foily niner, will it really work

Cruiser

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Having seen bow rudders tried elsewhere the boat had trouble tacking since the bow would not fall away to leeward on the new tack. It would get stuck in irons and then it could not sail off on either tack.

Any other thoughts on this?

 

Phil S

Super Anarchist
2,603
230
Sydney
I had the exact problem with a bow foil moth some 4 years ago. Julian may have addressed this by having the aft main foil further back in the boat. He also has the advantage of being able to back the jib and get going again. I note he had the std rudder fitted for launching and slow speed manoevreing in some of the photos.

 

Doug Lord

Super Anarchist
11,483
21
Cocoa Beach, FL
This boat may not be developed as a round the course boat-could be just for speed. There are some interesting things like three surface piercing struts instead of two on a "normal" bi-foiler-it would be interesting to know Frank Bethwaites theory here. Big hump to overcome the conventional configuration advantage-time will tell. But over twenty knots in their first few runs is not too shabby....

Foiler_Configuration_from_Mark_Drela.pdf

 

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Darbs

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I had the exact problem with a bow foil moth some 4 years ago. Julian may have addressed this by having the aft main foil further back in the boat. He also has the advantage of being able to back the jib and get going again. I note he had the std rudder fitted for launching and slow speed manoevreing in some of the photos.
Im not sure backing the jib is particularly convenient, seeing that it is self tacking

 

bistros

Super Anarchist
1,264
12
Having seen bow rudders tried elsewhere the boat had trouble tacking since the bow would not fall away to leeward on the new tack. It would get stuck in irons and then it could not sail off on either tack.
Any other thoughts on this?
Nice. Foily Niner.

 
12
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"Im not sure backing the jib is particularly convenient, seeing that it is self tacking"

While not particularly convenient, backing the jib is more convenient than getting stuck in irons

 

Villan

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But over twenty knots in their first few runs is not too shabby....
I believe thats faster than you have .. um .. *ever* foiled?

The idea behind having the " three surface piercing struts instead of two on a "normal" bi-foiler" might be purely one of weight carrying and stability. Gives a wider and more stable base to fly on, which is probably what you want when you are playing with a 49er budget. I doubt these guys are swimming nearly as much as the foiling 18 from last year which has the whole "dual-bi-foil" (correct?) thing going on.

 

dougculnane

Member
348
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Any other thoughts on this?
Early day. Getting the thing to tack is a secondary thing to sort out I would have thought. Moths have been foiling since 1972, and for about 8 years in the present configuration. Now some guys can stay on the foils during the tack. So give the guys a chance to sort out these things with a mixture of technique and system modifications. They have only sailed the thing twice.

Allowing more pivot on the rudder would solve this I suspect but the engineering may not be too easy.

As for more thoughts..?

The rig will likely be wrong (or at least unrefined). The asymmetric and it's fittings is maybe a whole load of weight to get rid off for starters.

The cables for controlling the front rudder would appear to drag through the water. This does not look right and I am sure a neater solution could be found.

heeling to windward upwind on the trapeze may be easy but require sorter trapeze lines or straps on the gunwale to let you hang there like a bat.

I would love to see a video of it flying.

Looks like a typical strap on project. Boat is far too bloody big. There is a whole load of boat/weight/cost to get rid of.

I suspect there will be more experimentation before a new class of boat emerges. Not sure a foiling 49er is a good idea. But it would be interesting to see a foiling 2 man skiff emerge and maybe this is the best foil configuration for it so far.

 

Doug Lord

Super Anarchist
11,483
21
Cocoa Beach, FL
But over twenty knots in their first few runs is not too shabby....
I believe thats faster than you have .. um .. *ever* foiled?

The idea behind having the " three surface piercing struts instead of two on a "normal" bi-foiler" might be purely one of weight carrying and stability. Gives a wider and more stable base to fly on, which is probably what you want when you are playing with a 49er budget. I doubt these guys are swimming nearly as much as the foiling 18 from last year which has the whole "dual-bi-foil" (correct?) thing going on.
====================

I can guarantee you that whether they are swimming or not has absolutely NOTHING to do with whether they have one strut or two struts on the main foil. The two strut configuration probably makes it easier to experiment with foil position without cutting the boat-which is actively racing as a foilless 49er.

The AET Foiling 18 and Mirabaud-developed from it-both use a "conventional" bi-foil arrangement-with rare crashes. Mirabaud has a new hull,stiffer mast and better wand system(double wand up to now- and new forward position wand) for this year and will be sailing again in a few weeks.

On-going Mirabaud thread-updated frequently: http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/sailboats...iler-22704.html

pix from Thomas Jundts site: ( http://www2.jundt.ch/blog/ )

_LV07815.jpg

 
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