Honestly, who really gives a damn about Afghanistan?

kent_island_sailor

Super Anarchist
26,942
4,901
Kent Island!
quod umbra said:
A decade or more ago we should have transitioned to a United Nations Peacekeeping force.

Your Uncle Joe is a bumbling idiot. Do you support bumbling idiots, yes or no?
OK - you HAVE TO be taking the piss here. The UN? The UN *has no armed forces*, you would have to find member countries to volunteer. Unless those volunteers were the USA, the forces involved would very quickly be killed and run right out of there or co-opted by the Taliban.

 

kent_island_sailor

Super Anarchist
26,942
4,901
Kent Island!
quod umbra said:
You must have missed where I said turn the place over to a UN PK Force.
And Biden has now increased the amount of personnel to 5k. 
Solet's review, Trump wanted to remove 3k troops and negotiate an exit, Biden just pulls out in the dead of night (so to speak) and the result is an increase of troops deployed.
The Afghans want the Taliban in charge. They are going to get it. Nothing we do is going to change that except for war on a massive enough scale to kill most of them.

 

phillysailor

Super Anarchist
8,170
3,000
The Afghans want the Taliban in charge. They are going to get it. Nothing we do is going to change that except for war on a massive enough scale to kill most of them.
Not sure I agree with “want”, but often you get the government you deserve.

I am sure the kids, women, and the many thousands who appreciated American assistance aren’t happy with their options, but you are totally correct about the only way we could’ve “defeated” the Taliban.

Such a victory would have, of course, radicalized many of our formerly sympathetic allies. We just have to become more wise with our “might” and resources.

 

phillysailor

Super Anarchist
8,170
3,000
Involve the Afghan government in the negotiations.  Otherwise, we handed them the defeat, at that time.
The Afghan government had no desire and no real incentive to compromise. Ashraf Ghani knew he’d be assassinated five minutes or five days after we left, and that his family would be tortured soon after.

They would have sabotaged the “peace” talks and violated terms of the agreement once we purchased their signatures.

Thats how they roll.

 

kent_island_sailor

Super Anarchist
26,942
4,901
Kent Island!
https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/08/16/afghanistan-history-taliban-collapse-504977

Basically as soon as Trump said "we're leaving" most of the Afghan government forces made deals to quit fighting. If you want to fault the USA, it was laughable to think the government forces were going to do anything but quit the second we left.

If that is all the fight the Afghans have in them to oppose the Taliban, there was no reason to stay another second unless we were going to stay forever.

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Steam Flyer

Sophisticated Yet Humble
42,467
8,675
Eastern NC
quod umbra said:
By both you mean Obama and Biden, right?

Trump was working on an exit strategy. Good or bad.
Biden had no exit strategy.

Nothing sadder than watching free Afagnies begging to be air lifted as they run along side US planes evacuating US nationals.
Trump had 4 years of bluster and bullshit, he didn't do anything except sign an agreement with the Taliban which Rep. Liz Cheney this morning called a "surrender." Of course, she had some harsh words for Joe Biden, too.

But the basic option since 2003 or so, has been "STAY" or "GO." If you're going to criticize both, at least do so from a position of some slight amount of knowledge beyond "Democrats = BAD"

- DSK

 

badlatitude

Super Anarchist
29,063
4,810
GOP Removes Page Praising Donald Trump's 'Historic' Peace Deal With Taliban



 




The Republican National Committee has removed a webpage from 2020 in which it praised Donald Trump for signing a "historic peace agreement with the Taliban." 

David Weigel, of The Washington Post, was the first to spot that the page had been removed with the web address redirecting to a 404 error page featuring the quip: "It looks like you're as lost as Biden is." 

The Guardian's congressional reporter Hugo Lowell later confirmed the webpage's removal after successfully tracking down the now-deleted page via The Wayback Machine digital archive. 

Featured as part of a section titled "President Trump Is Bringing Peace In The Middle East," the page described how the former U.S. president had "continued to take the lead in peace talks." 

The page also claims that "while President Trump has championed peace, Joe Biden has taken the lead in pushing for endless wars."

Read more: https://www.newsweek.com/gop-removes-webpage-praising-trumps-historic-peace-deal-taliban-1619605 
 

 

Olsonist

Disgusting Liberal Elitist
28,753
3,829
New Oak City
image.png  

 

Steam Flyer

Sophisticated Yet Humble
42,467
8,675
Eastern NC
If Trump had in fact pulled out of Afghanistan, it would have been one of the few things I'd say he'd gotten right... and of course, it wouldn't so much be his own decision unless it were out of spite at not making any money out of it, personally.

Instead he set the stage for disaster by excluding the sitting Afghan gov't from negotiations. This of course is after he fired all the State Dept professionals who actually had a clue.

Biden has to take the lumps for it. But there has been some really badly wrong advice being followed, like for example the foreign policy wonk on the news Saturday announcing that it will take months for the Taliban to take Kabul.

- DSK

 

Olsonist

Disgusting Liberal Elitist
28,753
3,829
New Oak City
If Trump had in fact pulled out of Afghanistan, it would have been one of the few things I'd say he'd gotten right...
Tom will be along shortly to say that his boy Shitstain did better than just pull out of Afghanistan in the four years he was there; any fool could have done that. Instead his boy promised to pull out of Afghanistan after the election. Guy will be concerned yet optimistic. Jeff will ask when can we go back in?

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Sol Rosenberg

Girthy Member
93,248
10,964
Earth
Tom will be along shortly to say that his boy Shitstain did better than just pull out of Afghanistan in the four years he was there; instead he promised to pull out of Afghanistan after the election. Guy will be concerned yet optimistic. Jeff will ask when can we go back in?
I will ask those who are critical of our exit from Afghanistan to go on the record with their opinion of what the US should have done and why. 

 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
60,986
4,982
De Nile
quod umbra said:
By both you mean Obama and Biden, right?

Trump was working on an exit strategy. Good or bad.
Biden had no exit strategy.

Nothing sadder than watching free Afagnies begging to be air lifted as they run along side US planes evacuating US nationals.
Working on an exit? He could've just left. Then he would have actually done something. No, he just "talked" about a strategy, like his healthcare strategy. All bullshit for the sycophants

 

Sol Rosenberg

Girthy Member
93,248
10,964
Earth
Your boy Shitstain had a strategy but no exit. Yeah, that's the ticket.
But it was the best most strongest strategy bigly, just like infrastructure week and the new bigly tremendous health care plan. They were the greatest. You’ll see when we find out what’s in them. Strongly. 

 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
60,986
4,982
De Nile
quod umbra said:
Oh so you were speaking of Obama. Got it and thanks for the clarification.
You must be replying to someone who thinks Obama did the right thing post OBL ventilation. 

 

Raz'r

Super Anarchist
60,986
4,982
De Nile
quod umbra said:
I made no distinction as to party affiliation. Simply pointed out the players involved.

The third option would have been back when is a UN Peacekeeping force made up of multi-national personnel.
I know, I know, the UN is impotent. I get that, but the reasoning would be to have the US step back after removing the Taliban, who you might recall harbored and aided al Qaeda. So shifting to a peacekeeping force removes the US v Them aspect and in turn forces the UN member nations to stand united against terrorism. 
I know, that is a  horrid idea. Sorry.
Actually, it's kinda a bullshit idea, as the force there was multinational up till quite recently. (Dont forget Poland!) - so - it already existed. 

As to getting them blue helmets instead of their own colors, you'd have to ask China and Russia why not.

 

kent_island_sailor

Super Anarchist
26,942
4,901
Kent Island!
quod umbra said:
I made no distinction as to party affiliation. Simply pointed out the players involved.

The third option would have been back when is a UN Peacekeeping force made up of multi-national personnel.
I know, I know, the UN is impotent. I get that, but the reasoning would be to have the US step back after removing the Taliban, who you might recall harbored and aided al Qaeda. So shifting to a peacekeeping force removes the US v Them aspect and in turn forces the UN member nations to stand united against terrorism. 
I know, that is a  horrid idea. Sorry.
There was no peace to keep. The Taliban would have chewed them up.

 
Top