Kids and guns.....again

[badlatitude]

Maybe it will be kids who make the changes and make a difference.

 

[Keith]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/06/politics/america-mass-shootings-2023-gun-violence/index.html?utm_content=2023-03-06T21%3A29%3A04&utm_source=twCNN&utm_medium=social&utm_term=link

 

[badlatitude]

Just another kid gun owners. But worry not, she will be forgotten by tomorrow. Your precious is not in danger, even though it should be.

4-year-old shot and killed by 3-year-old in Houston, sheriff says​

HARRIS COUNTY, Texas (KTRK) -- A 4-year-old girl has died after an apparent shooting in northwest Harris County on Sunday evening, according to the Harris County Sheriff's Office.

Authorities believe the young girl was shot unintentionally by her three-year-old sister.

At about 7:30 p.m., HCSO deputies received a call about a juvenile hurt at an apartment complex at 9955 Bammel North Houston.

According to Sheriff Ed Gonzalez, investigators believe the two sisters were in the apartment with five adults, including their mother and stepfather.

Investigators said that the adults believed that at least one of them was watching the girls, who were unsupervised in the apartment bedroom.

That's when authorities believe the 3-year-old got ahold of a loaded semi-automatic pistol and accidentally shot her 4-year-old sister.

The child was pronounced dead at the scene.

"It just seems like another tragic story of a child gaining access to a firearm and hurting someone else. This time it was a fatal shot, appears to be to her sibling," Gonzalez said.

It is not clear at this point if anyone will face charges.

Gonzalez urges people to ensure their guns are stored where kids cannot reach them, especially entering Spring Break week, when many more kids will be at home.

"You've got to make sure you're a responsible gun owner. Secure your weapons in a safe place. It's got to be more than just to tell the kids not to touch the weapons," Gonzalez said.

4-year-old accidentally shot, killed by younger sister in NW Harris County, according to HCSO

Five adults were said to be in the apartment when the 3-year-old got ahold of a loaded semi-automatic pistol and shot the 4-year-old, deputies said.

abc13.com

 

[Keith]

I'll just leave this here.

 

[Mike G]

I'll just leave this here.

The inside, which you can't see, has the second half of the second ammendment in gold lettering. They added an exclamation point at the end using an unfolding "caution" cone (for the slip/fall hazard of blood) and a first aid kit strapped to the wall. Then there's a pack of temporary tattoos that say "I love you mom/dad" that the kids can stick to their arms, if they have the time before the slaughter. You're encouraged to sit near a close friend, really cementing your BFF (Best Friends Forever) status. Also an N.R.A. donation box.

 

[Ishmael]

The inside, which you can't see, has the second half of the second ammendment in gold lettering. They added an exclamation point at the end using an unfolding "caution" cone (for the slip/fall hazard of blood) and a first aid kit strapped to the wall. Then there's a pack of temporary tattoos that say "I love you mom/dad" that the kids can stick to their arms, if they have the time before the slaughter. You're encouraged to sit near a close friend, really cementing your BFF (Best Friends Forever) status. Also an N.R.A. donation box.

Plus the room can be hosed out in ten minutes, so it's ready for the next occupants.

 

[Keith]

 

[Burning Man]

USAnians don't take responsibility in general. More and more are just spoilt children.

But the gun debate is disappointing. Both "sides" agree that there are many people who should NOT have access to firearms. It ought to be a simple process to implement whatever points of agreement can be codified.

But no. As soon as anybody they think is a libby-rull gungrabber walks into the room, there is no chance of agreement on anything.

I agree with all until your last para.....

It works both ways here. As soon anybody they think is neanderthal brainless gun owner also walks into a room - there is no chance of agreement on anything.

 

[MR.CLEAN]

As soon anybody they think is neanderthal brainless gun owner also walks into a room - there is no chance of agreement on anything.

I have had many good gun conversations here, despite owning guns and being a neanderthal (and being in favor of reasonable restrictions on firearm ownership and use). Typically I don't bother talking about school shooting-related gun restrictions (or CRT, or school book bans, or school sports) with those who have no children in school or likely to be going.

The straw man is heavy with you today

 

[jocal505]

I agree with all until your last para.....

It works both ways here. As soon anybody they think is neanderthal brainless gun owner also walks into a room - there is no chance of agreement on anything.

This is why. Let's agree on whether my brain has exploded, or not.

 

[Steam Flyer]

USAnians don't take responsibility in general. More and more are just spoilt children.

But the gun debate is disappointing. Both "sides" agree that there are many people who should NOT have access to firearms. It ought to be a simple process to implement whatever points of agreement can be codified.

But no. As soon as anybody they think is a libby-rull gungrabber walks into the room, there is no chance of agreement on anything.

I agree with all until your last para.....

It works both ways here. As soon anybody they think is neanderthal brainless gun owner also walks into a room - there is no chance of agreement on anything.

I agree there are some like that, but it's not as nearly universal as the other.

Hopefully, enough people that aren't this way will actually vote their conscience over the next few years, and perhaps we can start on some path out of this mess (if one exists).

 

[Burning Man]

I have had many good gun conversations here, despite owning guns and being a neanderthal (and being in favor of reasonable restrictions on firearm ownership and use). Typically I don't bother talking about school shooting-related gun restrictions (or CRT, or school book bans, or school sports) with those who have no children in school or likely to be going.

The straw man is heavy with you today

I'm not sure what you're on about?? What Strawman have I put up to shoot at? I favor reasonable gun restrictions too. I Have explicitly said that with many examples here for a long time.

But I was simply countering Steamer's false argument that it is ONLY the gunners that kill any debate on the subject.

 

[Burning Man]

I agree there are some like that, but it's not as nearly universal as the other.

Hopefully, enough people that aren't this way will actually vote their conscience over the next few years, and perhaps we can start on some path out of this mess (if one exists).

The ONLY true path out of this mess must involve far more than just more "reasonable" gun restrictions. It must involve a holistic "Whole-society" approach that tackles the root causes of why this violence occurs in the first place at the level that it does.

And something like that needs to be on the level of the New Deal, Great Society, Apollo Moonshot, etc. level of commitment from the entire country. But frankly, I'm skeptical that we have it in us to do that.

 

[MR.CLEAN]

I'm not sure what you're on about?? What Strawman have I put up to shoot at? I favor reasonable gun restrictions too. I Have explicitly said that with many examples here for a long time.

But I was simply countering Steamer's false argument that it is ONLY the gunners that kill any debate on the subject.

Copy. It's never ONLY one thing or another, but it's pretty unbalanced on the whole.

 

[MR.CLEAN]

It must involve a holistic "Whole-society" approach that tackles the root causes of why this violence occurs in the first place at the level that it does.

Na Jeff, this is pure bullshit and there's no mystery.

Since long before the story of Cain and Abel, humans been wanting to kill each other. Some cause their wife got boned, some cause their kid got killed, some cause their grandpappy got killed by your grandpappy, some for money, some for drugs, some for love, some because the are hallucinating, some because X% of humans get depressed and want to die.

The more weapons they have, the more dying and killing occurs. And a person who will kill one person will often kill many, if they can.

That's why guns were so heavily regulated in the first 200+ years of our national history.

 

[Burning Man]

Na Jeff, this is pure bullshit and there's no mystery.

Since long before the story of Cain and Abel, humans been wanting to kill each other.

The more weapons they have, the more killing they do.

That's why guns were so heavily regulated in the first 200+ years of our national history.

So the human evolution that has occured since before Cain and Able to where we created a fabric of "society" to prevent or at least tamp down the urge for us to kill each other is pure bullshit?? Really? OK counselor.

 

[Steam Flyer]

I apologize for not being more clear- did not intend to convey the idea that the ONLY barrier was the goddam gunnutz kablammists intransigence about libby-rulls.

Na Jeff, this is pure bullshit and there's no mystery.

Since long before the story of Cain and Abel, humans been wanting to kill each other.

The more weapons they have, the more killing they do.

That's why guns were so heavily regulated in the first 200+ years of our national history.

It's also why gun/weapon regulations are so commonly flouted, especially by those who can count on political favoritism.

The ONLY true path out of this mess must involve far more than just more "reasonable" gun restrictions. It must involve a holistic "Whole-society" approach that tackles the root causes of why this violence occurs in the first place at the level that it does.

And something like that needs to be on the level of the New Deal, Great Society, Apollo Moonshot, etc. level of commitment from the entire country. But frankly, I'm skeptical that we have it in us to do that.

That's not ONLY one path, that looks like a pretty wide range of options to me. Which is good, it should be like a Chinese menu of picking ideas and trying them on... but it will take a large commitment from a greater majority of USAnians. Is that possible?

How many Republicans will reject the gun-brandishing of candidates like Boebert? How many Democrats will vote FOR a candidate that says, "Look guys well-secured firearms in private homes is not that big a part of this problem"??

 

[d'ranger]

Want to stir up a hornets nest? On Quora the question was asked why someone needed an AR-15 and the answers were - great for self defense, predators, home invasions etc. I wrote that a pump shotgun, a 30-30 and a .357 revolver were more than adequate for any and all of those situations resulting in a flame war. My second post was you want one, you don't need one. It resulted in the guy in charge of the gun forum shutting down the thread. Evidently if you oppose military style weapons for everyday use you are an Elmer Fudd.

good times.

 

[Burning Man]

That's not ONLY one path, that looks like a pretty wide range of options to me. Which is good, it should be like a Chinese menu of picking ideas and trying them on... but it will take a large commitment from a greater majority of USAnians. Is that possible?

It a very wide path, but you must take all or most of the avenues for it to be successful overall. Choosing one and ignoring the others will have as much success as moar gun regs alone.

My "path" includes (but not all inclusive):

Better primary and higher education
Better mental health access
Poverty reduction
Ending the WOD
Parental education
Better universal healthcare
Better socio-economic opportunity
Firearms safety training
Targeted Gun Regulations
Better enforcement of existing laws against violence
Tougher laws and penalties against violence

If you leave any one out, the whole thing falls apart in the end.

And yes, this would take a YUGE commitment from a greater majority of 'Mericans. Which is why I said I was skeptical we had it in us as a society to make those sorts of commitments and sacrifices.

 

[Burning Man]

Want to stir up a hornets nest? On Quora the question was asked why someone needed an AR-15 and the answers were - great for self defense, predators, home invasions etc. I wrote that a pump shotgun, a 30-30 and a .357 revolver were more than adequate for any and all of those situations resulting in a flame war. My second post was you want one, you don't need one. It resulted in the guy in charge of the gun forum shutting down the thread. Evidently if you oppose military style weapons for everyday use you are an Elmer Fudd.

good times.

You missed the point of the debate then. While yes, your suggestions are "adequate" for the stated needs, there are better alternatives. And for some folks, those alternatives make a HUGE difference in effectiveness.

For instance, a small 100lb woman would likely be very uncomfortable shooting a pump 12 ga, a 30-30 lever action or a .357 Mag. And not liking it means she wouldn't train with it. And not training with it means she would probably never grab it if needed. So yeah, a military style weapon is often better for stuff like that for the very reasons it works great for the military and why they paid big bucks developing it. Because its light, accurate, easy to shoot for a whole range of people and is effective.

So you're entitled to your opinion and your stated opinion shouldn't have caused a flame war. But those people's opinions are just as if not more valid than yours. Because sometimes, "adequate" is not enough.