Organizing Sailing as Gouvernail Sees It.

[Starboard!]

The Olympics is primarily a for profit enterprise. The owners have BRILLIANTLY sold many people on the idea their should be games okayed to profit the owners and …. Oh yeah… give nations an opportunity to compete in games rather than wars.

Quite wonderfully, the athletes who get to qualify and compete enjoy a very special lifetime experience.

Having said that:

USSailing should be entirely focused on one kind of sailing just as the US tennis association is focused on one kind of court and ball game.

Badminton, ping pong, volleyball are each a lot more like tennis than Kiteboarding or Sunfish sailing is like PHRF or IOR.

A US Olympic sailing association might be a great service organization for those chasing the Olympic dream.

Such an association has no reason to dilute its focus and resources properly applied to Opti sailing and tri-Maran racing.

Summary:
USSailing should be broken up into about ten different service organizations.

And if the Olympic stuff starts taking up too much energy from an individual class association, that association can realize it is sucking resources away from its primary mission and find a way to do its job DESPITE being an Olympic class.

I think you are right that things need to be separated. But what confuses me is that sailing, in the sense that US Sailing was created to organize and grow, does not seem to have grown very much, if at all for quite a long time. I haven't seen statistics, but I've been involved in the sport for my entire life and coaching at all levels for nearly 2 decades. While it seems demographics have changed (slightly, for the better!), the sport seems to be shrinking amongst active racers.

In a world where most millennials and younger are seeking to spend their money on experiences and activities rather than more traditional (home, car, family, etc) "American dream" type things that their parents did, sailing should be an EASY sell. Further, with an increasing number of people shifting their location to be closer to lake or ocean coastlines (there are census numbers that show this), why are we not seeing the growth from the "community" based outreach that US Sailing has claimed to be focusing on in any of the seminars I've been to? Many clubs are struggling for new membership.

The issue seems to be more than US Sailing not having focus, being stretched too thin, or not having the resources. It really seems to be every issue all at the same time, which stinks of a fundamentally ineffective organization. It needs to be reimagined from the ground up.

 

[sunseeker]

I think you are right that things need to be separated. But what confuses me is that sailing, in the sense that US Sailing was created to organize and grow, does not seem to have grown very much, if at all for quite a long time. I haven't seen statistics, but I've been involved in the sport for my entire life and coaching at all levels for nearly 2 decades. While it seems demographics have changed (slightly, for the better!), the sport seems to be shrinking amongst active racers.

In a world where most millennials and younger are seeking to spend their money on experiences and activities rather than more traditional (home, car, family, etc) "American dream" type things that their parents did, sailing should be an EASY sell. Further, with an increasing number of people shifting their location to be closer to lake or ocean coastlines (there are census numbers that show this), why are we not seeing the growth from the "community" based outreach that US Sailing has claimed to be focusing on in any of the seminars I've been to? Many clubs are struggling for new membership.

The issue seems to be more than US Sailing not having focus, being stretched too thin, or not having the resources. It really seems to be every issue all at the same time, which stinks of a fundamentally ineffective organization. It needs to be reimagined from the ground up.

All of that is true, but it’s a waste of time to try and fix US Sailing. Better to spend your efforts on things that matter to you locally. If we all do that, things will be fine. The US Sailing Board is tone deaf, they don’t want any input, especially the President, Vice Pres and CEO. They are clueless about racing, and do not care at all, because they have never done it. It’s a mistake to look for those three clowns as the leaders of yacht racing. Ignore them, focus local.

 

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10 different orgs, w the bureaucracy of 10 boards, all competing w each other for $$?

absolutely not.

 

[Tcatman]

It needs to be reimagined from the ground up.

Clean referenced the fellows book who did an excellent job evaluating the current state of affairs. .... and crickets... Reimagining from the ground up could be even more of a dud... I found a lot of support for the notion...ah...the class and sport are dying... we can't get new young people into our formula... Any changes to the formula will piss off the people who do like the old tried and true formula... screw it... we will ride this horse into the ground. So long as we can get enough support for a nationals and some sort of mid winter series we can run the same game plan as the local racing just melts away. The old guys who like the old formula now have money and can travel. The young people..... well there are no young people.... 10 years later... that is the way it has played out ... racers simply grow older and step away.

I am not sure where the energy and leadership would come from from "re imagining from the ground up"

 

[dogwatch]

I am not sure where the energy and leadership would come from from "re imagining from the ground up"

Such re-energising as I've seen in the UK in recent decades has either come from from one-design manufacturers who can afford to put full-time resource into building a class or from a small number of people in a club who get a particular bee in their bonnet and run with it. Usually the recently-retired who have the time, still have the desire and energy for a new project in their lives and know how to organise and fund-raise.

It amazes me that so many American sailors, of all the people in the world, seem convinced that it is down to the national body to drive or even fund "saving sailing" projects. Tell us somewhere, anywhere in the world it has happened like that.

OK boomers, set to it. Or are you all "bowling alone"?

 

[Tcatman]

Usually the recently-retired who have the time, still have the desire and energy for a new project in their lives and know how to organise and fund-raise.

Are you referencing the past... the present or the future here? IMO present racers of a certain age have a mindset of buying a racing service.... consequently these recent retires would rather travel and buy a service (When you buy the service.. you have NO commitments to the community... hey you paid your entry fee! you bought a regatta service for 100 bucks and now can go racing.) While some may enjoy a shot at building something new or continuing to fight the same old fight of trying to get more racers into your class, they don't see a lot of support from their peers and "community". I think that is why you see the whining that "US Sailing is screwing up".... Its not my personal problem to take on ... but they want someone to fix it for them. US Sailing wants my money and that is what they say they do.... so they should fix it... That way... we can buy what we want. aka a doom loop.

 

[dogwatch]

Usually the recently-retired who have the time, still have the desire and energy for a new project in their lives and know how to organise and fund-raise.

Are you referencing the past... the present or the future here?

Present.

 

[Rambler]

Usually the recently-retired who have the time, still have the desire and energy for a new project in their lives and know how to organise and fund-raise.

Are you referencing the past... the present or the future here? IMO present racers of a certain age have a mindset of buying a racing service.... consequently these recent retires would rather travel and buy a service (When you buy the service.. you have NO commitments to the community... hey you paid your entry fee! you bought a regatta service for 100 bucks and now can go racing.) While some may enjoy a shot at building something new or continuing to fight the same old fight of trying to get more racers into your class, they don't see a lot of support from their peers and "community". I think that is why you see the whining that "US Sailing is screwing up".... Its not my personal problem to take on ... but they want someone to fix it for them. US Sailing wants my money and that is what they say they do.... so they should fix it... That way... we can buy what we want. aka a doom loop.

He is also referencing the UK and Australia and, as he said, in the present.

Even on this forum, those words perfectly describe what Curious, Stanno and myself are doing; each in our own ways and persuing our own ideals. And they are just the ones I know from their writings. There's another couple of people the next club North from us doing the same.

It really only takes one inspired person (and really not that much money), to make a dinghy/skiff club prosper.

Within the US, wouldn't Governail fall within that description too?

 

[Tcatman]

Curious, Stanno and myself... gouv... the carolina laser guy

Props to all of you running the classic model for building a racing club. IMO you are community building. My cohort of racers who are buying a regatta service would certainly support your efforts. The consensus is that national organizations are mostly irrelevant to what you are doing beyond certification of junior coaches, judges and race officers. I was looking for some insight into starboards comment.

. It really seems to be every issue all at the same time, which stinks of a fundamentally ineffective organization. It needs to be reimagined from the ground up.

Collectively us old farts can run the old program but I am not sure if re-imagining the problem and solutions is in the cards. Every idea that I have read is derivative and I don't see it speaking to the 20's and 30 somethings. What and more importantly Who am I unaware of? Are the 20 or 30 somethings interested in buying a regatta service or building and being part of a community? How different does this look like from our now "classic" point of view?

 

[knh555]

Collectively us old farts can run the old program but I am not sure if reimagining the problem and solutions is in the cards. Every idea that I have read is derivative and I don't see it speaking to the 20's and 30 somethings. What and more importantly Who am I unaware of?

Last year, we started doing an A/B regatta early in the season to allow our post-college sailors in our fleet to invite their friends sailing, and they're pretty much all damn good sailors. We can get twice as many teams in a limited number of boats in a format they're familiar with. Everyone seemed to have a good time and we exposed both our class and fleet to new sailors. It was successful enough that we're doing it again this June.

Time will tell if this helps grow our fleet, but it was conceived of and run by our fleet's 20-somethings as a way to get other 20-somethings into the boat.

 

[dogwatch]

My cohort of racers who are buying a regatta service would certainly support your efforts.

Sorry if I have not been paying attention but what cohort is that and why are you particularly interested in the 20s-30s?

 

[knh555]

Last year, we started doing an A/B regatta early in the season to allow our post-college sailors in our fleet to invite their friends sailing, and they're pretty much all damn good sailors. We can get twice as many teams in a limited number of boats in a format they're familiar with. Everyone seemed to have a good time and we exposed both our class and fleet to new sailors. It was successful enough that we're doing it again this June.

Time will tell if this helps grow our fleet, but it was conceived of and run by our fleet's 20-somethings as a way to get other 20-somethings into the boat.

Sorry if I have not been paying attention but what cohort is that and why are you particularly interested in the 20s-30s?

I can't speak for @Tcatman, but in our case, it's about growing the class and fleet with people who might actually outlast the the rest of us.

 

[Tcatman]

Sorry if I have not been paying attention but what cohort is that and why are you particularly interested in the 20s-30s?

My fleets were beach cats ... handicap, one design and development. I ran a couple of programs targeted at the high school sailors and they were great fun/successful but generated no long term interest in catamarans. The effort was not sustainable and the enormous establishment of high school and college racing in 420s is the dominant culture in the states.. Post college, the US data show that these racers drop out at high rates and so knh555 nailed the why?

"can't speak for @Tcatman, but in our case, it's about growing the class and fleet with people who might actually outlast the the rest of us."

The programs that I have seen for the post college crowd are national events run by one design classes (snipes, lightnings albacores). The alternative for these racers are racing OPBs or a long long hiatus. Seems to me that if my interest is in racing athletic boats.. 20 to 30 somethings are the target.

One question that I never have a good answer for... Is the nature of the sailing bug biting as junior the same as if it bit you when you were a young adult? For example, I played little league as a kid and loved it. but I had no interest in playing baseball or softball as an adult. Is this the primary reason that the huge junior participation and college racing over 30 years has not translated into a large stream of racers in the sport? (not to mention... the age old chestnut... does college racing ruin sailing for those sailors post college?)... Bottom line... with old fart status... I don't have much insight here (grin).

 

[Rambler]

Props to all of you running the classic model for building a racing club. IMO you are community building. My cohort of racers who are buying a regatta service would certainly support your efforts. The consensus is that national organizations are mostly irrelevant to what you are doing beyond certification of junior coaches, judges and race officers. I was looking for some insight into starboards comment.

. It really seems to be every issue all at the same time, which stinks of a fundamentally ineffective organization. It needs to be reimagined from the ground up.

Collectively us old farts can run the old program but I am not sure if re-imagining the problem and solutions is in the cards. Every idea that I have read is derivative and I don't see it speaking to the 20's and 30 somethings. What and more importantly Who am I unaware of? Are the 20 or 30 somethings interested in buying a regatta service or building and being part of a community? How different does this look like from our now "classic" point of view?

Agree with most of what you say.

Yes, I think the national organisations are largely irrelevant for club level sailing and even most classes' regattas and titles. They do little to actually help, and certainly nothing on a proactive basis, those community builders. And their certification process can be more hinderance than help as they make it all increasingly difficult and demanding and bury you in papaerwork.

I'm not sure what buying a regatta service means. I'm more of a club and class bulder by nature. Sometimes we do find it hard to get a club to run our titles at a reasonable cost; but do understand that, it they are don't have any affiliation with our class, there has to be some motivation for them to hold it.

20 to 40 year olds are largely the target of my current program. But you call it community building and I agree with that phrase. I make sure it is as much about the soical as about the sailing.

As for fixing the national bodies, I'm not sure how or what I want from them. There's a few don'ts. Don't make certification more difficult or regquire certification where it is not really required. Remember it is not about building your orgamisation with ever more bureauracy and costs; its about building sailing. Real sailing, not just churning numbers through LTS programs. Don't drain the coffers of clubs to feed your bureauracy. After that , it would be nice if they counld contribute positively. But what, I don't know. Mainly get out of the way I think.

 

[Rambler]

One question that I never have a good answer for... Is the nature of the sailing bug biting as junior the same as if it bit you when you were a young adult? For example, I played little league as a kid and loved it. but I had no interest in playing baseball or softball as an adult. Is this the primary reason that the huge junior participation and college racing over 30 years has not translated into a large stream of racers in the sport? (not to mention... the age old chestnut... does college racing ruin sailing for those sailors post college?)... Bottom line... with old fart status... I don't have much insight here (grin).

That's partly why I've bypassed teaching kids nd largely now target young adults (well, young compared to me).

Even keen kids laregely disappear as they go into the final study intensive years of school and in our town, then then leave for the big cities.

 

[Tcatman]

That's partly why I've bypassed teaching kids nd largely now target young adults (well, young compared to me).

boom! Are you ahead of the pack there? Certainly sounds more workable then catering to the 15 year olds...

(when I refer to buy a regatta service..... My observation is that beach cats were trailer sailors from the Hobie cat hey day... These beach cat clubs ran their own events... but as the numbers diminished for all racing... yacht clubs opened up to hosting beach cats.. The requirement that you belong to a member club of the RSA got lost in the shuffle. It would not matter if your club would reciprocate and offer a start to the snipes... they were not coming to your event.. Eventually... racers just cherry picked the events they liked and bought the regatta service from that club... Basically I became a consumer of a sailboat race service. The yacht clubs did not have a problem with this arrangement since boats on the water meant more bodies at the bar and it was a good thing. But the idea of reciprocity and community building got lost. So clubs run events and racers buy that service when they want to. YMMV if this is a thing.)

 

[Gouvernail]

Kids transitioning from junior to adult sailing….

My observations over my sixty years racing say:
Kids who race in the adult fleets stick around
Kids who race exclusively in junior Mm fleets age out and go away.

I around age right or ten I learned how much fun it was to race snipes beef with 70 and 80 year old men. Now that I am an old fart I make it a point to cause sailing against me to be fun for kids.

 

[Rambler]

boom! Are you ahead of the pack there? Certainly sounds more workable then catering to the 15 year olds...

Pretty well.
The relatively recent Australian Sailing inspired (but club run) "she sails" initative has probably also - more accidently than anything else - also attracted adults more recently.

But I got there first [I'm pretty sure].
Partly because I needed adult crews (I still avoid anyone under 20, even if they might be big and strong enough) and partly because I'd done general LTS courses for long enough by then (about 15 years) to know, whatever follow up you try and do, the retenton rate is terrible.

For a while the AS and the focus of most AS club certified programs was very much on "tackers"; an Optimist program. And while Bic's have now joined the LTS parade, it still seems to be junior focused.
More recently AS has gone back to recogniseing the benefit of 'family' type programs in benigh training dinghies such as the RS Quest. I only ever did LTS in those sort of boats.

 

[dogwatch]

(when I refer to buy a regatta service..... My observation is that beach cats were trailer sailors from the Hobie cat hey day... These beach cat clubs ran their own events... but as the numbers diminished for all racing... yacht clubs opened up to hosting beach cats.. The requirement that you belong to a member club of the RSA got lost in the shuffle. It would not matter if your club would reciprocate and offer a start to the snipes... they were not coming to your event.. Eventually... racers just cherry picked the events they liked and bought the regatta service from that club... Basically I became a consumer of a sailboat race service. The yacht clubs did not have a problem with this arrangement since boats on the water meant more bodies at the bar and it was a good thing. But the idea of reciprocity and community building got lost. So clubs run events and racers buy that service when they want to. YMMV if this is a thing.)

Sorry but I find that to be unduly cynical or perhaps I mean pessimistic. The small number of 20-30s continuing to sail are likely to be at a level where they want to be on the event circuit. If they are still sailing at 50+, then as their sailing fitness fades, their willingness to help run events will, we hope, rise, as it did for their predecessors. Expecting most 20-30s to be interested in give-back to sailing is a lost cause; however getting older is a certainty.

 

[knh555]

Sorry but I find that to be unduly cynical or perhaps I mean pessimistic. The small number of 20-30s continuing to sail are likely to be at a level where they want to be on the event circuit. If they are still sailing at 50+, then as their sailing fitness fades, their willingness to help run events will, we hope, rise, as it did for their predecessors. Expecting most 20-30s to be interested in give-back to sailing is a lost cause; however getting older is a certainty.

We’re finding good energy at both the fleet and class levels from those in their 20s. They just need to be encouraged and supported by those who’ve been around a bit longer where they own certain projects, events, or parts of what it takes to run a fleet. The old timers are still contributing to as it’s unrealistic to expect to just retire and hand things over. Basically, treat them as part of the fleet and community the same as when we were young.