Failure to disclose during a purchase

[NoStrings]

10 years ago I purchased my Baltic 37. I had a pre purchase survey that found a few cosmetic things, but nothing that would scare a prudent buyer away.

Since then I've discovered that the previous owner sunk the boat, which explains why I've had to re-wire and re-power the damn thing. That all happened a few years ago though, and I suspect that the Statute ofmLimitations has expired on any claims that I might have made in that regard.

However, last weeks insurance survey uncovered a long standing problem in the form of cracks where the forward edge of the keel stub meets the hull. There was an existing repair that: a) wasn't disclosed, and B) not discovered during the original purchase survey. The repairs are going to run around 4k.

Is there a CA atty on here with experience in these kind of transactions that I can chat with off line?

 

[rcskywalker]

So you've owned and enjoyed this boat for a DECADE without incident, but problems now surfacing are somehow the previous owner's or surveyor's responsibility? I'm no lawyer and I didn't sleep in a Holiday Inn Express, but that just doesn't pass the sniff test to me.

 

[Beer Can]

10 years ago I purchased my Baltic 37. I had a pre purchase survey that found a few cosmetic things, but nothing that would scare a prudent buyer away.

Since then I've discovered that the previous owner sunk the boat, which explains why I've had to re-wire and re-power the damn thing. That all happened a few years ago though, and I suspect that the Statute ofmLimitations has expired on any claims that I might have made in that regard.

However, last weeks insurance survey uncovered a long standing problem in the form of cracks where the forward edge of the keel stub meets the hull. There was an existing repair that: a) wasn't disclosed, and B) not discovered during the original purchase survey. The repairs are going to run around 4k.

Is there a CA atty on here with experience in these kind of transactions that I can chat with off line?

I think you're screwed. How could you possibly prove the problems are more than ten years old? Old boats get older. Also, the statute of limitations most likely ran long ago. Also, surveyor probably has severe liitations on liability, much like a home inspector. Plus 4k is less than you would spend on the first month of litigation.

 

[El Mariachi]

I would think, Nick, that not disclosing that a boat morphed into a submarine one weekend would be about the same as buying a car that you later found out was Katrina-ized, or was salvaged at one time in it's past.

Just a thought, sorry to hear this and good luck.....

 

[El Mariachi]

Hey, but I just noticed Whisper's reading this thread----he knows fuking everything about the law.....

 

[NoStrings]

Just asking the question, kind of like if one of you had owned a house for a decade and the PO conveniently failed to mention that his wife was bricked up in an old stairwell with the sash weights.

The red fairing compound used in one of the repairs hasn't been in manufactur for as long as I've owned the boat.

 

[Mojo31]

You will spend more on fees than it's worth, and if you win what are the chances of recovering your loot?

You could look for a lawyer to take it on a contingency, but I'd be wary of a lawyer who would do so.

Sometimes the first loss is the best loss.

 

[Oxygen Mask]

My 2cents-

I think if it were the factory or the dealer who failed to disclose, you would definitely have some traction.

Otherwise, Used As-Is is just that, unless they signed something guaranteeing condition/history (which I doubt...)

You had your survey and accepted the goods. That's the risk we all take when we buy used.

 

[Innocent Bystander]

Not disclosing a sinking is a pretty shitty thing to do but I'm not aware of any requirement to disclose previous damages, particularly if the seller can make the case that, as far as he was concerned, repairs were done in a workmanlike manner and your surveyor found no fault with the boat. Aren't most boat contracts "As is/where is"?

 

[Delta Blues]

And of those that replied so far, how many are Californikation Lawyers?

 

[El Mariachi]

And of those that replied so far, how many are Californikation Lawyers?

Well, fwiw, the last lawyer who represented me in a court of law ended up going to prison for leaking confidential DEA info to a drug running grandma he was representing. Which is why all my current attorneys are un-Italian.... :lol:

 

[SailSailBail]

No recourse.

I am pretty sure your contract and subsequent negotiations after survey pretty much rules out any possibility of liability if PO.

When you negotiated after survey did you get PO to fix or did you knock down the price further?

 

[NoStrings]

I knocked the price down naturally for those items discovered in the survey. The survey, done in slings, (let that be a lesson to everyone), did not discover the fault. However, the PO knew damn good and well that this crack existed. I didn't have the opportunity to walk away from the deal, or to further reduce my offer based upon what the PO knew. Does "as is" protect someone that doesn't disclose a known fault? Once again, I'm just asking the question, and I'm betting that a LOT of boat buyers would like to know the real answers, in this case in CA.

 

[CowboyKell]

No recourse.

I am pretty sure your contract and subsequent negotiations after survey pretty much rules out any possibility of liability if PO.

When you negotiated after survey did you get PO to fix or did you knock down the price further?

You always have recourse.

I can get the cost of repairs for you. I'll require a $10,000 retainer. If it was truly submerged and or grounded I can get your original purchase price back, for that I'll require a $50,000 retainer.

 

[Great Red Shark]

I'd just name the surveyor that missed the crack and any evidence that the boat had SUNK ! NOT a surveyor you want to trust your life to.

 

[Bad Andy]

Unless he lied or purposely misrepresented with the intention to deceive, you are up shit creek. Now if you had asked about the specific issues and he didn't disclose, you may have recourse, but they may have ran out 3 years ago.

 

[SailSailBail]

I knocked the price down naturally for those items discovered in the survey. The survey, done in slings, (let that be a lesson to everyone), did not discover the fault. However, the PO knew damn good and well that this crack existed. I didn't have the opportunity to walk away from the deal, or to further reduce my offer based upon what the PO knew. Does "as is" protect someone that doesn't disclose a known fault? Once again, I'm just asking the question, and I'm betting that a LOT of boat buyers would like to know the real answers, in this case in CA.

I reckon the acceptance of as-is after price reduction for discovered issues end your chances. I certainly accepted that as the risk when I did the same.

If you made seller fix the issues I would have given you a better chance.

Of course in California it might be different. Is 4k a significant percentage of boat price?

 

[Rondog]

Wow! How did you find that the PO had sunk the boat? Just curious.

 

[NoStrings]

I knocked the price down naturally for those items discovered in the survey. The survey, done in slings, (let that be a lesson to everyone), did not discover the fault. However, the PO knew damn good and well that this crack existed. I didn't have the opportunity to walk away from the deal, or to further reduce my offer based upon what the PO knew. Does "as is" protect someone that doesn't disclose a known fault? Once again, I'm just asking the question, and I'm betting that a LOT of boat buyers would like to know the real answers, in this case in CA.

I reckon the acceptance of as-is after price reduction for discovered issues end your chances. I certainly accepted that as the risk when I did the same.

If you made seller fix the issues I would have given you a better chance.

Of course in California it might be different. Is 4k a significant percentage of boat price?

Considering what I have in the boat at this point, it's like buying a large candy bar. I got over the sinking part. The re-powering was a good upgrade, and rewriting the boat took two long weekends.

This crack in the hull thing has me a bit pissed off though.