Richard Slater unilaterally emasculated the AC

Xlot

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With his Jacobine interpretation of no “ghost boat” collision to the centimeter, he’s effectively taken out any incentive to penalty seeking - which was traditionally at the heart of match racing up to IACC Cups. I don’t understand why people bemoan the sail change ballets of yore, and not this - while complaining that passing is now impossible

And one comment was that, if indeed there was a collision, the attacking boat would be penalized for not doing enough to avoid it!

Interestingly, the only guy who had understood the “new” rules implication in advance was BA (Luca Devoti did say this was always his forte): he was hyper-aggressive at some starts, knowing he could get away with murder

The remedy? Too late now, but before this spreads to club races - with an exponential increase in collisions and protest room arguing - as a minimum the “diamond” needs to be substantially widened by a couple of meters at the boat stern

Also, please note this is not a Cicero pro domo sua” - since TR is still supposed to have some  ;) speed edge, it would be a way to passing

 

Ex-yachtie

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Auckland, NZ
With his Jacobine interpretation of no “ghost boat” collision to the centimeter, he’s effectively taken out any incentive to penalty seeking - which was traditionally at the heart of match racing up to IACC Cups. I don’t understand why people bemoan the sail change ballets of yore, and not this - while complaining that passing is now impossible

And one comment was that, if indeed there was a collision, the attacking boat would be penalized for not doing enough to avoid it!

Interestingly, the only guy who had understood the “new” rules implication in advance was BA (Luca Devoti did say this was always his forte): he was hyper-aggressive at some starts, knowing he could get away with murder

The remedy? Too late now, but before this spreads to club races - with an exponential increase in collisions and protest room arguing - as a minimum the “diamond” needs to be substantially widened by a couple of meters at the boat stern

Also, please note this is not a Cicero pro domo sua” - since TR is still supposed to have some  ;) speed edge, it would be a way to passing
Um, putting aside the question of “Why?”, if you made the diamond bigger, the boats will just get further apart. 

 

Xlot

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Not specifically focusing on that. But pray tell me how many “sailing” penalties (i.e. not counting OCS and boundary infractions) have been adjudicated since the Xmas races, and compare them historically with previous Cups

 

nav

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The on-the-water-umpires have come to different conclusions to the video-game umps, so 'we' are not the only ones disputing their new way of determining infractions.

Apart from their millimetre decisions that seem to ignore the vagaries of wind and waves, they also seem to have turned the 'right of way rule on it's head'

Let's hope nothing too big  :) hinges on this weirdness

 
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crashtack

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I agree that the focus on "no simulated collision" is strange. They've built the "diamond" exactly because they don't want boats to get unreasonably close - these things after all aren't dinghies, where a skipper can have confidence in where his bow is to the centimeter. Yet at the same time, the umpires seem to be perfectly content with the ac75s coming together on courses and at distances which would cause a sonar crew to shudder, without giving out penalties. I'm not saying that the move in R1 should have been a red flag (last race of Prada was a weirder "no call" imo), but it does seem that penalty-seeking, a rather central part of match racing, is no longer a very viable option in these races, partly because of all the green flags, and partly because penalties often don't seem to matter very much (e.g. AM vs ETNZ in the ACWS)

 
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mauriciogfj

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How would you call it?
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jaysper

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I agree that the focus on "no simulated collision" is strange. They've built the "diamond" exactly because they don't want boats to get unreasonably close - these things after all aren't dinghies, where a skipper can have confidence in where his bow is to the centimeter. Yet at the same time, the umpires seem to be perfectly content with the ac75s coming together on courses and at distances which would cause a sonar crew to shudder, without giving out penalties. I'm not saying that the move in R1 should have been a red flag (last race of Prada was a weirder "no call" imo), but it does seem that penalty-seeking, a rather central part of match racing, is no longer a very viable option in these races, partly because of all the green flags, and partly because penalties often don't seem to matter very much (e.g. AM vs ETNZ in the ACWS)
When they first started racing I couldn't believe some of the shit that didn't get a penalty.

Personally I think the methodology for determining penalties is crazy, but if you look at the video below then you can at least make sense of the resulting decisions.




 

mauriciogfj

Member
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Brazil
Clearly the rules have not been conceived for boats flying at 40 knots.
It seens unlikely the speed genie is going to be back into the bottle. If that is the case the rules, most likely, will have to be ajusted accordingly. 

 
Not specifically focusing on that. But pray tell me how many “sailing” penalties (i.e. not counting OCS and boundary infractions) have been adjudicated since the Xmas races, and compare them historically with previous Cups
All have very accurate software that prevent such infractions no? Plus at velocity they travel at any collision ends the contest. 

 

Blitzkrieg9

Member
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62
The rules are certainly broken. The diamond needs to be much larger because of the high speeds.  Someone is going to get seriously hurt or killed, then we'll see some changes that reintroduces match racing tactics. 

 

mauriciogfj

Member
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122
Brazil
^^It makes sense.
We saw a very bad incident in Bermuda, in a race between GBR and JPN. No one got seriously hurt by sheer luck and a strong foil.
The current rules and officiating have improved since then, and will certainly improve (change) in the future.

 

nav

Super Anarchist
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^ Well done, now you are talking Richard's language at least  :blink:

 

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