Concon is the closest thing to a yachting center near Valparaiso - I stopped there in 2012 for a haul out and some repairs on a circumnavigation. There was a travel lift and a marina / yacht club, and everyone was very welcoming, but pretty much jack-all in terms of marine trades / chandleries - was very glad my (now) wife brought down a suitcase full of parts and we pent 2.5 weeks raiding all the local hardware stores for anything vaguely marine-adjacent.
GGR 2022
- Thread starter littlechay
- Start date
Jud - s/v Sputnik
Super Anarchist
I believe that there was a contact in Montt that arranged for a RIB to come out to provide charts- he has no coastal charts. The approach to Ushuaia, solo, sans charts (and the long way offshore to the approach, a very long lee shore, and sans self-steering), might have been too risky…
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Kolibri
Anarchist
News just posted on Kirsten's FB page
Kirsten on SV MINNEHAHA checked in on HF radio frequency 8713KHz at 080803UTC
She is well and the vessel is handling the conditions comfortably with 70 metres of warp deployed as a drogue, and a small storm jib. The primary swell is now from the WNW aligned with the wind waves and there is an occasional secondary swell breaking into the cockpit from the NE.
Kirsten plans to retrieve the drogue when the wind eases and continue on her course towards Cape Horn. But for now, it's safety first. I am proud to have been able to support her through this trying period in her solo circumnavigation.
Kirsten on SV MINNEHAHA checked in on HF radio frequency 8713KHz at 080803UTC
She is well and the vessel is handling the conditions comfortably with 70 metres of warp deployed as a drogue, and a small storm jib. The primary swell is now from the WNW aligned with the wind waves and there is an occasional secondary swell breaking into the cockpit from the NE.
Kirsten plans to retrieve the drogue when the wind eases and continue on her course towards Cape Horn. But for now, it's safety first. I am proud to have been able to support her through this trying period in her solo circumnavigation.
Jud - s/v Sputnik
Super Anarchist
I wonder about her warps - how thick they are (or how big they typically are in order to be effective as a drag device). Anyone know if she’s posted this somewhere (in a vid)? Surprised after such a big refit that she doesn’t carry a drogue - much less bulk, especially if made of Dyneema. (But no one has an endless budget, and warps are undoubtedly cheaper, if harder to deal with, I’d think, being heavy/bulky.)
Pic of Suhaili towing warp —the blue line visible— a painting done for RKJ.
[email protected]
Super Anarchist
I read RKJ's account of the GGR years ago, and Moitessier's soon after. RKN favored warps, but Moitessier tried them (maybe with a tyre attached?) but found that lack of flow over the rudder left him more more vulnerable to being broached, so just let Joshua run free. I've never, and hope not to experience such conditions - especially in a long keeled double ender - so haven't formed my own opinion.
Both of the above, are better sailors than I could ever hope to be, and Kirsten is more in their league than mine!
Jud - s/v Sputnik
Super Anarchist
Which is why I’m curious to know about her warps —and, more specifically, her experience with them. It’s interesting to note that both she and Abhilash were relatively close to each other (a few hundred miles apart - so basically experiencing the same conditions? Although I’ve no idea what their respective courses were - but I assume both were running from the 50-60 kts), and he (not towing a drag device, I think) got knocked down, while she didn’t. (I wonder what his strategy for the storm was.)
Of course it’s probably not as simple as “he didn’t have a drag device, while she did”, but it’s thought-provoking that they both were basically in the same storm (but she a bit more north of him, I think - where I think there may have been less wind?), and they each (independently of each other) remarked on waves/swell from the N (in addition to the prevailing one from the W) - a cross sea that broke on them - in Kirsten’s cockpit, and knocking Abhilash down).
Did a drag device make the difference in their respective experiences? We’ll never know
But it’s interesting “data” re: drag devices in general.
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TheDragon
Super Anarchist
Kirsten has no choice now, she has to beeline it for the cape, and the weather looks favorable. Doing 6-7 knots now while Tomy is still 3-4 knots. Fingers crossed they both get around okay.
I have a Jordan series drogue, bought by my PO who had planned to cross the Pacific with his young family, but did not. It is burried deeply in my lazarete along with a monster anchor I can barely pick up. I hope never to use either. I think I would link my four large heavy thick mooring lines together as a warp first.
I have a Jordan series drogue, bought by my PO who had planned to cross the Pacific with his young family, but did not. It is burried deeply in my lazarete along with a monster anchor I can barely pick up. I hope never to use either. I think I would link my four large heavy thick mooring lines together as a warp first.
Semper_Windy
Member
@TheDragon think you might enjoy Heavy Weather Sailing 7th edition by Peter Bruce & Robin Knox-Johnston. Most extensive writeup of testing around various heavy weather tactics I've seen, though mostly models + real life anecdotes.
Forget the exact discussion around dragging things. Think it came out slightly in favor of series drogues vs warps or sea anchors, etc. Also a really interesting discussion about hull and deck form when it comes to broaches!
Forget the exact discussion around dragging things. Think it came out slightly in favor of series drogues vs warps or sea anchors, etc. Also a really interesting discussion about hull and deck form when it comes to broaches!
Your Mom
Super Anarchist
Guggenberger is making nice pace in the right direction. I wonder if he might be able to work his way up to the front two in the Atlantic.
Kolibri
Anarchist
Yep...RKJ, Moitessier, Kirsten, Simon, Abhilash, etc have some serious skills that are way beyond where I'll ever be.
I did bring warps and a borrowed drogue on my crossing from San Francisco to Oahu. Never needed to use them. Highest winds we encountered were 30 knots gusting to 40 knots for a ~12 hour period. We sailed with a small storm jib in the staysail position and put our electric motor in regen mode so the prop would spin backwards charging the battery bank. This slowed the boat down ~1.5 knots and made for a slightly smoother ride.
Cisco
Super Anarchist
And also, you can't go through Chilean territorial waters direct to Ushuaia without seriously pissing orf the Chileans. Last bloke I know that played that game was fined US$50k - reduced on appeal to $5k - and was kicked out of the country and told not to bother coming back.
Then there are the issues with importing stuff into Argentina and even just getting things down from BA.
TheDragon
Super Anarchist
Well, the bottom half of the Hydrovane survived, but not the top, and no dodger. Must have been quite a shock.
Tanton Y_M
Super Anarchist
In reference to sea anchor and drogue.
Worth reading on: www.tantonyachtdesign.blogspot.com
Search: Sea anchor, heaving-to and drogue aboard Rachel Slocum.
Jambalaya
Super Anarchist
One of Simon's oldest friends (they did mini's together and won DH Fastnet on Simon's 105 plus started the Transquadra on Paul's JOD35 before retiring with damage) has flown out to help Simon with works and to deliver required parts.. paul helped with the pre-race prep of Clara. He sent me the following
Hi Andy, yes here in Montt lovely place, and the people have really helpful. Finished all the job last night. Simons planing to leave midday today.
Paul
Hi Andy, yes here in Montt lovely place, and the people have really helpful. Finished all the job last night. Simons planing to leave midday today.
Paul
Jambalaya
Super Anarchist
Indeed quite an "alarm call" ! Maybe he got a big breaking wave over the boat which just smashed the vane, dodger and mainsail (I think sliders got broken even though main was lashed to boom)
shebeen
Super Anarchist
The most qualified man for the job! What a trip.
Jambalaya
Super Anarchist
I have a feeling Simon is going to be first back to Le Sables
Your Mom
Super Anarchist
Especially if he used his stop to clean the bottom and do other maintenance that can't be done at sea. As long as you're dropping to Chichester, you might as well do everything you can with your one stop to be fast to the finish.
littlechay
Super Anarchist
- Thread starter
- #740
A warp doesn't have to be of very large diameter to be effective. It's the bight that does all the work.
The warp v drogue thing is very interesting. Whilst a series drogue might be more effective in theory it is very difficult to handle safely, very difficult to retrieve, difficult (impossible) to effectively rig at tripline for. etc.. I have never used one but know several people who have; none successfully retrieved it.
A warp streamed in bight is very easy to handle, very easy to retrieve (well it is still a bit of work) as you just let one end go and wind in the other end. I've used a warp a few times in 40 knots or so, just a single line with a fender on the end (once with a 20kg anchor and 10m of chain on the end) just to slow the boat a little and provide more directional stability to help the Aries. It works very well. My boat is a steel 35 foot Charpentier trireme design; so quite comparable to the GGR boats. I have played with a warp streamed in a bight an it is amazingly effective and creates a great slick if you can tune it to the wavelength (something you can't do with a series drogue).
My missus and I started building a drogue some years ago but never finished it.. not sure we ever will.
