That's a trailer sailer!

[Grith]

Grith, seem to be not hearing what is being said to you.

if you had just been highlighting the advantages of trailer sailers in general or of your boat in particular, then I for one would not have been tough on you.

The problem is that instead of honestly describing the compromises, you have been busy making implausible claims about your boat's capabilties, phrased in weaselly terms reminiscent of a dodgy marketer.

Many CA regulars are highly experienced sailors. Several regulars are professional designers. Many others know how to assess the basic parameters of boat design, and see how factors such as SA/D, D/L, rig profile, stability, and wetted surface will impact performance.

There are places where you can get away with boosterism. This is not one of them.

Two legged.
I completely understand ultimate sailing efficiency dynamics for racing or long offshore passages where speed can be very important and weather conditions (on the nose for days) unavoidable.
Please explain why this should matter that much for inshore sailing/cruising between sheltered overnight or multi day hangouts where time sailing is usually limited to about 8 hours maximum and the next anchorage can usually be selected with wind direction and sea state conditions in mind.
I will personally will accept some slight loss of sailing performance/speed in some conditions for comfort and to be able to go over the fringing reef and access that sheltered, secluded white sandy beach or over the river mouth sandbar into the shallow lagoon.
I have often watched the keel boats anchored out bucking in the wind and waves whilst nosed up overnight right onto the beach.
It’s similar I feel to those selecting yachts with pilot houses and/or internal steering positions who sail in very cold and inclement northern locations.
Lots of friends have inshore/inland cruised for many years with a wide range of swing or retracting keel trailer sailers like Court 750’s and RL28’s and the like.
My yacht is just a similar but slightly different take on precisely these type of maxi sized trailable Yachts.
Why all the negativity?
Not so secluded bunch of said trailer sailers hanging out together.🙂

 

[TwoLegged]

Two legged.
I completely understand ultimate sailing efficiency dynamics for racing or long offshore passages where speed can be very important and weather conditions (on the nose for days) unavoidable.
Please explain why this should matter that much for inshore sailing/cruising between sheltered overnight or multi day hangouts where time sailing is usually limited to about 8 hours maximum and the next anchorage can usually be selected with wind direction and sea state conditions in mind.

Grith, you are still completely and totally missing the point that I and others have been making. So it would be very helpful if you would take a little time to read and re-read what I write here, before you reply.

I have not at any point denied the need for trade-offs. Every boat is a compromise, and if trialability is one of the goals, then something else will have to give.

Everyone buying a boat has to choose which compromises are best for them. Shoal draft vs windward ability; cockpit size vs cabin space; etc etc.

You make what choices work for you. I have not tried in any way to say what priorities you should have, or what trade-offs you should make.

My comments have been about one thing: that your claims of good sailing performance look improbable. I look at your boat's numbers and rig profile and hull shape, and I cannot reconcile what I see with the claims you make about it's sailing performance. That's all.

 

[Grith]

Grith, you are still completely and totally missing the point that I and others have been making. So it would be very helpful if you would take a little time to read and re-read what I write here, before you reply.

I have not at any point denied the need for trade-offs. Every boat is a compromise, and if trialability is one of the goals, then something else will have to give.

Everyone buying a boat has to choose which compromises are best for them. Shoal draft vs windward ability; cockpit size vs cabin space; etc etc.

You make what choices work for you. I have not tried in any way to say what priorities you should have, or what trade-offs you should make.

My comments have been about one thing: that your claims of good sailing performance look improbable. I look at your boat's numbers and rig profile and hull shape, and I cannot reconcile what I see with the claims you make about it's sailing performance. That's all.

Sorry Two Legged but please quote exactly where I said my current yacht had good or even above average sailing performance. I have not!
All I said was that I can keep up with heavily laden smaller cruising yachts on many points of sail and on some limited ones it’s unusual flattish hull configuration can actually work to its advantage whilst not so on many others.
I have not in anyway promoted its ultimate sailing performance as a primary or even significant benefit as it’s patiently not.
It’s a cross between a yacht, a small motor cruiser and a caravan/houseboat.
I actually sails better than a hell of a lot of alternatives out there but generally worse than the majority on balance I feel.
My primary point has always been the use of larger retractable keel true trailer sailers as an alternative style of cruising yacht.
My particular choice came after many years of trialling alternatives as it suits my particular preferred cruising grounds, sailing style and now longer liveaboard requirements.
I absolutely agree it’s not the choice many would make. Works for me however and I feel it doesn’t deserve the negative comments from some.

 

[TwoLegged]

Sorry Two Legged but please quote exactly where I said my current yacht had good or even above average sailing performance. I have not!

I did not say that you had me such a claim. Please don't put words in my mouth.

What I did say is that your claims about the boat's performance are a mix of too vague to test, and not credible.

Some examples:

My yacht very rarely uses its big engine and sails perfectly fine as a cruising trailer sailer. It keeps up or even passes many other cruising loaded trailer sailers and small cruising yachts on most points of sail. ( not upwind into a chop admittedly)

I would venture that my time above displacement speed under motor is well less than that spent planning under sail.

 

[Fah Kiew Tu]

Sorry Two Legged but please quote exactly where I said my current yacht had good or even above average sailing performance. I have not!

You're new here aren't you...

TwoLegged *gives* you your opinions and then attacks them, she doesn't bother with minor details like *reading* what you actually write. If she bothered doing that, she'd have very little to say.

My advice is to just ignore her. Life is less aggravating if you do.

FKT

 

[TwoLegged]

TwoLegged *gives* you your opinions and then attacks them, she doesn't bother with minor details like *reading* what you actually write. If she bothered doing that, she'd have very little to say

Yet again, FKT demonstrates his preferred conduct of personal attacks and outright lies. I did read what was written, and quoted it.

FKT makes no attempt to civilly discuss a disagreement. He just lies and smears and tries to silence.

 

[Russell Brown]

Here's my favorite trailer sailor. The set up at the ramp is around 20 minutes, it can go upwind in a gale at pretty high speeds without a lot of stress or spray. It goes almost 9 knots with a 6 hp outboard, it has a large double bed and comfy cockpit and lots of other cool things. Have I tried to sell anybody on this boat? No.

I have missed Two Legged and am happy she's back. She's one of the more intelligent people that bother to share their views here and I learn from her.

 

[TwoLegged]

Here's my favorite trailer sailor. The set up at the ramp is around 20 minutes, it can go upwind in a gale at pretty high speeds without a lot of stress or spray. It goes almost 9 knots with a 6 hp outboard, it has a large double bed and comfy cockpit and lots of other cool things.

A G32 would not be everybody's cup of tea. Many ppl would want more accommodation, with things like standing headroom and separate cabin.

But I like fast sailing and camp cruising, and I reckon that the G32 would be a near-perfect boat for two humans and a dog to go noodling around the crinkly west coast of Ireland. Unfortunately G32s are as rare as hen's teeth, and I fear that the EU's accursed Recreational Craft Directive might ban them.

 

[Grith]

I just checked the specs at https://imexusyachts.com/portfolio/imexus-28/

With a smaller engine, the boat would still be an under-ballasted, under-canvassed tub with excessively-high topsides, a low-aspect rig, a helm borrowed from a RIB, no rocker, and a stern so draggy that it is probably the capital of Dragistan.

If it makes you happy, then good for you. But "yacht"? No way.

Two Legged This is the type of foul mouthed derogatory crap I was responding to.
My apologies for the language if you are female as has been stated by others here.
What gives you the right to decide what is a yacht?
Calling out others as bullies seems pretty ridicules having come out with this sort of stuff yourself.
I will happily stand by, prove by example and practice everything I have posted and based on your extreme number of posts here I actually wonder if you have had time to do the sailing to back up your words or are you just another keyboard warrior.
I will assume you are actually an experienced sailer as I am whilst just over the last 30 years, but perhaps not previously, a different focus.
I have the privilege to met and even sail with some very notable sailers from a triple solo circumnavigator, though a multiple Sydney Hobart winner to Americas Cup winning designer, skipper and crew.
A benefit of living most of my early life in Perth Western Australia and heavily into competitive yacht sailing in my younger years.
I made no claims that my current chosen yacht was a speedster quite the contrary only stating it generally can keep up with and occasionally pass it’s equivalent heavily laden small cruising peers.
( In part possibly as I usually substitute low carried stores, batteries and liquids not filling its 730kgs of water ballast in many conditions)
This is something other heavily laden small lead/steel ballasted centreboard/ drop keel or keel cruising yachts cannot do often sinking them to or below their maximum designed waterline.
BTW I am sure you are aware that many yachts designed specifically for cruising have more modest mast heights and sail plans than their even sometimes identical hull racing brethren.
As for your derogatory hull comments I also had a very wide flat stern with twin rudders and limited rocker on a class winning 20 foot sports trailer sailer over 35 years ago that would plane on all points of sail except direct upwind.
Its lead filled drop keel with lead bulb was 9 foot long and drew 6 feet when down and this weighed more than the rest of the entire yacht, rigging and sails combined.
Out of interest it had almost every possible sail adjustment control conceivable most from the cockpit as does the poor “ not a yacht “ Imexus most as standard from the manufacturer.
Been there done that and know how to use them!
PS I like to remain respectful and accepting of others choices but some people just deserve a return of serve so I decided not to just ignore you as recommended by Fah Kiew Tu.

 

[Grith]

Here's my favorite trailer sailor. The set up at the ramp is around 20 minutes, it can go upwind in a gale at pretty high speeds without a lot of stress or spray. It goes almost 9 knots with a 6 hp outboard, it has a large double bed and comfy cockpit and lots of other cool things. Have I tried to sell anybody on this boat? No.

I have missed Two Legged and am happy she's back. She's one of the more intelligent people that bother to share their views here and I learn from her.

View attachment 557554

View attachment 557555

View attachment 557558

Out of interest what’s it width on trailer or do they tilt it on its side to meet trailable width standards. Looks interesting. I possibly would have gone for a Dragonfly 28 Tri myself if they weren’t so ridiculously expensive and almost never available second hand here in Australia.🙂

 

[Jim in Halifax]

You're new here aren't you...

TwoLegged *gives* you your opinions and then attacks them, she doesn't bother with minor details like *reading* what you actually write. If she bothered doing that, she'd have very little to say.

My advice is to just ignore her. Life is less aggravating if you do.

FKT

Yet again, FKT demonstrates his preferred conduct of personal attacks and outright lies. I did read what was written, and quoted it.

FKT makes no attempt to civilly discuss a disagreement. He just lies and smears and tries to silence.

Ahhh...the Cruising Anarchy cosmos is in harmonious balance once again. Thank goodness it takes a variety of sandwiches to make a good picnic.

 

[TwoLegged]

Two Legged This is the type of foul mouthed derogatory crap I was responding to.

This is absurd. Nothing in what you quote is any way foul-mouthed.

You are apparently incapable of actually reading, and you make completely bogus assertions. So I am going to put you on ignore.

Have a lovely life, chasing shadows.

 

[Max Rockatansky]

G32 are trailerable?

come to think, I posted my F27GS earlier in this thread. AFAIC, it did everything well, and with a 5hp kicker that was not often needed. The Granger mods were well thought out and not only optimized her speed but made for comfort in cruising. She was a lovely, lovely boat.

 

[TwoLegged]

G32 are trailerable?

Of course! It was a big part of the marketing.

Only 8 foot beam, so no width restrictions.

 

[Russell Brown]

Out of interest what’s it width on trailer or do they tilt it on its side to meet trailable width standards. Looks interesting. I possibly would have gone for a Dragonfly 28 Tri myself if they weren’t so ridiculously expensive and almost never available second hand here in Australia.🙂

It's 8'6" on the trailer, so it's legal and very light, but it's a little stressful to trailer because it's so long and almost like an 8'6" wide cube. I find myself backing into things (like my wife's car) and the tail end can swing pretty wide.
I like the Dragonfly 28, but have never sailed on one. I'm currently building a 29' folding trimaran. It will use the folding system that Farrier came up with, but very different from a Farrier.
Trailerability is a very important fact of life for me as I have been priced out of being able to afford a slip and we have few natural harbors with mooring fields.
Sorry about touching a nerve here. it wasn't my intention.

 

[TwoLegged]

I like the Dragonfly 28, but have never sailed on one. I'm currently building a 29' folding trimaran. It will use the folding system that Farrier came up with, but very different from a Farrier.

It would be very interesting to know more about the trimaran, if you feel like telling.

 

[Panope]

...Trailerability is a very important fact of life for me as I have been priced out of being able to afford a slip and we have few natural harbors with mooring fields......

Same for me (I am in the same town as Russell).

I've got the mast raising (tabernacle) and trailering (travel at 4:00 a.m.) parts dialed in fine, but the skyrocketing travel lift costs are starting to hurt.

In the future I may attempt launching and retrieving from the ramp with the following plan:

-Fit dolly wheels at trailer tongue.
-Disconect truck from trailer.
-Use STRONG winch (mounted in truck) to ease boat up and down ramp.
-Somehow belay the truck to the Earth so it does not get dragged down the ramp. Maybe sneak some "fixed anchors" into the parking lot (like a rock climber). Or, tie off to a second, parked/chocked truck.

 

[Cruisin Loser]

Wow. Just wow. Some folks need to take a deep breath and chill.

As to what constitutes a proper "Trailer Yacht" I'm kind of with Grith here. To me the whole point of "Trailer Sailer" is that it tows easily and launches off the trailer at a public ramp, and can be used for local exploration and camping. Oh, and it should have sails. Beyond that, anything goes. 20 years ago we met the nicest people on a Mac 26X out at Cuttyhunk. had them aboard the Hinckley for dinner. Beautiful folks, great kids, it fit their budget and got them on the water. No, it didn't sail fantastic, but that's not the point of trailer sailers.

Some of these cats and tris are super cool, but look to be beyond a lot of budgets and lack the interior space that Grith seems to have.

 

[TwoLegged]

Same for me (I am in the same town as Russell).

I've got the mast raising (tabernacle) and trailering (travel at 4:00 a.m.) parts dialed in fine, but the skyrocketing travel lift costs are starting to hurt.

I am surprised and saddened to hear that this is happening.

I had kinda assumed that Port Townsend would have avoided the wider curse of everything maritime being bought up big companies whose mission is to squeeze every last drop out of their assets.

 

[Panope]

I am surprised and saddened to hear that this is happening.

I had kinda assumed that Port Townsend would have avoided the wider curse of everything maritime being bought up big companies whose mission is to squeeze every last drop out of their assets.

Actually, the travel lift, yard, launch ramp, and marinas are all owned and operated by a public entity, the Port of Port Townsend.

It is not clear to me why the travel lift costs have roughly quadrupled in the last 10 years.