RAINMAKER DISMASTED OFF HATTERAS IN GALE

[captpiratedog]

Good Read Clean. Like something out of heavy weather sailing for 2015. I wonder what Coles take on it would be too. I must agree too that the Capts stresses on safety of persons on board first then property so best call to get everyone off , esp. after the ship crashing thing and knowing the shits gonna get worse before it gets better. Besides , its not like the owner can't afford to buy another boat should he ever decide to go back to sea after such a stressful event.It also tells the tale that no matter how good you are shit can still hit the fan real fast. I just wonder....and we may never know... What caused it? Did the mast break? Did a rigging component fail? Was it something that didn't get done correctly at the factory by a lower worker in a hurry? Or was it that a triple reefed main with storm jib is too much sail for a line squall such as the one they had and the boat just can't take it...or maybe just bad luck from several factors... this is the mystery and I'm not about to say what they should have or not done... I wasn't there...besides this thread makes for great bedtime reading

 

[Trickypig]

Re: electrics/electronics.

The designer could only have designed the saloon as little more than an enclosed hard dodger; with the companionway being the access to belowdecks.

It is difficult to tell from the photos but it appears that the electronics above decks look to all be of weatherproof operation.

If there was water ingress to the electronics/electrics, I can only think it was via the broken through deck connections for the mast wiring (IF common sense prevailed and the saloon electronics and switching was weatherproof.)

 

[the_abandoned_brane]

Gotta say it's been an entertaining thread.....

it really has. i just spent two and a half hour catching up. when i should have been

 

[Trickypig]

and furthermore a Penalty Box video of Rainmakers delivery not so long ago….

happier days

 

[Ed Lada]

soak_ed You are a funny guy...

Tomorrow once the meds have done their thing, and feeding tube has been removed you should start writing that coffe-table book about your life's adventures.

Thanks Windward, to quote an old song, "What a long strange trip it's been". At my age things get a little fuzzy and it takes some energy to get these old arthritic fingers to work on this computer thing, but someday I might tell you folks about the time I taught this little, fat, loud mouthed kid from San Diego, named Dennis how to sail...

 

[alphafb552]

Well this thread certainly has been an interesting read...

I started out wondering as others did, whether or not the cavalry was called too soon. Reading part 2 of the story put that to rest, the boat clearly appeared to be in no fit state to face the expected conditions heading its way...

But part 2 did certainly raise some serious questions about the design itself. Sure, the 'indoor/outdoor' pilothouse as built here, sounds like a great selling proposition, but when it fails, as it clearly did on Rainmaker, it compromises the basic security of the boat.

I don't have a 10th of the offshore experience that many others have here, but one basic rule counts for all of us, all the time: when the weather turns nasty, you need to be able to keep it outside of the boat if you want the crew to survive.

The failure of the rig is worrisome, but an event that can and will happen due to various reasons and should normally be survivable without too much drama.

That the pilot house failed when the mast came down, is a much larger concern.

But the biggest issue is that after the pilot house failed, there was no way to keep the water out of the boat, or off of the systems.

As an aside, one lesson we can start thinking about is how do you get rid of a failed rig that has hydraulic systems incorporated, without spreading the oil all over the boat?

 

[SCANAS]

Flame me but I think the design is fine. It's the rig falling that caused the issues. Mono or multi, carbon rig or tin, most boats will get holes in them when the rig comes down in that kind if sea state.

 

[alphafb552]

Flame me but I think the design is fine. It's the rig falling that caused the issues. Mono or multi, carbon rig or tin, most boats will get holes in them when the rig comes down in that kind if sea state.

Well in my book that may be acceptable for inshore or racing boats, but not for "the ultimate performance cat for those planning to circumnagivate as owner-operators"..;

But then what do I know about 'disruptive technology'...

 

[Trickypig]

Flame me but I think the design is fine. It's the rig falling that caused the issues. Mono or multi, carbon rig or tin, most boats will get holes in them when the rig comes down in that kind if sea state.

Not flaming… but rigs go over on many boats yet there was a cascading list of failures here... electrics, electronics, companionway integrity, wide open slippery space and broken glass underfoot.

Was the design prone or not prone to these issues?

 

[Aggrin3]

President of More Money Than Brains club buys bad ass boat, buys bad ass crew, and evidently thinks he's a bad ass too. The captain has to be covering for the owner because I can't believe anyone with experience would go out in shit like that-Gunboat and bad ass or not. The barrier to entry to offshore sailing seems like it's getting lower with every great innovation. Gunboats or SAT phones etc. Every clown with money can buy his way out there and have others needlessly risk their lives to save them. And this fucker puts his son on the boat! Too bad common sense and humility weren't available for purchase when the owner decided he was an offshore sailor.

 

[Pertinacious Tom]

C'mon Clean you're a Journo when you want to be!

No, I'm not. I don't have a calling or a mission or a profession or some other bullshit self-aggrandizing label...

INTERNATIONAL MEDIA!!

But without the self-aggrandizing pink flag.

 

[SCANAS]

Flame me but I think the design is fine. It's the rig falling that caused the issues. Mono or multi, carbon rig or tin, most boats will get holes in them when the rig comes down in that kind if sea state.

Not flaming but rigs go over on many boats yet there was a cascading list of failures here... electrics, electronics, companionway integrity, wide open slippery space and broken glass underfoot.

Was the design prone or not prone to these issues?

Weaknesses exposed once the rig came down, hadnt been an issue up until then.

 

[Trickypig]

Flame me but I think the design is fine. It's the rig falling that caused the issues. Mono or multi, carbon rig or tin, most boats will get holes in them when the rig comes down in that kind if sea state.

Not flaming but rigs go over on many boats yet there was a cascading list of failures here... electrics, electronics, companionway integrity, wide open slippery space and broken glass underfoot.

Was the design prone or not prone to these issues?

Weaknesses exposed once the rig came down, hadnt been an issue up until then.

Agreed.

 

[Edith Bicknell]

Flame me but I think the design is fine. It's the rig falling that caused the issues. Mono or multi, carbon rig or tin, most boats will get holes in them when the rig comes down in that kind if sea state.

Not flaming but rigs go over on many boats yet there was a cascading list of failures here... electrics, electronics, companionway integrity, wide open slippery space and broken glass underfoot.

Was the design prone or not prone to these issues?

Weaknesses exposed once the rig came down, hadnt been an issue up until then.

Agreed.

Question. Have any GBs been lost from a flying fish striking and breaking a window or moonroof?

 

[SCANAS]

Flame me but I think the design is fine. It's the rig falling that caused the issues. Mono or multi, carbon rig or tin, most boats will get holes in them when the rig comes down in that kind if sea state.

Not flaming but rigs go over on many boats yet there was a cascading list of failures here... electrics, electronics, companionway integrity, wide open slippery space and broken glass underfoot.

Was the design prone or not prone to these issues?

Weaknesses exposed once the rig came down, hadnt been an issue up until then.

Agreed.

Question. Have any GBs been lost from a flying fish striking and breaking a window or moonroof?

In 2,000,000nm no

 

[billy backstay]

Clean

I've read and reread part 2 of the interview.

It's airbrushed, sanitised and disinfected. Riddled with the lawyer speak you claim to detest, and will translate nicely into a report to the insurer.

I guess you have another chance in part 3 to stop being a lawyer and start being a journalist.

While Captain Bailet may impress the insurers with the detailed account of his due diligence and the "act of god" that took the rig down, the readers of this forum are simply having their intelligence insulted.

You are certainly doing a bad job of claiming that you left the legal profession behind long ago, because this sure isn't great journalism.

You need to read the entire thread. You can not insult what is not here. Captain Bailet has impressed me many times, I am good with the act of god, and due diligence led to five alive in the post mortem.

Finally, a sensible comment about this keyboard (and probably alcohol) fueled mob lynching, of all parties involved, including the humble(sic) reporter! LOL!. BRAVO!

 

[captpiratedog]

PJ can pitch it as a Condomaran then

I've always loved the gunboats but PJ's presentation.........


"Indoors" "moonroof" etc etc That's condo speak.

 

[DryArmour]

The crew reports there were no dark clouds in Clean's part 2 report. The only thing I can come up with is that the front is approaching and the wind suddenly shifts from 110AWA to 70AWA and increases from 28 to say 45+ in a gust that rapidly builds to 68 knots as the report suggests. Auto pilot bares away hard, leeward bow compresses, boat goes into the back of a tall, square wave and the rig blows under massive momentary loads. Not hard to imagine at all. I wasn't there but have spent most of my life on maxi multihulls and ULDBs. This is the scenario I am sticking with. I was in the waterspout camp until I read that there were no dark clouds. I was also told they were on the radar and there was nothing for 10 miles.

 

[billy backstay]

Marks scenario is very plausible, IMHO....

 

[TwoLegged]

The crew reports there were no dark clouds in Clean's part 2 report. The only thing I can come up with is that the front is approaching and the wind suddenly shifts from 110AWA to 70AWA and increases from 28 to say 45+ in a gust that rapidly builds to 68 knots as the report suggests. Auto pilot bares away hard, leeward bow compresses, boat goes into the back of a tall, square wave and the rig blows under massive momentary loads.

So, was it good seamanship to let the autopilot drive in those conditions?