ILCA gives LPE the boot... seeking new Laser builder

tillerman

tillerman

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Wess said:
And again having seen the mess that is the Canadian health care system I often wonder about the sanity of it’s citizens ....
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I don't know what quality of health-care systems has to do with building boats but, as it's been raised, here is a link to an independent rating of the world's healthcare systems... with ranks of a few countries of interest below

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/best-healthcare-in-the-world

1. France
2. Italy

12. Portugal

17. Netherlands
18. UK

30. Canada
31. Finland

36. Costa Rica
37. United States
38. Slovenia

I still think English built boats are best. 

 
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Wess

Wess

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The water, mountains or canyons
Bill5 said:
Huh? We know your builder of choice is Ovington. Not sure what health care systems have to do with all this. Have you been drinking again?
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Not yet but it is Friday and we are about to head to a yacht renaming ceremony. I don’t know much about that but knowing the owner I am sure there will be much drinking involved.  I will toast her new yacht and The Laser Class! Cheers!!!

 
Bruce Hudson

Bruce Hudson

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New Zealand
tillerman said:
What's the boat with the red sail that appears in the video at around 0:43? Is that a Laser with a C-rig?
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Well spotted!

image.png

Looks very similar to me.

View attachment 301747

 
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Bruce Hudson

Bruce Hudson

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Gouvernail said:
The entire concept of a new rig runs opposite of everything having to do with the Laser game. 
 

The game is to play a game between individuals who each use  functionally identical toys. 
 

The toy was created in 1969 and all the rest are supposed to go the same speed using the same effort as when sailing  the original.

The purpose of the class is to help organize and publicize opportunities to play the game conducted on those identical toys.

some fundamental   concepts:

* If it makes the toy sail faster it is cheating 

* If it slows the boat down there is no excuse for it 

* anything that improves durability is great unless it changes the initial performance 

* Changes for the sake of conveniences and  comforts are acceptable only if those changes do not modify performance 

*Kirby, Fogh, Bruce, and their friends could easily have made any part of the next toy a little better and therefore improved the performance a little bit at any time beginning with the second boat built. They decided to make identical toys so the games  would be entirely contested on the racecourse. 
 

* If the object had ever been to make the toys faster, the toys would have a motor mount. 
 

* The object is to bring an identical toy  to the games so each sailor can know the differences in the  toys has NOTHING to do with the order of finish. 
 

* The games are best when we are each playing the same game with functionally identical equipment

***repeat reading  this until it sinks in ***
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New rigs including the Radial (ILCA 6) and the 4.7 (ILCA 5) are intended to be new classes.

 
Bill5

Bill5

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Those rigs won’t be relevant on a global basis for quite some time, if at all. With the revitalized class and multiple builders, the ILCA has stability. Had the class blown up with the Olympics and LPE shit show, there could have been an opportunity for new rigs, different construction methods and a lot of other changes. But ILCA did a great job salvaging matters and the class is way stronger than when Rasta was holding the cards. 

 
Wess

Wess

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The water, mountains or canyons
Gouvernail said:
The entire concept of a new rig runs opposite of everything having to do with the Laser game. 
 

The game is to play a game between individuals who each use  functionally identical toys. 
 

The toy was created in 1969 and all the rest are supposed to go the same speed using the same effort as when sailing  the original.

The purpose of the class is to help organize and publicize opportunities to play the game conducted on those identical toys.

some fundamental   concepts:

* If it makes the toy sail faster it is cheating 

* If it slows the boat down there is no excuse for it 

* anything that improves durability is great unless it changes the initial performance 

* Changes for the sake of conveniences and  comforts are acceptable only if those changes do not modify performance 

*Kirby, Fogh, Bruce, and their friends could easily have made any part of the next toy a little better and therefore improved the performance a little bit at any time beginning with the second boat built. They decided to make identical toys so the games  would be entirely contested on the racecourse. 
 

* If the object had ever been to make the toys faster, the toys would have a motor mount. 
 

* The object is to bring an identical toy  to the games so each sailor can know the differences in the  toys has NOTHING to do with the order of finish. 
 

* The games are best when we are each playing the same game with functionally identical equipment

***repeat reading  this until it sinks in ***
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Gouvernail said:
But now that Wess is in charge......
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He would ask why does ILCA think its OK that you can upgrade your (NOT) OD boat - at the cost of $ thousands - on:

  * Improved mast sections (upper now, lower coming)

  * Better line packages

  * Better vangs

  * Better outhaul connections and controls

  * Improved daggerboards and daggerboard controls

  * Improved rudders

  * Better sails

  * Various tillers and tiler extensions

And he would think you a fool if you think that new rigs aren't coming in part because this is how class leadership makes money for the class since folks don't join and how builders make money.

If lemming were really honest they would concede that there are so many upgrades that cost in total thousands, and that the only thing that is still OD on the boat is the hull.  And bad news lemmings you only think that because changes to the hulls are buried in the construction manual and not made public so you don't even know that your hull has been obsoleted some time ago.

Happy Monday all!

 
RobbieB

RobbieB

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Charleston, SC
Wess said:
  * Improved mast sections (upper now, lower coming)

  * Better line packages -Since the boat hit the market "control lines" have been open for improvement.

  * Better vangs - Oh how I miss the old fangled set up with truckers hitches, thimbles and the $60 harken rotating tang connection.

  * Better outhaul connections and controls -Clearly you were not around for the days of thimbles and truckers hitches... Those were awasome!

  * Improved daggerboards and daggerboard controls - Blades have changed mostly in order to STOP people from illegally fairing them.  They have finally come up with a design where you can actually repair the trailing edges if they are damaged.  However, you can't monkey with the finish.  Improved controls?  Outside of some felt to keep the dagger board from wearing through the deck How/where?

  * Improved rudders - Same as above

  * Better sails - longer lasting, finally!

  * Various tillers and tiler extensions - Man I miss the days of bendy PVC extensions, but again these have been monkeyed with since the boat hit the water. Hey, if you want to go back to the old "frying pan" set up knock yourself out!
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Bill5

Bill5

Right now
2,962
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Western Canada
Wess said:
He would ask why does ILCA think its OK that you can upgrade your (NOT) OD boat - at the cost of $ thousands - on:

  * Improved mast sections (upper now, lower coming)

  * Better line packages

  * Better vangs

  * Better outhaul connections and controls

  * Improved daggerboards and daggerboard controls

  * Improved rudders

  * Better sails

  * Various tillers and tiler extensions

And he would think you a fool if you think that new rigs aren't coming in part because this is how class leadership makes money for the class since folks don't join and how builders make money.

If lemming were really honest they would concede that there are so many upgrades that cost in total thousands, and that the only thing that is still OD on the boat is the hull.  And bad news lemmings you only think that because changes to the hulls are buried in the construction manual and not made public so you don't even know that your hull has been obsoleted some time ago.

Happy Monday all!
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The only change I would have backed off was the vang. No problem with the purchase, but a stopper at block to block (or just past) would have saved a bunch of top sections, and perhaps reduced the need for the carbon top. The balance are either durability or simple efficiency related. Nothing that changed the performance of the boat. 

 
tillerman

tillerman

Super Anarchist
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Rhode Island
Bill5 said:
The only change I would have backed off was the vang. No problem with the purchase, but a stopper at block to block (or just past) would have saved a bunch of top sections, and perhaps reduced the need for the carbon top. The balance are either durability or simple efficiency related. Nothing that changed the performance of the boat. 
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You could supervang with the 3:1 vang but it took some skill. Top sections used to break in those days too.

 
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