shebeen
Super Anarchist
https://thedailysail.com/dinghy/10/57294/1/zhik-moth-worlds-the-wingmen
very interesting...10 years is a long time in moth history
New Moth revealed
- Thread starter jamem3
- Start date
very interesting...10 years is a long time in moth history
yeah, its ok, lighter winds seem great. still a bit to go before I'm at the front tho, like all things it takes time to resolve and you have to keep in mind the pocket luffs are a pretty polished item these days, so if I can come close with an attempt in 12 months then there is a chance with work, it can be better, but I'm not the fist to try this, just the first to make one this big (the mast that is). This mast is old (2006) so a new plan is not too far away I think.
F18 Sailor
Super Anarchist
I’m a little confused-this looks like the eXploder Moth launched at Garda last year, the lead designer is the same as eXploder use, but has Ovington stickers on it?!?
The carbon hiking straps look really uncomfortable.
The carbon hiking straps look really uncomfortable.
WCB
Super Anarchist
F18 Sailor
Super Anarchist
That makes little sense, as eXploder are primarily a boat builder themselves.
Daniel Holman
Anarchist
- 570
- 136
My understanding is that eXploder mould the parts, they are then sent to the UK for assembly and being turned into boats with all the other componentry spars etc - Ovi hold a relationship with CST for instance.
Must say a carbon hiking strap is probably fine if you don't intend to hike much - I used to go through the skin on my insteps in laser days even with a padded strap!
Must say a carbon hiking strap is probably fine if you don't intend to hike much - I used to go through the skin on my insteps in laser days even with a padded strap!
Bored Stiff
Member
There is padding on the underside of the carbon, but point taken…
Ovi hold the IP, but too busy to build it themselves is my understanding.
Ovi hold the IP, but too busy to build it themselves is my understanding.
couchsurfer
Super Anarchist
17mika
Anarchist
Regarding MD3, I talked a lot with designer and the exploder polish Guy (I do not remember the name) in Garda when I measured their boats.
Boats were pretty promising at the time speedwise, but really just first prototypes, with obvious issues to sort out, mainly structural. And all guys were pretty transparent that they would need time to sort things out and crash test the boats in all conditions, so boats in garda I guess were pretty different from the ones that will be sold. I liked the fact that foils were pretty morelesse ok the first go, which is far from obvious in the moth class.
I guess now they are more good to go , even if I think they are not taking orders yet. I have no details about the Ovington setup, UK guys would have a lot more info on this.
Good times, with a lot of new boats happening, and other in the making.
See you on the water!
Michele
Boats were pretty promising at the time speedwise, but really just first prototypes, with obvious issues to sort out, mainly structural. And all guys were pretty transparent that they would need time to sort things out and crash test the boats in all conditions, so boats in garda I guess were pretty different from the ones that will be sold. I liked the fact that foils were pretty morelesse ok the first go, which is far from obvious in the moth class.
I guess now they are more good to go , even if I think they are not taking orders yet. I have no details about the Ovington setup, UK guys would have a lot more info on this.
Good times, with a lot of new boats happening, and other in the making.
See you on the water!
Michele
maxstaylock
Anarchist
- 749
- 462
Exploders USP in A Cats seems to be rapid design, mould tool and componant production, seem to go from imagination to finished parts in no time at all. Their hulls and beams are good, but their foils are things of real beauty. They always sold their cats with some user assembly required, most of the sailors have specific ideas on systems etc so it works well, and much cheaper than other makers, so I guess Ovington are perfect for turning a platform into the turn key product the Mothies want.
Lost in Translation
Super Anarchist
One of the great things about the Moth from what I can see is that there are so many builders. It will be interesting to see if this variety remains in five years. Some of the design of the eXploder Moth reminds me of their current eXploder A-Class. Their cats don't have carbon hiking straps given they are trapeze boats but they have carbon access ports and many other custom carbon parts.
The A-Class has seen the eXploder team come to dominate its production volume over time as their designs and quality continued to improve over the years at prices that were lower than the competition. The design work with https://d3appliedtechnologies.com is excellent and is powering their Moth as well. D3 is behind many of the foiling successes today and work in a cooperative fashion with other experts which makes them even more potent. I have been very impressed.
The Moth development looks intense and arguably won't allow the eXploder folks to succeed in the marketplace to the degree they have in the A, but we've seen this team become dominant in A-Class production during a challenging time when the class was just learning to foil. The evolution from their 2013 to 2020 A-Class has included 3 totally different hull and platform builds, over 50 foil designs for the daggerboards alone, numerous iterations of rudders and elevators, and experimentation in almost every aspect of the boat. Put them in the Moth class for a decade and it is likely the class evolution will speed up substantially, though the class is already at a very high level of refinement.
I suspect the amount of money going into the Moth market each year is higher than in the A and therefore could support multiple builders for the long term just out of less sensitivity to price. That said, their partnership with Ovington can bring wider sales, distribution, and support services that can help them grow faster in the Moth.
Will be interesting to watch.
The A-Class has seen the eXploder team come to dominate its production volume over time as their designs and quality continued to improve over the years at prices that were lower than the competition. The design work with https://d3appliedtechnologies.com is excellent and is powering their Moth as well. D3 is behind many of the foiling successes today and work in a cooperative fashion with other experts which makes them even more potent. I have been very impressed.
The Moth development looks intense and arguably won't allow the eXploder folks to succeed in the marketplace to the degree they have in the A, but we've seen this team become dominant in A-Class production during a challenging time when the class was just learning to foil. The evolution from their 2013 to 2020 A-Class has included 3 totally different hull and platform builds, over 50 foil designs for the daggerboards alone, numerous iterations of rudders and elevators, and experimentation in almost every aspect of the boat. Put them in the Moth class for a decade and it is likely the class evolution will speed up substantially, though the class is already at a very high level of refinement.
I suspect the amount of money going into the Moth market each year is higher than in the A and therefore could support multiple builders for the long term just out of less sensitivity to price. That said, their partnership with Ovington can bring wider sales, distribution, and support services that can help them grow faster in the Moth.
Will be interesting to watch.
Daniel Holman
Anarchist
- 570
- 136
Yep it seems like there is enough volume and thus cash to make it worth several builder's whiles, which is good. I think!
17mika
Anarchist
New (updated) kid on the block
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CbvEuWYgYqf/?utm_medium=copy_link
Let's talk about small and high wings!
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CbvEuWYgYqf/?utm_medium=copy_link
Let's talk about small and high wings!
WCB
Super Anarchist
martin 'hoff
Super Anarchist
17mika
Anarchist
I do not have details, neither I spoke with the ferrighis or ruggero. But I like their concept of aero wings, which seems the same as the current manta, just more extreme.
With those wings I'd be more worried about tacking, than anythung else honestly
Lost in Translation
Super Anarchist
How do the aero wings perform? The windward one is adding righting moment I believe but I can’t figure out what the high leeward one is doing except adding heeling moment. Can it add driving force?
The leeward wing is aligning a wing shape to the apparent wing trying to provide forward drive. The down side is that the raised forward part also provides a lot of drag when tacking. Most of the other new designs have wings with no camber to offer less drag.
