Mothquito

Lakrass

Member
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Probably that the gennaker will be mainly use for those sailing in tandem and not in solo. Some more below. Would be interesting to see on water behavior when they begin sailing this.

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Major Tom

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Darkest Africa
I can’t see how it will be ‘affordable ‘ although I do understand that that is a relative term. In effect 2 sets of high modulus foils will cost a fortune all by themselves.

 
Hej Jonas!

Great engineering, but this will of course be reflected on the pricetag. The outward pointing foils are technically really to my liking, but could be hazardous in tight racing situations.

Lars

also mostly above 60 N

 

teknologika

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Hej Jonas!

Great engineering, but this will of course be reflected on the pricetag. The outward pointing foils are technically really to my liking, but could be hazardous in tight racing situations.

Lars

also mostly above 60 N
Yes. Those foils are an accident waiting to happen ( t-foils are bad enough ) ISAF needs to ban them for inshore sailing. 

 
Looks like a big water- bug. All we need is yet ANOTHER new design to dilute the already completely diluted pool of small boat racers ( of any type ). The reasons that new fleets cannot seem to form and gain traction are everywhere. Could be fun to sail the Mothquito - but lonely. 

 

A Class Sailor

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On the water
What a crock of shit! The problem with foiling is that every man and his dog thinks they can make a better mouse trap. This is not a better mouse trap.

Besides the point already made about the dangers of the outward facing foils, particularly seeing their overall width, there are lots of other things that are simply wrong. To start with, there is absolutely no need for 2 rudders. All that is happening is the drag is doubling up. What i am more interested in is getting those rudders up and down when sailing off a beach in anything but dead flat water. They say the back of the boat slides in and out but with the size, length and number of tubes involved, I can see no way that you will be able to move it in and out on the water because if there is any load at all, they will simply lock up. Therefore to get the rudders up and down you will need to go out along the tube to be able to pull the foils as they are in a vertical dagger box. I look froward to watching that

The guys designing this seem to know little about modern foiling. They state that "It’s common to see catamarans that fly with a negative trim, that is, bows down, with the risk of suffering spectacular pitch-pole or rollover by the bow". That shows a complete lack of understanding. Foiling cats try to be bow down (and heeled to windward) because it is faster and safer. Besides the speed benefit of the airflow over the tramp working with the deck sweeper, if you are bow down and you get hit by a gust, there is far less chance that the acceleration will create dangerous bow up attitude that leads to the foils stalling out.If you are bow up and the foils let go, there is much more momentum built on the way down and you are more likely to go over the front. I don't achieve it as often as I would like, but getting bow down at speed makes the whole boat feel a lot safer.

I know it has already been said, but the 4.9m beam for the foils is scarily crazy. so much hidden under the water will make it really friendly to other water users.

As a final thought, I cannot get my head around what happens when you capsize but none of the scenarios I come up with are good.

In the words from The Fly (which seems apt), Be afraid, very very afraid!

 
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dgmckim

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North Carolina
I don't understand how this is any better than what already exists. Same as that stupid new America's Cup boat - how is that actually better in any way than the cats? It's main selling point is that it isn't a catamaran. Anyways, I digress. Why would anyone spend a ton of money on this when they could just buy a moth and have actual other moths to race against. Or a wazsp. Or an A cat. Or a nacra. Or a UFO. etc etc. Also who in Gods name that is buying a foiling boat is going to want to park it on the beach like that while they sunbathe?

 

inebriated

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Australia
yeah, pretty silly design

it's really interesting though because now that foiling is starting to trickle down to more average sailors, people can only really make one design boats that foil, because cat and mono hull single hander development classes are already around.

you then have to dumb the design down a bit to make it accessible and affordable for the one design criteria, e.g. the waszp

and then you need to make something that people actually really want, to be honest, i only really see the waszp succeeding out of this influx of single handed foilers

 

Nips

New member
What I like in the description is the dimensions to 2 decimal points of a metre, and then "oversized" mainsail.

Think it falls into yet another dreamer exercise, just that instead of using the back of a school exercise book with a biro during religious studies classes , the sketches etc are now using 3D design packages. Still doesn't make it anymore likely to be a viable sailing/foiling craft. 

 

Team_GBR

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and then you need to make something that people actually really want, to be honest, i only really see the waszp succeeding out of this influx of single handed foilers
Cannot disagree more. The Waszp has succeeded because it had a first to market advantage over the competitors. Now new designs are coming through, I cannot see the Waszp continuing to sell in the same numbers because it is deeply flawed not least because it isn't that much easier to sail than a Moth. I would make a pretty big bet that the UFO will outsell the Waszp going forward (if it isn't already), and there will be other boats we haven't yet seen.

The one thing I am pretty confident about is that the Mothquito is not going to be one of the foilers that succeeds.

 

ASA

Member
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Cannot disagree more. The Waszp has succeeded because it had a first to market advantage over the competitors. Now new designs are coming through, I cannot see the Waszp continuing to sell in the same numbers because it is deeply flawed not least because it isn't that much easier to sail than a Moth. I would make a pretty big bet that the UFO will outsell the Waszp going forward (if it isn't already), and there will be other boats we haven't yet seen.

The one thing I am pretty confident about is that the Mothquito is not going to be one of the foilers that succeeds.
You are kidding yourself if you think the UFO is already outselling the WASZP. there have been around 600 WASZPs sold worldwide +120 in the USA already. That is considerably more than the UFO. The WASZP is now developing a solid racing program with numbers increasing. It will be interesting to see what the UK get to their nationals and the USA get to the ACC event. But with 36 boats at the Aus nationals and 25 at the NZ nationals recently numbers are starting to increase. It is not out of the question that there will be 70-80 boats sailing at the Europeans at the end of June and organisers of the WASZP Games in Perth are expecting numbers in excess of 120 based on early indications from Aus and other countries. 

That to me is a huge jump on the competition and obviously its not just in numbers but also racing and culture. 

 

Team_GBR

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You are kidding yourself if you think the UFO is already outselling the WASZP. there have been around 600 WASZPs sold worldwide +120 in the USA already. That is considerably more than the UFO. The WASZP is now developing a solid racing program with numbers increasing. It will be interesting to see what the UK get to their nationals and the USA get to the ACC event. But with 36 boats at the Aus nationals and 25 at the NZ nationals recently numbers are starting to increase. It is not out of the question that there will be 70-80 boats sailing at the Europeans at the end of June and organisers of the WASZP Games in Perth are expecting numbers in excess of 120 based on early indications from Aus and other countries. 

That to me is a huge jump on the competition and obviously its not just in numbers but also racing and culture. 
I am not sure whether I made myself clear or you don't want to understand what I posted. To be outselling the Waszp has nothing to do with how many boats have been sold to date. The question is how many were sold in, say, January and then in each month going forward. Numbers at regattas have nothing to do with current sales figures. It also wouldn't surprise me if the UFO would outsell the Waszp and have lower numbers racing.

We have also seen it all before. Classes come and go far quicker today than we used to see. look at some of the Laser Performance, Topper International and RS boats. Class loyalty isn't what it used to be.

 
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ASA

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I'll let you do the maths then. The UFO has about 100 boats sold (not all built) The WASZP has around 600 in the market, both were put in production mid-late 2016......

 

inebriated

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Cannot disagree more. The Waszp has succeeded because it had a first to market advantage over the competitors. Now new designs are coming through, I cannot see the Waszp continuing to sell in the same numbers because it is deeply flawed not least because it isn't that much easier to sail than a Moth. I would make a pretty big bet that the UFO will outsell the Waszp going forward (if it isn't already), and there will be other boats we haven't yet seen.

The one thing I am pretty confident about is that the Mothquito is not going to be one of the foilers that succeeds.
ok, mentioning that, i could probably see the UFO getting somewhere as well, i just think that the buyer is a bit different

i do however believe that the waszp will still remain to sell well in the future, just because no one will buy say a onefly at a club where there are more than one waszps, similar to how waszps probably will not get into clubs invested in UFO's

 

Team_GBR

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I'll let you do the maths then. The UFO has about 100 boats sold (not all built) The WASZP has around 600 in the market, both were put in production mid-late 2016......
So what. Past sales doesn't give an indication of future sales, which is what I was predicting.

 
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