Even the Chinese are protesting covidiocy

Parma

Super Anarchist
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Science like politics can be local. There are still (few I hope) folks that believe the earth is flat.

On the other hand it becoming clear that a majority (far from a few) of people see covidiocy (lock-downs, masks, mandates, etc..) as worse than covid itself. Even in China where the population likely has one of the highest mortality risks from covid, its viewed as a low enough risk that folks just don't care.
No.

You can't say that.

I said SCIENCE so I win and you have to be quiet.

In fact now that I've said SCIENCE everybody has to be quiet.

SCIENCE everybody, SCIENCE.
 

NeedAClew

Super Anarchist
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Science is "local" in the flyover state death zones. I guess I should be more sensitive to their losses.
 

The Dark Knight

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1- Sweden did have lockdowns.
Still making that false claim. Last time you couldn’t back it up with evidence that supported your claim, so what’s changed.

Sweden did not institute city wide legally enforceable lockdowns shutting down businesses and forcing residents to stay home, like what was done in China(extreme), Australia, most of Europe and perhaps in some US states.

Advice encouraging working/studying from home, advising social distancing, putting caps on crowd sizes and canceling events etc is not a lockdown.

The Swedish government did eventually give itself laws to allow lockdowns but I cannot find any evidence of them being used.
 

The Dark Knight

Super Anarchist
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What like China? No matter how much you change the definition of "lockdown" Sweden didn't have a lockdown. Surely any definition of lockdown must include closing ALL schools.
You need to understand that the Swedish mentality is vastly different to most of the world.

Swedes trust their governments and their advice. So when asked to stay home, social distance, where masks etc, Swedes listen and act on that advice. On top of that, Sweden has a VERY high proportion of single person households which meant that those that caught it had no one to infect.

So Sweden could, unlike most other countries, avoid needing to be locked down.

If you think you can take the Swedish and apply it to anywhere else, then you are as stupid as steamingpileofshit and the others of his elk.

Sweden should ONLY be discussed in isolation and NEVER be used to compare with other countries.
 

Steam Flyer

Sophisticated Yet Humble
45,305
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1- Sweden did have lockdowns.
Still making that false claim. ...

Not at all. Because it's not a false claim.

I cited the Swedish gov't own Ministry of Health website and a bunch of Swedish news articles. For about the 15th time.

...

Sweden did not institute city wide legally enforceable lockdowns shutting down businesses and forcing residents to stay home, like what was done in China(extreme), Australia, most of Europe and perhaps in some US states.

Advice encouraging working/studying from home, advising social distancing, putting caps on crowd sizes and canceling events etc is not a lockdown.

The Swedish government did eventually give itself laws to allow lockdowns but I cannot find any evidence of them being used.

Yep, "eventually" being about 4~5 months after the start and it was obvious that "let it rip" was stupid and going to have very bad results.

The lockdowns in Sweden were locally mandated and controlled (as their health ministry said), and as you noted, people were tending to follow advice (as in "avoid it like the plague") and no huge outcry. I know they closed some schools but I don't think it was for long periods, like we (the USA) did.

Unlike some people who, when told "avoid it like the plague," instantly start hollering FUCK YOU I'M RUSHING OUT TO CATCH THE PLAGUE!!
 

Chief Stipe

Member
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Not at all. Because it's not a false claim.

I cited the Swedish gov't own Ministry of Health website and a bunch of Swedish news articles. For about the 15th time.
For the zillionth time I point out to you that there are different levels of lockdowns.

Sweden did NOT have a China or even an New Zealand type lockdown. Children still went to school.
 

00seven

James "Grumpy" Bond
3,202
916
Blue marble
For the zillionth time I point out to you that there are different levels of lockdowns.

Sweden did NOT have a China or even an New Zealand type lockdown. Children still went to school.
And none were as locked down as Melbourne, Australia. (Highest covid deaths per capita state as well JBTW)
 

Chief Stipe

Member
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Yep, "eventually" being about 4~5 months after the start and it was obvious that "let it rip" was stupid and going to have very bad results.
But the 4 to 5 months of "let it rip" didn't have very bad results.
The lockdowns in Sweden were locally mandated and controlled (as their health ministry said), and as you noted, people were tending to follow advice (as in "avoid it like the plague") and no huge outcry. I know they closed some schools but I don't think it was for long periods, like we (the USA) did.
Once it was determined that certain age groups were not at risk they moved to protect those that were. It was obvious from the start that children were not at risk but were more at risk by stopping them from going to school. A very enlightened approach that was written into pre-covid pandemic planning.

Contrary to the resident Covidian experts here Sweden did very well and will not have the long term poor health outcomes due to not blowing their economy away!
 

The Dark Knight

Super Anarchist
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But the 4 to 5 months of "let it rip" didn't have very bad results.

Once it was determined that certain age groups were not at risk they moved to protect those that were. It was obvious from the start that children were not at risk but were more at risk by stopping them from going to school. A very enlightened approach that was written into pre-covid pandemic planning.

Contrary to the resident Covidian experts here Sweden did very well and will not have the long term poor health outcomes due to not blowing their economy away!
Swedish results in 2020 were totally fucked. They were punching well above their weight.

Anyway, stop refering to Sweden in regards to how ANY OTHER country should have tackled Covid.
 

Grrr...

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What like China? No matter how much you change the definition of "lockdown" Sweden didn't have a lockdown. Surely any definition of lockdown must include closing ALL schools.
Why? Does every kid in the country go to same school, where one sick kid would infect everyone?
 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
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But the 4 to 5 months of "let it rip" didn't have very bad results.

Once it was determined that certain age groups were not at risk they moved to protect those that were. It was obvious from the start that children were not at risk but were more at risk by stopping them from going to school. A very enlightened approach that was written into pre-covid pandemic planning.

Contrary to the resident Covidian experts here Sweden did very well and will not have the long term poor health outcomes due to not blowing their economy away!
Didn't have bad results you say?

Just comparing the Nordics - they fucked the pooch royally.

Deaths per million:
Sweden. 1850
Denmark 1111
Finland 893
Norway. 635

Literally 3x the death rate of their most comparable neighbor.

 

Chief Stipe

Member
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Didn't have bad results you say?

Just comparing the Nordics - they fucked the pooch royally.

Deaths per million:
Sweden. 1850
Denmark 1111
Finland 893
Norway. 635

Literally 3x the death rate of their most comparable neighbor.

Your figures are way out of date. Plus you assume that the populations of those "Nordic" countries are similar. In fact they're not.

You also don't account for the fact that in the year prior to the pandemic Sweden had a lower than average mortality. The "dry tinder" factor.

What happened to excess deaths as a measure?
 
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Chief Stipe

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Why? Does every kid in the country go to same school, where one sick kid would infect everyone?
Why not? Children have a less risk of serious illness from Covid than the flu. Everyone will catch it eventually so why not allow children to get it and obtain immunity naturally. It would have helped reach herd immunity quicker.
 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
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You figures are way out of date. Plus you assume that the populations of those "Nordic" countries are similar. In fact they're not.

You also don't account for the fact that in the year prior to the pandemic Sweden had a lower than average mortality. The "dry tinder" factor.

What happened to excess deaths as a measure?
Do your own homework. That data is all of 5 months old. Got better data, post it.
 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
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Why not? Children have a less risk of serious illness from Covid than the flu. Everyone will catch it eventually so why not allow children to get it and obtain immunity naturally. It would have helped reach herd immunity quicker.
Glad to see you still don’t understand a fucking thing about how this shit works. Imagine if a dumbass like you could actually learn.
 

Grrr...

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Why not? Children have a less risk of serious illness from Covid than the flu. Everyone will catch it eventually so why not allow children to get it and obtain immunity naturally. It would have helped reach herd immunity quicker.
The point seems to have flown over your head. If you only shut down schools in highly affected areas, you don't need to close them all at once.

OH.... And exposing them all at the same time so we completely overwhelm our emergency services? That is ridiculous and absurd.
 

Chief Stipe

Member
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The point seems to have flown over your head. If you only shut down schools in highly affected areas, you don't need to close them all at once.

OH.... And exposing them all at the same time so we completely overwhelm our emergency services? That is ridiculous and absurd.
But that's the point - children are not the one's "overwhelming emergency services"! Nor was it their parents in Sweden. They just shouldn't see 80yr old Grandma and Grandpa for a couple of weeks.
 

Grrr...

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But that's the point - children are not the one's "overwhelming emergency services"! Nor was it their parents in Sweden. They just shouldn't see 80yr old Grandma and Grandpa for a couple of weeks.
Yeah. Right.

in Colorado, preliminary data show that more than 1,400 kids between 0 and 19 have been hospitalized (equal to 3.2% of the state’s total hospitalizations). Many of them required critical care in the ICU and even mechanical ventilation.

Fortunately, most kids get better with care. But, tragically, more than 625 children in the U.S. have died from COVID-19, including 21 here in Colorado.


The numbers are more sobering when you consider that childhood deaths in the U.S. – even in a typical year – are rare. During the pandemic, COVID-19 has become one of the top 10 causes of pediatric death.

Screw it. Just let them all catch it at the same time and let God sort 'em out.

You and facts just don't seem to get along very well, do you?
 




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