F18 Spinnaker - Small rips

can-UK

Member
136
44
Dubai
Hi All,

I have a Nacra Infusion F18. I keep finding small holes and tears near the centre of the foot of the sail... between the bottom edge and the first retrieval ring.

I've taped everything up and have looked for anything which might be snagging the sail during gybes and retrievals... but can't find anything which may be causing the damage.

Any suggestions on what to do next or look for?

Thanks in advance.

 

can-UK

Member
136
44
Dubai
Friction burns from the retrieval line? I use to get a lot of these holes an would patch them. Had some reinforcement patches in key areas.
Yeah maybe that's it.. i thought the same.. but initially discounted it as the damage didn't look like friction burns.. maybe i'll take the cover off the line and reinforce the sail.

Thanks for the advice.

 

hobie18rich

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First they like to appear when you set the sail on the beach. If you hoist on the beach put some water on the area before you hoist. Second hand feed it into the sock and don't use the retrieval line on a dry chute with a dry line. All the F-18's do this it is just a matter of limiting it as best you can.

 

teamvmg

Super Anarchist
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Its actually down to how you are sailing.

If you sail deep to retrieve the sail, it bunches on the hoop and you get these friction burns

If you sail harder by getting the helm out on the wire sooner and retrieving as you round the leeward mark, the sail flows back from the hoop and you don't get the burns.

 

DSYHS

Member
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Its actually down to how you are sailing.

If you sail deep to retrieve the sail, it bunches on the hoop and you get these friction burns

If you sail harder by getting the helm out on the wire sooner and retrieving as you round the leeward mark, the sail flows back from the hoop and you don't get the burns.
experienced the same.

while learning the spi, you tend to sail deep to douse; cue burn and chafe marks. heat her up and all is fine

 

Tornado_ALIVE

Super Anarchist
4,377
54
Melbourne, AUS
Its actually down to how you are sailing.

If you sail deep to retrieve the sail, it bunches on the hoop and you get these friction burns

If you sail harder by getting the helm out on the wire sooner and retrieving as you round the leeward mark, the sail flows back from the hoop and you don't get the burns.
On both the T and the F18, I as skipper came in hot (hoter than most) and on the wire for both sets and drops and still saw these holes in the foot of the kite. Might have more to do with what side the retrieval line is on when you drop.

 
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Tornado_ALIVE

Super Anarchist
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Melbourne, AUS
If there isn't a gate at the bottom and I am sailing a port course, I will 9 times out of 10 come into the bottom on port.

If there is a gate at the bottom, I am dropping which ever side suits either my lay line or which side of the course I want to take for the upwind. Port, Starboard I don't care. I won't compramise my possition or tactics on a course for a vew small holes which will unlikey get bigger and can be patched.

 

teamvmg

Super Anarchist
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Definitely drop on starboard, that is how the boat is rigged.
Assuming that there is no bias on the gate... or no boats will be covering you.... or that there is no favoured side of the beat... or.. or

Sail preservation comes very low on that list!

 

F18 Sailor

Super Anarchist
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Annapolis, MD
I was referencing training...we'll gybe over to starboard if possible. Often this isn't as we risk running out of water if we gybe and drop.

I don't care about holes in my sail either when it comes to racing.

 

catsailordude

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Toronto

Tornado_ALIVE

Super Anarchist
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Melbourne, AUS
You need to get this stuff.

Holmenkol Seal n Glide. It's not cheap, but it is well worth the price.

http://www.sailboats.co.uk/Product~Trade_Secret_SEALnGLIDE__Glaze_powered_by_Holmenkol_Nano_Technology__Seal_N_Glide_125ml_pack_HM-25200.html

It only needs to be applied to the side of the spinnaker that has the retrieval line on it.

Also, when you retrieve your spinnaker, make sure you have taken up all of the slack in the retireval line (plus a bit more) before you release the halyard.
I have ran this stuff no a kite I had to screen print and worked great, but still had this issue.

I was referencing training...we'll gybe over to starboard if possible. Often this isn't as we risk running out of water if we gybe and drop.

I don't care about holes in my sail either when it comes to racing.
I am racing when I train also....... :p :)

 
The most important thing to do to prevent this is look at the material of your retrieval line...

Dyneema does not heat up and cause friction burns as polyester does. Don't believe me? Run both through your hand.

There's some very good sailors that use very thin dyneema, this can also cause a problem.

I generally either taper a few feet of dyneema into the retrieval end or run a dyneema blended cover without a core. Since I've done this I've never got burn holes.

Pulling the core out also seems to help to reduce friction and also prevents hockling. I even know some people that have been okay with polyester covers with core taken out but I still prefer dyneema or dyneema blend without a core.

 

SCARECROW

Super Anarchist
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Melbourne, Aus
if you want to get real fancy (and save money on rope) you run core only from 1 foot above the cleat and casing only from 1 foot below the cleat. The warning that goes with this is select your top halyard block carefully (We used to use Karver) and keep an eye on it because if the core can cut into the sides of the block and end up jamming.

 
There's actually nothing real fancy about that, it's the easiest way to make a tapered spin halyard and really should be the only way! And like you said you do save some money.

With a tapered halyard there is actually less of a chance of the halyard burning through the sidewall. Again back to dyneema heat friction versus polyester heat friction. We burnt through 4 harken carbos and a ronstan before swtiching to a karver but now the quality control of karver seems to be down and there is often so much play in the karver sheave that there is more of a chance of the tapered section jumping the sheave. So we switched to the harken 16mm airblock like comes stock on many boats with absolutely no issues. Keep it simple I guess.

Sorry don't mean to try to disprove your opinion, just offering mine.

 

F18 Sailor

Super Anarchist
2,675
254
Annapolis, MD
Todd's tip is definitely spot on, haven't had issues myself before I got this Infusion with the bone stock non-race package, i.e no Dyneema halyard.

This is Microwind racing's suggestion for a spin halyard: http://www.microwindracing.com/boat.html, it requires splicing two lines together (not too bad), and Todd seconded that setup offline.

What is the recommendation for a single line where you strip the cover off one end and the core out of the other as discussed by Scarecrow and mentioned by others?

 




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