Glass sheathing delaminating from iron keel

My S2's lifting keel is delaminating. Large 6-inch cracks have appeared on the leading and trailing edges of the keep, up near the hull. Is it possible simply to fill the cracks with epoxy, clamp the sides together, then fair the keel? Any other suggestions? I really really don't want to pull the keel out to fix it.

 

CharlieCobra

Super Anarchist
2,766
2
PNW
Grind it off, wire brush the crap outta the iron nugget, apply phosphoric acid or some other rust eating chemical, prime with an epoxy primer, rough it up to get tooth and then apply epoxy impregnated Dynel over it. Fair it out and paint.

 

Chuck L

Super Anarchist
What's Dynel?

Anyhow, if it's a lamination that will repair the gap, then I agree. You need to bridge that gap (crack) with something structural, otherwise it will just crack again.

You need to do as Charlie says and make sure you add a structural layer of glass (dynel?) over the crack or it will open up again. Taper the edges, laminate several layers on, grind down the excess around the edge of the repair (just flush, not too much or you effectively remove your repair!), fill and sand.

Check the West System library for basic crack repair procedure.

Also, if there is water now in the structure, you need to dry that out. Lots of people drill 2 holes in their rudder every year -- a drain in the bottom, and a vent in the top -- then they fill the holes every spring. You may need to do something similar.

A friend has a Bluenose 24, which has an internally ballasted (encapsulated) keel. He uncovered her one spring to find a 6" by 6" hole in the side of the keel where the ice (frozen between the lead and the skin) popped the fibreglass right off. You don't want that, trust me.

Cheers,

 

CharlieCobra

Super Anarchist
2,766
2
PNW
Dynel is a cloth used with resin for wood decks, very flexible stuff. The reason I said to grind the existing glass off is because it's likely delaminating because the iron keel is rusting and expanding. If you just drain and cover it, it'll just happen again. Pull the old glass, kill the rust, re-glass.

 

Steam Flyer

Sophisticated Yet Humble
44,292
9,617
Eastern NC
What's Dynel?
Anyhow, if it's a lamination that will repair the gap, then I agree. You need to bridge that gap (crack) with something structural, otherwise it will just crack again.

You need to do as Charlie says and make sure you add a structural layer of glass (dynel?) over the crack or it will open up again. Taper the edges, laminate several layers on, grind down the excess around the edge of the repair (just flush, not too much or you effectively remove your repair!), fill and sand.

Check the West System library for basic crack repair procedure.

Also, if there is water now in the structure, you need to dry that out. Lots of people drill 2 holes in their rudder every year -- a drain in the bottom, and a vent in the top -- then they fill the holes every spring. You may need to do something similar.

A friend has a Bluenose 24, which has an internally ballasted (encapsulated) keel. He uncovered her one spring to find a 6" by 6" hole in the side of the keel where the ice (frozen between the lead and the skin) popped the fibreglass right off. You don't want that, trust me.

Cheers,
Dynel is a fiber, like glass or kevlar or carbon. It is strong but stretchy, and also extremely abrasion resistant. Bonding a layer of dynel over a delaminated foil would be a good idea IMHO, but you'd really want to taper it into the existing laminated and bond it down very strongly... vacuum-bagging it would be best. Also, it doesn't sand worth a durn, so make sure the surface comes out smooth. It's really good for stuff like grounding strips on skegs, daggerboard / centerboard tips, and probably here too where the lifting keel rubs against the trunk. The Dynel stuff I get is a rather coarse-weave cloth (looks like cheesecloth) and I tend to use it in two layers filled with hi-desnity filler or colloidal silica, and peel-ply it down hard for a good bond and a smooth surface.

FB- Doug

 

Chuck L

Super Anarchist
Dynel is a cloth used with resin for wood decks, very flexible stuff. The reason I said to grind the existing glass off is because it's likely delaminating because the iron keel is rusting and expanding. If you just drain and cover it, it'll just happen again. Pull the old glass, kill the rust, re-glass.
Dynel, OK, sounds good.

Yup, agree -- grind off everything that has delaminated, back to where it is good. If it's all bad, then it all comes off.

Do it right or do it twice.

 

Ishmael

52,527
12,310
Fuctifino
Postiches, cascades, and falls were worn with adornment to add quick fixes to Bouffant and Beehive hairstyles. In the late 1960's, the big hair fashion fad was to wear a Dynel. A Dynel was synthetic hair that a woman would take to a wig or department store and a technician would blend the Dynel to match the ladies hair. It was then braided, wound around stuffing and pinned to the top of the head.

For some women however, especially younger teens, the 1960 Bouffant hairstyle and Beehive was not the look they were wanting. In 1961 some girls opted to tame their locks without products such as hair spray. Instead they used barrettes and ribbons to keep their tresses in place and to create pretty hairstyles.

Often times they curled their hair and wound the locks into a bun or a coil and used hairpins to hold the style in place. Typically, a short bang or fringe went along with this look.

bouffant-hairstyle-1960.jpg


 
I'm new to this forum, but somewhat expert as a shipwright. You might try using West's new G Flex epoxy, as it's more flexible than traditional 105/205....So far it's a great improvement. Also, it will kick underwater, so their small available patch kit should be on everyone's emergency gear list....As for 105/ 205 or 206, I routinely use a gallon or so a year in maintainance aboard Royaliste....But that's another story,eh? clean for your hands..white vinegar, then soap...

 

Chuck L

Super Anarchist
No traditional welcome? Just because it's Fix-it Anarchy, and the guy seems to know what he's talking about?

(Even in the CA 36 thread last year we stopped to welcome newbies!)

Sometimes you just have to do it yourself...

FUNB, and SUYW/GFTs!

(And yes, I buy 105 by the gallon. First year was a fabricating job, second year was a keel fairing job (lots of 410 for that one), last year was the cockpit floor, this year is the bulkheads...)

Cheers,

 
Thanks..I was recommended this forum to chase down some crew, but after signing in, I saw ther was a bit more to the sight. I'll pay attention until it's time to relaunch.(We're drydocked 'till spring for the first time in 10 years underway)..Chuck; I originally purchased Royaliste and took her to the West Coast a little upstream from you in Shawville..We sailed across the border a season ago to score some oak to replace the channels for our mainmast shrouds. A new period vessel is rising from the ashes in the same location in Shawville; LaRevenante...a 1755 French privateeer..

 

Chuck L

Super Anarchist
Thanks..I was recommended this forum to chase down some crew, but after signing in, I saw ther was a bit more to the sight. I'll pay attention until it's time to relaunch.(We're drydocked 'till spring for the first time in 10 years underway)..Chuck; I originally purchased Royaliste and took her to the West Coast a little upstream from you in Shawville..We sailed across the border a season ago to score some oak to replace the channels for our mainmast shrouds. A new period vessel is rising from the ashes in the same location in Shawville; LaRevenante...a 1755 French privateeer..
Talk about a project...

Shawville? Were you ling here and took the boat, or was it a special trip to get her? I feel like we're neighbours!

The upper Ottawa is more heavily populated with power boats, but you can actually get to Temiskaming with the truck and trailer services. The lower Ottawa (between Arnprior and Ottawa) is almost all sailboats.

Post pictures of the Royaliste then -- that counts as boat porn!

Cheers,

 
Actually, I came from San Francisco the week before Valentine's Day, 2001 I think. BooCoo below zero, dug her out, loaded her with a 400 ton crane, and hauled her west for the restoration beginnings....Vernon Fairhead did the original changeover from a dead yacht, I took off from there. He's who is launching LaRev, and I'll be up helping him with stepping, etc. (retired structural Ironworker/rigger that I be)...We'll be travelling the Great Lakes in company...Yep, they are huge projects, but a real kick at sea, thru the ICW, or on the Great Lakes...As for posting, I'll look into it, but I'm in the desert right now with pretty much no bandwidth. There are photo's on our two websites, and a google search under pirate ship Royaliste will deliver a veritable novel of stuff. We've done a few movies during my stewardship, and some other mighty interesting gigs..Not a fast racer, but a heckova lot of adrenaline when that much wood and canvas are on a reach or something....In 2007, we sailed her from South Carolina to Halifax, then up the St. Lawrence to Iroquois, Ontario, somewhat making a continental circumnavigation of sorts....The river's a bear in places....Gary

 
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