New luxury yacht tax in Canada

Bristol-Cruiser

Super Anarchist
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1,528
Great Lakes
I would love to understand the logic behind $250k on boats and $100k on planes and cars. We really do not have significant manufacturing in any of these sectors - a few boat builders Kanter and Gozzard come to mind.. I think this is largely a symbolic measure and does distract attention from other aspects of this massive budget. As to getting the budget passed, the luxury tax would make it easier for the NDP to support the minority Liberals.

 

fastyacht

Super Anarchist
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Article below about the 1990ish luxury tax - 

there was a recession at that time as well . . 

Hmmm, if the tax wrecked the boating industry, why did it not also wreck the fur, car, and jewelry industries ?? 

One reason governments wind up taxing luxury goods is that the rich are so good at hiding income 

Further on the relationship between the luxury tax and the decline of the boating industry: correlation is not causation. 

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-xpm-1992-07-07-9202180334-story.html
Blah blah. I was there. Sorry, it was definitely causatiion.

 

robalex117

Super Anarchist
Article below about the 1990ish luxury tax - 

there was a recession at that time as well . . 

Hmmm, if the tax wrecked the boating industry, why did it not also wreck the fur, car, and jewelry industries ?? 

One reason governments wind up taxing luxury goods is that the rich are so good at hiding income 

Further on the relationship between the luxury tax and the decline of the boating industry: correlation is not causation. 

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-xpm-1992-07-07-9202180334-story.html
I think there is a differnece in buying a $100K car and a  lets say $2,000,000 boat.  People do really need the car and do purchase them somewhat locally.  Same with jewelry.  But for expensive boats some more then $2million first they are not necessary and the buyer can just wait, or more often purchase it overseas and register offshore.  

By the way New York and FL cap the sales tax now on boats, since they have figured out that getting something is much better then getting a big ZERO dollars in sales tax if they were not caped.  

 

kent_island_sailor

Super Anarchist
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Kent Island!
Article below about the 1990ish luxury tax - 

there was a recession at that time as well . . 

Hmmm, if the tax wrecked the boating industry, why did it not also wreck the fur, car, and jewelry industries ?? 

One reason governments wind up taxing luxury goods is that the rich are so good at hiding income 

Further on the relationship between the luxury tax and the decline of the boating industry: correlation is not causation. 

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-xpm-1992-07-07-9202180334-story.html
We went from $1.5 million to $325,000 revenue in the space of a year. Outside whatever alternative universe you live in this misbegotten scheme took a chainsaw to marine businesses and put hard working people out on the street.

Rich people didn't even give a shit, their blind trust called their Panamanian banker who called his Swiss Banker who sold some bearer bonds and got a 100 foot yacht transfered from one trust to another trust in Grand Cayman. Regular old working people got it right up the ass.

 
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fastyacht

Super Anarchist
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And CT repealed the property tax on boats some years ago...because it cut out CT economic activity...went to Ny, Ma, RI. Yep. It isnt imaginary. Taxes have consequrnces.

 
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Sail4beer

Usual suspect
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Toms River,NJ
Blah blah. I was there. Sorry, it was definitely causatiion.
I think some guy could still afford to buy his lady a $25,000 mink coat and a $50,000 diamond ring. Probably decided to skip the luxury tax on a $1.5 million powerboat like all the other people with money to burn. Burning it’s ok, giving it to a stupid political stunt- no way.

 

fastyacht

Super Anarchist
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Having been through it I am amazed there is any debate. But I am sadly Not Amazed at the fools in Canadia doing it all over again.

 

Laker

Super Anarchist
4,215
286
PNW
Having been through it I am amazed there is any debate. But I am sadly Not Amazed at the fools in Canadia doing it all over again.
Please do not look at this through the lens of American culture.  Although there are common behaviours, look at the Swedish attitude towards taxes as an indication (BBC has a recent article on this)  Some cultures see the responsibilities attached to paying taxes, something that is reflected in the attitudes in Canada to the Canadian Revenue Agency vs the US attitude to the IRS.  In other words, there is a filter to buying guns in Canada and a different view of taxes.

 

Sail4beer

Usual suspect
10,614
3,865
Toms River,NJ
If you can afford a million dollar toy you can afford 150K tax
You can, but the attitude was fuck no, I’m not getting price gouged by the government. Let them ruin the marine industry, I’m going offshore to buy.

That was the sad truth. Rich people didn’t just stop buying boats, they just bought them elsewhere. That’s why the US builders  tanked -because no one in their right mind was willing to pay the extortion and the builders’ overhead and lack of commissions drained them into poverty and property loss.

 
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kent_island_sailor

Super Anarchist
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Kent Island!
Please do not look at this through the lens of American culture.  Although there are common behaviours, look at the Swedish attitude towards taxes as an indication (BBC has a recent article on this)  Some cultures see the responsibilities attached to paying taxes, something that is reflected in the attitudes in Canada to the Canadian Revenue Agency vs the US attitude to the IRS.  In other words, there is a filter to buying guns in Canada and a different view of taxes.
There is a big difference between a tax on EVERYONE and a tax on YOU. Income tax is the same for everyone at your income level and you choose what to spend it on. When you tax just certain things you are saying F U to just those people.

 

fastyacht

Super Anarchist
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Please do not look at this through the lens of American culture.  Although there are common behaviours, look at the Swedish attitude towards taxes as an indication (BBC has a recent article on this)  Some cultures see the responsibilities attached to paying taxes, something that is reflected in the attitudes in Canada to the Canadian Revenue Agency vs the US attitude to the IRS.  In other words, there is a filter to buying guns in Canada and a different view of taxes.
Good luck with that.

Tou cannot possibly be Canadian. L O L

 

AJ Oliver

Super Anarchist
12,894
1,806
Sandusky Sailing Club
 That’s why the US builders  tanked -because no one in their right mind was willing to pay the extortion and the builders’ overhead and lack of commissions drained them into poverty and property loss.
Are you certain that your assertion is true ?? The early 1990s were also the time during which sailing participation began to plummet, and it has continued to do so. And most of the decline was due to factors other than the tax.  Sailboat sales declined, including boats that were not subject to the tax (cost less than $ 100K). Back in the early 1990s you could buy a lot of boat for that much. 

Second point: As many of you know, the US (especially) has experienced alarming shifts upward in income and wealth - and you are advocating tax policies that will make it worse. 

I'm try to be civil here - hope I am succeeding. 

 

fastyacht

Super Anarchist
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Are you certain that your assertion is true ?? The early 1990s were also the time during which sailing participation began to plummet, and it has continued to do so. And most of the decline was due to factors other than the tax.  Sailboat sales declined, including boats that were not subject to the tax (cost less than $ 100K). Back in the early 1990s you could buy a lot of boat for that much. 

Second point: As many of you know, the US (especially) has experienced alarming shifts upward in income and wealth - and you are advocating tax policies that will make it worse. 

I'm try to be civil here - hope I am succeeding. 
Notice that none of the builders I mentuoned upthread were sail oat bulders (except Pj).

Sailboats in 1992 were less than 10% of total market. Jet skis were ascendant. In the large boat segment sailbosts were tiny fraction.

 

fastyacht

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As for "tax policies that will make it worse, I consider that a near vacuous position.

Income tax is where the rubber meets the road. Has been ever since 1917 or so.

All luxury taxes hurt little guys serving patrons.

Period. And ill conceived sudden Draconian ones are fundamentally (arguably purposefullly so) damaging to small business and their employees. There is no slack in small biz.

 
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andykane

Member
483
235
Victoria, BC
There is a big difference between a tax on EVERYONE and a tax on YOU. Income tax is the same for everyone at your income level and you choose what to spend it on. When you tax just certain things you are saying F U to just those people.
This is the fundamental problem with this tax - it's blatantly unfair. It's saying "you spent $250k on a boat so you can afford to pay some extra money", while at the same time saying "you spent $250k on a motorhome, have fun, you get a special exception".

I'm nowhere near buying a boat to which this tax would apply, but it will still impact me when 20 years from now there's one less used boat to choose from because someone saw this tax and spent their money on something else (like a racecar, which again, has a special exception???)

 

fastyacht

Super Anarchist
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But that is true of all taxed. 

As a leftie, even i have to admit the old conservative economists adage is at least partly true .  .  

If you tax something, you get less of it. 
But the point is that the luxury tax is punitive. It amounys to socialcengineering to favour grocers over shipwrights and draughtsmen

 






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