mound of the hound

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carlsbad
There is a boat in San Diego that I absolutely cannot fucking stand, and I am not alone in this. It is Staghound, the R/P 50 that despite years of mostly being poorly sailed with second-tier sails, has won a lot primarily due to the fact that the boat is quick, but has also been handed embarrassingly gifted PHRF ratings as well.

People have complained about it for years, but PHRF San Diego didn't do anything until the boat added a fat top main, longer sprit, and new rudder, but even then it was a gift (-3 seconds a mile if I remember correctly).

After a number of competitors bitched, it was brought up for a rating review about a year ago.  This rating review included some ORR data from a test certificate in an old and slower configuration.  Even with this data, the boat got an additional knock (I think 9 seconds) which they sailed with and continued winning,

Based on the original review, PHRF worked with a yacht designer and came up with a VPP spreadsheet to remeasure using both measured VPP and PHRF numbers and requested all PHRF negative rated boats get ORR measured (almost all already were) and rated, so that there was measurement data (and ratings) that could establish something more concrete than the bellyaching.

So guess who refused to get measured after 6 months of asking? You got it. And of course the reasons are obvious, especially from people who don't want a fair fight.  They still wouldn't comply, so PHRF hit them -6 as a blanket penalty for refusing to get measured to get the rating a bit closer to reality.  This penalty would be dropped as soon as they turned in a measurement certificate.

So what was their response? They asked for a refund from PHRF San Diego, pulled their already issued San Diego PHRF Certificate, and then entered the San Diego based Cabrillo series (first race of the year) using their SoCal PHRF cert which gives them another 15 seconds a mile advantage, as So Cal PHRF never gave them the 9-second knock that they took last year or the temporary  120 day -6 knock for refusing to get measured which is just the San Diego rating.

It is worth noting that Chuck Skewes, the sails salesman from Ullman Sails, who represented Staghound at the SD PHRF meeting, agreed to accept the 6 sec knock until they turned in their measured cert then went and did this anyway.  Funny, circumventing standard procedures and pissing off a fleet of larger boats and their owners who buy big, expensive sails doesn't seem like a good way to attract customers to me...

I think they blatantly subverted the system, by using the outdated and inaccurate -48 rating instead of the more accurate and recent SD PHRF issued. -63.  We're not sure it's actual cheating, but it is a chickenshit move that in no way meats the spirit of fair racing.  This boat is widely despised not only because of their continual rating fuckery, but because they strut around like they are the shit.  It's a fucking joke.

This is truly unsportsmanlike and not surprising for this group's truly blatant FU to PHRF and all their competitors. IMO, PHRF SD should refuse to issue them a certificate going forward.  I mean, if their SD cert wasn't good enough for this, why should it be good enough going forward? Fuck these guys. Almost all PHRF races here require each boat to have an SD cert.

Perhaps for this series, everyone in their class should race in the ORR division and let them have their PHRF pickle dish by themselves.  If they are willing to sell their soul (assuming there is one) for a trophy, then let them have it. - ed.

 
Coming from class sailing most of my life, I'm fairly new to this PHRF BS. Right away, I see plenty of whiners and manipulation to get the ratings they want.

Never understood why SD had their own PHRF certs to begin with. There's already PHRF SoCal. What's the story there?

I would understand regional adjustments, but an entirely different committee? This in itself makes little sense.

From what I've seen the SD ratings are all gifts regardless of the boat. A convoluted system revolving around a localized fleet. 

Clean it up and maybe the shenanigans stop. Easier said than done I know.

 

Parma

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I wonder what Hoa (cashier at Von's) would think about this. How do you pronounce Hoa anyway? Why am I on the roof?

 

fan

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This whole thing is beyond shenaninigans its border line 69 unsportsman like.  Amazing how desperate some are for a pickle dish I guess.

 

Rain Man

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We gave up long ago on expecting PHRF to be fair.  Just go out and race.  Quite often we describe our result as "first after xxxxx" where xxxxx is a boat with a known soft rating.

All the lightweight race boats in my area were hit with a big penalty this year to make it easier for the 4kt shitboxes to win.  All that will do is shift the post-race discussion to who really won the regatta after the results are posted showing a 4kt shitbox winning.

PHRF is the worst rating system ever except for all the others.  At least it is cheap.

 
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Rum Runner

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Hey Ed- Why not challenge the owner to a fight?  Meet at dawn around a burning pile of PHRF measurement forms.  Then pour engine oil over your naked bodies and wrestle until the winner prevails. You can even have Woody take side bets.  

 

axolotl

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Never understood why SD had their own PHRF certs to begin with. There's already PHRF SoCal. What's the story there?
I was on  the PHRF-SD Board for a few years and here's the story:  San Diego is so far south it's almost always a light air venue so  PHRF-SoCal base ratings do not accurately reflect a boat's potential due to the venue.  Having raced throughout So.Cal. there's some truth to that; when racing in LA your boat better be able to perform and handle 25kn winds while in SD they cancel races if it's gonna be that windy.  So serious SD boats optimize for light air with deeper/lighter sails (no penalty) and the big boys with dough mod with fatheads, oversize booms and poles, prods, modded keels & rudders and masthead kites to compensate and rating them accurately becomes difficult, they can take a rating hit but it pays off often, especially the one offs.

Concerning the Snaghound,  a decade ago they had some competition and didn't dominate as much as they do now, but as the fleet aged out (Dennis lost his mast, Wasabe folded due to the cost factor, Bad Pak never did get a fair rating because it was so radical, the Pennells have semi-retired, etc.) they no longer have viable competition and win every time.  You'd have to hit them with 20+seconds/mile to allow the remaining boats in the fleet to have a chance.  Note in Cabrillo 1 this year only had 3 boats in their fleet so the idea that nobody races against them anymore is actually happening.

Concerning Snaghound's crew complement, Alec, Chuckie (an MIR with a vested interest) and mission critical foredeck/trim  crew is competent, but in the last few years sailors I consider gumbies and just another pretty face have joined the roster and brag on FaceBook about their winning ride.  I suspect they're purely railmeat for local racing.  Correct me If I'm wrong, but the Snag was middle of the fleet in the big races like N2E over the last 6 years or so so its offshore rating  is reasonable or they fare poorly when confronted by big boy boats from out of town.

 

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carlsbad
What a load of wank.Skews and company have proven time and again on the race course what douches they are .This just confirms it .
One of my least favorite people on the planet. the slime just oozes. and that owner, i've disliked him for 30 years. throw in a few other complete twats, and there ya have it - shit stew!

 

Editor

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carlsbad
Hey Ed- Why not challenge the owner to a fight?  Meet at dawn around a burning pile of PHRF measurement forms.  Then pour engine oil over your naked bodies and wrestle until the winner prevails. You can even have Woody take side bets.  
that old fuck? sheeet....

 

Editor

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carlsbad
I was on  the PHRF-SD Board for a few years and here's the story:  San Diego is so far south it's almost always a light air venue so  PHRF-SoCal base ratings do not accurately reflect a boat's potential due to the venue.  Having raced throughout So.Cal. there's some truth to that; when racing in LA your boat better be able to perform and handle 25kn winds while in SD they cancel races if it's gonna be that windy.  So serious SD boats optimize for light air with deeper/lighter sails (no penalty) and the big boys with dough mod with fatheads, oversize booms and poles, prods, modded keels & rudders and masthead kites to compensate and rating them accurately becomes difficult, they can take a rating hit but it pays off often, especially the one offs.

Concerning the Snaghound,  a decade ago they had some competition and didn't dominate as much as they do now, but as the fleet aged out (Dennis lost his mast, Wasabe folded due to the cost factor, Bad Pak never did get a fair rating because it was so radical, the Pennells have semi-retired, etc.) they no longer have viable competition and win every time.  You'd have to hit them with 20+seconds/mile to allow the remaining boats in the fleet to have a chance.  Note in Cabrillo 1 this year only had 3 boats in their fleet so the idea that nobody races against them anymore is actually happening.

Concerning Snaghound's crew complement, Alec, Chuckie (an MIR with a vested interest) and mission critical foredeck/trim  crew is competent, but in the last few years sailors I consider gumbies and just another pretty face have joined the roster and brag on FaceBook about their winning ride.  I suspect they're purely railmeat for local racing.  Correct me If I'm wrong, but the Snag was middle of the fleet in the big races like N2E over the last 6 years or so so its offshore rating  is reasonable or they fare poorly when confronted by big boy boats from out of town.
well said. there is no real talent on that boat - it's a fast r/p design specifically for sd. too bad he didn't get a nelson design, then it would be an actual hound. oops, better not make fun of nelson, the pretty face might get upset.

 
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PaulK

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So what was their response? They asked for a refund from PHRF San Diego, pulled their already issued San Diego PHRF Certificate, and then entered the San Diego based Cabrillo series (first race of the year) using their SoCal PHRF cert which gives them another 15 seconds a mile advantage, as So Cal PHRF never gave them the 9-second knock that they took last year or the temporary  120 day -6 knock for refusing to get measured which is just the San Diego rating.
So why does the San Diego based Cabrillo Race Committee allow boats to use SoCal PHRF certificates? Perhaps PHRF San Diego could issue 'guest' certificates for racers from out of town for this series, for maybe $3.00 each? 

 
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