F1 2023

Don't know, don't care. I'm just telling you what the rules say, which is nothing about 'touching'. Cite the applicable Sporting Rule that disagrees with the stewards or accept that you're 100% wrong about 'touching'.


While a car is stationary in the pit lane as a result of incurring a penalty in accordance with Articles 54.3a) or 54.3b) above, it may not be worked on until the car has been stationary for the duration of the penalty. (emph mine)
Rules are like laws. Most of the work is done by the judges, interpreting the law and establishing precedent.

The FIA did not define "worked on", so the teams and the stewards did. The clear precedence of previous decisions was that touching the car with a hand or a tool constituted a commencement of "working on" the car. It creates a clear definition that Stewards can monitor and teams can adhere to.

Most of us assumed that the rear jack constituted a tool, but in fact that precedent has not been established. In fact, far from it. The precedent showed that teams assume the front jack can touch the car for safety reasons but the rear jack was a grey area.

It would seem to me that the rear jack should not touch the car because it certainly saves time and reduces the 5 second penalty. However AM successfully showed that the rule doesnt say this and nor does precedent because they found video of 7 previous instances when the rear jack touched the car during a 5 second penalty without any additional penalty. (Brilliant testimony by the way!)

Ultimately (like most judges), the Stewards addressed a grey area by finding the decision they wanted to find , and by that time it was clear that bumping FA off the podium for an incident that was reported 51 minutes after it occurred was an unfair and hugely unpopular decision....so they grabbed the well presented lifeline offered by Aston Martin.
And chose to ignore the illegal hand that touched the car before the 5 second penalty was over . Mercedes or Ferrari also wisely decide not to report the hand long after any reasonable protest should have been lodged.
 
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So what needs to change in the regulations

1. The drivers need help in placing the car laterally on the grid. They need a visual aid at eye level. Until that is provided then there has to be a wider tolerance +/- how many meters the car can be laterally off the box. I anticipate that the visual aid should be easy to build.

2. The minimum penalty should stay at 5 seconds. Anything less than that gets silly. BUT the penalty for failing to take a stop penalty should be the same as the original penalty. If FA failed to comply with the original 5 second penalty, the serving a second 5 second penalty is the appropriate penalty.

3. Infringements and Penalties should be reported as soon as reasonably possible.

4. Touching the car with the rear jack should be deemed as "working on" the car.

The FIA could learn from the rules in World Sailing:

61.1 Informing the Protestee
(a) The protesting team shall inform the Stewards and the other team at the first
reasonable opportunity.
When their protest will concern an incident on the racing track, the team principal shall hail ‘Protest’ on team radio and conspicuously display a red flag at the first reasonable opportunity

64.3 Decisions
When the stewards decides that a car is deserving of a penalty
under rule 62, they shall make as fair an arrangement as possible
 

SCARECROW

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So what needs to change in the regulations

1. The drivers need help in placing the car laterally on the grid. They need a visual aid at eye level. Until that is provided then there has to be a wider tolerance +/- how many meters the car can be laterally off the box. I anticipate that the visual aid should be easy to build.
a tennis ball on a piece of string that hits their faceplate when in position.
 

silent bob

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So what needs to change in the regulations

1. The drivers need help in placing the car laterally on the grid. They need a visual aid at eye level. Until that is provided then there has to be a wider tolerance +/- how many meters the car can be laterally off the box. I anticipate that the visual aid should be easy to build.

2. The minimum penalty should stay at 5 seconds. Anything less than that gets silly. BUT the penalty for failing to take a stop penalty should be the same as the original penalty. If FA failed to comply with the original 5 second penalty, the serving a second 5 second penalty is the appropriate penalty.

3. Infringements and Penalties should be reported as soon as reasonably possible.

4. Touching the car with the rear jack should be deemed as "working on" the car.

The FIA could learn from the rules in World Sailing:

61.1 Informing the Protestee
(a) The protesting team shall inform the Stewards and the other team at the first
reasonable opportunity.
When their protest will concern an incident on the racing track, the team principal shall hail ‘Protest’ on team radio and conspicuously display a red flag at the first reasonable opportunity

64.3 Decisions
When the stewards decides that a car is deserving of a penalty
under rule 62, they shall make as fair an arrangement as possible

I didn't really care for Jolyon Palmer as a driver, but his analysis series on F1TV is usually spot on. He gives insightful and unbiased information. I have gained a lot of respect for him because of this. in this clip, he breaks down everything that happened in the FA issue.

 

ro!

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a tennis ball on a piece of string that hits their faceplate when in position.
While a ball on a string works in our home garage, I suspect that F1 will need massive tech, gps, lasers and flashing lights to make it work in a breeze!

Todays big news is the first reaction to RB domination, James Key is let go from McLaren, since there’s been a drop off in results since his first design…following the departures over the winter from Ferrari one of who will replace him.
Could JK be the answer to team Willys tech chief search? or even back to AlphaT…
 

Chris in Santa Cruz CA

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This time last year Leclerc was poised to run away with the season. There’ll be a big catch up soon and we may see that Red Bull will feel the effect of the cost-cap penalty as the season goes on and they can’t do big updates.
I read somewhere that Mercedes was ready with a new ‘with pod’ side-pod update.
I think this is different. Red Bull cheated and the result is last year and this year them being at an advantage.
 
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silent bob

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Just remember back to 2009. The whole Honda/Brawn changeover, the double diffuser. Button won the 6 of the first 7 races, and barely squeaked the WC over Vettel. Red Bull takes a big hit to their Wind Tunnel and CFD this season, and it will affect them later. I wouldn’t make too many assumptions until Monaco, or so!
 

Chris in Santa Cruz CA

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Just remember back to 2009. The whole Honda/Brawn changeover, the double diffuser. Button won the 6 of the first 7 races, and barely squeaked the WC over Vettel. Red Bull takes a big hit to their Wind Tunnel and CFD this season, and it will affect them later. I wouldn’t make too many assumptions until Monaco, or so!
I remember that but time will tell. Pretty dominant performance in sand land. I guess we have to watch all season!
 

Chris in Santa Cruz CA

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While a ball on a string works in our home garage, I suspect that F1 will need massive tech, gps, lasers and flashing lights to make it work in a breeze!

Todays big news is the first reaction to RB domination, James Key is let go from McLaren, since there’s been a drop off in results since his first design…following the departures over the winter from Ferrari one of who will replace him.
Could JK be the answer to team Willys tech chief search? or even back to AlphaT…
McLaren have got to be shitting bricks. Ascending and then bottom feeders. I wonder how many job offers a week newey gets.
 

billy backstay

Backstay, never bought a suit, never went to Vegas
Its academic because Hamilton is not leaving Mercedes and certainly not leaving F1
If Mercedes have a pathway to a competitive car then Hamilton will stay with Merc'
If Toto sees that he will not have a competitive car for 2024 then he will give Hamilton a hall pass .

Hamilton is not a masochist so there is no way he will get into the Ferrari morass. If he does get the hall pass (and I think it is extremely unlikely) then surely Aston Martin will have to look at that opportunity very seriously. A lot of water has passed under the bridge since FA and LH were paired at McLaren. They are both GOATs , the two oldest drivers on the grid, and huge respect for each other (FA was the first to commiserate with LH after the Abu Dhabi fiasco) and affection has replaced the old wounds. They could put together an incredible display if they were given two competitive cars showing the young drivers a thing or two about what it really takes to be a GOAT. Their different driving styles complement each other....there is not a single track where they would not have a style that works. Lewis is familiar with the Mercedes power unit. The respect and affection of the Merc factory for Lewis would ensure AM continues to get excellent support for their power units.....and Merc would at least have a potential winning power unit while its factory team get on top of the aero issues................

For us older guys a Hamilton-Alonso GOAT team would be a serious wet dream!!
 

Terrorvision

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Or…
Ricciardo sitting on his couch with $40M wishing he was as fast as Lando..
and Piastri with a grin thinking I’m showing everyone that I can be as fast or faster as Lando and that’s going to be a good thing when LH retires…
I think Lando was keen to be outright #1 driver for Maclaren this year but there clearly isn’t a good car underneath him and it looks like it’ll be a tough turd to polish.
If Checo jumps/gets pushed this year Lando has a competitive seat waiting. Horner gets a good driver with media charisma to balance out Max’s belligerence and we get competition at the front. It looks like Toto has Mick Schu in the seat once Hamilton vacates.
 

SCARECROW

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Or…
Ricciardo sitting on his couch with $40M wishing he was as fast as Lando..
and Piastri with a grin thinking I’m showing everyone that I can be as fast or faster as Lando and that’s going to be a good thing when LH retires…
Yep this. Going to be a long year in Orange but the person most likely to do well out of it is Oscar. Lando is rated very highly by the paddock and if Oscar goes close to him in his first season he’ll come out roses.

Ironically being at the back makes this easier. Half a second slower than the driver coming 5th puts you in about 12-15. Half a second slower than the guy coming 11-12 can often put you in 12-13.
 

silent bob

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