Steve and Dave Clarks Unidentified Foiling Object

[Joseph Lapp]

Martin,

You mention "CF" - what does that mean.

I also have Plexus MA300 and MA310.  Would work on the push rod tab on the main foil?

Thank you

 

[Gilles29]

I think there's 2 plastic rings, and I'm not sure which one @Gilles29is missing.

• a "credit card thin" plastic ring to reduce friction between mast collar and deck, this one is not glied or attached to anything, and is often lost. Safe to sail without it for a couple outings (not forever - get a replacement). 
  

Yes Martin, it's that one which is missing

 

[martin 'hoff]

Martin,

You mention "CF" - what does that mean.

I also have Plexus MA300 and MA310.  Would work on the push rod tab on the main foil?

Thank you

Carbon Fiber ... so my comment was -- carbon fiber or fiberglass, and a regular epoxy (like West Systems 105/205). I'm not an expert on the Plexus line, but I _think_ those are more "glue" epoxies, so maybe not what you are after.

 

[Gilles29]

You mention "CF" - what does that mean

IMHO I think it's Carbon Fiber

 

[Joseph Lapp]

Martin and Gilles,

Thank you for the clarification.    So using epoxy and fiberglass and or CF (I should have guessed carbon fiber) to repair the push rod tab.    Do you think fairing putty on the outer edge of the main foil is sufficient?

 

[martin 'hoff]

Martin and Gilles,

Thank you for the clarification.    So using epoxy and fiberglass and or CF (I should have guessed carbon fiber) to repair the push rod tab.    Do you think fairing putty on the outer edge of the main foil is sufficient?

My pleasure. I'd do CF or glass + epoxy on the outer edge of the foil. You're rebuilding something that needs strength. Putty won't have enough structure. Might last one outing...

 

[Champlain Sailor]

Yes Martin, it's that one which is missing

That ring is to minimize friction between the bottom of the mast flange and the deck.   As Martin said, you can sail without it for a little while, particularly if you put some Vaseline in between the two surfaces to minimize binding.   I believe the ring is made from HDPE, the same material as ski bottoms.   So any dense, slippery plastic would work.   But Fulcrum has plenty of them and is happy to sell it to you for a pretty reasonable cost.

 

[martin 'hoff]

Been unlucky recently with not quite enough wind in recent outings. Here's a clip from Tropical Storm Elsa days - 

 

[Kelly Federal]

Here's a clip from Tropical Storm Elsa days - 

Elsa was good to me…



This was about five hours before the front hit and started taking down trees and power lines.  Fortunately for me, not another soul out on the water.  When I was done, I just tucked the boat on its dolly up against the leeward side of a dock house.  The next morning, though the power was out across the island, I was back out on the water.

 

[martin 'hoff]

13 minutes ago, Kelly Federal said:

Elsa was good to me…

Yeah that clip is rad. Winds have been marginal for the UFO here in Miami lately, at least on the days I can get out on the water. 

And a litany of small problems needing TLC. My rudder rake control rod was bent, and I had to straighten it enough that I could pull it out, and then hammer it straight properly. I think the boat is now in better shape.

 

[Joseph Lapp]

So wanted to show you my repair work on the main foil.    I used fiberglass and Raka epoxy (2 layers) to reinforce the push rod tab and the damaged end of the main foil.     I worked up the epoxy to make a slightly bigger tab.    Used a Dremel, orbit sander, and then hand sanding from 80, 220, 600 and 1,000 grit.   What do you think?

 

[barthrh]

I missed sailing last year and got a late start. Wind didn’t meet expectations today so we rigged. Except we couldn’t get the sail up. It bound hard just below each of the longer battens and we finally gave up at the last one.

We cleaned the track, silicones the crap out of everything, used the two hand push technique and got trough 2/3 but just couldn’t power through the final one.

What am I doing wrong? My boat is a low SN (30-ish).

 

[martin 'hoff]

my repair work on the main foil (...)  What do you think?

Looks great! I'll send my damaged foils your way next time. My repairs look awful in comparison

couldn’t get the sail up. It bound hard just below each of the longer battens and we finally gave up at the last one.

Ease rig tension fully. Stand at the port/aft corner of the boat and pull from the halyard standign in that corner, bend the mast aggressively by pulling that halyard.

If there's a 2nd person available, have them push the sail up the track at the same time you pull the halyard. The pushing the sail up movement should also be pulling the sail a bit towards the mast.

When I do that, I stand on the ground, forward of the mast and mainfoil, put one foot on the mast collar, put my palms together on either side of the sail (as if praying) and push up and pull towards me / the mast.

 

[barthrh]

Ease rig tension fully. Stand at the port/aft corner of the boat and pull from the halyard standign in that corner, bend the mast aggressively by pulling that halyard.

This is what I recalled as being part of the trick, but was first of all thinking that needing to stand back didn't make sense for rigging single-handed, and I was also concerned with the amount of bend on the mast. So go nuts, it seems. What about batten tension? Is it possible that relaxing them more would reduce the perpendicular pull away from the luff?

 

[martin 'hoff]

This is what I recalled as being part of the trick, but was first of all thinking that needing to stand back didn't make sense for rigging single-handed, and I was also concerned with the amount of bend on the mast. So go nuts, it seems. What about batten tension? Is it possible that relaxing them more would reduce the perpendicular pull away from the luff?

Go nuts indeed. You can ease batten tension, but in normal conditions you'll want to capsize the boat and reapply batten tension. And it's honestly not needed.

I'd only lower batten tension if it's very windy.

 

[Gilles29]

So wanted to show you my repair work on the main foil.    I used fiberglass and Raka epoxy (2 layers) to reinforce the push rod tab and the damaged end of the main foil.     I worked up the epoxy to make a slightly bigger tab.    Used a Dremel, orbit sander, and then hand sanding from 80, 220, 600 and 1,000 grit.   What do you think?

Good job !

 

[Dave Clark]

Looks great! I'll send my damaged foils your way next time. My repairs look awful in comparison

Ease rig tension fully. Stand at the port/aft corner of the boat and pull from the halyard standign in that corner, bend the mast aggressively by pulling that halyard.

If there's a 2nd person available, have them push the sail up the track at the same time you pull the halyard. The pushing the sail up movement should also be pulling the sail a bit towards the mast.

When I do that, I stand on the ground, forward of the mast and mainfoil, put one foot on the mast collar, put my palms together on either side of the sail (as if praying) and push up and pull towards me / the mast.

Yeah I'd bet a lot of money it's the shroud tension. Possibly unaccounted tension in the actual knots which lead to a "false slack" in the control line.

Make sure the knots on your shroud setup allow for as much length in the system as humanly possible. It's possible to have the little control line which goes to the cleat totally slack but still have the shrouds locking up if the tackle themselves are out of range. An easy way to test for this is to fully untie the shrouds from the bullseye low friction rings for one hoist. Seems silly but it's a nice binary way to make dead certain that you aren't locking the mast into a overly straight position.

The luff curve of the UFO mainsail is aggressive and the shrouds are designed to push the mast into a straight position. The mast needs to be allowed to form to the curve of the luff through the hoist. Weirdly enough the same factor is critical on the Fareast 19R. Just found out from a customer the other day. In that case I think you crank on a backstay to hoist. The down and back pull with the UFO halyard is doing a similar thing.

The relationship between the luff round and the straight but bendable spar is 99% of the time the critical or only feature. As a general note to anybody, don't bother considering conventional factors like lubrication or batten tension until this relationship has been FULLY explored. If you've got the curves matched and it still isn't going up, look for debris in the track.

DRC

 

[barthrh]

Yeah I'd bet a lot of money it's the shroud tension. Possibly unaccounted tension in the actual knots which lead to a "false slack" in the control line.

Make sure the knots on your shroud setup allow for as much length in the system as humanly possible. It's possible to have the little control line which goes to the cleat totally slack but still have the shrouds locking up if the tackle themselves are out of range. An easy way to test for this is to fully untie the shrouds from the bullseye low friction rings for one hoist. Seems silly but it's a nice binary way to make dead certain that you aren't locking the mast into a overly straight position.

The luff curve of the UFO mainsail is aggressive and the shrouds are designed to push the mast into a straight position. The mast needs to be allowed to form to the curve of the luff through the hoist. Weirdly enough the same factor is critical on the Fareast 19R. Just found out from a customer the other day. In that case I think you crank on a backstay to hoist. The down and back pull with the UFO halyard is doing a similar thing.

The relationship between the luff round and the straight but bendable spar is 99% of the time the critical or only feature. As a general note to anybody, don't bother considering conventional factors like lubrication or batten tension until this relationship has been FULLY explored. If you've got the curves matched and it still isn't going up, look for debris in the track.

DRC

Thanks! During assembly I made sure that there were no twists of fouls where the shroud met the spreader, but I'll keep an eye on tension during the hoist. Track was brush cleaned to free it of nesting critters. In fairness, we have not been hyper-bending the mast. If anything, I was pulling in a way to minimize that. Is it unbreakable (practically)?

What I notice is that 4-6" below each batten, the stretch perpendicular to the mast is significant and pulling the bolt rope away. I assume that a big bend will resolve this.

 

[Joseph Lapp]

I see a lot of comments on issues raising the sail.   From my catamaran days, I have a Easy-Rigg tool that allows me to stand at the mast and hoist all the way – no need to move aft.    Not sure if it is still available but here are some pictures.

BTW – is anyone else upset that US Sailing has not endorsed the UFO Foiler over the Melges import?    The UFO is built in their backyard!

 

[Joseph Lapp]

Need some help from my UFO Foiler friends.   I’ve been sailing the UFO for almost two years now but still having a hell of a time with sustained flight.    I’ve owned and actively raced many boats including a Prindle 18-2 and a Hobie 17 so not new to sailing.    I’m 70” tall and 210 lbs.  I’ve watched DRC’s videos over a dozen of time but capsize to windward more often than I would like to admit.    Matter of fact, I’ve capsized the UFO more times then all the other boats combined.  

Below is my speed track in knots from Sunday on Superior Bay Duluth.   A lot of kite sailors were out since the winds were 10- 13 knots with gust to 17.    I sit on the middle pad, feet in far hiking strap.   The wand has 12-15” showing above the strut.   I get going and up (silent wake) and as can been seen from the graph, speed goes to zero (there are several parking events where I didn’t stop my Garmin Instinct watch).   The higher speeds are on a beam/broad reach.  I did have a great recovery where I almost capsized but pulled it out – rowing helps.

Looking for any advice anyone may have.  

Thank you,

Joe