Curious Double Fatality at Sea

H

Howler

Animal control officer
424
430
I know something that a lot of other people don't know:

I'm not smarter, or wiser, or a better sailor, or inherently luckier, or more favored by God, or more immune to mishaps, or whatever, than these two who lost their lives.

And neither are any of us.

The sea simply does not fuck around, nor does it graciously offer second chances.
 
B

Bow

New member
10
8
Canada East...
Latadjust said:
It would be interesting to hear from the recovery skipper about how they went about locating the boat, search pattern, the whole tale.
Click to expand...

My company helped salvage the boat, we used ice flow prediction software from last know position to determine where the boat had drifted. The rigging failure was within the hydraulic vang system causing it to fall onto deck/dodger.
 
MauiPunter

MauiPunter

Will sail for food
6,030
2,786
Maui, Las Vegas, Boston
Bow said:
My company helped salvage the boat, we used ice flow prediction software from last know position to determine where the boat had drifted. The rigging failure was within the hydraulic vang system causing it to fall onto deck/dodger.
Click to expand...
Just as I suspected. I assume the victims were hit by the swinging boom.
 
eastbay

eastbay

Member
393
20
Oakland
The loads on those connections must be high- the weight of the sail plus boom, loading eccentrically and cyclically. I wonder what specifically failed and what could be done to have a safety back up OR engineering so it wouldn't ever fail. A redundant topping lift but who would want that slatting around being a PIA if you didn't have to?
Certainly regular inspection (how many of us really do that?) but the flaws preceding failure may not have been visible anyway.

Bow- could you tell what broke?

A real tragedy; may they RIP.
 
L

longy

Overlord of Anarchy
7,443
1,565
San Diego
The boat has a hydraulic vang, visible & un bent in pictures. So if the return gas pressure fails (never seen one fail catastrophically, usually slow leaking) the boom can fall untill the cylinder is tw0 blocked. Then it's rigidly supported again. Mainsheet still works - so boom can be hauled in (pic of boom on dodger) to stop it from motion. A preventer line could then be run from the boom bail out to (? something) to get it off boom & completely secured. All this could have been done from the cockpit/dodger area.
 
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Grande Mastere Dreade

Grande Mastere Dreade

Snag's spellchecker
21,187
5,640
30°26'36.2"N 88°32'13.8"W
Tylo said:
That is the only reason I can think of for putting the buttons on the mast; being able to do the furling and while seeing the how the sail is "stacking" on the mandrel. I assume the main halyard is at the mast as well (there seem to be two powered winches there at least) so the person who up there is able to control sheet tension while furling which makes it a one-person job but also effectively eliminates any chance of holding on properly (or limiting it to holding the main halyard at least).
Click to expand...
maybe the builders were expecting crew to reef the main before the shit hits the fan....
 
S

Skipper Kenny

Member
110
17
pUGET sOUND
eastbay said:
The loads on those connections must be high- the weight of the sail plus boom, loading eccentrically and cyclically. I wonder what specifically failed and what could be done to have a safety back up OR engineering so it wouldn't ever fail. A redundant topping lift but who would want that slatting around being a PIA if you didn't have to?
Certainly regular inspection (how many of us really do that?) but the flaws preceding failure may not have been visible anyway.

Bow- could you tell what broke?

A real tragedy; may they RIP.
Click to expand...
Not to mention all the force from the main sheet while running close hulled. Not my favorite design
 
G

GH41

Member
173
43
HHISC
longy said:
The boat has a hydraulic vang, visible & un bent in pictures. So if the return gas pressure fails (never seen one fail catastrophically, usually slow leaking) the boom can fall untill the cylinder is tw0 blocked. Then it's rigidly supported again. Mainsheet still works - so boom can be hauled in (pic of boom on dodger) to stop it from motion. A preventer line could then be run from the boom bail out to (? something) to get it off boom & completely secured. All this could have been done from the cockpit/dodger area.
Click to expand...
Maybe they got caught between the unsupported boom and the dodger frame. In the picture it looks like the boom is resting on the dodger.
 
eastbay

eastbay

Member
393
20
Oakland
Yeah the two block effect- therefore I was thinking that the mast or boom connection must have failed. God, the thought of that thing drooping from the gooseneck swinging around like a psychotic windshield wiper..... I don't have any idea if that actually happened but it's a scary thought.
 
robalex117

robalex117

Super Anarchist
1,329
276
here and there - sailing mostly now in New England
Interesting in this picture the two parts of mainsheet is all twisted.
https://forums.sailinganarchy.com/threads/curious-double-fatality-at-sea.237643/post-7981287

I used to sail on hi performance catamaran that had a 1:1 mainsheet that went to a 1:2 hydraulic ram and it broke from time to time. We tried to stay ahead of it and change it often but sometimes it broke. Over 7 years I think it broke three times while sailing, always powered up going upwind.
 
shaggybaxter

shaggybaxter

Super Anarchist
4,668
2,764
Australia
I have a copy of the coroners report into the Kiwi boat Platino where the boom beat the living shit out of the boat and killed two crew, it made for compelling reading.

The force of the swinging boom was sufficient to break the mainsheet traveler controller and the traveler car then broke free of the track. The complete failure of the traveler arrangement left the boom swinging from side to side with the mainsheet and traveler hardware hanging from its outboard end.
The motion of the boom was now only restricted by the boom hitting the shrouds10 on either side of the mast.

Loss of control

The owner was the first to make it to the wheel and attempt to take control and the surviving crewmember made his way to the aft deck behind him soon after. The Owner tried to steer while the surviving crewmember ensured there were no ropes in the water so that the engine could be used without risk of entangling the propeller.
The two men worked to turn Platino’s bow into the wind so the sails could be furled away and an attempt made to rescue the crewmember lost overboard. The owner found it very difficult to turn the wheel and impossible to effectively control the yacht. Despite this, Platino was held head to wind for short time and all but the last few metres of the mainsail was furled away.

The boom continued to swing from side to side across the rear of Platino where the owner and the surviving crewmember were located as the yacht rolled on the confused sea. The boom was 8.6 metres long and weighed 678kg with the mainsail furled inside it. A length of the mainsheet was hanging from the end of the boom and the traveler car (which had broken free of its track) was still attached to the end of the mainsheet. The traveler car was 350mm long, weighed just over two kg and the crew described it as acting like a wrecking ball as it quickly caused substantial damage to the rear of the yacht.

After making their way to the helm station, the Owner and the surviving crewmember watched the motion of the boom and lay on the deck each time it swung past. The damage that occurred in the initial few minutes included the following, which happened in close proximity to the two men:

 The helm console (where the hydraulic sail handling controls were mounted) was smashed off of its pedestal while the Owner was at the wheel. This happened before he was able to finish furling all of the mainsail or any of the headsail (the headsail remained half furled as it had been set). The surviving crewmember soon realised that the broken helm console was interfering with the steering wheel, making it even more difficult to turn. He used his legs to push the console away until he was later able to tie it back from the wheel.

 The bimini was smashed off while the two men were beneath it. This was left hanging by one webbing strap which the surviving crewmember cut to allow it to fall overboard and out of the way.

 The cockpit table was torn from the deck and propelled over the side.

 The steering wheel was buckled and one of its spokes was broken, adding to the difficulty in turning the wheel.

 The life lines at the rear of the yacht were knocked down on the starboard side. The two men were unable to establish any form of effective control over Platino for some time after the initial crash gybes.
 
Student_Driver

Student_Driver

Super Anarchist
2,087
211
Darien
IIRC there was an issue with the auto pilot on Platino that was causing the boat to change course numerous times before the gybe. Then there was the improper preventer set up directly to the deck.

In January, I was on a boat if similar size to Platino and this CNB66 in the atlantic when our boom parted right along the rivets for the hydraulic vang. Conditions were benign 10-14 knots dead astern. We were fortunate to get it under control but did nothing till all 7 crew were on deck.

Vangs cause stress. Not surprising that accidents can be attributed to failures in vangs/booms. Nonetheless, Platino was a cascade of bad decisions.
 
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