like. It's ok in calm seas but I'd prefer it back in the cockpit when the stress levels go up.

I think all we can ever do is learn from crap like this and try and make sure it doesn't happen to us. Just sad to lose two lovely people and thinking of their families.

So reefing safely is a two-person task, so the person at the mask can use one hand to hold on, and or be closely short-tethered. I can see why you didn't like it!!

Condolences for your friends who were lost, hope something is learned from this for future boats, reefing-furling set-ups...
.

 

[Tylo]

What a terrible design. I cant believe CNB didn't place it at the helm like 99% of other boats with the same system. That could have been the difference between life and death for them.

I'm not sure what kind of system this yacht uses, or if my experience is representative, but the furling booms I've worked with have required very strict management of boom angle and sheet tension when furling to ensure that the sail furls properly in the boom and doesn't start "walking" backwards or forwards. If this is the case, on a boat as big as this with a park avenue-style furling boom, the main sheet furling/mandrel may not be visible from the helm so someone would have to go forward anyway to keep track of the furling progress.

That is the only reason I can think of for putting the buttons on the mast; being able to do the furling and while seeing the how the sail is "stacking" on the mandrel. I assume the main halyard is at the mast as well (there seem to be two powered winches there at least) so the person who up there is able to control sheet tension while furling which makes it a one-person job but also effectively eliminates any chance of holding on properly (or limiting it to holding the main halyard at least).

I do agree that for double-handed sailors it would make more sense to have one person at the mast monitoring the furling progress and maybe controlling sheet tension while another controls the furler from the helm but at 66 ft communication between the mast step and the helm may not be possible in all conditions, it must be quite far between the two locations.

 

[floater]

Also they got nothing out of this..

except a shocking and no doubt traumatic experience.

 

[V21]

I agree, I doubt it's a terrible flawed idea and no one thought about putting controls in the cockpit. I think it's located purposely to stop people mashing buttons without being able to see everything

 

[kent_island_sailor]

I suddenly like my crappy reefing system a bit better.

 

[Howler]

Not limited to large rigs. A J/35 boom can kill you just as dead as the boom on a 65-foot boat.

Hell, a Laser boom can kill you too: in an uncontrolled gybe it'll swing like a major league batter's bat.

 

[Calling Elvis]

From the pics, shouldn’t that boom clear anyones head by a good amount, almost regardless of where they are standing, and if the wife was struck by the boom, she would be on the deck or overboard, how would the husband be hit by the boom helping her? Wouldn’t there be damage to that dodger and/or the lifelines if it dropped that low due to loss of sheeting and boomvang?

 

[MauiPunter]

From the pics, shouldn’t that boom clear anyones head by a good amount, almost regardless of where they are standing, and if the wife was struck by the boom, she would be on the deck or overboard, how would the husband be hit by the boom helping her? Wouldn’t there be damage to that dodger and/or the lifelines if it dropped that low due to loss of sheeting and boomvang?

Failed boom vang. There is no topping lift on that rig.

 

[Calling Elvis]

Failed boom vang. There is no topping lift on that rig.

Does look like that, was just wondering how the dodger wouldn’t stop the boom on one side or the other. My questions aren’t meant to be leading or anything, never sailed on a boat like that, just genuinely curious how that could happen and how to avoid something seriously sad on a much smaller boat.

 

[Latadjust]

This boat is sort of a flush deck design, very exposed helm stations and "cockpit", main sheet right in the midst, that thing could lasso crew/helmsman in an unexpected jibe.

 

[ExOmo]

Paltino

 

[Panoramix]

Do some passage making on a small boat then on a big boat and you'll understand why.

Yes, bigger is more comfortable but according to the spec, a CNB66 lightship displaces 31 tons!!! That is seriously big and at some point you hit the domain of diminishing returns...

During the 90s Finot designed for his family the cigale 14m, it displaces 10 tons, it is big enough to be comfortable and roomy and relatively fast, built in aluminium so reasonably foolproof. Now the 30 years old design is dated but IMHO it is a much better compromise in term of size for a husband and wife crew who can sail comfortably without having to deal with a "small ship".

 

[Ex Machina]

Paltino

Very fuckin sad event that and upset many in the sailing world here . The forum discussions were very much like this thread but with some serious disrespect being thrown around .

 

[SV Tom Crean]

Very fuckin sad event that and upset many in the sailing world here . The forum discussions were very much like this thread but with some serious disrespect being thrown around .

Agreed. Two very lovely people who absolutely loved doing what we all love - sailing. They were living their dream. To be taken like this is just so sad and cruel.

 

[cje]

I just took a moment of silence.

 

[TUBBY]

All the electric winch needs!